MMA (Mixed Martial Arts) Thread: UFC/Strikeforce

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Super impressive victory by Sass. If I correctly remember his record, Volkmann is his first legit win. I figured Volkmann could neutralize Sass' sub attempts and work his very good grappling game to a decision. In my opinion, anyone who can beat Volkmann is legit.
 
Someone on Twitter noticed a giant lump under Miller's brace.

I never question why a fighter does this or that—but, if his leg was truly borked, I wonder why Miller chased Dollaway after hurting him and took it to the ground. Miller was having success on the feet.

And a general, lengthy "ugh" in regards to Dollaway. Miller should probably be cut. Injuries and what not, he just can't cut it at the UFC level.
 
I had it as a toss up. For the Pick Em, I leaned towards Barboza simply because I figured Varner was on a no-return decline. Definitely happy to see Varner win.
 
[quote name='Maklershed']Never would've guessed Varner beats Barboza. Unbelievable.[/QUOTE]
Yeah it was a fairly big surprise.Looks like Varner is back after all.It was looking sad seeing him at one point where he seemed to have lost his heart for the sport and even briefly retired.

Doing pretty bad so far for this event at like 2-5 :lol:.Thought Mayhem would be able to sub Dollaway but guess not, did show some improved striking but couldn't stop from being controlled and the knee looked injured collapsing on it after throwing a few strikes.I'd like to see Mayhem get one more shot in the UFC but can't really argue if they decide to cut him.
 
I had two good money prop bets on Struve. I think the first was finish in R1. I know the second was Struve by SUB. Can't believe those were at plus money.
 
Picked up my slacking record for tonight up to 5-5 so still not good but doing better then what it was lol.

Saw that punch from Roy and just let out a "OH SHIT" seeing him flatten Herman like that.I expected Roy to TKO/KO him just not that easily.
 
Mazagatti actually did a good job stopping the fight between Herman and Nelson...that was a nuclear bomb punch lol. I think Del Rosario looked so bad on the ground because he was tired..he was breathing pretty heavy after the first round. Part of it has to be because of the long lay off.


6-4 so far...damn you Diego Brandao and Edson Barboza for messing up my boosts.
 
Brandao-Elkins happened as I thought it would. I think Brandao can be a headcase if he doesn't finish in R1. Elkins is pretty tough, and I figured he would survive and use his wrestling to grind out a decision.

Pretty good return for Velasquez. R1 went down as I expected, though I figured something more out of Pyle-Silva with Silva getting rocked and working out of his guard off his back. I did not foresee Velasquez opening a cut that would affect Silva's vision. I thought Silva would survive R1 and finish Cain in R2. To Silva's credit, Velasquez was not able to put out his lights.
 
[quote name='shotgunshine']Mazagatti actually did a good job stopping the fight between Herman and Nelson...that was a nuclear bomb punch lol. I think Del Rosario looked so bad on the ground because he was tired..he was breathing pretty heavy after the first round. Part of it has to be because of the long lay off.


6-4 so far...damn you Diego Brandao and Edson Barboza for messing up my boosts.[/QUOTE]
Yeah seemed like that,Rosario's exhaustion seemed to be one of the factors that came into play,you'd have to think his cardio just wasn't up to par from being gone for so long.

7-5 for the night.

Small question.Who do you guys think did better against Bigfoot between Cormier and Cain.Cormier made his win over Bigfoot seem effortless making it look just so easy knocking Bigfoot down like 3 threes while Cain had his win over bigfoot making it look more savage with all the blood.
 
I was more impressed with Cormier's win just because I didn't know his boxing was that good. He had also took the fight on short notice and haden't really beaten anyone great at that point(I think Jeff Monson was his biggest win). I expected Silva to beat him down, and instead Cormier basically toyed with him. I was completely shocked. With Cain, I expected him to brutalize Silva.


Went 8-4 overall.
 
Ya know, for a guy as articulate amd personable as Frank Mir is, he fights like a damned moron. I've been a big fan of his for a long time, but I think he needs to retire. He just looks pathetic out there. He says he didn't want the fight to turn into a boxing match, but ONE takedown attempt (I'm not even counting that shitty diving single after he was knocked silly) is apparently enough to abandon the strategy entirely...especially considering it almost worked.

Not that I had any expectation of him beating Junior, but if it was going to happen, the first 20 seconds of the fight was the recipe. What the hell good is being the bigger fighter if you're not going to use your weight to tie your opponent up, lean on him, grind him down, etc. After he gave up and was content to box from the outside, it was just a matter of time. YOU ARE NOT A BOXER, FRANK MIR! If you don't learn some damn greco wrestling or judo or some way to get your opponent to the mat (because your shot is garbage), just stay home. It's not even like he's one of those guys who is afraid to get KO'd. If you're going to just get knocked out anyway, why not go out with your best?
 
I like Mir more than I dislike him, but something about him I find irritating. Could be how he presents himself during interviews. Some people say the persona Jones puts out there is fake. I say that about Mir with the additional element of pretension. Never met the guy, though, and I could be wrong.

Mir looked slow and out-of-shape. At the weigh-in, he had a big gut even by Mir standards. I think Mir's strategy was to ground dos Santos—but that's easier said than done. There is no way Mir could have bullied dos Santos with a Sonnen-like takedown.

If you take a good look at Mir, it looks like he has been trying to lose the mass he put on to combat Lesnar. I think the best Mir is a leaner Mir. I won't completely blame the extra muscle for his slow hands in this fight, but surely it played a part.

As for Cormier and Velasquez, I think Cormier wrecking Silva is a much bigger statement than what Velasquez did tonight. Cormier said that he'd drop to 205 if he had to fight Velasquez for the title. Honestly, I think that's best for Velasquez, as, right now, I favor Cormier if that fight ever had to happen. Could Velasquez ground Cormier and hurt him with elbows? Maybe. But I think there is a greater possibility in Cormier rocking Velasquez, and when Cain instinctively shoots for the TD, it won't be there, and D.C. would finish with his heavy hands.

Just my two cents, tho.
 
Mir is a big dummy for only trying for one takedown the entire fight. I dont think he would've gotten Dos Santos down anyway but it was his only chance to win the fight and he doesn't even bother going for it again. Oh well. So I guess its going to be Cain and Dos Santos rematch? Who do yall like?
 
[quote name='Chase']Mir looked slow and out-of-shape. At the weigh-in, he had a big gut even by Mir standards. I think Mir's strategy was to ground dos Santos—but that's easier said than done. There is no way Mir could have bullied dos Santos with a Sonnen-like takedown.

If you take a good look at Mir, it looks like he has been trying to lose the mass he put on to combat Lesnar. I think the best Mir is a leaner Mir. I won't completely blame the extra muscle for his slow hands in this fight, but surely it played a part.[/QUOTE]

I agree. I think a 250 Mir is the best Mir. But that still doesn't change his skills. He was never going to outbox Junior in a million years. And I can recognize the "Oh shit, this isn't going to work" realization (like Lesnar had against Cain). But after one attempt? If anything, that came off as trying to get the takedown into Junior's head so he could have a better chance at boxing with him.

You'd think that after being put on queer street and STILL submitting one of the best BJJ guys in the sport's history, he might have refocused on what his strengths are...but no. Same crap ass "I'm going to stand toe to toe with Shane Carwin" Mir. Stupid.

Just like I said about Lesnar when he fought Overeem, if you're not going to bring your A game, don't even bother showing up. This fight was a waste of time to watch, and a pathetic challenger to feed to a fighter as good as Junior. Even though they've already fought, I think Roy Nelson could have done better (considering he's actually gotten serious and improved since that fight). Hell...I think Miocic could have done better than Mir. I'm ready to see some new blood in title contention.
 
[quote name='Chase']As for Cormier and Velasquez, I think Cormier wrecking Silva is a much bigger statement than what Velasquez did tonight. Cormier said that he'd drop to 205 if he had to fight Velasquez for the title. Honestly, I think that's best for Velasquez, as, right now, I favor Cormier if that fight ever had to happen. Could Velasquez ground Cormier and hurt him with elbows? Maybe. But I think there is a greater possibility in Cormier rocking Velasquez, and when Cain instinctively shoots for the TD, it won't be there, and D.C. would finish with his heavy hands.

Just my two cents, tho.[/QUOTE]



I agree with most of this. I think if these two ever fought(and sadly they wouldn't) I would favor Cormier. Cormier pretty much has the best wrestling in the division. The good thing about him is how he mixes his striking up. He throws combos instead of single strikes. He'll throw head kicks, and he has good movement and speed for a guy his size.
 
[quote name='Chase']I like Mir more than I dislike him, but something about him I find irritating. Could be how he presents himself during interviews. Some people say the persona Jones puts out there is fake. I say that about Mir with the additional element of pretension. Never met the guy, though, and I could be wrong.

Mir looked slow and out-of-shape. At the weigh-in, he had a big gut even by Mir standards. I think Mir's strategy was to ground dos Santos—but that's easier said than done. There is no way Mir could have bullied dos Santos with a Sonnen-like takedown.

If you take a good look at Mir, it looks like he has been trying to lose the mass he put on to combat Lesnar. I think the best Mir is a leaner Mir. I won't completely blame the extra muscle for his slow hands in this fight, but surely it played a part.

As for Cormier and Velasquez, I think Cormier wrecking Silva is a much bigger statement than what Velasquez did tonight. Cormier said that he'd drop to 205 if he had to fight Velasquez for the title. Honestly, I think that's best for Velasquez, as, right now, I favor Cormier if that fight ever had to happen. Could Velasquez ground Cormier and hurt him with elbows? Maybe. But I think there is a greater possibility in Cormier rocking Velasquez, and when Cain instinctively shoots for the TD, it won't be there, and D.C. would finish with his heavy hands.

Just my two cents, tho.[/QUOTE]

i agree excpt for the Cormier and velasquez thing

Velasquez has speed, and if JDS has proven anything its that size doesnt matter in the Heavyweight division, its speed
 
Here comes my extremely biased opinion.. Our stream was shit as hell all night, BUT we got to see the Valesquez vs Silva fight... All I have to say is that Cain is coming for that belt again.. and in devastating fashion.

Not to take anything away from JDS because he is actually one of my favorite fighters.. In my eyes, I see Cain as the more aggressive and dominating fighter. Sure, Cain is one of the smaller heavyweights, but I will never erase that image from my head of him man handling Lesnar around like a rag doll.

The guy has been training MMA for 6 (?) years and he has been a terror in the division. One of the smaller fighters, for sure, but boy does he bring it. I honestly can't speak on Cormier, because I have not seen him fight once... but from what I've read here recently, he's also one of those newbreeds and upcoming fighters.

All I can say with 100% positivity though, is that the UFC Heavy Weight division is THE most stacked division to be in right now. If Jon Bones decides to move up, there's a couple of matches I can see him having a hard time with.. regardless of his freakish athleticism and talent.

I've been out of the loop for a while, but this card just drew me back in. Hopefully I find myself getting involved in the discussions pretty soon! Cheers!
 
[quote name='bigpimpin24']All I can say with 100% positivity though, is that the UFC Heavy Weight division is THE most stacked division to be in right now.[/QUOTE]

lol...no. The Lightweight division is without question the deepest division. There are easily 5-6 guys in that division who could take the belt on any night. After Junior and Cain, the talent in the heavyweight division drops off pretty steeply. Lesnar was a pretender, Reem won't stay off the juice, Barnett is a juicer who ruined his legacy a decade ago, and Cormier shows promise, but will likely drop to 205. Other than that, you have Big Country. If he's a top contender, then that says it all for the heavies. I'll take fighters who don't gas in 60 seconds.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']lol...no. The Lightweight division is without question the deepest division. There are easily 5-6 guys in that division who could take the belt on any night. After Junior and Cain, the talent in the heavyweight division drops off pretty steeply. Lesnar was a pretender, Reem won't stay off the juice, Barnett is a juicer who ruined his legacy a decade ago, and Cormier shows promise, but will likely drop to 205. Other than that, you have Big Country. If he's a top contender, then that says it all for the heavies. I'll take fighters who don't gas in 60 seconds.[/QUOTE]

You're absolutely right. I kind of got ahead of myself. Lightweight does have Pettis, Diaz, Edgar, Henderson, Maynard, Miller and some others. My bad :whistle2:#
 
[quote name='bigpimpin24']You're absolutely right. I kind of got ahead of myself. Lightweight does have Pettis, Diaz, Edgar, Henderson, Maynard, Miller and some others. My bad :whistle2:#[/QUOTE]

It's ok. Some people get excited over big, strong men, lol ;) j/k. I've just gotten sick of seeing fighters gas over the years...which happens most often with heavyweights. The lighter weight classes tend to be much more technical, and contrary to popular belief, there are still plenty of knockouts.

Your list is also omitting Guida, Cerrone, and Guillard (though his stock has dropped a bit). And it's pretty crazy to think that we're talking about the depth of the division AFTER BJ Penn retired. That says something. You could toss any of those names up into the air and get a hell of a fight.
 
Nate, perhaps Mir's plan was to pace himself for a five-round fight. Takedowns can be tiring, and for someone with cardio that fades after round three, if I were Mir, I'd work a jab and look for a good opening that doesn't get myself brained by the power of Cigano. I think Frank Mir did the best he could for Frank Mir.

I think the person who beats Cigano will need an iron chin, a lot of power and skill in their hands and legs, and the ability to time the perfect strike. I still want to see Mark Hunt get a crack at Cigano. Now, this would probably be the fight where Cigano uses his boxing to open up a trip and submits Hunt, but Hunt has an iron chin and enough power and technique to make it interesting on the feet. Overeem would be another interesting challenger. He could try to hurt Cigano's legs with kicks while looking for an opening to do some damage. I think I'd favor Cigano by TKO because his chin is better, but it would be an interesting fight to see unfold. I'd also like to see Rothwell pick up some wins and get a chance at the title.

Shine, I'm a fan of Cormier's combos. He has picked up a lot at AKA, including some sweet striking skills. I think his speed is comparable to the speed of Velasquez (who has wicked quick hands). And Rylin, Velasquez is taller and usually weighs more than Cormier. ;)

I don't yet know who I'd pick in Velasquez-Dos Santos 2. I can't help but think Cain's chin is a red flag. Kongo rocked him multiple times. Now, Kongo has power in his hands, but Cigano has so much more power in his hands. I can't see Cain wrestling Cigano to the mat and having him there long enough to do a lot of damage. I can see Cain using his quickness to clip and damage Dos Santos. But, can I see Cain finishing Dos Santos? Not unless Dos Santos is hurt going into the fight. (And Dos Santos couldn't even walk a week before the first fight.)

And hey, speaking of heavies, I updated the OP with news about Roy Nelson calling out Brock Lesnar. That would be an interesting fight.
 
Biggest surprise of the night for me was Varner taking out Barboza. It seemed like the UFC was trying to groom Barboza into a title contender, and after watching a couple of Varner's fights in regional promotions, I thought this was just going to be another gimme fight that Barboza would win easily.

But I guess now we get the intrigue of Varner's comeback as a dark horse looking for revenge on his old WEC opponents.
 
[quote name='zewone']It's funny that anyone pays any attention to what Thekrakrabbit has to say. He's proven time and time again to have no idea what he is talking about. And not just about MMA, any and all subjects he lacks comprehension.[/QUOTE]

LOL.

On a somewhat related note, Mir said that he was forced into a striking match with Dos Santos. He only tried one takedown and after that was stuffed apparently he gave up mentally. He never had a hope of surviving against JDS in a striking match and the fact that he didn't try but one takedown in the first minute makes me think he was never that confident anyway, or at the very least his confidence was burnt up when he got stuffed once.

Varner taking out Barboza was a shock though. I was pretty high on Barboza but not only did he get outstruck and knocked out but his takedown defense was shattered in that fight as well. If he was getting KO'd by Varner that hard then perhaps durability will be a real issue for him in the future.

On a sidenote, The Ultimate Fighter 15 Finale is this Saturday. Who becomes TUF?
 
I like Barboza and did expect him to run thru Varner, but I was never that high on him like i've seen others. His original opponent was going to be Evan Dunham before he got injured and I was picking Dunham to win. He had never been tested, never faced a good wrestler, never really been hit clean, and I felt he should've lost his fight with Ross Pearson...there was alot of question marks about him. I dont know if its just one of those things where sometimes a guy just gets caught or if he has defensive liabilites... not trying to make excuses but maybe the change in opponent could've messed him up...Varner fought like a guy with nothing to lose because he really didnt have anything to lose and he made the most of it. Either way, its a big set back for him. It'll be interesting to see how he does in his next fight.
 
[quote name='shotgunshine']I like Barboza and did expect him to run thru Varner, but I was never that high on him like i've seen others. His original opponent was going to be Evan Dunham before he got injured and I was picking Dunham to win. He had never been tested, never faced a good wrestler, never really been hit clean, and I felt he should've lost his fight with Ross Pearson...there was alot of question marks about him. I dont know if its just one of those things where sometimes a guy just gets caught or if he has defensive liabilites... not trying to make excuses but maybe the change in opponent could've messed him up...Varner fought like a guy with nothing to lose because he really didnt have anything to lose and he made the most of it. Either way, its a big set back for him. It'll be interesting to see how he does in his next fight.[/QUOTE]

Was a huge setback to him. I was siding with him against Dunham and thought Varner was an even easier fight, but he really disappointed everyone in that fight.

He has never really been hit cleanly but displayed some sick counter punching and technical ability in previous fights. None of that was there tonight, he had no answer to a flurry of punches and the occasional takedown mixed in. Clearly his chin is not up to par either, getting KO'd that hard by Jamie Varner.
 
[quote name='Thekrakrabbit']On a sidenote, The Ultimate Fighter 15 Finale is this Saturday. Who becomes TUF?[/QUOTE]


Iaquinta has been more impressive. In general, in terms of talent, this season has been really underwhelming. I think it's safe to assume that any of them (Iaquinta, Chiesa, Lawrence, Scillia, etc.) would be crushed by the mid-tier talent at 155. I think Iaquinta has been the most impressive fighter this season—with Jury in tow. But, put any of them in the Octagon with a good mid-tier lightweight, like Ross Pearson, and I think Pearson eats them up.

In the freshly updated main post, I think the most interesting news, as of late, is Franklin stepping in to replace Belfort against Silva. Anyone else think Franklin retires Silva with a solid knockout?
 
I would say a Franklin KO would be plausible. This is almost guaranteed to be mainly a stand up battle and Silva's chin is on the decline. On the other hand Ace is also on the decline and Silva still has nasty punches if he can connect. I would say 6-4 advantage goes to Ace simply because I feel he has slightly better technical striking than Wand.

I have "Saku Blues" seeing this match-up. Both these guys are on the decline and have nothing else to prove, and it's going to be a bit depressing if one of them gets wrecked.
 
Franklin and Wanderlei? Really? Well that show went from already being ehhhh to being pretty bad...and the co main event is Fabricio Werdum vs Mike Russow...what an awful show. I wouldn't care if its a tape delayed free show or something but this is a ppv. I almost always order the UFC shows but will be missing this one...maybe i'll go to a bar to watch it if I can get a couple of friends to go.

I guess if anything its good for Wanderlei because he would've been destroyed by Belfort. He actually has a decent chance to beat Franklin. Franklin is nowhere near as good as he used to be, hasen't fought in well over a year and is like 37. Yeah, Wandy isn't anything great nowadays either but I think its kind of a toss up, though I favor Franklin. If Wandy loses, he really needs to retire.
 
Franklin isn't a genius fighter and doesn't have but 5% in the tank that he did "in his prime". Don't count out Wandy in this one, they both can be finished quickly.
 
I'd say its a coin flip.I don't think Franklin has that sort of one punch knock out power to put Wanderlei's lights out so easily.Their first fight with Wandy's chin already being not what it use to be managed to go three rounds and was super close.I might even slightly favor Wandy since Franklin is coming back from shoulder surgery and has been out for over a year.About 50/50 here so can't go too wrong.

On the bright side yeah, at least Wandy doesn't have to go through a brutal KO by the hands of Vitor.
 
Ultimate Fighter Finale is tonight! Other then the very first show, where guys have to fight to get into the house, I haven't watched one episode...so it'll be interesting to see how I do on my picks since I pretty much dont know anyone on the show.
 
I can't remember all my picks for the Pick Em. However, I do remember that I picked Chiesa by SUB. In general, most fighters for (the recently canceled by FX) TUF Live have been underwhelming in regards to talent. I may have also picked Jury by decision and the dude who had bad acne by grinding UD.

Oh, and hey, I picked Kampmann over Ellenberger. I did my legwork. I think Ellenberger is a larger Rick Story, and see the fight playing out like Kampmann-Story. Put out a photo on Twitter showing a part of my file on Kampmann. (Not included on Twitter is how much I put on Kampmann.)

We shall see! I expect be a bunch finishes considering the level of talent outside of Kampmann-Ellenberger (which may also be a finish.)
 
UFC 147 looks like a horrible card. I am pretty disappointed. Cung Li and Franklin were something I was looking forward to watching in person.

Meh...
 
[quote name='Chase']I can't remember all my picks for the Pick Em. However, I do remember that I picked Chiesa by SUB. In general, most fighters for (the recently canceled by FX) TUF Live have been underwhelming in regards to talent. I may have also picked Jury by decision and the dude who had bad acne by grinding UD.

Oh, and hey, I picked Kampmann over Ellenberger. I did my legwork. I think Ellenberger is a larger Rick Story, and see the fight playing out like Kampmann-Story. Put out a photo on Twitter showing a part of my file on Kampmann. (Not included on Twitter is how much I put on Kampmann.)

We shall see! I expect be a bunch finishes considering the level of talent outside of Kampmann-Ellenberger (which may also be a finish.)[/QUOTE]

I went back and forth with Ellenberger-Kampmann and I decided to go with Kampmann, who for some reason is pretty underrated. I also think he should've won both fights with Diego Sanchez and Jake Shields. Ellenberger has big power and could crack him early but I think Kampmann will take a decision or maybe even a late sub as Ellenberger has problems with good ju jitsu guys(see Carlos Condit and Carlos Eduardo Rocha)
 
Ref did a horrible job on the stoppage of Marcello-Sicilia match. This was my first time seeing them fight and both of them were extremely unimpressive. Sicilia is going to have to change his entire game to compete with even lower level UFC lightweights...a wins a win though so good for him.
 
Kim Winslow will get someone killed. She's worse than Jim Axtell, Greg Franklin, and That Mustached fuck.

However, I did pick (and put money on) Perez. So, no complaints here.
 
[quote name='shotgunshine']Ref did a horrible job on the stoppage of Marcello-Sicilia match. This was my first time seeing them fight and both of them were extremely unimpressive. Sicilia is going to have to change his entire game to compete with even lower level UFC lightweights...a wins a win though so good for him.[/QUOTE]

I thought he let it go on a bit too long myself. I also was not impressed at all at the caliber of the fight. Way too many wild punches and both of them having their hands at the waist like that is just asking to get KO'd by a half decent striker.
 
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