MMA (Mixed Martial Arts) Thread: UFC/Strikeforce

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[quote name='Moxio']Scorch, use Sopcast's.

sop://broker.sopcast.com:3912/24267[/QUOTE]

I don't know how to use that link.

//edit: Downloading Sopcast, I'll figure it out.

Figured it out, thanks.
 
I can't believe he got out of that choke. Wow.

GREAT first round, but I think Randy's worn himself out with all of the punches. Nogueira really caught him off guard with the temple shot, I thought he was definitely going to tap out to the choke hold.
 
GREAT fight. I thought Nogueira had Couture several times.. the first choke, the submission in the second, the near-KO in the third, then the other submission in the third.. Randy's great, but Nogueira had the edge tonight.
 
Meh, lot of quick knockouts, but the main event was just plain epic.

Also, no knock against Couture, but legit question - How is he considered one of the best of all time with a now 16-10 record? It wasn't long ago that I started following UFC, but the last few fights of his I've seen were all losses.
 
^I was thinking that too; to preserve his legacy he should have retired at 16-8 or fought cream puffs/gatekeepers, not contenders.
 
I was just curious as to what he's done in his earlier fights to be considered the greatest of all time. I know he had the belt for a while, but still, even 16-8 seems like nothing compared to Nog with his 32-5-1 record.
 
  • UFC 13 heavyweight tournament winner
  • Interim UFC light heavyweight champion
  • Most light heavyweight world championship belt (2x)
  • Most heavyweight world championship belt (3x)
  • Most championship belt in UFC history (6x)
  • Most world championship belt in UFC history (5x)
  • Most title fight fought in UFC history (15x)
  • Oldest fighter to win a world championship belt in UFC history (43 year, 255 days)
  • First fighter in UFC history to hold two world championship titles
  • First fighter in UFC history to become a champion after being inducted into the Hall of Fame
He beat Kevin Randelman back at UFC 28 to become HW champ. Beat Pedro Rizzo twice and then got beat by Barnett(who later tested positive for roids). Next he lost to Ricco Rodriguez and left HW for awhile.


Couture moved down a weight class to fight at 205 lbs in the UFC's light heavyweight division. In his light heavyweight debut, Couture took on long-time number one contender Chuck Lidell for the interim light heavyweight championship.Couture won by TKO in the third round, and became the only UFC competitor to win championship titles in two weight classes, a feat since matched in 2008 by BJ Penn; this earned Couture his nickname "Captain America".

His next match was billed as a "Champion vs. Champion" fight in order to settle who was the rightful, undisputed champion of the division. Couture faced the five-time defending champion Tito Ortiz for the undisputed light heavyweight title. Couture won a unanimous decision and became the undisputed UFC light heavyweight champion at age 40.

At the age of 43, Couture defeated then-champion Tim Sylvia at UFC 68 by unanimous decision to claim his third UFC heavyweight title. numerous takedowns. All three judges' scored the bout 50-45 for Couture, making him the first fighter in UFC history to become a three-time champion.
On August 25, 2007, at UFC 74 Couture defended his title against Gabriel Gonzaga, Couture defeated Gonzaga by TKO (strikes) to retain the title.

Overall Nog's resume is better in my opinion he has consistantly fought some of the toughest guys in MMA in PRIDE(including FEDOR twice).

However Couture is still doing it at age 46! I swear at this rate he might make it to 50!
 
Ah, okay. That seems like a pretty large list of accomplishments. I'd say he's losing his touch if it wasn't for that fight with nog. I really thought the fight was over at about 7 different points in the match... Props to him for sticking with it. Great fight by both guys - shame it wasn't 5 rounds.
 
[quote name='seen']^I was thinking that too; to preserve his legacy he should have retired at 16-8 or fought cream puffs/gatekeepers, not contenders.[/QUOTE]

thats a pussy thing to do. fight cans to maintain some stupid record. more than half his fights were championship fights. you obviously dont understand competition or you would see why fighting guys he would smash wouldnt be worth it for him or any fighter.
thats one thing that will never change in american fans, the obsession with records. look at sakuraba considered one of the best middleweights and best fighters ever at any weight and look at his record.
it irks me when people look at records with no interest in the fights themselves.
 
Couture did a lot of shit in the UFC when the UFC was garbage. Now that the UFC is the premiere fighting organization, he couldn't pull half the crap he did.
 
Yeah, I'm not even a huge Couture fan, but I can recognize the guy has done some incredible things that nobody thought he could do. As Joe Rogan mentioned Saturday night, people thought Couture was done when he was training to fight Tito Ortiz. All he's done since that point is win two more titles.

Another interesting point Rogan touched on is that Nogueira is currently one year younger NOW than Couture was when he had his first UFC fight. One of the most impressive things about Randy's resume is that every single one of those accomplishments were attained after the age of 34.

When you compare him to other guys in his age range that were once big UFC stars, it's like watching "Where Are They Now". Couture is actually OLDER than Ken Shamrock, Royce Gracie, Bas Rutten, Tank Abbott, Don Frye, and Mark Coleman. Just the fact that Couture is even relevant in the UFC is an unbelievable achievement.

As for seen's suggestion that Couture "preserve his legacy" by fighting creampuffs, I think the fact that he hasn't says even more about him. He's not a bitch and he doesn't back down from anybody. He didn't embarrass himself against Lesnar, and he certainly didn't embarrass himself against Nogueira. Personally, I'd like to see him drop down to 205 again and see what he can do against guys like Rashad Evans or even Anderson Silva. Hell, I'd even like to see him fight Tito again.
 
[quote name='paz9x']thats one thing that will never change in american fans, the obsession with records.[/QUOTE]

Well, seen is a big boxing fan. And you know the prestige of a fighter's record is a much bigger deal in pro boxing (where good fighters often do fight a lot of cans). That's how you get guys who end their careers 58-0. One thing I've heard dozens of MMA fighters say is "If you've never lost, you're fighting the wrong people." And that's the truth.
 
Couture is a legend because he delivers what the fans want.

He'll pretty much fight anyone people want to see him fight, you can see that in his resume. I mean shit, there was talk about him dropping weight and fighting Lyoto Machita for the light heavyweight title if people want him to.

And yeah, in MMA, records are less important than saying boxing. Dana White has said multiple times, and I agree with him, it doesn't matter if you win or lose its HOW you win or lose. Despite Couture's record, his fights are always entertaining, which is a big reason as to why he is such a legend in MMA.

And with his new contract, that's supposed to be 3 (I think?) fights or 28 months, he'll be almost 50 like another poster says. If he loses his next 3 fights, but puts on a show like he did at 102, he'll still be considered a legend.
 
zewone must be a mma n00b to really have zero respect for one of the sports greatest athletes.

for long timers mma has really been royce, tito, frank shamrock, randy, and chuck eras.

now you've got penn, machida, gsp, lesnar, and silva as champions. i have no idea which one will lose first.

penn vs. diego sanchez?
gsp vs. ???
silva vs. marquardt 2 (now without early stoppage!)
machida vs. rampage?
lesnar vs. carwin?

i'd say penn probably faces the most dangerous opponent as long as diego doesn't fall in love with his hands and try to outbox him.

nate the great is really the best answer the MW division has to anderson outside of paulo filho who will never fight him.
 
[quote name='zewone']Couture did a lot of shit in the UFC when the UFC was garbage. Now that the UFC is the premiere fighting organization, he couldn't pull half the crap he did.[/QUOTE]

thats like belittling wilt chamberlains achievements because the sport wasnt as evolved during his career.
Thats also what I was referring to when I say people care about the records more than the actual fights.
Youre missing a lot if you dont understand or care to understand the relevance and circumstances of the fights at the time. the mo smith and tito fights especially.
 
[quote name='Kuroi Kaze']zewone must be a mma n00b to really have zero respect for one of the sports greatest athletes.

for long timers mma has really been royce, tito, frank shamrock, randy, and chuck eras.
[/QUOTE]
That's funny. I've probably been involved with the sport longer than you have.
[quote name='paz9x']thats like belittling wilt chamberlains achievements because the sport wasnt as evolved during his career.
Thats also what I was referring to when I say people care about the records more than the actual fights.
Youre missing a lot if you dont understand or care to understand the relevance and circumstances of the fights at the time. the mo smith and tito fights especially.[/QUOTE]
What can I say? I'm not a fan of Randy's and I think he's way too overhyped. Call me a hater if you like. Tito is nothing special, (anyone) beating him means absolutely nothing to me.
 
I think zewone just does not like fighters with a wrestling background that win by controlling their opponent. Both Tito and Randy win by controlling their foes and grinding them out on top. Neither one really has one hit knockout power or extraordinary submission skills so I can see where he does not like them. But you can't take away from the fact that they have both had better careers than most.
 
[quote name='zewone']Yeah, they both got lucky and got famous. That is true.[/QUOTE]

Ok I'm not sure if I am actually interpreting your post correctly or not. Are you saying that the success of Tito Ortiz and Randy Couture is due to luck? Is that really what you are saying here? I could understand picking out a certain fight and calling the winner lucky in how they won the fight, but using the term "luck" when referring to careers?

Are you positive you are following MMA?
 
[quote name='zewone']Haha, ok, whatever. I know how much you guys love ground and pound and dirty boxing. Carry on.[/QUOTE]

you either come off as a bit of a jackass or you are. your posts in this thread are uneducated.
theyre the opinions id expect from someone walking into the middle of a conversation.
 
Haha, alright. I am an asshole. I really don't care. I don't know how uneducated they can be when I'm not trying to show off my vast MMA knowledge. At least I can capitalize and use proper punctuation.

I don't like the guy (as a fighter). I think he sucks (as a fighter). That's my point.
 
[quote name='zewone']Haha, alright. I am an asshole. I really don't care. I don't know how uneducated they can be when I'm not trying to show off my vast MMA knowledge. At least I can capitalize and use proper punctuation.

I don't like the guy (as a fighter). I think he sucks (as a fighter). That's my point.[/QUOTE]

nice, ill be sure to follow zewone's guide to online grammar. you mentioned youd been a fan longer than another cag, that sounds like you are trying to say your opinions are superior to his.
theres no need to be a jerk.
you make statements without any reasoning and make racial comments.
if you think youre going to post things like that and nobody will engage you in discussion youre wrong.
if you have no desire to engage in discussion you have no business posting here.
 
You should notice that Kuroi Kaze was the one calling into question how long I've watched the sport.

That's fine. People can comment on my comments all they want, doesn't mean that I won't comment back.
 
there is a 0% chance you've been into mma longer because i got in at the beginning. i'm 30 years old and have trained at mma gyms for nearly 6 years.

you obviously don't train in any discipline because getting your ass kicked in the gym washes out personality traits like yours.
 
[quote name='Maklershed']I don't think anyone back in the early days could handle the new breed of fighters. Even Gracie would have a tough time handling the stand up aspect.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, this is most definitely true. It's not to say that the fighters back then weren't as good, but hardly anybody cross-trained between disciplines. The whole concept of UFC in the first place was to see "which discipline was the best".

I've said many times that in my opinion Don Frye was the forefather of the modern MMA athlete because he was one of the first with a legitimate stand-up game who also had a wrestling background. As far as Gracie Jiu-Jitsu goes, it's been essentially exploited since the days of Royce. Guys are way too strong now to allow themselves to just be held in place. It's just the evolution of the sport.
 
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