MMA (UFC, Strikeforce, Bellator, Invicta, etc.) Discussion Thread -- Version II

I guess they aren't going to try and replace the headliner, so now it is a FS1 card. Makes sense since there sales would have been horrible. I'd also be pissed if I had tickets for the event.

UFC must've not even spoke to Werdum before announcing that. Crazy on their part.

The holding up the division for rematches and title shots is getting crazy. People are getting derailed so nobody is on a streak. Arlovski was the last one. Great streak and most deserving of a shot, and then boom he's out of the picture. Now with champ and Cain injured there aren't many HW's left who aren't injured or booked upcoming. Have Reem vs Stipe sounds good, but then you knock one out of potential title contenders down the ladder.

Also - Cain has no business getting a rematch right away after that fight. He was beaten for 3 or 4 rounds. It wasn't a flash knockout like Aldo or a super close decision like Lawler's wins.

 
I don't even want immediate rematches for flash KO's. Not Aldo...not Ronda...not Anderson. Nobody. That basically equates to "But but...I wasn't ready!" Tough shit. You came in unprepared, didn't take your opponent seriously, and got steamrolled. Maybe getting knocked down the ladder will help you regain your focus.

The fights that SHOULD get immediate rematches are ones that essentially should be draws but nobody wants to see a draw. Lawler/Condit and Dillashaw/Cruz are the only fights recently I can think of that actually warrant immediate rematches. Those guys fought their freaking hearts out, and convinced some people that they actually won. Let us see those contests again. Not "what could have happened if Fighter X hadn't been a dumb ass".

If the UFC would take this policy and the interim belt policy seriously, we'd have a lot more interesting fights. I guarantee it.

 
And then the problem is you have the UFC (and Cruz) talking about having Faber fight for the belt next...and Dillashaw points out that he had to fight Barao again after dominating him. And he's right. But that's another rematch that shouldn't have happened. They've gone too far down this damn rabbit hole...and it has to stop at some point. Otherwise, you're just playing favorites.

 
n8rockerasu said:
And then the problem is you have the UFC (and Cruz) talking about having Faber fight for the belt next...and Dillashaw points out that he had to fight Barao again after dominating him. And he's right. But that's another rematch that shouldn't have happened. They've gone too far down this damn rabbit hole...and it has to stop at some point. Otherwise, you're just playing favorites.
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I agree they have no logic in who they decide gets immediate rematches, except who they like. They like Anderson Silva so he gets one. They don't like Aldo, so no rematch for you. TJ has to crush Barao twice, etc.

They've opened up a can of worms with the rematches in that it looks like favoritism when they start throwing them out to certain people
(which they are). Cain is getting twice. Once after getting quick ko'd and then again after being destroyed.

For this weekend. Rumble vs Bader is a very interesting fight. It may be "boring" if Rumble tires out after 6 minutes and just gets wrestled for the rest of the fight, but it will show at what level both of these guys are at. Rumble has looked great, but only when taking people's heads off. He looked amazing for 90 seconds of the Cormier fight, and then done. Especially of his back. His only technique was to try and bench him off. He had no idea how to defend/escape from half guard or any other positions. If Rumble hasn't improved Bader will be able to capitalize of that and just eventually overwhelm him on the ground.

On the other hand, Bader has some of the most spectacular KO' and finishes ever. Machida's was beautiful. Glover's was great too. Then there was getting dropped by Tito (lol).

I kind of feel bad for Bader. For someone who is so highly ranked and with top 10 wins, I can't remember anything from all his fights except for all his losses. All four finishes were spectacular. I still watch the Tito one on youtube once in a while. The only thing that ever stuck to me in a fight he won was when Rumble slammed him on his head.

 
Poor Bader. Once again he is on the wrong side of a highlight reel finish. We'll be watching Rumble relieve him of his senses for years to come. Can't wait to see Johnson again. Only problem with most of his fights is that I can't even enjoy a snack or a drink during them. I sit down get comfortable and boom it is over.

Final thoughts on Bader - why on God's name did he hold onto the kimura while being mounted? That was some whitebelt level stuff you do when you are scared.

Biggest surprise was Rothwell. Barnett did not respect the grappling of Rothwell and paid for it. Barnett is one of the best HW grapplers of all time so that was crazy to see him guillotined.

And Sage looked horrible on the ground. The hype train went off the tracks. That was all from panic. There is no way that choke was tight. It was completely on the wrong side of the body so the pressure was completely just squeezing and not leverage.

 
That Johnson finish was really cool. I've never cared for Bader so always happy when others make him look bad.

Sage fight was weird, Joe was calling him out pretty bad for that quick tap.

 
tylerh1701 said:
That Johnson finish was really cool. I've never cared for Bader so always happy when others make him look bad.

Sage fight was weird, Joe was calling him out pretty bad for that quick tap.
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I looked online and apparently Saga is a purple belt at BJJ which is "supposed" to mean you are pretty legit. There are obviously huge gaps in levels of purple belts from your recreational guy to your tournament competitor.

Now that I've thought about it - Sage could be a decent enough grappler to be a purple belt, but he may have gotten overwhelmed by the moment. I remember some of my early wrestling/jiu jitsu/judo tournaments, and i did stupid stuff, paniced, etc. Especially when someone is beating you. It is so easy to just get instantly disheartened and want it all to end.

On the other hand I wasn't be paid 40K to show and 40K to win.

 
Probably a good move for him. He's my favorite fighter but he'said kinda been floating around since losing the belt. Wonder if he'll stay at 170, I hope he goes back to 155.
 
They offered him an immediate title shot against the 170lb champion, Andrey Koreshkov. I don't know. It's an interesting move, but as others have said, Bellator is dangerous because it's only useful to Viacom as long as it's making money. Viacom doesn't care about MMA in the same way that the Fertita brothers and Dana White do.

As soon as Bellator starts spending more than they're bringing in (which could easily happen if they keep signing fighters to these huge contracts), they could be done for. It's basically what WCW did when it was trying to rival WWF. It was awesome for a little while. And then it blew up in their face.

 
Set for 199...same as CM Punk. So, there are literally zero big fights (other than Jon Jones, maybe) for UFC 200. It's so weird how they're scheduling things.
 
I will give them a little bit of an excuse for the Weidman/Rockhold rematch. Romero completely screwed that up (and his career) by being popped. He just beat Jacare in the number 1 contender match. Even thought I thought Jacare won, it is hard to probably sell it after Romero won the number 1 contender fight.

I'm a big fan of Jacare but his wins of the Mousasi and more recently Camozzi was not as impressive as Romero stomping of Machida. Then Romero beat Jacare.

I would've given the title shot to Jacare, but I can see why they decided to go with the rematch. I don't agree with it, but it isn't as bad as  Werdum v Cain and alot of the other ones.

Biggest news to me is Penn likely fighting in just over a month. Crazy to think about. I really really hope he just isn't smashed. He will be the last legend of that era of UFC still kicking around (Randy, Liddell, Matt Hughes, GSP).

 
Been watching the episodes of Dana White's Looking for a fight and man the stuff is great. Dana, Serra and Tooth are pretty fun to watch. I wish there were more episodes :(

 
That did not go the way I thought it would. I expected a grind out by Hendricks. Happy to get some different blood at the top of the heap. Lawler still has some interesting matches ahead like Maia, Wonderboy and Woodley. I'd be happy to see any of those.

Nelson looked like crap. I wouldn't have cared if he didn't get the decision. It was just a bad bad fight. He is done being anything close to a top guy.

 
My favorite thing about the Fight Night cards isn't even the fights. It's this

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWxAvq1DCDc[/youtube]

Obviously, a lot ot watch/listen to in one sitting...but the conversations are hilarious. The first 15 minutes of this one was gold in and of itself.

 
I wonder if Punk will get starched in 30 seconds. I haven't looked online for any recent training videos, but his white belt in jiu jitsu won't help him that much if Gall is 1/2 as good as he looked this weekend.

Rogan's podcast looks interesting enough, but usually I can catch any interesting tid-bits mentioned on other forums.

How is Bravo on it? I imagine he spends most of the time talking about weed, the Rubber Guard and all the "cool" names for his techniques. Time for the Cannabis Clutch!

 
Dokstarr said:
I wonder if Punk will get starched in 30 seconds. I haven't looked online for any recent training videos, but his white belt in jiu jitsu won't help him that much if Gall is 1/2 as good as he looked this weekend.

Rogan's podcast looks interesting enough, but usually I can catch any interesting tid-bits mentioned on other forums.

How is Bravo on it? I imagine he spends most of the time talking about weed, the Rubber Guard and all the "cool" names for his techniques. Time for the Cannabis Clutch!
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Yeah, Eddie and Joe are usually high as hell, lol. And Eddie mostly talks about conspiracy theories and watching shit on Netflix. Every time anybody mentions a movie/show/documentary, he's like "Is that on Netflix? No? Dammit." I enjoy it just for the conversation. Makes you realize how normal these guys are. Just regular dudes laughing at the same goofy shit we all do.

There was one where he went on for like 15 minutes talking about shark attacks. It was pretty amazing, haha. :)

 
And CM Punk is out again. This time for back surgery. He was fine Sunday but unable to move Tuesday and now will be out for like 2 months. Add that to recoop time maybe end of 2016.

I wonder if watching the fight on Saturday had him say holy crap - I don't want to be choked out or knocked out on a blockbuster ppv in 25 seconds.

Punk should honestly just cancel the whole thing and ride off in the sunset. He is rich and popular. His back got worse when going to train with the New Jersey Devils. Practicing with a NHL team isn't going to make him a better MMA fighter. Why go out there and get blasted in front of everyone.

He's not Lashely, Lesnar or any other high level wrestler who has transferred over. Lashley who was training for the Olympics still hasn't made it "big". His last fight was against James Thompson (of Kimbo Slice and Pudz fame). 

He should've approached like Batista. Batista wanted to be a fighter. Had the look, talked trash, etc. Trained and took a fight at a regional bingo hall style show in Providence, RI. The guy who he beat was 3-19 in his last 22 fight. Was also 40, 5ft10 and 300 lbs and made Roy Nelson look in shape. And even for the first 2 or 3 minutes, the guy was beating Batista and pinning him up against the cage. Batista did eventually get him down where it was apparent the other guy had no idea what to do, and that was it.

Batista never fought again and never even spoke about fighting again. He became Drax and is making that Marvel/Disney money now.

If Punk wants to just say that he is "a fighter", he should do a show at a VFW. Find some over the hill weekend warrior who wants to make a quick buck. Mickey Gall may not be a world beater, but he is young a serious about his future as a fighter.

 
Totally agree. Punk is in dream land and is being enabled by Dana White. The sad thing is, for as much shit as Sage Northcutt gets...that kid actually is a fighter...and actually got thrown in the deep end rather quickly. Punk has less time left in his athletic career and is being coddled even more. Guess that's what being rich and famous gets you.

It's legitimately more offensive than Kimbo Slice fighting in the UFC at this point. Punk playing as himself in the new UFC game is probably the closest he's ever going to get, lol.

 
At least Kimbo had somesort of "background". It wasn't much of a background (as seen by him getting KO'd by Seth Petruzelli and fighting top tier fighters like Ken Shamrock and Tank Abbott), but at least it was  something that legitimately had you trying to KO the other guy.

Punk isn't Lesner, Lashley, Bad News Brown (Judo Olympic medalist), or even Earthquake (forget his real name) who was a successful sumo wrestler. Punk is almost 40 and has no combat sport or wrestling experience. He is a white belt in BJJ. Lets say he is even blue belt level in BJJ. That doesn't mean anything. There are probably at least 3000 active blue belts in this country, along with college/high school wrestlers, judokas, amateur boxers, etc. who are all much more prepared for UFC.

I'm never usually a conspiracy theory kind of guy, but this could be the only time in recent memory that I could ever possibly think that UFC may encourage the fight to a certain way. I'm sure it won't happen, but if some weird finish happens and then years later it comes out I wouldn't be completely surprised.

 
Thank God the nightmare finally ended.

Kimbo Slice vs Dada5000 may be the worst professional fight I've seen of all time. Both were gassed about 30 seconds into it and never recovered.

Kimbo would just lean on Dada to make him fall over. Then Kimbo showed he has never taken a grappling class in his life by appearing scared in full mount. I really thought John was going to start taking points away when Dada refused to get up from the ground or off the stool.

Then there was that final Mike Tyson's Punch-Out!! esque fall in which Dada rolled flailed around the ring and eventually flopped down comically. I did enjoy that Dada had to be taken away by stretcher with oxygen. I would never be happy someone has to go away via stretcher, but in this case it wasn't due to any damage or injury is was just because he was so incredibly out of shape that he needed O2 and an ambulance.

I also thought Kimbo was going to fall over during the post fight. After the "interview" he just kind of bent over and it looked like his corner was going to have to carry him away.

Then the Ken vs Royce fight. Another mess. Ken looked every bit his age and Royce looked weird in his eyes almost like he was scared. I do think Ken was shot no matter what, but it sucks that Royce just ball shotted him for the finish.

I usually don't buy into the Gracie's are dirty talk, but the post fight speech and then the post fight conference both had Royce talking really weird. He said both times that him and Ken come from a time of no rules, no gloves and groin shots allowed. Real fighters when you could do anything. Then he said I didn't low blow him, but we did come from a time when that was normal and good. Then he give that big goofy smile.

It felt like Royce was writing his own "If I Did It".

 
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mitch079 said:
Apparently that fight almost killed Dada as his heart stopped and had to be resucitated after he was taken to the hospital. http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mma-cagewriter/dada-5000-in-stable-condition-after-his-heart-reportedly-stopped-following-loss-to-kimbo-slice-223108957-mma.html
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I don't know if I believe all of that.

Supposedly it was due to his severe weight cut, but he came in like 8 or 9 lbs under the limit.

Nobody weight cuts and extra 10 lbs. If you go through a hard cut even an extra 1/2 pound can be nearly impossible, but he goes and cuts almost an extra 10?

Maybe he almost had a heart attack from living hard, out of shape, and not training or had some other underlying issue, but the weight cut is just flat out wrong unless he doesn't know how to use a scale.

 
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Dokstarr said:
Supposedly it was due to his severe weight cut, but he came in like 8 or 9 lbs under the limit.
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Not sure if you're thinking of somebody else, but Dada weighed in at exactly 265. Considering how horribly out of shape he looked, I don't doubt anything about any medical problems he suffered after that horrifying debacle.

In other news, Cowboy vs Cowboy tonight! Great showing from Cerrone. I was a little worried about him getting pushed around, but he fought smart and used his full skillset. Glad he didn't just stand there and try to bang with him. Always freaking entertaining, man.

 
TheN8torious said:
Not sure if you're thinking of somebody else, but Dada weighed in at exactly 265. Considering how horribly out of shape he looked, I don't doubt anything about any medical problems he suffered after that horrifying debacle.
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I stand corrected. When I watched I somehow thought it was like 256 or something. I was way off.

Then it was just he didn't train or prep at all for this fight and came in disgusting shape. I don't wish anyone ill, but you think with how much money he was being paid he would at least put in a tiny bit of effort.

I haven't seen the payouts yet for this - but I'm sure him and Kimbo pretty much just had money thrown at them.

 
Wow...RDA broke his foot and pulled out of UFC 196.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2618942-rafael-dos-anjos-vs-conor-mcgregor-reportedly-cancelled-due-to-dos-anjos-injury

Obviously, this is a legitimate injury, but it's crazy how many of Conor's opponents have pulled out of fights. If you go back through his fight history, he's had more guys pull out than show up. I really can't think of a fighter this has happened to more often.

They're trying to find a replacement, but it won't be Frankie Edgar. I don't think that would be fair anyway. McGregor trained for a 155lb fight. You can't just tell him "Well...now you need to make that horrible weight cut again AND the fight is for your belt. Hope two weeks is enough time!"

Do they throw money at Nate Diaz and see if he can get sober with only 2 weeks notice? Or do they just feed Conor a 155 can as a tune up and let him keep talking massive shit to RDA? Honestly, that's probably what I'd do. It's not Conor's fault the fight isn't happening...might as well give him a cookie and keep the hype train rolling.

 
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From what I read online Edgar, Aldo and Khabib are all out for the fight.

Aldo turned down a rematch.

Edgar wants it but just had surgery.

Khabb is supposed to be fighting soon and hasn't fought in two years (he would also likely grapple the hell out of Connor)

I think it is going to be Diaz or maybe Cerrone. Diaz is probably the safer fight. Diaz will just Diaz and stand and trade. Cerrone may try to work takedowns and jiu jitsu in there.

This fight being cancelled is pretty shitty though. Even though I think Connor is being over blown I was super interested in seeing this fight to see what was going to go down. If Connor can smash Diaz or Cerrone that will just make the build up to the RDA fight that much more crazy. If he loses though - so much money gone.

 
Yeah, I think I'd go with Diaz out of that group (assuming he's capable). Cerrone is an odd one considering he just fought Sunday night at 170. Who knows what his weight is at now and/or how different cutting down to 155 would be for him than it usually is.

Plus, to me, that would be kind of a shitty match up for Conor since he's been preparing for a completely different style of opponent (even though he says it doesn't matter). I realize Diaz is very different from RDA too...but man, Conor coming up from 145 and Cerrone coming down from 170 just feels like a huge difference...especially on two weeks notice.

Of course Aldo would turn it down. And Khabib, sorry but he doesn't deserve it (plus, he's got a great match up with Ferguson coming up that will test where his skills are after two years). Too much of a wild card and the last thing the UFC needs is risking their best promo machine on a guy who doesn't do much for the company and might disappear again for another two years. People can cry "selective matchmaking", but unless a guy is undeniably next in line, I don't think they owe anybody anything.

It needs to be Diaz or Michael Johnson or somebody like that.

 
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Ok...so, it is McGregor vs. Diaz...but at welterweight... WTF?

10011434_10153834711561276_1361730164063258666_n.jpg

 

Ya know...as much as people shit on the Conor hype, what if he's like Rumble Johnson and cutting all that weight was just hurting his performance and limiting his power? Can you even imagine? lol

I'm guessing this means Nate is out of shape though if he needed to take it at 170. His cardio is probably going to be dog shit.

 
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This fight is interesting.

What shape will Diaz be in? They are usually always in good shape since they do triathlons and marathons all year long.

How much bigger will Diaz be then him?/ He has like 4 inch height a few inch reach.

Will Diaz pass the drug test?

This is a dangerous fight for Connor. I thought they would use the excuse that Cerrone was at welterweight to go with Diaz, but apparently they just are going with Diaz in general. Diaz is a safer fight. Great jiu jitsu, but lousy wrestling and will glady stand and trade. If Cerrone is on he will mix in wrestling take downs, etc.

I agree 100% with Khabib. If he came in a ragdolled Connor there is a 50/50 chance we won't see him for 2 years after derailing the biggest money maker in the UFC.

 
Hah - that is amazing. The Diaz Bros both have brain damage. Way too many shots to head combined with way too much smoking up.

 
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Oh man it's so fucking funny watching that. I, too wish there was more time for pressers because the shit Nate says is always so damn off the wall and random.
 
Bisping vs Silva was more or less what I expected. I feel the judges got it right. I had it 1, 2, 4 Bisping and 3, 5 Silva. That knee at the end of the 3rd was brutal and for sure thought Bisping would be stopped in the 4th.

Silva obviously did more damage and landed the bigger shots but Bisping was more consistent. If Silva was more offensive and didn't play around as much he could have taken it. Good fight to watch none the less
 
I saw it the same way as the judges using the 10 point per round method. If you took the fight as a whole I'd say Silva won, but the current judging criteria has Bisping winning.

Anderson just gave that fight away. I don't understand. After losing the the first two rounds, he finally starts to find his groove and just keeps letting Bisping go. Every time he had Bisping in trouble he would just hit the brakes and decide to lean against the cage. Bisping was completely rocked in that 4th round and I can't believe Silva didn't go in for the kill. I just don't understand it. It's like he intentionally threw the fight away.

The last round I kept thinking Silva is just waiting to go all out. Then I thought with 90 seconds left he is gonna go all out. Then with a minute left he just kind of did nothing.

Silva also looked much more hit-able and got stunned by Bisping shots which was surprising..

This fight made me think it is time for Silva to hang it up unless he takes some legend fights against Shogun or Henderson.

 
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I also found it pretty hilarious as to how butthurt Dana was at the end when he was talking to Hardy and Anik. I really doubt Silva can make another run at the belt but there are definitely some interesting fights that can still be made.

He did look a lot more hittable for sure though. He's still dangerous but yea, there was plenty of times where he could have stopped Bisping but didn't go in for the finish for some reason
 
Still trying to come to grips with the Silva fight. Was more disappointed that it seemd he didn't care to win than just being old and not having it anymore.

In other news I saw Sean Sherk calling out Royce Gracie. I use to like Sherk, but come on. Call out someone who is at least kind of relevant. Gracie was done like 14 years ago.

 
Here's a good .gif of one of those times he just kind of sat there as Bisping stumbled around hurt.
 
 
PowerfulSeriousBagworm.gif

 
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Yeah, it's almost like Silva gets off more now on hurting people and controlling pacing than actually winning. Just look at him swagger around after that kick. It's a little sadistic. You're there to win a contest...not crush the guy's soul and gloat. I really don't feel bad that maybe the judges didn't score things fairly when Silva's not taking the sport seriously.

I've seen people say "That's just Anderson's style!" Yeah, ok. Cool. It's dumb. Don't be an asshole. Finish the fight. He's honestly lucky that Bisping isn't younger/better or this would have been Silva/Weidman 1 all over again. A top 5 MW would probably crush him at this point.

 
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This was really cool to see. Rich as hell, drives super cars...still visits fan's apartments and picks up their shoes off the floor, haha.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_ZofBjfcDQ[/youtube]

 
Courtesy of Jon Jones FB page.

12512280_863486323761580_5830198148032115511_n.jpg


Have to admit, I legitimately laughed out loud. Jonny Bones just better hope Harriet doesn't get in there. :lol:

 
I'm real interested to see how Jones does. I do think that even if he gets the title back (of which there is a high probability) there is a good chance his life spirals out of control again and he flushes it all away.

I don't like to get on the Ronda hate train, but the recent picture of her from this week has her looking rough. I don't know if she will be making a come back this year. She seems to be following the Johnny Hendricks off-season diet. That didn't work out well for Hendricks since he missed weight, had to pull out of a fight and then was crushed in the first round.

I almost forgot that Hunt is fighting Mir in a few weeks. I like both guys so hate to see one lose. I just hope that Mir is crushed. He's taken a huge amount of head damage over the years, and a Hunto Bomb could push him over the edge. Mir is one of those fighters (like Arlovski) that I'm always just waiting for the big shot to hit and scramble his brains. I'm gonna go with Hunt, just because 

 
She was just on The Tonight Show a couple weeks ago. She doesn't look shredded by any means, but I don't see anything that looks severely grotesque either.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPEYTQ4flGc[/youtube]

At worst, maybe you could say she looks like somebody who isn't presently training. But honestly, that's probably the best thing for her. The problem comes if she all of a sudden schedules a fight and has to rush back. But if she and her camp actually handle this hiatus properly, I see nothing wrong with it. To me, it's a mental health break more than anything. If she doesn't get her mind right, her physical condition is irrelevant.

 
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