Official 2011-12 NFL Regular Season Thread

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[quote name='AJVtony831']That's a bit too far. The niners offense should share some of the blame for the poor performance. Putting it all on him is a bit much[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I was rooting for the 49ers last night and to put the whole blame on Williams and the special teams is a bit much. In the last few minutes of regulation and the first several minutes of OT how many times did their defense force a 3-and-out only to have their offense do the same thing? They had several chances to put a drive together and win the game.

I do however think they got totally screwed on that one call where they would have recovered the fumble if the refs hadn't been way too quick on the whistle. I know the play is supposed to be called as soon as forward progress is stopped but damn, that was lightning quick. I don't think I'd seen a play killed that fast all playoffs long!
 
I have recovered from the emotional "minutes-after-loss" and I'm still upset about it, but you are right, it isn't right to throw it all on Williams.

I said after the Saint game they needed to recommit to the run more, they did, but then failed to do so in certain spots that leave me scratching my head. I don't think they ran the ball once in the last 6 plays they had, both 3 and outs if I'm not mistaken.

Harbaugh also did a poor job at the end of the first half not running more time off the clock and it gave the Giants 3 points in the end.

Also, Williams is apparently getting "death-threats," I doubt he's in any real danger, but that is really messed up and totally out of line, so my dying line is also way out of line so I retract that.


As some others have pointed out, it was a great season and there is much to look forward to, so you have to be happy with the season. Having it end this way though, takes some of that away. That's a punch to the gut.
 
[quote name='KingBroly']San Francisco didn't convert a single third down...[/QUOTE]

Yup, there's also that.

The 49ers have basically played mistake free football all year, and they had to. There were many times this season the offense sputtered.

They made two huge mistakes, that was enough to result in a loss. You can't really expect to go all the way to winning the Super Bowl playing mistake-free football. Eventually you have to pick the team up.
 
[quote name='KingBroly']San Francisco didn't convert a single third down...[/QUOTE]

They converted the completely meaningless one on the last play in regulation. :roll:
 
[quote name='Reo 15x']This x1000. And yeah, it was suck for luck all the time this year. We just pretend this year didn't really happen.[/QUOTE]

Frontrunners. Just like I thought.

That was a great win for the Giants. Tough tough defense, playing away and the weather were all huge obstacles and they overcame all of them. There were large stretches of the game where I was getting annoyed at the offense for not being able to move the ball but the Giants D was great other than those 2 throws to Vernon Davis (seriously, how does he go uncovered ever? - he is their only offensive weapon other than Gore).

The 49ers converted 0 third downs and their WRs only had one catch for 3 yards! Plus no turnovers by the offense. Can't play much better than that.
 
[quote name='perdition(troy']Sigh. There is absolutely nothing about this Super Bowl that interests me. No interesting players, just Brady being Brady and Eli's ugly face plastered everywhere.[/QUOTE]

As a Giants fan I have no qualms with Eli's face. I don't need my QB to be a pretty boy. Just win baby. And as far as I'm concerned nothing is more compelling than sticking it to Brady and Belichick again.
 
Yeah, I have no interest in the SB either. Two teams I strongly dislike.

Have a feeling the Pats win big though. Brady and Belichick will be even more motivated than usual to try to get revenge from a few years back with losing the perfect season.
 
[quote name='kill3r7']As a Giants fan I have no qualms with Eli's face. I don't need my QB to be a pretty boy. Just win baby. And as far as I'm concerned nothing is more compelling than sticking it to Brady and Belichick again.[/QUOTE]

Same here.

How could any football fan think a rematch of arguably the best Super Bowl ever played isn't compelling? Any one of the 4 possible match-ups would have been compelling, IMO.
 
[quote name='RAMSTORIA']Kyle Williams has single handedly cost the 49ers te game.[/QUOTE]

Yep. Dude better be feeling awfully bad for letting his team down so much.
 
I hate John Clayton as much as he clearly hates the Giants. Here is his "analysis" of why the Patriots are going to win the Super Bowl:

[quote name='Crazy John Clayton']Though I write this without conviction, I'd give the edge to the Patriots. You just get the feeling there is a touch of destiny with this team that is tied to owner Robert Kraft, whose wife passed away last year. Players and the entire organization dedicated the season to her. Longtime Patriot followers believe it was Myra Kraft who somehow made Billy Cundiff miss his 32-yard field goal in the fourth quarter and helped Moore strip a potential game-winning touchdown pass from Evans.[/QUOTE]

REALLY??? Give the edge to the Patriots because they have Tom Brady but please don't tell me that the owner's ghost-wife is going to affect the outcome of the game. Jesus.
 
[quote name='Javery']Same here.

How could any football fan think a rematch of arguably the best Super Bowl ever played isn't compelling? Any one of the 4 possible match-ups would have been compelling, IMO.[/QUOTE]

This rematch doesn't have the same impact that the 18 and 1 bowl did.
 
[quote name='jello44']This rematch doesn't have the same impact that the 18 and 1 bowl did.[/QUOTE]

No Super Bowl will though until the next 18-0 team gets beaten by a huge underdog with under a minute to play needing a TD to win.

Manning lobs it. Burress alone. Touchdown New York!!!
 
[quote name='bvharris']Haha, thus illustrating why the next two weeks are going to be miserable. I wish they could play this game tonight.[/QUOTE]

Are you kidding? I wish the game wasn't until March. Only two more weeks of this stuff to soak up and enjoy! :D
 
It'll be an interesting dynamic, since it looks to be the Giants fans who are overconfident this time around (at least from what I've seen so far around the internet).

Not that it will affect the play on the field, but it wouldn't shock me if the Giants were favorites by gametime.
 
[quote name='bvharris']It'll be an interesting dynamic, since it looks to be the Giants fans who are overconfident this time around (at least from what I've seen so far around the internet).

Not that it will affect the play on the field, but it wouldn't shock me if the Giants were favorites by gametime.[/QUOTE]

I'll admit I feel better about our chances going into the game compared to Super Bowl 42 but I'm still nervous as hell because of Tom Brady and Bill Belichik (and those freaking TEs). I think the Giants best is a little better than the Patriots best but as these playoffs have shown us, anything can happen.
 
[quote name='Javery']I think the Giants best is a little better than the Patriots best but as these playoffs have shown us, anything can happen.[/QUOTE]

I'm not sure I agree with that. I guess it depends whether you define "best" as potential, or what we've actually seen on the field.

The Patriots' best was what they did to Denver last week. That would be pretty tough to beat, even for the Giants at their best (I'm not saying I think that's how the game will play out, because I don't).

This is stating the obvious, but what worries me about the matchup is that the things the Giants do well (rush the passer and air it out with multiple WRs) are exactly the way you'd want to beat the Patriots. They're also playing their best football at the right time of the year.
 
I'm thinking more abstractly - I think the Giants D is a lot better than the Pats D and the Giants offense is almost on par with the Pats offense (but may actually be slightly worse running the ball even though I'd rather have Bradshaw or Jacobs over Green-Ellis). Pats may have the edge in special teams for returns (Giants are horrible) but Weatherford has been punting out of his mind and Tynes is pretty reliable. Also, the Giants beat them once before this season in Foxboro without Bradshaw or Nicks playing. Honestly, I don't even want a good game - I'd love a 38-10 Giants win.
 
[quote name='Javery']I'm thinking more abstractly - I think the Giants D is a lot better than the Pats D and the Giants offense is almost on par with the Pats offense (but may actually be slightly worse running the ball even though I'd rather have Bradshaw or Jacobs over Green-Ellis). Pats may have the edge in special teams for returns (Giants are horrible) but Weatherford has been punting out of his mind and Tynes is pretty reliable. Also, the Giants beat them once before this season in Foxboro without Bradshaw or Nicks playing. Honestly, I don't even want a good game - I'd love a 38-10 Giants win.[/QUOTE]

The Patriots haven't been blown out all year. Even in the one game they were truly dominated (the Steelers) they only ended up losing by 8. So if it turns out to be a blowout that way, something catastrophic will have probably happened (like Brady kidnapped by mafia level catastrophic).

I really don't know that I'd agree the Giants D is "a lot better" than the Patriots D. They were both pretty bad in the regular season (the Giants gave up about 500 fewer yards but allowed about 60 more points, so you pick your poison) and have stepped it up in the playoffs to varying degrees. The Giants definitely have more talent on the front line (outside of Wilfork, who is the best defensive player on either team) but the Pats have also been generating significantly more pressure on the QB over the last month. A lot of the improvement on both teams have been about getting back key defenders who missed serious time: Chung and Spikes for the Pats, and Osi and I think a couple others (you'd know better than I) for the Giants.

As for the running game, I'm not sure how anyone could decide an advantage either way. The Giants had the worst rushing attack in the league in the regular season and the best in the postseason. Meanwhile Belichick deactivated the Pats' most explosive runner last game (Ridley) because he'd fumbled in 2 straight. So who the hell knows what's going on with that matchup.

Pats definitely have an edge in special teams, but it's actually in their coverage, where they were phenomenal all year, rather than their returning, where they were merely average.
 
[quote name='bvharris']The Patriots haven't been blown out all year. Even in the one game they were truly dominated (the Steelers) they only ended up losing by 8. So if it turns out to be a blowout that way, something catastrophic will have probably happened (like Brady kidnapped by mafia level catastrophic).

I really don't know that I'd agree the Giants D is "a lot better" than the Patriots D. They were both pretty bad in the regular season (the Giants gave up about 500 fewer yards but allowed about 60 more points, so you pick your poison) and have stepped it up in the playoffs to varying degrees. The Giants definitely have more talent on the front line (outside of Wilfork, who is the best defensive player on either team) but the Pats have also been generating significantly more pressure on the QB over the last month. A lot of the improvement on both teams have been about getting back key defenders who missed serious time: Chung and Spikes for the Pats, and Osi and I think a couple others (you'd know better than I) for the Giants.

As for the running game, I'm not sure how anyone could decide an advantage either way. The Giants had the worst rushing attack in the league in the regular season and the best in the postseason. Meanwhile Belichick deactivated the Pats' most explosive runner last game (Ridley) because he'd fumbled in 2 straight. So who the hell knows what's going on with that matchup.

Pats definitely have an edge in special teams, but it's actually in their coverage, where they were phenomenal all year, rather than their returning, where they were merely average.[/QUOTE]

JPP is hands down the best defensive player on the field. His ability to play the run and cover as a DE makes him really special. He's going to be a stud for a long, long time. Overall, because of the pass rush I would say the Giants' D has the edge. With that said, if we end up winning this game it's going to be because of the offense. Outside of McCourty the Pats secondary will have a tough time covering the Giants receivers.
 
It's not going to be a blow out - the Pats offense can keep up with anyone. I'm just hoping for one. Since the Giants got Tuck, Umenyiora and Boley back at full strength their defense has been much much better. Still not great though as their secondary is prone to giving up one or 2 big plays per game. Keep in mind that the Giants had one of the toughest schedules in the league which helps explain why they gave up so many points (Saints, Packers, Patriots, Eagles in a 5 game span with the other game against the 49ers - brutal).

Their offense has also been better since the return of Bradshaw and Nicks to 100% (or close). The game is definitely a toss-up and I could see the spread going to 1.5 by game time depending on Gronk's health and all the other stuff that will come out over the next 2 weeks.
 
[quote name='kill3r7']JPP is hands down the best defensive player on the field. [/QUOTE]

He's a very very good player, one of the best young d-linemen in the game without a doubt. You might even think that given their relative ages, you'd rather have him going forward than Wilfork, and I could get behind that. But to say he's "hands down" the better defensive player than a guy who might well be remembered as the best nose tackle of this generation is just homerism. If you watched both games yesterday, Wilfork had the best day of anybody on either field by a margin wider than his pants size. :D

I'll be picking the Giants in this game, since I think they match up very well and are peaking at the right time. But let's not pretend like the Giants are worlds better than the Patriots, because I don't think anybody could rationally make that case.

[quote name='Javery']Keep in mind that the Giants had one of the toughest schedules in the league which helps explain why they gave up so many points (Saints, Packers, Patriots, Eagles in a 5 game span with the other game against the 49ers - brutal). [/QUOTE]

Not to mention those two brutal Redskins games. ;)

Plus knocking everyone in America out of their suicide pool (myself included) by losing at home to the Seahawks.

I have no real point with the above two comments other than that the Giants laying a total egg would surprise me less than the Patriots doing so. I don't think that will happen though.
 
[quote name='bvharris']He's a very very good player, one of the best young d-linemen in the game without a doubt. You might even think that given their relative ages, you'd rather have him going forward than Wilfork, and I could get behind that. But to say he's "hands down" the better defensive player than a guy who might well be remembered as the best nose tackle of this generation is just homerism. If you watched both games yesterday, Wilfork had the best day of anybody on either field by a margin wider than his pants size. :D.[/QUOTE]

Wilfork is a top 3 DT but he's not the best. Right now, I would take Ngata and Suh over him. Justin Smith is right there as well. There is a premium placed on sacking QBs and Wilfork just doesn't do that enough.
 
[quote name='kill3r7']Wilfork is a top 3 DT but he's not the best. Right now, I would take Ngata and Suh over him. Justin Smith is right there as well. There is a premium placed on sacking QBs and Wilfork just doesn't do that enough.[/QUOTE]

None of the guys you mentioned are nose tackles, which is what I said. Wilfork doesn't always line up in the middle, but when he does he's as dominant as anybody who has ever played that position.

I don't want to pile on you, but the purpose of a nose tackle in the 3-4 is not to accumulate sacks or tackles but to occupy multiple blockers and collapse the pocket. Nobody in the NFL right now does both that and also sheds blockers to corral running backs better than Wilfork.

Just looking at sack totals is not a very good way to evaluate defensive line play, especially for a player like Wilfork. Any serious evaluator of the game would tell you the same thing. During the time the Patriots were primarily a 3-4 defense (they've run both more this year), Wilfork never had more than 2 sacks in a season and yet made plenty of pro bowls and all-pro teams. There's a reason for that.
 
As an unbiased not fan of either team opinion, JPP is definitely the defensive player on the feild at the Super Bowl, without question.

And yes, the Giants D right now is SO much better than the Pats it isn't even funny. I don't care about season statistics. All you have to do is watch both games yesterday. It's right there in front of you.
 
[quote name='bvharris']None of the guys you mentioned are nose tackles, which is what I said. Wilfork doesn't always line up in the middle, but when he does he's as dominant as anybody who has ever played that position.

I don't want to pile on you, but the purpose of a nose tackle in the 3-4 is not to accumulate sacks or tackles but to occupy multiple blockers and collapse the pocket. Nobody in the NFL right now does both that and also sheds blockers to corral running backs better than Wilfork.

Just looking at sack totals is not a very good way to evaluate defensive line play, especially for a player like Wilfork. Any serious evaluator of the game would tell you the same thing. During the time the Patriots were primarily a 3-4 defense (they've run both more this year), Wilfork never had more than 2 sacks in a season and yet made plenty of pro bowls and all-pro teams. There's a reason for that.[/QUOTE]

I am well aware as to what a nose tackle does but most teams today have switched to 4-3 defense. Hence why I listed my top 3 DT. Ngata early in his career played exclusively as a nose tackle and was a total beast. But since you want to talk about nose tackles here are two very good ones that come to mind, Ratliff and Hampton. Actually, most people would argue that Hampton is the best true nose tackle (clogger) in the league. Anyhow, my point was that JPP is more valuable because he excels at sacking the QB. There is nothing more important in today's NFL than knocking the QB on his ass. You as a Pat's fan should know this better than anyone.
 
Ok let's take a step back to reality here. The Pats played like garbage Sunday on offense and still won. The Giants are hot but so are the pats who have won 10 straight. Now belichick is going to spend two weeks looking at tape of super bowl 42 and the game we lost this season. it is rare that a team comes out and beats the pats twice. BV I understand where you are coming from but unless you trying to pull off a reverse jinx have some faith in the home team. We are going to fricking cream the Giants this is a classic Pats statement game and right after we can listen to giants fans cry about why Brady was in the game leading a TD drive in the last minute with the Pats up by 20.
 
[quote name='jlarlee']Ok let's take a step back to reality here. The Pats played like garbage Sunday on offense and still won. The Giants are hot but so are the pats who have won 10 straight. Now belichick is going to spend two weeks looking at tape of super bowl 42 and the game we lost this season. it is rare that a team comes out and beats the pats twice. BV I understand where you are coming from but unless you trying to pull off a reverse jinx have some faith in the home team. We are going to fricking cream the Giants this is a classic Pats statement game and right after we can listen to giants fans cry about why Brady was in the game leading a TD drive in the last minute with the Pats up by 20.[/QUOTE]

Would you like to put a little friendly wager on that? The money would go to child's play charity or a charity of your choosing.
 
[quote name='jlarlee']Ok let's take a step back to reality here. The Pats played like garbage Sunday on offense and still won. The Giants are hot but so are the pats who have won 10 straight. Now belichick is going to spend two weeks looking at tape of super bowl 42 and the game we lost this season. it is rare that a team comes out and beats the pats twice. BV I understand where you are coming from but unless you trying to pull off a reverse jinx have some faith in the home team. We are going to fricking cream the Giants this is a classic Pats statement game and right after we can listen to giants fans cry about why Brady was in the game leading a TD drive in the last minute with the Pats up by 20.[/QUOTE]

I'm not trying any reverse jinx. Obviously I hope the Patriots win 50-0, but I honestly believe this is a extremely tough matchup for them. I expect it to be a one score game either way, I just have a bad feeling about it. I hope to hell I'm wrong.
 
[quote name='kill3r7']Would you like to put a little friendly wager on that? The money would go to child's play charity or a charity of your choosing.[/QUOTE]

I like embarrassing bets better. Loser puts the winning teams logo up as their avatar for a month.
 
On this we can all agree and be thankful: At least we're not Jets fans. :D

381630_2954263665114_1517104452_33011959_1279553138_n.jpg
 
[quote name='jlarlee']I like embarrassing bets better. Loser puts the winning teams logo up as their avatar for a month.[/QUOTE]

Done deal. It's all in good fun.
 
I'm happy neither game yesterday disappointed. Ravens and 49ers you came so close yet Special Team played a big part in both loses. Out of the two goats I think I would least likely be Williams since he messed up twice. However, he is a rookie so I give a bit of a slide.

Congrats to Pats and Giants! This is certainly an interested match up with a Giants team many thought didn't have a chance to make the playoffs on one side We then have a Pats team that has been statistically bad defensively through most of the season. Both teams playing their best football now when it really counts. Most people not Giants or Pats fans will be absolutely sick of hearing about it and will just want it to be over with already!

I give a slight edge to the Giants due to their weapons in the secondary and pass rush.

I'm hoping for another instant classic like 42.




In other news: Colts owner Jim Irsay has reportedly interviewed ex-Ohio State head coach current gameday consultant Jim Tressel TWICE for the head coaching job.

As a Colts fan, I would not have a problem with Tressel getting a shot at the job (yes I'm also a Buckeye but I'm saying this without bias).

FACT:
He is a proven winner every where he has coached. Including four Championships in D II and one at OSU.

He has a ton of football knowledge and is an excellent football mind.

He is a stickler for details.

I don't know if he will be successful in the NFL. However, I would give him a shot before an unproven NFL assistant that may have never been a head coach at any level previously.

Besides, there is not that many other options at this point. Granted, there is a report that Ravens DC is also in the running (which is not bad).
 
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Vegas clearly loves the Patriots but the media is giving them zero chance in this game, not sure what to make of it. Does Vegas know something? 63% of bets on the spread are on the Giants and 77% of the moneyline bets are on the Giants, and we're still at Pats -3.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Vegas clearly loves the Patriots but the media is giving them zero chance in this game, not sure what to make of it. Does Vegas know something? 63% of bets on the spread are on the Giants and 77% of the moneyline bets are on the Giants, and we're still at Pats -3.[/QUOTE]

Right up my alley. This is going to be another tight game obviously but I didn't really like the way the Giants played against the 49ers. Pats have worse defense but much better offense and their passing game is almost unbeatable...and obviously it is boring (slant, curl, slant, slant, curl, slant, TD).

I like the Pats here actually. -3 looks like a perfectly decent line to me, I have trouble thinking the Giants are going to be able to pressure Brady enough to force him to make mistakes.
 
Is it me or does this year's Super Bowl feel like it's a rerun episode on TV? I dunno maybe it's because I'm bummed my Niners lost, but I think Brady and the Pats will get their revenge and beat the Giants. If Giants win, then Eli is better than big brother Peyton.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7...aiders-hire-dennis-allen-denver-broncos-coach

Raiders are hiring Broncos DC Dennis Allen as head coach.

A tad surprising as I figured the new GM would bring over a Green Bay assistant since that's where he came from.

I like hiring a defensive minded coach (despite my love of offensive football!) as a crappy defense was the main reason the Raider's missed the playoffs this year.[/QUOTE]

Although I'm not familiar with him, the more I think about it the more I like the decision. His scheme is a 4-3 which is what the Raiders are used to. It throws a key rival into a bit of disarray. And the Raiders may actually find a way to beat Denver!
 
[quote name='TKtheknight']Is it me or does this year's Super Bowl feel like it's a rerun episode on TV? I dunno maybe it's because I'm bummed my Niners lost, but I think Brady and the Pats will get their revenge and beat the Giants. If Giants win, then Eli is better than big brother Peyton.[/QUOTE]

Better Clutch Brother? Yes Eli would claim that title. But Peyton in the regular season is the face of consistency. I would have to say that Peyton is a one of the greats of the regular season, maybe the best regular season quarterback overall. He just chokes a little bit in the post season. If Eli was more consistent you could say he is better but that's just not the case.
 
[quote name='TKtheknight']Is it me or does this year's Super Bowl feel like it's a rerun episode on TV? I dunno maybe it's because I'm bummed my Niners lost, but I think Brady and the Pats will get their revenge and beat the Giants. If Giants win, then Eli is better than big brother Peyton.[/QUOTE]

i find it funny 2 years ago before the Superbowl, everyone was talking about how Peyton was about to become the greatest quarterback ever, his vision, his work ethic, his command of the offense. Then a stupid third string wide receiver who married a nude model, couldn't do his job and catch a ball kicked straight to him on a onside kick; and now he is a loser under achiever.
 
Did you guys see this explaining why Billy missed his kick?

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-s...-rushed-fateful-field-goal-try-013101618.html

Its a yahoo article so meh but its good for cooler talk. It also raises the questions, why the fuck do you have 100 people "working" on the sidelines yet no one can make sure the down is right on the scoreboard? There is not a sport out there that gets more things wrong with 10x the amount of people and cameras view than the NFL. fuck they are horrid.


For those who dont want to click, basically on the last set of positions the scoreboard read the wrong down because of the Boldin fumble out of bounds. It fumbled past a first down so the scoreboard listed it that way but really it was 2nd down. That threw off the kickers routine of practice on the sideline and why everyone seemed so rushed when they were taking it. Billy wasnt even near the sidelines when they were calling for him to go into the game because he thought it was still 3rd down after looking at the board.
 
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