Rumor: PS3 to block used games

[quote name='Quackzilla']Wow, more fanboy bullshit. :roll:[/QUOTE]
I wouldn't say that its completely out of left field here, but they'd be stupid to do it. This is their patent though... They might use it on something down the road, maybe movies?
 
Here's the deal. This may not happen on games but I'm going to theorize it may be done on demo units at E3 and so on. Imagine if someone tries to jack the demo version of a game and put it on their system or another. It wouldn't work and they'd be fucked, case closed.
My issue is someone doing it is the system breakage and us being thrown over a barrel for Atlus games unless they debut at the $20-30 price.
Also that HL2 shit is bogus. Ugh means I have to keep an old HDD around just to play the game on a new system, what a load of crap.
 
Imagine how much effort people would put into hacking the ps3 (and the market for modding) If you could bypass this system, imagine how cheap the games would be on ebay since there wouldn't be a normal market for them.
 
[quote name='Sarang01']Also that HL2 shit is bogus. Ugh means I have to keep an old HDD around just to play the game on a new system, what a load of crap.[/QUOTE]
You are talking about Half-Life 2, right?

If you log in to your account on any computer it will download the game off the internet, you can play it on any computer and install it as many times as you want as long as you log in.
 
Man, the more I think about it, I more I WANT it to happen.

1. PS3 breaks.
2. Sell game boxes on eBay.
3. Profit.
4. Sell game instructions on eBay.
5. Profit.
6. Sell game inserts on eBay.
7. Profit.
8. Sell game (disc only) on eBay.
9. Profit.
10. Sell controllers and cables.
11. Profit.

That's, like, a lot of profitses.
 
Another reason to not play on the internet. I'm perhaps a bit old but I have never caught the 'play live online fever' that so many have. Meh...if Sony wants to do this I don't care, I don't connect online for games, if sony wants to make me connect to the internet to play a game...well than I just won't buy nor play it. I have an xbox and never went with xbox live, but I can still play games with no problems, I might miss an update.. but this update crap is just enabling publishers to rush out incomplete product, why do we put up with it? Why enable crap to be released? Someone might find a rogue example but when I buy a car I expect to be able to turn the key, engine starts and then my automobile is used. Sure there might be a rare recall but that is for something usually 'small' I can still use my car although my rear window might fall out. Is there anything else that one can put out an incomplete project and make sure the buyers will not nor cannot use it?
 
[quote name='gaelan']connecting to the net and communicating with skytel to get permissions and authorizations...[/QUOTE]

Skynet?
 
[quote name='Mr.Answer']Another reason to not play on the internet. I'm perhaps a bit old but I have never caught the 'play live online fever' that so many have. Meh...if Sony wants to do this I don't care, I don't connect online for games, if sony wants to make me connect to the internet to play a game...well than I just won't buy nor play it. I have an xbox and never went with xbox live, but I can still play games with no problems, I might miss an update.. but this update crap is just enabling publishers to rush out incomplete product, why do we put up with it? Why enable crap to be released? Someone might find a rogue example but when I buy a car I expect to be able to turn the key, engine starts and then my automobile is used. Sure there might be a rare recall but that is for something usually 'small' I can still use my car although my rear window might fall out. Is there anything else that one can put out an incomplete project and make sure the buyers will not nor cannot use it?[/QUOTE]
It has nothing to do with going online...

Theres an authorization code on a part of the disc, and once your PS3 (or whichever device this is used for) reads it, it copies it, and then erases it with its laser. No going on the internet required.
 
Hmm. I'm having a hardtime deciding which of these is a more obvious pile of BS...this story, or a great heaping deposit of male cow feces.
 
[quote name='capitalist_mao']Skynet?[/QUOTE]

no skytel like the pager service...yeah skynet. i don't know where the hell skytel came from.
 
CAG is so full of rabid Nintendo fanboys it is really pissing me off.

You can't have a Sony related forum or thread without having a dozen fanboys trolling it.
 
There are more 'flaming' fanboys here than on the gamefaqs board, in all seriousness.

I just checked.

And here on CAG, the Nintendo board is troll free, but the Sony board is so full of trolls anyone who posts something postitive gets gang raped in the ass.

The moderators are so fucking lazy, they should crack down on trolling.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']It has nothing to do with going online...

Theres an authorization code on a part of the disc, and once your PS3 (or whichever device this is used for) reads it, it copies it, and then erases it with its laser. No going on the internet required.[/QUOTE]



See this part makes it seem improbable to me, dvd's or blu-ray discs whatever can only be modified using a drive that is capable of altering the data on the disc, I really doubt sony is going to put a blu-ray rewriteable drive in every ps3 it would be way too cost ineffiecent. The more likely scenario that I can think of is something like what microsoft does with stuff like win xp or office xp nowadays where you get x number of uses before you have limited functionality. However that would require an internet connection and some form of memory card/ hard drive on the system in order to play a game. I guess I wouldn't put it past sony or even ms with the xbox360 from doing this at some point I just don't see it as very feasible right now.
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']CAG is so full of rabid Nintendo fanboys it is really pissing me off.

You can't have a Sony related forum or thread without having a dozen fanboys trolling it.[/QUOTE]

And the same goes for any forum or thread.

Anyway, regardless of who is posting and what they are posting, if Sony were to do this (I doubt they will, but without the internet, where will I speculate?) there would be an obvious backlash. Friends wouldn't be able to take games to other friends houses, you couldn't rent, and you couldn't buy used games. Granted, console makers don't necessarily profit from any of those, so I can understand why they would want to do this, they just can't. Rentals and used games drive the market. When I didn't have any money when I was a kid, I would rent games, which meant I played the systems and bought new games once in a while. If I couldn't rent, I wouldn't have had the system. The same goes for used games. Get rid of either of those, and I wouldn't have ever bought a new game, even as sparingly as I did back then.

Anyway, no one is saying that Sony is doing this. We are just all commenting on what could happen (based on patents and apperently what Sony has said) if they did. Fanboy or not, this would suck.
 
Would seem like a bone-headed move to me. Sony would not gain much from it.

Though with any major corporation, they will try to protect their property in some manner. All in an effort to boost the bottom line and not care whose feathers are ruffled. Would not surprise me if something like this happened.
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']CAG is so full of rabid Nintendo fanboys it is really pissing me off.

You can't have a Sony related forum or thread without having a dozen fanboys trolling it.[/QUOTE]


Very true, just look at all the backlash the PS2 version of RE4 got after it was released. As if anyone expected the game to look better than the GC version... my fave quote from that "any TRUE gamer would have bought this on the gamecube already".

But seriously I still wouldn't put it past one of the console makers to eventually try this crap mentioned by the OP. I'm sure Sony is at least tossing the idea around but I highly doubt they would dare to go this route. It would hand Microsoft the opening it needs to grab the number one spot(at least in the US/Europe market).

I REALLY hope this isn't true.
 
For those that are skeptic of Sony implementing some sort of DRM you need to take your head out of your ass.

First, the Playstation 3 will be using Blu-ray. For Blu-ray movies they have released the DRM (copy protection) schemes they will be using.

Sony Announcment of Blu-ray DRM (PDF)

Basic run down of the Blu-ray DRM

Blu-ray Disc Association, led by Sony, representing one of two competing high-definition DVD formats, stated it will simultaneously embrace digital watermarking, programmable cryptography, and a self-destruct code for Blu-ray disc players.

The BDA statement is unprecedented not only because its solution to the nagging problem of digital rights management is to embrace every option on the table, but also because Blu-ray appears to have developed its own approach - in some cases, proprietary - to each of these three technologies.
Click to expand...

The digital watermarking technique, which will be called ROM Mark, is described in the statement as "a unique and undetectable identifier in pre-recorded BD-ROM media such as movies, music and games."
Click to expand...

One part of the announcement that had been anticipated by experts was Blu-ray's embrace of Advanced Access Content System (AACS), one version of which has also been adopted by the HD DVD Forum. This controversial technology would require that disc players maintain permanent connections to content providers via the Internet, making it possible for discs that fail a security check to trigger a notification process, enabling the provider to send the player a sort of "self-destruct code."
Click to expand...

If you don't think Sony is considering implementing something like this for their games you are fooling yourself. Sony is most likely going to be losing big bucks selling the Playstation 3. They will make it up selling games, but also, games are becoming more expensive (again). Which could cause more people to consider the used market, where Sony makes nothing. Also, movies are not nearly as expensive as most games, so if they are willing to do this for movies, don't be surprised to see something similar coming to games. They may not use the same implementation, but I doubt they will sit back and do nothing.
 
If that is true I will personally reverse engineer my own PS3 (after the first price drop, of course) and modify it to bypass the DRM software and hardware, and I will post instruction right here.

But I seriously doubt this will be used for anything but demo discs and betas.
 
Why would they waste that much time and effort on unfinsihed games(demos/betas) that they give away for free? If they are taking the time to invent and patent this technology it will be used in more expensive, money-makers for Sony (Blu-Ray movies/games).
 
I could see this being used to great effect on beta discs and review copies. But to do this on retail for the normal consumer copies, would never happen.
 
[quote name='zewone']Why would they waste that much time and effort on unfinsihed games(demos/betas) that they give away for free? If they are taking the time to invent and patent this technology it will be used in more expensive, money-makers for Sony (Blu-Ray movies/games).[/QUOTE]
I mean the e3 builds that are always getting leaked.
 
[quote name='extzed']See this part makes it seem improbable to me, dvd's or blu-ray discs whatever can only be modified using a drive that is capable of altering the data on the disc, I really doubt sony is going to put a blu-ray rewriteable drive in every ps3 it would be way too cost ineffiecent. The more likely scenario that I can think of is something like what microsoft does with stuff like win xp or office xp nowadays where you get x number of uses before you have limited functionality. However that would require an internet connection and some form of memory card/ hard drive on the system in order to play a game. I guess I wouldn't put it past sony or even ms with the xbox360 from doing this at some point I just don't see it as very feasible right now.[/QUOTE]
It doesn't need a rewritable drive in order to work, it can be erased by a regular drive after one use. This is what the patent is patenting.
 
[quote name='b3b0p']For those that are skeptic of Sony implementing some sort of DRM you need to take your head out of your ass.
...
If you don't think Sony is considering implementing something like this for their games you are fooling yourself. Sony is most likely going to be losing big bucks selling the Playstation 3. They will make it up selling games, but also, games are becoming more expensive (again). Which could cause more people to consider the used market, where Sony makes nothing. Also, movies are not nearly as expensive as most games, so if they are willing to do this for movies, don't be surprised to see something similar coming to games. They may not use the same implementation, but I doubt they will sit back and do nothing.[/QUOTE]

Sony has also hired marketers and business people, who will doubtless realize that they cannot gamble their huge (and I mean huge) investment in the PS3 away on a draconian DRM scheme that will alienate several of the main retail avenues for their games (EBGames, Gamefly, Amazon...)

However I do think that some companies with a hot gaming property will be selling premium priced extra content online. I think that the business types are going to try to push this model on us slowly, until the PS4 where a move like this will seem less revolutionary.

Sony business types probably like it because they lose money on every hardware sale. With DRM that would make used games obselete, they will sell less of the hardware to saavy devil customers (who rent or buy used games at reasonable prices) , and they will be netting more of the preorder fanboys and casual game suckers.

DRM crap like this is a deal-killer for me - if PS3 pulls it I'm going Nintendo - you can bank on that.
 
Here's a question: With the market popularity of the PlayStation brand, and if we assume that this technology is implemented in the PS3, will it have the opposite effect we're all predicting?

My hypothetical goes like this: A person lays down $500 on a PS3 (give or take). Games are $50, or even $60. It's not going to be that well-known that games can't be played on other systems, so the PS3 sells like a motherfucker, and now people rationalize buying new games: "Well, I already spent the money on this console, I can't just let it go to waste." They accept this new technology, since the "cost of entry" for PS3 is so high, and they bought it unaware of the new tech.

Just a thought; it's not as if consumers have ever proven themselves to be resilient against anything some mega-fuck-corporation has tried to do to us.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Here's a question: With the market popularity of the PlayStation brand, and if we assume that this technology is implemented in the PS3, will it have the opposite effect we're all predicting?

My hypothetical goes like this: A person lays down $500 on a PS3 (give or take). Games are $50, or even $60. It's not going to be that well-known that games can't be played on other systems, so the PS3 sells like a motherfucker, and now people rationalize buying new games: "Well, I already spent the money on this console, I can't just let it go to waste." They accept this new technology, since the "cost of entry" for PS3 is so high, and they bought it unaware of the new tech.

Just a thought; it's not as if consumers have ever proven themselves to be resilient against anything some mega-fuck-corporation has tried to do to us.[/QUOTE]

That's not quite the issue at hand though. When someone buys an Xbox instead of a PS2, they buy games specifically for it. This is taking it a step further where now you have to buy games specific to your own console. That is a HUGE leap into locking down users into what they have. What happens when you buy a game and it either sucks or fails later on? You're screwed.

For Sony, this is big big bucks. For the consumer, it's 13 inch long ass reamings.

I mean, this is like having to buy a new car when you need new tires.
 
[quote name='Strell']That's not quite the issue at hand though. When someone buys an Xbox instead of a PS2, they buy games specifically for it. This is taking it a step further where now you have to buy games specific to your own console. That is a HUGE leap into locking down users into what they have. What happens when you buy a game and it either sucks or fails later on? You're screwed.

For Sony, this is big big bucks. For the consumer, it's 13 inch long ass reamings.[/QUOTE]

You don't seem to get my point. This is NOT technology that Sony is going to embellish when promoting their system. People will purchase items based on brand loyalty alone (that is unarguable). So, we will expect the PS3 to sell like a motherfucker, right?

If they use this technology, is it feasible that the people who spent ALL THAT $$$ on the PS3 will find out they can't buy used games from EB, they can't rent games, and they can't try out their friends' titles, only to shrug their shoulders as consumers and deal with it?

Here's a question: when have consumers shown themselves to be so upset with something a company has done that they actually did something about it an affected the company?

What I'm saying is that, amidst all the postulating we are all doing, the track record of consumer capitulation towards the profit-minded interests of companies have shown that people might get angry, but rarely change their habits or do anything to stop it.

Despite the workaround, you can technically only play songs purchased from iTunes on 3 different computers, and only burn it 10 times. How is this any different, really?
 
I really don't think people will take it lying down because the used market is huge. People sell their games back all the time and continually. Go to any store and see how many copies of Madden 2006 are there. And hundreds more will show up when 2007 drops. Yes, Sony will hide it. They'll make an effort of course, but until it gets in the public eye, people will sublimely not care.

That amount of time will be approximately 2 weeks. I'm being generous.

Corporations will be pissed, especially when you consider Gamestop is probably a large retailer for Sony. Best Buy might have issue too if their used sales take off. Walmart and others won't care.

You are saying that customers - the same people who will bitch about the tiniest of things - are going to shrug their sholders and say "eh?" when they find out they can't get used games, trade them in for cash, and have to replace THEIR ENTIRE LIBRARY if the system died?

I've seen people bitch about the number of fries in their 99 cent order.

99 fucking cents. THink about that.

Your point is analogous to saying "people still pay high gas prices even though they are high." But I don't know anyone who has to buy a new car with each fill up. Or, perhaps to be a little more fair, has to go to a different gas station each time they need gas.
 
[quote name='Strell']I really don't think people will take it lying down because the used market is huge. People sell their games back all the time and continually. Go to any store and see how many copies of Madden 2006 are there. And hundreds more will show up when 2007 drops. Yes, Sony will hide it. They'll make an effort of course, but until it gets in the public eye, people will sublimely not care.

That amount of time will be approximately 2 weeks. I'm being generous.

Corporations will be pissed, especially when you consider Gamestop is probably a large retailer for Sony. Best Buy might have issue too if their used sales take off. Walmart and others won't care.

You are saying that customers - the same people who will bitch about the tiniest of things - are going to shrug their sholders and say "eh?" when they find out they can't get used games, trade them in for cash, and have to replace THEIR ENTIRE LIBRARY if the system died?

I've seen people bitch about the number of fries in their 99 cent order.

99 fucking cents. THink about that.

Your point is analogous to saying "people still pay high gas prices even though they are high." But I don't know anyone who has to buy a new car with each fill up. Or, perhaps to be a little more fair, has to go to a different gas station each time they need gas.[/QUOTE]

Perhaps I'm not being clear enough. People won't be happy. Yes, people bitch about their fries, and people bitch about gas prices. As the recent profit surge of oil companies can show you, it sure didn't change consumers' behavior much.

I'm not saying people will take it and like it; I am saying that they may take it and get used to it. I'm trying to think of examples to the contrary, where consumers who were truly fed up did something that changed the company (fuckin' New Coke maybe), but I'm coming up relatively empty.

:rofl: at Quack calling anybody fanboy.
 
Of course the console manufacturers and publishers would love to kill used game sales. They would increase their sales dramatically. I mean, think about it. The whole "used game market" dominated by EB and Gamestop have taken away from new game sales through people trading new releases, and people buying them second hand to save a few bucks. Sony is a bully about it.. I mean, look at the post about DRM's. They know they're big, and they'll try to protect any media that they can for the firm as much as possible.

I disagree with it.. especially for the fact that when frineds loan their other friends a game, it spreads word of mouth advertising (for example, I never would've played Contra if somebody hadn't brought it over to my house as a kid).

However, I just can't see this happening. It doesn't surprise me with how bold Sony has been in the past few years, but it would damage retailer relations a great bit. That and.. the way it sounded in the article, it would have to be an HD-DVD-RW or something to work.
 
Well, let me look at it this way. Of the games you own, mykev, how many of them are used? How many did you rent at some point? How many did you borrow from someone? I'm willing to wager a good percentage. And being that this is CAG, I'm willing to wager everyone here falls into that demographic also. But this is all beside the point...

I see your point - Sony thinks they own 60% of the market, so who else to spearhead such a movement? If they are going to sell PS3s without fail anyway, why not gamble on increasing your profit margins as best you can by A) playing off your userbase and B) you know you are going to lose on hardware sales, something that can only be overcome with software sales? Again, this all sounds like "well we've got shit you want and you have to play by our rules and you'll learn to like it like the bitches you are, bitches."

I think it COULD pay off. How many people re-buy DVDs released with a whole 13 seconds of previously-unreleased footage? Enough for companies to keep doing it...

But I dunno. This would honestly be enough for to tell Sony to piss off. Katamari you may have, but that isn't enough anymore.
 
On the other hand what would be an interesting side effect of this would be no more opened, yet sold as new, could it have been used already?, games at Gamestop. I know I'd be damn sure to buy only factory sealed games if this technology was indeed incorporated into PS3...
 
It's not going to happen with regular games. Period. Sony has made some bonehead moves over the years but as most people agree they will not cripple their own system.

For online-only games, however, this could be a good idea.
 
[quote name='Strell']Bwaha! Hahahah ha ah ha haha!

Dood, do you seriHAHAHHAHHA

God, I can't even get through a sentence withoHAHAHHAHHAHA BAWHABHAHA

...

HAWHAWHBAWHA
 
[quote name='Jeoff']It's not going to happen with regular games. Period. Sony has made some bonehead moves over the years but as most people agree they will not cripple their own system.

For online-only games, however, this could be a good idea.[/QUOTE]


Whether or not this technology is actually put into the PS3, we will end up seeing technology like this from the recording industry because of their war on piracy.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Here is the actual patent:
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...aragi+AND+an/Sony&RS=(IN/Kutaragi+AND+AN/Sony[/QUOTE]

Holy fucking shit! I just read the whole thing...

What I love about this though, is that since Sony patented it.. the other console manufacturers can't do it as well unless they license the technology. So at least there's hope for used Nintendo and MS games.

However.. let them do this. It'll be a matter of time before somebody cracks the code, and can "rewrite" the code onto a disc. Then it'll have been nothing but a big waste of time!

It looks like Sony is taking a blatent shot at Ebay and the game stores though. I cant wait to see the reaction this is going to cause :)
 
[quote name='secretvampire']People are sure getting worked up over this. It will never happen. If it did...bye, bye Sony.[/QUOTE]
Thats true, I'm fairly certain that this won't happen for PS3 games. However, I'm not so sure they won't use it for other things, like music or movies. Have to keep a close eye on it, just in case.
 
Waaaaaiiit a minute.. this could be for Blue Ray players. I wrote a paper about this from an article in Forbes a few months back. The guy who was responsible for coming up with SSL (I can't remember his name off the top of my head) was coming up with it for Toshiba's HD-DVD and Sony's Blue Ray disc formats while they were still in negotiation talks a few months back. They wanted to find a way to make DVD's more secure and come up with a method of a unique identification code for each disc. That would require people to crack the code on every single movie instead of the hardware format like current gen DVD players. Given it would still be able to be done, but it would take time.. and since DVD sales are mostly generated within the first 2 months of release, this seemed like the most effective security method.

This isn't for the games, it's for the Blue Ray movies. Still sucks that you can't watch a high def movie at anyone's house though...
 
I absolutely will NOT buy anything using any technology remotely like this. Just as I won't buy any cd that is "rip-proof", I will not buy any console that blocks used games. Since there is much more used market than new now, at least in number, if not dollar value, this would be a rather stupid move. Hell, even best buy is going to carry used games very soon.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Here's a question: when have consumers shown themselves to be so upset with something a company has done that they actually did something about it an affected the company?[/QUOTE]

Well, the record labels (including Sony) gouged consumers for years, so when Napster arrived many consumers felt no guilt in liberating tunes that the labels had been price-fixing into archaic album formats for years.

The record labels became so upset that they sicced their RIAA attack dogs on the public. Yet for the most part the public doesn't care - we all know that record label cartels are the scum of the earth and who wants to put more money in the RIAA coffers. Who wants to pay a group of lawyers to extort settlement fees from your 12 year-old sister or computerless grandmother for allegedly sharing tunes? Go independent, and support bands by buying tshirts/ concert tics/etc.

There's also always the classic "Dolphin in Tuna" boycott that resulted in fishing companies actually making an effort to eliminate dolphin from their tuna.

Jack in the Box food poisoned 12 people, killing a small girl, and people stopped eating at their restaurants. I don't see too many outlets of that fast food joint around any more.

For the most part the public are corporate tools, however I have no doubt that boneheaded marketing, excessive price gouging, and negative publicity does affect sales.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
bread's done
Back
Top