Signs of trouble for PSP?

beerguy961

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http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/09/02/news_6106399.html

First time I've heard of the PSP being anything but great. Sucks to hear that there won't be an ability to create our own UMD disks (what's the point of video playback then?) and no word on any MP3 playback (although some other compression format was confirmed). And what's the price gonna be? Too many questions left for me to ally myself with one handheld or the other...
 
I understand the reasoning behind keeping UMD proprietary but that doesn't bode well for UMD movies. Such a format would probably be a huge success in Japan but it would flounder stateside. Don't expect to see UMD movies here.
 
[quote name='PsyClerk']Who cares about movies and MP3s? These things live and die by their game libraries.[/quote]

But they are tad expensive to just be for gaming. This is why they marketing it as the "Walkman of the Future". If the public sees it as "just a gaming machine", they are gonna stick with the $80 SP.
 
[quote name='daphatty']I understand the reasoning behind keeping UMD proprietary but that doesn't bode well for UMD movies. Such a format would probably be a huge success in Japan but it would flounder stateside. Don't expect to see UMD movies here.[/quote]

If they gave out a UMD version of movies when you buy the special edition, now THAT would be a great idea. I wouldn't buy a UMD by itself, however..
 
[quote name='PsyClerk']Who cares about movies and MP3s? These things live and die by their game libraries.[/quote]

Sony thinks you do.
 
I have a feeling that Sony is scrambling to get that battery life to a decent level. I am really curious how short it is at this point.
 
Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail? Seems that they are talking a lot of shit for a system that at this point is not particularly practical. I may be wrong because I have not been reading many articles on it, but it seems like the system will be good or bad based on a whole lot of "ifs".

Plus another part of me just doesn't want to see Sony coming down on Nintendo's handheld market.
 
[quote name='scdoanintendo']Why the hell is a portable system hooked up to a desktop tower in the pictures at gamespot?[/quote]

Because that's the developer version. Games are created using the device connected to a PC. I don't think this is new. It works the same way for other consoles, I believe. It also says in the Gamespot article that you'll be able to connect the PSP to a PC or PS2 via USB, but it doesn't mention specific reasons why you'd want to do that.
 
[quote name='Mr Unoriginal']Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail? Seems that they are talking a lot of shit for a system that at this point is not particularly practical. I may be wrong because I have not been reading many articles on it, but it seems like the system will be good or bad based on a whole lot of "ifs".

Plus another part of me just doesn't want to see Sony coming down on Nintendo's handheld market.[/quote]

I think I'm with you on that. As much as I'll probably eventually have to get a PSP, I really don't want it to do to well - I see too many potential problems with it for it to become the market leader.
 
Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail?

I hear what you're saying. I'm by no means a Nintendo fanboy, but the Game Boy has been such a cultural institution that challanging just about amounts to blasphemy at this point.

On the other hand I never really want any gaming system to fail. If it succeeds it will eventually have quality games, the price will drop and I can buy it on the cheap in 6 years :lol:
 
I'm not planning on picking up a PSP (I only really need one current portable and either the GBASP or DS will be enough), but it is disappointing that they're probably only going to go with ATRAC. If you read a lot of the criticism of Sony's new harddrive-based music player, most of it centers around the fact that it takes an incredibly long time and far too much memory to convert your mp3's to ATRAC. Silly move just like the Memory Stick.

Sean-O
 
So does this mean, since you can't write with it, that we have to get memory sticks for game saves? Jeez. I had high hopes for this thing but it's Fabling it up here.
 
It seems like they tried to do too much with the handheld and in the end everything ended up botching everything. For example, the movie format is proprietary and users can't burn their own discs so you would have to rebuy all your movies. Battery life is still a big iffy. MP3's are still not official, and they will probably use their own proprietary format. All this wouldn't matter if it has great games at a reasonable price, but I imagine you will be paying for the extra "botched" features. I really have been skeptical from the start of everything Sony has been touting for this machine. I guess we will see how it all comes together.
 
Mr Unoriginal wrote:
Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail? Seems that they are talking a lot of shit for a system that at this point is not particularly practical. I may be wrong because I have not been reading many articles on it, but it seems like the system will be good or bad based on a whole lot of "ifs".

Plus another part of me just doesn't want to see Sony coming down on Nintendo's handheld market.
I have always seen the PSP as the crap that it is, and have thus wanted it to fail. But that was in the early stages. Now, it is inevitable that it will be released and I hope it does relatively well. I would just feel bad for all the unsuspecting fools who are blind followers of Sony that would just go out and buy the system and then have it tank.
 
Why wouldn't you want to see Sony come down on Nintendo's handheld market? Even if you hate Sony the competition'll still be good for the consumer and hopefully drive Nintendo to develop some games instead of just porting or emulating them.
 
I agree they are scrambling to get a higher quality battery at this point. The system is done and now they need a batter with more mAs. My guess is battery life is under 2 hours at this point and they refuse to reveal that.

If I can't record my own movies or mp3s to a disc this device is not worth more than $100. I refuse to pay more than $100 for a portable game device.

I did however pay $250 for a PDA.
 
I know what you mean about wanting it to fail, I feel kind of the same way, for some reason sony making a portable game system makes them even more evil to me.
 
Why wouldn't you want to see Sony come down on Nintendo's handheld market? Even if you hate Sony the competition'll still be good for the consumer and hopefully drive Nintendo to develop some games instead of just porting or emulating them.

Who are you talking to? If you're talking to me, I qualified my statement that I don't want them to utterly fail for the sake of the naive consumer (although if things go as they have looked since they first announced the PSP, it can't have very much success).
 
[quote name='Mr Unoriginal']Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail? Seems that they are talking a lot of shit for a system that at this point is not particularly practical. I may be wrong because I have not been reading many articles on it, but it seems like the system will be good or bad based on a whole lot of "ifs".

Plus another part of me just doesn't want to see Sony coming down on Nintendo's handheld market.[/quote]

I don't know if fail is the right word...I just want to see the DS beat the snot out of the PSP saleswise. :)

Sony doesn't seem to know what they're getting into here. Nintendo may have a monopoly, but it's because they're the best with portables. Sony keeps on announcing things that just sound like a bad idea. What happens when the analog stick wears out, and how long will that take? Is there really a market for the non-gaming features? How on Earth are they going to be even remotely competitive with the pricing of the GBA and its games?

I'll give Sony its due if the PSP works...but at this point, I really don't see that happening. Then again, we've all been wrong before...
 
I don't know if fail is the right word...I just want to see the DS beat the snot out of the PSP saleswise.

Sony doesn't seem to know what they're getting into here. Nintendo may have a monopoly, but it's because they're the best with portables. Sony keeps on announcing things that just sound like a bad idea. What happens when the analog stick wears out, and how long will that take? Is there really a market for the non-gaming features? How on Earth are they going to be even remotely competitive with the pricing of the GBA and its games?

I'll give Sony its due if the PSP works...but at this point, I really don't see that happening. Then again, we've all been wrong before...

Ditto. That's pretty much how I have felt. Nicely put Gothic_Walrus.
 
It was always a given with a Sony product that they would push their ATRAC format. They own it and don't have to pay any license as they would with MP3 playback.

As for playing your own video, keep in mind that the PSx DVR and Sony laptops have Memory Stick slots. For game saves Memory stick compares pretty well with PS2 Memory Cards. A 64 MB Memory Stick can be had for the same $20 as an 8 MB PS2 card. At the high end Sony is aiming to have 1 GB Memory Sticks under $100 by late 2005.

This opens up some possibilities. The screen resolution of the PSP is less than half that for a widescreen NTSC display (keeping ratios equal) which means the file sizes for video will be accordingly smaller. In addition the PSP uses MPEG-4 natively which is a much small per frame cost in storage consumption. If the PSX or other Memory Stick capable DVR is programmed to produce files optimized for the PSP display you'll be able to get quite a lot on a single Memory Stick. Pretty cool if you want to watch recorded TV shows during your morning commute and fairly competitive with portable media players with lesser gaming abilites.

PSP has a load of problems but UMD as a ROM format is far down the list.
 
I don't blame Sony for trying. I just think they're pursuing the wrong formula. If they tried to go head-on with Nintendo at the same price points instead of pushing a Ferarri it would be accessable to all and give the market a good kick in the butt to improve the quality of portable games. The amount of worthless licenseware on the GBA would be the death of any console with real competition.
 
The only thing that this system is missing is DUAL analog sticks. Why they only have one is beyond me. How hard could it be to add another. That is a SEVERE oversight IMO.
 
[quote name='Mr Unoriginal']Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail? Seems that they are talking a lot of shit for a system that at this point is not particularly practical. I may be wrong because I have not been reading many articles on it, but it seems like the system will be good or bad based on a whole lot of "ifs".

Plus another part of me just doesn't want to see Sony coming down on Nintendo's handheld market.[/quote]

I buy all systems. But personally, I hope this fails as well. Nintendo has held the market for so long, and I don't want to see it any other way. The good thing is it's making Nintendo work harder to stay #1. Guess I am just a Nintendo fanboy at heart. :wink:
 
a: Why would you want it to fail?

b: The Japanese consumer market is almost the opposite of the American consumer market. They are the main target market, you opinion is about as valuable as a bag of sand in the desert.
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']a: Why would you want it to fail?

b: The Japanese consumer market is almost the opposite of the American consumer market. They are the main target market, you opinion is about as valuable as a bag of sand in the desert.[/quote]

In answer to b, that's why companies aren't developing for the XBox and focusing mostly on the PS2 and Gamecube right? Am I right?
 
i understand what everyone is saying about not wanting sony to take over nintendos handheld dominance, i felt the same way when they made the playstation, i was stubborn and bought a 64 first, and i held on to it and liked it, but the playstation just had some amazing games, and they just got better as the system got older. i have a feeling itll be the same with the psp, bottom line is its going to have tons of third party support, which means lots of great games (lots of bad ones too).... point is, its gonna be good and become great
and as for the UMD disk problem, itll probably be alright when you consider that memory sticks are HUGE now, fewyears into psps life youll be able to pick up a 5 GB stick (at a price of course)
AND a final thought... they have to be scrambling to figure out how to extend the battery life so id say wait for the 2nd generation models if not the 3rd.
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']Well, I don't like the DS, so I am hoping the PSP does VERY well, enough for an early price drop.[/quote]

I'm guessing that the "VERY" is supposed to be sarcastic, because otherwise your post makes negative sense. It actually takes away sense from other posts that used to make sense.
 
[quote name='iheartmetal']i understand what everyone is saying about not wanting sony to take over nintendos handheld dominance, i felt the same way when they made the playstation, i was stubborn and bought a 64 first, and i held on to it and liked it, but the playstation just had some amazing games, and they just got better as the system got older[/quote]

Sony has ruined the console gaming scene, in my opinion. I equate them to Electronic Arts in many regards.

fuck PlayStation 1&2 and fuck the PSP. Sony can go fuck themselves, because the 64 was always better than the Playstation and it's 50 miliion crappy games. At least Nintendo always comes through with quality games. Quality, not quantity.
 
[quote name='Gothic_Walrus'][quote name='Mr Unoriginal']Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail? Seems that they are talking a lot of shit for a system that at this point is not particularly practical. I may be wrong because I have not been reading many articles on it, but it seems like the system will be good or bad based on a whole lot of "ifs".

Plus another part of me just doesn't want to see Sony coming down on Nintendo's handheld market.[/quote]

I don't know if fail is the right word...I just want to see the DS beat the snot out of the PSP saleswise. :)

Sony doesn't seem to know what they're getting into here. Nintendo may have a monopoly, but it's because they're the best with portables. Sony keeps on announcing things that just sound like a bad idea. What happens when the analog stick wears out, and how long will that take? Is there really a market for the non-gaming features? How on Earth are they going to be even remotely competitive with the pricing of the GBA and its games?

I'll give Sony its due if the PSP works...but at this point, I really don't see that happening. Then again, we've all been wrong before...[/quote]

Intresting point about the analog stick. I never thought about the fact that all my analog sticks that are old (even 1st party) get loose. Damn... another unthought of problem with "advanced" portable gaming that Nintendo forsaw before anyone else did. Thats the thing with the portable market, theres a VERY delicate balance between power and portability that Nintendo has mastered.
 
[quote name='beerguy961'][quote name='Quackzilla']a: Why would you want it to fail?

b: The Japanese consumer market is almost the opposite of the American consumer market. They are the main target market, you opinion is about as valuable as a bag of sand in the desert.[/quote]

In answer to b, that's why companies aren't developing for the XBox and focusing mostly on the PS2 and Gamecube right? Am I right?[/quote]

No, it's simply the standard Japanese circling of the wagons against an unwelcome foreigner. This is SOP across many industries there. Japanese consumers naturally responded in kind when they saw little support coming from the developers who mattered in their eyes.
 
[quote name='OneThousandFingers']Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail?

I hear what you're saying. I'm by no means a Nintendo fanboy, but the Game Boy has been such a cultural institution that challanging just about amounts to blasphemy at this point.

On the other hand I never really want any gaming system to fail. If it succeeds it will eventually have quality games, the price will drop and I can buy it on the cheap in 6 years :lol:[/quote]

The Atari 2600 was also a cultural institution, but it died because it rested on its laurels. The Game Boy is also falling into this trap. Most GBA titles released today are rehashes of SNES/Genesis games. There is very little innovation or excitement about upcoming titles. I, for one, welcome Sony's entrance into the portable gaming market because competition breeds better games. If Nintendo doesn't get its act together, it will lose its hold on the portable gaming market, much like the way it lost the console wars.
 
It appears Sony has already beat Sony to formatting DVR material for portable playback devices.

The latest rev of Media Center PC will transcode recording in the background while they're recording so the transfer to your Portable Media Player is a quick file transfer. At the lower resolution in WMV 9 the file is quite small compared to the MPEG-2 original.
http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/pmc.asp


You don't have to buy a Media Center PC either. You have a choice of several TV tuner/DVR cards from third parties.
http://www.winnetmag.com/windowspaulthurrott/Article/ArticleID/43842/windowspaulthurrott_43842.html
 
[quote name='anonymouswhoami'][quote name='OneThousandFingers']Am I the only one that kinda wants to see the PSP fail?

I hear what you're saying. I'm by no means a Nintendo fanboy, but the Game Boy has been such a cultural institution that challanging just about amounts to blasphemy at this point.

On the other hand I never really want any gaming system to fail. If it succeeds it will eventually have quality games, the price will drop and I can buy it on the cheap in 6 years :lol:[/quote]

The Atari 2600 was also a cultural institution, but it died because it rested on its laurels. The Game Boy is also falling into this trap. Most GBA titles released today are rehashes of SNES/Genesis games. There is very little innovation or excitement about upcoming titles. I, for one, welcome Sony's entrance into the portable gaming market because competition breeds better games. If Nintendo doesn't get its act together, it will lose its hold on the portable gaming market, much like the way it lost the console wars.[/quote]

The problem with PSP is that the expected price point is so much higher it cannot be expected to have much effect on Nintendo's GameBoy market. It would be like expecting the Neo-Geo to have an impact on SNES sales back in that era. Even if the games hadn't been prohibitively expensive (this could have easily been achieved via CD-ROM and additional RAM, as was done later in the Neo-Geo line but SNK had economic reasons for increasing their mask ROM orders) the base hardware would still have relegated the system to a niche market a small fraction of that commanded by the SNES.
 
I'm sorry I just can't be enthusiastic about Sony's hardware anymore. After a Playstation and a pair of Playstation 2s have failed on me, I can't help but think that if I spend $200+ on a PSP it's just going to do the same thing. Until Sony can re-establish themselves as a company that can build hardware that lasts, they're not getting any more of my money.

(Also, I don't want to hear any BS excuse about their hardware performance because they dont make money/loose money/whatever with the PS2. It's dumb and irrelevant. If you manufacture a console, no matter if you're making money off it or not, it should last as long as games are still being produced for the system under normal usage and conditions. Period.)
 
[quote name='anonymouswhoami']
The Atari 2600 was also a cultural institution, but it died because it rested on its laurels. The Game Boy is also falling into this trap. Most GBA titles released today are rehashes of SNES/Genesis games. There is very little innovation or excitement about upcoming titles. I, for one, welcome Sony's entrance into the portable gaming market because competition breeds better games. If Nintendo doesn't get its act together, it will lose its hold on the portable gaming market, much like the way it lost the console wars.[/quote]

You're forgetting two things. First, Atari didn't rest on its laurels. There was this thing called the 5200. A major upgrade, to say the least. Following that there was the 7800, more of a true 2600 succesor since it was backward compatible to that system. It never got anywhere due to Warner Comm. pulling the plug on the whole operation.

Second, the GameBoy has hardly stood still. There was one major hardware revision to the original B&W platform, then the Gameboy Color, and most recently the GBA, an entirely new platform which has also seen a major hardware revision. While many 16-bit titles have been revived on the GBA, those have reached millions of consumers who in many cases weren't even born when those titles first appeared. This has been hugely lucrative. There have also been more than enough original games on GBA to qualify its existence. True, those are mostly games that could have been produced on the SNES but that is no longer a viable place to publish while the GBA is. The revenue from the Advance Wars series, new Castlevania entries, Mario & Luigi Superstar Saga, Metroid Fusion, etc are numbers Sony would be thrilled to reproduce on their own platform. First, they have to ship a product at a price that will provide a sufficient installed base to approach GBA sales numbers.
 
Atari did rest on its laurels. The 5200 did not come out until 1982, but by then Colecovision was already out. Why would people purchase a unit that wasn't as powerful as the competition and that also couldn't play their old 2600 games, something that the Colecovision was able to do (with an adapter). The games for the 5200 were the same titles as the 2600, just upgraded in terms of graphics (Pac Man, Pitfall, River Raid, Pole Position). There was no innovation. Nintendo execs think the same way about the Gameboy. Without competition, the original Game Boy's life span was more than 12 years! There was no need to innovate because they didn't have to. I don't call adding color or trimming the size of the unit a major upgrade. In the same time span, 3 generations of consoles came and went. Instead of going back to the drawing board and coming up with innovative hardware, they give us a souped up GBA with a second screen? The price tag of the PSP will also plummet with time. Remember, the Sony Playstation was $299 at launch, the Sega Saturn $399. The PSP is not aimed at the 12 year old like the GBA, it's aimed at the 20-35 year old with disposable cash.
 
[quote name='anonymouswhoami']Atari did rest on its laurels. The 5200 did not come out until 1982, but by then Colecovision was already out. Why would people purchase a unit that wasn't as powerful as the competition and that also couldn't play their old 2600 games, something that the Colecovision was able to do (with an adapter). The games for the 5200 were the same titles as the 2600, just upgraded in terms of graphics (Pac Man, Pitfall, River Raid, Pole Position). There was no innovation. Nintendo execs think the same way about the Gameboy. Without competition, the original Game Boy's life span was more than 12 years! There was no need to innovate because they didn't have to. I don't call adding color or trimming the size of the unit a major upgrade. In the same time span, 3 generations of consoles came and went. Instead of going back to the drawing board and coming up with innovative hardware, they give us a souped up GBA with a second screen? The price tag of the PSP will also plummet with time. Remember, the Sony Playstation was $299 at launch, the Sega Saturn $399. The PSP is not aimed at the 12 year old like the GBA, it's aimed at the 20-35 year old with disposable cash.[/quote]

You have a distorted concept of history. The chipset in the Colecovision was no more recent than that of the Atari. It was all of the shelf chips that first appeared in the 70's. Anyone could duplicate the Coleco because they had zero inhouse silicon engineering personnel. I've programmed both the Coleco/MSX and Atari 8-bit systems. There are things I could do on the Atari that would be like pulling teeth on the Coleco. In addition, those titles that appeared both on the 2600 and 5200 were in the minority. Those staples, which have appeared on almost every console ever marketed, were primarily the early releases that already existed for the Atari computers and made for a quick launch library. The 8K Pac-man got the intermissions it was lacking as a 16K 5200 cart. The eventually library consisted primarily of games that had no 2600 version or that version was so horribly inferior as to make comparison painfully lopsided.

If you don't think adding color to the GameBoy was a major upgrade, well, you're insane. The massive sales of GameBoy Color systems and massive software support attest it was much more than just a minor upgrade for Nintendo's bottom line. Likewise, the Gameboy Pocket didn't just trim the size. The screen was a major imporvement in clarity and made for a major spike in sales to those who'd found its predecessor unusable. Again the sales prove the value of the revision.

If you think the DS is merely a souped up GBA with asecond screen, you're in for a surprise. I spent time with it hands-on at E3. This is a much more powerful and highly innovative design that strives to stay close to the formula that made the GB line such a success. The test of a higher price of entry is the sole risk. The extent of that risk is minor compared to what Sony is attempting.

It's not clear to me why you're referencing the price of the Sega Saturn at launch. What has that to do with this. As for the US launch price of the PS1, so what? We're all well aware that these thing drop in cost over time but this only happens, outside of fire sales like the Dreamcast demise, when a product is a success at its original price. Sony, and most importantly third party developers, need to see some serious ROI to sustain this product long enough for advances to allow price drops. In the same time frame the DS will do the same. It is unlikely Sony will be able to close that gap. While the DS moves down into the realm of temptation purchases the PSP will go from very expensive to merely expensive. If this was a winning formula SNK would have sold a lot more consoles.

Referencing the PSP demographic is another trouble point. First, there is no proven market for portable game systems in the adult market. The GBA, despite reaching a goodly number of adult gamers, would be worthless to Nintendo if that segment were the sole purchaasers. Kids outnumber adults in the handheld sector by about 100 to 1. The need to control whiny children during long car trips is a major market in of itself. Plenty of adults who have a PS2 at home for Madden wouldn't be caught dead in public with a portable game system.

The second problem is too assume those adults who do want a portable game system will find the price reasonable even with their deeper pockets. This is not an iPOD. The iPOD is a primarily passive device. You start it on a playlist and ignore it. It is an environmental accessory rather the focus of attention. You can find numerous people going through their entire day with an iPOD strapped on since it only plays what they like and holds enough to go all day without repeating. On that basis it justifies the price. The PSP doesn't fit that equation. Yes, plenty of us here are GBA owners but the typical employed adult doesn't have enough free time away from home to make a portable game system that enticing at such a price. At the same time the price puts it out of the reach of kids and will make their parents gasp if requested to buy it.

IMHO, Sony is trying to win the market by sheer firepower directed at a target that may not exist. They aren't doing anything Nintendo couldn't do if they thought there was a market at that level. Their technology partners have more than a little experience in silicon for portable systems. Heck, with some engineering refinements taking advantage of current production process sizes it wouldn't be that hard to make a portable GameCube that sold for that price and ran the existing library. The question is, who's buying?
 
[quote name='Indiana']If I can't record my own movies or mp3s to a disc this device is not worth more than $100. I refuse to pay more than $100 for a portable game device.[/quote]

I hear that. Portable gaming a very niche experience, and pretty much all the time I spent playing my GBA was time when I literally could not play on a console. If I'm at home with the big screen and stereo, I'm not going to play a game on a 4-inch screen with one tiny speaker. The GBA is for traveling or sneaking a game at work or school, not a primary game device.
 
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