Surprise for us Later Today!?!?!

[quote name='galvatron2k1']And I think there lies the problem. It is a very expensive upgrade because you have to buy a whole new console for all the features. Last time I checked, this was CHEAP ass gamer. But that also is beyond the point.

I know I'm pissed and will not buy another console from Microsoft because of this and it seems that pimp may have some issues buying this as well. Does Microsoft owe us anything? No. But if they were in such a battle to try and be the top, I think they should offer alternatives for people that supported them from the start.

Even their Windows Operating System gives you the option of upgrading at a reduced package (although it is software), but still at least they give you something.

Now, if Playstation were doing something like this, would you defend them the same way or talk about how much they screwed their consumers?[/QUOTE]

I'm sorry, your just a moron if your pissed that Microsoft released a revision to there system 18 months after release. Nintendo has done it nearly every generation (Nintendo, Super Nintendo, GameCube, Gameboy, Gameboy Advance, DS) and Sony has done it with both the Playstation and Playstation 2. Expect it soon with the PSP as well. Your not gonna buy another Sony or Nintendo system again....right? Lets not even get into the fact that the PS3 has now removed the Emotion Chip from all PS3s. Or now that Rumble may be standard with all newer systems in the future.
 
[quote name='gizmogc']I'm sorry, your just a moron if your pissed that Microsoft released a revision to there system 18 months after release. Nintendo has done it nearly every generation (Nintendo, Super Nintendo, GameCube, Gameboy, Gameboy Advance, DS) and Sony has done it with both the Playstation and Playstation 2. Expect it soon with the PSP as well. Your not gonna buy another Sony or Nintendo system again....right? Lets not even get into the fact that the PS3 has now removed the Emotion Chip from all PS3s. Or now that Rumble may be standard with all newer systems in the future.[/QUOTE]
Wasn't it about 18 months between DS and Lite?
 
[quote name='WhipSmartBanky']Wasn't it about 18 months between DS and Lite?[/QUOTE]

Yep. Many people re-bought that. Just like the SP before it. And the SP II. And the Micro. How many iPods have been releases? Will you just not buy those anymore either? :roll:
 
I don't know why someone would be pissed about this. It happens all the time to early adopters. I'd feel like I was getting raped if I paid $480 for a 360.

I just think it's stupid to release a 3rd SKU (two was bad enough) with less features than you're competition for a comparable price.
 
[quote name='gizmogc']I'm sorry, your just a moron if your pissed that Microsoft released a revision to there system 18 months after release. Nintendo has done it nearly every generation (Nintendo, Super Nintendo, GameCube, Gameboy, Gameboy Advance, DS) and Sony has done it with both the Playstation and Playstation 2. Expect it soon with the PSP as well. Your not gonna buy another Sony or Nintendo system again....right? Lets not even get into the fact that the PS3 has now removed the Emotion Chip from all PS3s. Or now that Rumble may be standard with all newer systems in the future.[/quote]

Now I'm a moron because I won't pay $480 for a console I already have but you will? Yeah, that makes sense. It's pointless to debate with you.

But yet I see this crap in your revision list - "V5 introduces minor internal changes and the only difference between V6 (sometimes called V5.1) and V5 is the orientation of the Power/Reset switch board connector, which was reversed to prevent the use of no-solder modchips. V7 and V8 are also similar."

So some of these revisions were to block modchips... :roll:

Now, if Sony makes a revision to their console that has meaning to me and is not upgradeable, then yes, I will be saying the same stuff on the Sony boards! If Nintendo does the same, then yes, I will be on the Nintendo boards. Problem is... although many of you produce valid arguments (which I have given credit to), is this going to get HDMI on my 360? Can I buy a port to upgrade my existing 360? Yet, although PS3 has their faults... it is on their console. Packed in cable or not, you can buy it separately. Like I said in the beginning... PS3 looks better and better.
 
[quote name='WhipSmartBanky']Wasn't it about 18 months between DS and Lite?[/quote]

That's a really good point, I forgot how pissed off I was after I bought a DS and a couple months later the DS lite was announced.:lol:
 
$480 is rediculous for this sku. If Microsoft was serious about winning next gen, this would be the new $400 sku. Way to hand marketshare over to Sony, MS. $20 away from the 20GB PS3 WITHOUT any HD media drive? Are you kidding?

Microsoft should see how obvious is is that people want lower priced systems (look at the Wii's success) and pull away from Sony with a $300 premium and $400 Elite model.

I'm perfectly happy with my premium 360 and I won't be upgrading anytime soon. The black 360 looks like it lost it's penis in a fire anyway.

Controllers look kinda cool in black though. Might actually get a second controller in black.
 
[quote name='galvatron2k1']Now I'm a moron because I won't pay $480 for a console I already have but you will? Yeah, that makes sense. It's pointless to debate with you.[/QUOTE]

"I know I'm pissed and will not buy another console from Microsoft because of this..."

Because of a revision 18 months after it was released. Don't buy a Nintendo, Sony, Apple, etc. ever then.
 
[quote name='gizmogc']"I know I'm pissed and will not buy another console from Microsoft because of this..."

Because of a revision 18 months after it was released. Don't buy a Nintendo, Sony, Apple, etc. ever then.[/quote]

Still have a DS phat... anything different besides the look? Nope... So, didn't buy a DS lite.

Still have a PS2 phat... anything different besides the look? Minor... So, didn't buy a slim PS2.

Still have a GBA SP I. anything different besides the look? Yep, screen is darker... So, screw Nintendo, will I buy another... nope.

Apple Ipod... Don't give a shit...

However, let's total up the systems I do have and look at the prices the new consoles were released at...

DS Lite = $129 I believe
PS2 Slim = $199 when it originally came out, correct me if I'm wrong.
GBA SP II = $100. again, just an estimate.

Total for all 3 - $438. Upgrading to Microsoft elite - $480.
 
[quote name='jer7583']$480 is rediculous for this sku. If Microsoft was serious about winning next gen, this would be the new $400 sku. Way to hand marketshare over to Sony, MS. $20 away from the 20GB PS3 WITHOUT any HD media drive? Are you kidding?

Microsoft should see how obvious is is that people want lower priced systems (look at the Wii's success) and pull away from Sony with a $300 premium and $400 Elite model.

I'm perfectly happy with my premium 360 and I won't be upgrading anytime soon. The black 360 looks like it lost it's penis in a fire anyway.

Controllers look kinda cool in black though. Might actually get a second controller in black.[/QUOTE]

Yeah. I wish the rumor that the Elite would be the "new premium" and be priced at $400, and the current premium be the "new core" at $300 were true.

I'm shocked to hear that they didn't announce that the current Core would no longer be sold....
 
[quote name='galvatron2k1']Still have a DS phat... anything different besides the look? Nope... So, didn't buy a DS lite.
[/QUOTE]

Wrong.

DS Lite has *hugely* upgraded screens, in both quality and brightness. Better Stylus too. The system on the whole is better.

I do agree with you on the upgrade costs though, I didn't mind upgrading to a DSL because it was only $130, and I shaved off $50 of that thanks to trading in my DS.

It dosen't matter, as the 360 is built like shit, and mine is broken anyways, so I can't trade that in for anything even if there was a deal.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']Is anyone else not that mad because:

A. They don't care too much about the HDMI because they think component looks pretty damn good as it is

and

B. They haven't filled up their 20 gig HD at all yet (and it's really only a 12 gig HD)

I'm mad because I want a BLACK 360. That thing looks sexy as hell.[/QUOTE]

I agree. To me HDMI is not prevalent enough yet to warrant the kind of mass frenzy it seems to be creating and component works fine for me. I've been looking for a new audio setup including a receiver and it's really hard to find a nice, decent price HDMI switching receiver. My TV is not large enough nor are my eyes trained enough to see any difference so HDMI is just a nice bonus to me b/c I do like the one cable mentality. And yes I'm 6GB short of max but that's only because I've got demos I should delete and have never played or the original videos that came with it as I find Warren Miller just nice to watch from time to time. Now if I could re-download those videos again I'd have even more space.

What I really want for now is the black b/c and I quote "DAMMMMMN" just like black dreamcast.

No true hardware(working components of the console) upgrade=$0 from me. Besides we all know this will become available on the pro for cheaper and hardware upgrades too at a later date so for now I'm happy. Hopefully when the upgrades do come, MS will ship several colors of the console so I can get a black one.

What puts me off about the whole podcast was that he encourages people to delete and re-download when you feel like playing again. Well sometimes I just want to power up my console and play a little geometry wars without having to go through the marketplace and the download time. And whatever happens if our download history is "misplaced" and we dont have physical copies of what we've downloaded. I agree that 20 GB is the sweet spot but only if all 20 are available and not overly interested in the media marketplace.

All in all, I'm too happy with my year of gaming to be overly upset over this.
 
[quote name='gizmogc']Let me know where you can find a 20GB PS3 since most stores no longer carry them and Sony has all but phased them out due to 'customer demand' of the 60GB. Stop holding onto the price of a $500 PS3 when they are not available to purchase.[/quote]

:whistle2:s So, I'm supposed to let you know now? Because they have them at the local K-Mart. And Wal-Mart. And I went to both of those places yesterday. And until your post, I didn't know they were supposedly hard to find.

EDIT: As far as "upgrades" go, I don't really care that they do it. The only "upgraded" system I have purchased is the PSTwo, and that was mainly because I paid $0 out of pocket to trade up.

I didn't rebuy any of the other systems mentioned in here. I still have my original NES, SNES, PS1, GBA, DS, etc.
 
Honestly, I see this as a major turning point in the MS vs Sony thing. People seeing a $480 Xbox and $500 PS3 on the shelves are going to go with the PS3 every time. MS has totally shot themselves in the foot here. Ugh.
 
[quote name='Roufuss']Wrong.

DS Lite has *hugely* upgraded screens, in both quality and brightness. Better Stylus too. The system on the whole is better.[/quote]

Corrected... DS Lite = screen brightness. Screw Nintendo (x2).
 
Definitely in for the new 120GB HDD. I won't be getting a TV w/HDMI anytime soon (720p over component works ok for me right now), so the Elite will have to stay that way at least for now as far as I'm concerned.

And yeah, this announcement wasn't much of a surprise. I hope tomorrow night's announcement is going to be a little less obvious.
 
[quote name='jer7583']Honestly, I see this as a major turning point in the MS vs Sony thing. People seeing a $480 Xbox and $500 PS3 on the shelves are going to go with the PS3 every time. MS has totally shot themselves in the foot here. Ugh.[/QUOTE]

But aren't people forgetting that the $500 PS3 is still a "crippled" (for lack of a better term) PS3?? And aren't retail stores beginning to no stock the 20 gig version of the PS3? I see the argument, but I don't think it's as strong as people make it out to be.
 
well i was planning on upgrading as I wanted the hdmi output...(I have a setup that it would look better with hdmi), but without the smaller chip and possibly not including the quieter drive I will wait for the white version of the elite to upgrade.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']But aren't people forgetting that the $500 PS3 is still a "crippled" (for lack of a better term) PS3?? And aren't retail stores beginning to no stock the 20 gig version of the PS3? I see the argument, but I don't think it's as strong as people make it out to be.[/QUOTE]

Exactly. For all intents and purposes the 20gb PS3 does not exist as a PS3 purchasing option anymore. Sure you might be able to find an old one still sitting on a store's shelves but by no means is this indicative of it still being marketed. The PS3 is a $600 now and that's that.
 
A problem I have about the new HDD is not that it's $180, but that the 20 gb one is still $100. They say a laptop one is like $160 for 120 gb, but that doesn't explain why the 20 gb hdd is still $100. Same thing with the cards.

And that $100 wireless adapter. WHY!

Anyway, Halo 3 beta will be announced. I'm telling you guys when it comes out, it'll be 2 discs.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']But aren't people forgetting that the $500 PS3 is still a "crippled" (for lack of a better term) PS3?? And aren't retail stores beginning to no stock the 20 gig version of the PS3? I see the argument, but I don't think it's as strong as people make it out to be.[/quote]
How is it crippled at all?

The only knock, which is kind of major, against that argument is that more and more retailers arent stocking it anymore.
 
[quote name='FriskyTanuki']How is it crippled at all?

The only knock, which is kind of major, against that argument is that more and more retailers arent stocking it anymore.[/QUOTE]

Again, like I said, I used the word crippled because no other adjective I could think of could quite describe it. But it does only have a 20 gig HD, no WiFi, and no memory stick slots.

But my main point is that most gamers want the "best" version of whatever console they're buying. For $480, people get the "best" version of the $360 or for $500, people get the lesser version of the PS3.

EDIT

I think the fact that stores are beginning to not carry it supports my argument that people want the best version of their console of choice.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']Again, like I said, I used the word crippled because no other adjective I could think of could quite describe it. But it does only have a 20 gig HD, no WiFi, and no memory stick slots.[/quote]
Yeah, you definitely can't play Motorstorm without that memory stick slot. None of those are crippling differences between the 20GB and 60GB PS3s.

[quote name='A Happy Panda']But my main point is that most gamers want the "best" version of whatever console they're buying. For $480, people get the "best" version of the $360 or for $500, people get the lesser version of the PS3.[/quote]
I agree with what you're saying about people wanting the most fully-featured version of whatever console they're buying. The thing is that the differences between the SKUs of the PS3 and 360 are quite different.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']
EDIT

I think the fact that stores are beginning to not carry it supports my argument that people want the best version of their console of choice.[/QUOTE]
It's self-fulfilling though. The 20GB sells less because they stock less of them. Also, the retailers make more money off the 60GB.

This is getting off topic.
 
[quote name='FriskyTanuki']Yeah, you definitely can't play Motorstorm without that memory stick slot. None of those are crippling differences between the 20GB and 60GB PS3s.


I agree with what you're saying about people wanting the most fully-featured version of whatever console they're buying. The thing is that the differences between the SKUs of the PS3 and 360 are quite different.[/QUOTE]

Ok. So crippling is not a good adjective, I will agree with you there.

But since when do you need a HDMI cable and 120 gig HD to play Gears of War?

My main point is ultimately what we both agree on, people want the best version.

I'm just shocked that people are so offended by Microsoft announcing the Elite model. After a year and a half of amazing games, great service (depends on who you ask) people are willing to bring out the torches and pitchforks on MS, who has for the most part, satisfied a vast majority of gamers. Its as if no company in history has ever screwed over early-adopters before (sarcasm). 18 months is a long time. Companies find ways to make more money. Get over it.
 
It's neat for people who don't already have a 360, but for people who already own one it's kind of not worth it to upgrade since it isn't anything special upgraded.

HAHAHA OMG 120GB HD is $180.... my ass lol...... no thanks. That's one element the PS3 has above the 360 definetly. It's actually kind of suprising how non-propreitary the PS3 is which is very UnSony Like. The 360 on the other hand is redicuously proprietary. I want to use my logitech steering wheel on PGR3 dammit -_-
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']Ok. So crippling is not a good adjective, I will agree with you there.

But since when do you need a HDMI cable and 120 gig HD to play Gears of War?[/quote]
When did I make the claim that that was the case? I never even mentioned the 360, just questioning your post about the two PS3 SKUs having major differences that made one an illogical choice over the other.

[quote name='A Happy Panda']My main point is ultimately what we both agree on, people want the best version.

I'm just shocked that people are so offended by Microsoft announcing the Elite model. After a year and a half of amazing games, great service (depends on who you ask) people are willing to bring out the torches and pitchforks on MS, who has for the most part, satisfied a vast majority of gamers. Its as if no company in history has ever screwed over early-adopters before (sarcasm). 18 months is a long time. Companies find ways to make more money. Get over it.[/quote]
My only reservation is about why MS needs to release the third major SKU this soon, which just seems to just clutter things up a little more.
 
[quote name='FriskyTanuki']When did I make the claim that that was the case? I never even mentioned the 360, just questioning your post about the two PS3 SKUs having major differences that made one an illogical choice over the other.


My only reservation is about why MS needs to release the third major SKU this soon, that just seems to just clutter things up a little more.[/QUOTE]

My point was that people don't need an Elite 360 to play GoW just like people don't need the $600 PS3 to play Motorstorm. That is not just for you, but for everyone. People are acting like they got screwed because somehow they absolutely need the Elite.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']

But my main point is that most gamers want the "best" version of whatever console they're buying. For $480, people get the "best" version of the $360 or for $500, people get the lesser version of the PS3.

[/QUOTE]


Lets not forget that if you want to bring the $480 360 up to spec with the $500 ps3, you end up spending $680 for an HD-DVD player. Even then, the $500 PS3 is still more full featured. Or you can spend $600 and get it for $80 less and wireless...which would put the 360 up to $780. Might as well include all the details in the argument if you're going to make it.

and you can always add an extra 100gb....for 180 fucking dollars :rofl: aka more than the price of DS Lite, PS2, Gamecube, or Xbox and $70 less than a Wii.

That is not just for you, but for everyone. People are acting like they got screwed because somehow they absolutely need the Elite.
Click to expand...

Like you said, people want the best version of the system. The "premium" appeared to be that system for the 360, but instead MS springs this on.
 
I don't feel bad that for the same amount I paid for a 37" 720p LCD a year ago I could have a 42" 1080p TV now.

I don't feel bad that I have purchased THREE versions of the Gameboy Advance.

I don't feel bad that the computer I am typing on will be worth about $300 in one year.

Things get changed, updated and improved all the time. I don't see why this is a big deal. My launch 360 will still play Halo 3 and Gears 2. I don't look down at the contoller and think "man this would be so much more fun if the controller was black."

For a year and a half I have stuck the disc in the machine and it plays the game... the Elite is going to do the same thing. Its existance doesn't invalidate the purchase of a mere "premium" system in any way, shape, or form. Is it good for people who don't have a 360 yet? Sure... but it shouldn't matter to people who are already using and enjoying a 360.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']My point was that people don't need an Elite 360 to play GoW just like people don't need the $600 PS3 to play Motorstorm.[/quote]
Then that wasn't that good of a comparison for "crippled" SKUs. Comparing the 20GB and 60GB PS3s to the Core and Premium 360s is the better comparison for what you were saying before. Then again, I wasn't arguing with that point, so I don't know why it's the focus now. :lol:

/end of discussion between us
 
Apparently, there is no data transfer cable...


http://blog.wired.com/games/2007/03/microsofts_john.html

I asked Rodman whether the Elite itself would also include a hard drive data migration cable, for users who wanted to upgrade their box. "The answer is no, because most people wouldn't use it," he said. But Microsoft is going to provide a migration solution for existing console owners, he added, saying that "the pedal is to the metal" to come up with a solution. Rodman said he would let us know the solution before the April 29 ship date of the Elite.
Click to expand...

Perhaps you will be able to upload your saved items to a microsoft server...and download to your new HD.
 
God I feel bad for the people who end up doing this: (and there are probably more than we think).

Premium - 400
Wireless - 100
HD-DVD - 200
120g HD - 180

Spending $280 more and getting less functionality than a PS3? Priceless.
 
[quote name='getmyrunon']God I feel bad for the people who end up doing this: (and there are probably more than we think).

Premium - 400
Wireless - 100
HD-DVD - 200
120g HD - 180

Spending $280 more and getting less functionality than a PS3? Priceless.[/QUOTE]

-$80 because only retards buy the official Microsoft Wireless adapter.

And which functionality is less? Memory card readers built in?
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']-$80 because only retards buy the official Microsoft Wireless adapter.

And which functionality is less? Memory card readers built in?[/QUOTE]
No, no, no motion sensitive controllers of course.
 
Looks like Japan's not getting the Elite anytime soon (no big surprise there), but the 120 GB hard drive (18,900 yen) and 512 MB memory card (5,775 yen) will be released on June 7 in Japan.

IGN says that there's a data cable with the hard drive. It doesn't mention that it comes with the new SKU though. The PR I got doesn't mention any data cable, so either MS was just light on the details (not much in the way of specs are mentioned in it) or it's one of the fine details that we don't know yet.

A standalone $179.99 HDD also ships April 29. This package includes one 120GB HDD, software, and a specialized cable to port data from a user's current hard drive to the new one. To complement the new black console, Microsoft will also ship a wireless black controller (MSRP $49.99), a black Play and Charge Kit ($19.99), and a standalone rechargeable battery pack ($11.99) on April 29, also in black.

...

Microsoft has no plans to offer rebates, discounts, or free trade-ins for loyal early adopters. When asked how he thought gamers would respond to the new higher-priced addition, Penello said, "I think and hope that people are going to understand. There is as price for being an early adopter and your points and feelings are valid (Penello said when referring to gamers IGN suggested would be angry about the new system). But whenever you innovate and change, you have to face this situation. Your same old system is still perfectly valid. Think about it this way, it's a new bundle that comes with a bigger hard drive."

...

Why should they buy a new system now, if for some new reason, Microsoft decides to create a new system a year and a half from now?

"Should we just ignore new technology? Or listen to the input we hear from gamers and address it? If some new technology comes out, I'm going to have to look at that. We're trying something new."
Click to expand...



Is that the new data cable? Or is that the Play and Charge cable?
 
[quote name='FriskyTanuki']Looks like Japan's not getting the Elite anytime soon (no big surprise there), but the 120 GB hard drive (18,900 yen) and 512 MB memory card (5,775 yen) will be released on June 7 in Japan.

IGN says that there's a data cable with the hard drive. It doesn't mention that it comes with the new SKU though.





Is that the new data cable? Or is that the Play and Charge cable?[/QUOTE]
Play and Charge and a battery pack.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']-$80 because only retards buy the official Microsoft Wireless adapter.

And which functionality is less? Memory card readers built in?[/QUOTE]


hdmi, blu-ray, 3 systems in 1, true 1080p... it still ends up being more than a PS3 but with less functionality.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']-$80 because only retards buy the official Microsoft Wireless adapter.

And which functionality is less? Memory card readers built in?[/QUOTE]

Oops, I meant to say spending $280 more to equal base functionality of a PS3.
 
[quote name='Apossum']hdmi, blu-ray, 3 systems in 1, true 1080p... it still ends up being more than a PS3 but with less functionality.[/QUOTE]

Oh I didn't see in his original post he was pricing out the premium. I guess if you price out the Elite now, you can cross off HDMI, don't know what you mean by "true 1080p", I thought they were removing the emotion chip, and yeah, not everyone wants a HD movie player.

After mulling over the official announcement, I really hope MS decides to offer a substantially discounted Add-on with the purchase of an Elite very soon.
 
Yeah, who cares about this new xbox. Mine is fine, and I'll keep my eyes open for a deal on the 120GB drive. Those things are going to be shelf warmers just waiting to be marked down.

Am I the only one who thinks this thing is going to flop ? And be as hard to find as a 20 gig ps3 ?
 
Don't know if this has been posted or not, but it looks like the Elite does NOT have the 65nm chipset, which blows. I would gladly pay the extra $80 to get that early (compared with the main line). But if now they are going to make the standard model in white with all these features PLUS the 65nm chip and price it back to $400 in the Fall, well, damn, I'm conflicted now. I may just wait :cry:. I'd hate to pay MORE than normal and get the last of the overheating/failing systems. Unless they come out with more info about this supposedly cooler running system (in what way, has it been improved and quieted and cooled in other ways than the 65nm chip would provide?) I'm hesitant...
 
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