The Falcons Are In The Wild - But Rarer Than A Mewtwo! Gotta' Catch Them All!

Zen Davis

Zen Davis

Banned
Update 2:
[quote name='oNeWiNgEdAnGeL']Since I work at Best Buy I can use the store's system to check out for items being released and whatnot. I printed out the screen with all the info listed below. I was going to take a picture with my cell, but the quality sucks. This is basically all the news I could gather:

- Xbox 360 Pro System w/HDMI is a DIFFERENT sku from all other 360s.
- Release date on these is 09/01/07
- For some reason, the dimensions of the box and item are different. I don't know if the box means the item it's shipped in or the actual box itself and if the item is the system itself, or if the box if the 360 box, or if the box is the box shipped in and the item is the 360 box. The weight leads me to believe that the box is the item that we get and the item are the 360 boxes since weight of the box is almost double of that item and each box comes with 2 Xbox 360s if I'm not mistaken.

Here are the dimensions for the old 360/Elite:

Box:
Length: 15.1300 IN
Width: 11.8100 IN
Height: 12.8100 IN
Weight: 31.0100 LB

Item:
Length: 7.3100 IN
Width: 11.5000 IN
Height: 12.5000 IN
Weight: 14.9100 LB

Here it is for the new HDMI "Pro" 360:

Box:
Length: 11.5000 IN
Width: 7.3100 IN
Height: 12.5000 IN
Weight: 16.6700 LB

Item:
Length: 11.5000 IN
Width: 7.3100 IN
Height: 12.5000 IN
Weight: 16.6700 LB

So that probably means each box we get contains only one system. However, as you can see, the systems did get a little heavier. The boxes themselves changed in size as well.

I'll address any questions you guys may have.[/quote]

Update: Premiums with HDMI are now available:
hdmi_prem.jpg

we present the first of many you'll be seeing with the much-discussed, built-in HDMI port (and obviously the cooler 65nm chips onboard). You can stop saving and start buying -- as long as your Xbox was built on or around July 4th, a date which will now be remembered for two reasons.
Click to expand...
http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/08/xbox-360-premium-confirmed-shipping-with-hdmi/

[quote name='Trakan']http://kotaku.com/gaming/confirmed/microsoft-hdmi-coming-to-premium-360s-287542.php[/quote]
LinkinPrime edit.
---*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
When I was at E3 I had a chance to get a look at the new Halo-edition 360 hardware, and I asked about the HDMI connection. "HDMI will probably be standard moving forward," I was told. I pushed for more information, but was rebuffed. Now, after the price drop announcement, a mole sent us some interesting information about Microsoft's upcoming hardware plans. If you're thinking of buying, you may want to hold off.

First, a few caveats. This is rumor. I won't name the source, but the information she/he provided me matches up with everything I've been told and understand about Microsoft's future hardware plans. I think it sounds solid, but I'm not willing to say this will definitely happen.

2.jpg


Soon you may not have to choose between the Elite and HDMI
According to my source, Microsoft wants to cut through all their existing inventory of hardware. They will then quietly "soft launch" a new version of the Core and Premium hardware in late August or September that will include an HDMI port. It's also expected that this new hardware will feature the 65nm process for the CPU and quieter DVD drives. The new hardware will ship in boxes very similar to what we saw on store shelves now, but there will be a small "call out" on the box so you know you're getting a system with the HDMI connection.

Much about this information makes sense. We can expect the 65nm machines to launch any time now, and with the launch of the Halo-edition system only the Cores and Premiums will lack the HDMI, this revision will make the connection standard. We also know Microsoft will be fixing the heating issues that caused their costly warranty extension, and bundling all these updates into one product moving forward would be a smart move.
Click to expand...
http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2007/08/07/360-cores-and-premiums-with-hdmi-an-inside-source-spills-the-beans

I can't wait.
 
Hope that rumor pans out, as that's just what I'm waiting for.

Want the new chips for piece of mind, a quiter drive for less annoyance, and HDMI would be ideal for me as I have a free HDMI input on my HDTV, but all the componet inputs are taken (though I could move the cable box to HDMI with a DVI to HDMI cable if I had to).

If this, and the rumor of another drop to $300 this fall for the premium is true, I'll be a happy camper.
 
Is there a plan for a new, quieter drive?

[quote name='dmaul1114']Hope that rumor pans out, as that's just what I'm waiting for.

Want the new chips for piece of mind, a quiter drive for less annoyance, and HDMI would be ideal for me as I have a free HDMI input on my HDTV, but all the componet inputs are taken (though I could move the cable box to HDMI with a DVI to HDMI cable if I had to).

If this, and the rumor of another drop to $300 this fall for the premium is true, I'll be a happy camper.[/quote]
 
I hope they slap a big sticker on it that says "65 nano chip included!"

or Red Rings of Death Free!
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']

If this, and the rumor of another drop to $300 this fall for the premium is true, I'll be a happy camper.[/QUOTE]
Where have you heard this rumor? I'm not doubting you, I just haven't personally heard anything about another drop (besides CAGs wishing for it, that is)
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']Wonder what will happen to the existing X360 stock??? Will it get recalled from stores or clearanced?[/QUOTE]

I keep hearing this IS the clearance-the price drop is being used to try to clear out the remaining inventory.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Hope that rumor pans out, as that's just what I'm waiting for.

Want the new chips for piece of mind, a quiter drive for less annoyance, and HDMI would be ideal for me as I have a free HDMI input on my HDTV, but all the componet inputs are taken (though I could move the cable box to HDMI with a DVI to HDMI cable if I had to).

If this, and the rumor of another drop to $300 this fall for the premium is true, I'll be a happy camper.[/QUOTE]
QFT
 
[quote name='Danimal']Where have you heard this rumor? I'm not doubting you, I just haven't personally heard anything about another drop (besides CAGs wishing for it, that is)[/QUOTE]

CheapyD posted it in the 360 price drop thread in the deals forum a while back. Saying the current drop was to clear stock, then their would be another drop this fall when those were gone and the falcons (which are cheaper to produce) are on store shelves pretty much exclusively (as the old models have sold through).

Edit: Here's his post. He actually just got it from another board, so it is a just a rumor for sure. But hopefully will pan out....really needs to if the 360 wants to compete with the Wii at all this holiday season.

[quote name='CheapyD']
artredis1980 from NeoGaf says

have it coming from a reliable source that CURRENTLY

The Core will drop to 279
The Premium will drop to 349
The Elite will drop to 449

This will clear out the inventory of the Premium which is the most manufactured 360 and the most sold as they know Premium will sell the most until the demand for Elites pick up in 2008. Elites and Cores have relatively the same manufacturing percentage: low at the moment until FALL this year.

When the 65 nm processor falcons are introduced across all SKUs, the holiday season, a month or so after Halo 3 will see the core drop to $249, The Premium will drop to $299 and the Elite will drop to $399.

The Core, Premium and Elite Falcons will have a redesigned motherboard which includes HDMI across all SKUs, a quieter DVD Drive and the falcons will STILL have an extra fan heatsink as Microsoft is not prepared to take anymore risks.

The Falcon will reduce the cost to manufacture the Xbox 360 CPU and GPU by ~40-50% but Microsoft will incure additional costs on the new fans and HDMI across all SKUs. Still at the 249,299 and 399 price, Microsoft will expect a profit from the console by early 2008 when the Q4 results are announced.



EDIT: Clearing out inventory of 90nm so they mostly have 65nm on shelves this holiday season
Click to expand...
[/QUOTE]
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']If Cheapy's theory pans out...then I'm not sure if I should get a Halo 3 Themed X360, might as well wait to get a Elite.[/quote]120GB drive takes care of all the ills with worrying about space.

Between the Elite and the H3 LE 360, I'd go with the Elite every single time. The color scheme and LE gamerpics/themes aren't worth passing up 100GB worth of HD space.
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']If Cheapy's theory pans out...then I'm not sure if I should get a Halo 3 Themed X360, might as well wait to get a Elite.[/QUOTE]

Again, Cheapy just quoted that post from artredis1980 at NeoGaf, so who knows how reliable it is.

It did have the actual price drops for the current drop right, and was posted earlier than I saw anywhere else, so that helps add some credence to that poster as he may well have insider info.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']CheapyD posted it in the 360 price drop thread in the deals forum a while back. Saying the current drop was to clear stock, then their would be another drop this fall when those were gone and the falcons (which are cheaper to produce) are on store shelves pretty much exclusively (as the old models have sold through).

Edit: Here's his post. He actually just got it from another board, so it is a just a rumor for sure. But hopefully will pan out....really needs to if the 360 wants to compete with the Wii at all this holiday season.[/QUOTE]


yeah I can see what sony and MS did.. to cut the price just enough to get the unit moving and to get some of the gamers to buy it now.. and then when the holiday hit.. they'll have to lower the price once again to make it more affordable.. at PS3/$400 and 360/$300

Wonder if Wii will lower at all, probably not.. but they may come out with new color like pink or something for the girlie gamers.. :)
 
[quote name='racthamp']yeah I can see what sony and MS did.. to cut the price just enough to get the unit moving and to get some of the gamers to buy it now.. and then when the holiday hit.. they'll have to lower the price once again to make it more affordable.. at PS3/$400 and 360/$300 [/quote]

Those prices would make a tough decision for me. 360 kills the PS3 in terms of games I want to play, but given that I watch DVDs far more than I play games, the BluRay player function would make the PS3 damn tempting at $400.

[quote name='racthamp']
Wonder if Wii will lower at all, probably not.. but they may come out with new color like pink or something for the girlie gamers.. :)[/QUOTE]

I doubt it as well. With them not being able to keep it on store shelves at $250, they have no need to drop price this year. Probably see it slashed to $200 next summer would be my guess....whenever supply finally catches up to demand.
 
[quote name='danh']I hope they slap a big sticker on it that says "65 nano chip included!"

or Red Rings of Death Free![/QUOTE]

Why are so many people equating the 65nm chip with a more stable 360?

There is absolutely no evidence to support the theory that a 65nm chip will make the 360 more reliable. Microsoft is pushing for the 65nm strictly for cost reduction in production.

The above is claiming they are working on the cooling issues that are causing abnormally high failure rates. This has more to do with a redesign of the motherboard, fans, and heatsinks.

I really wish this myth that 65nm somehow = more stable 360 would end. Since it isn't even that chip they are making 65nm that is failing. Every indication is that if they threw those 65nm chips in current 360's they would fail just as much.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']Why are so many people equating the 65nm chip with a more stable 360?

There is absolutely no evidence to support the theory that a 65nm chip will make the 360 more reliable. Microsoft is pushing for the 65nm strictly for cost reduction in production.

The above is claiming they are working on the cooling issues that are causing abnormally high failure rates. This has more to do with a redesign of the motherboard, fans, and heatsinks.

I really wish this myth that 65nm somehow = more stable 360 would end. Since it isn't even that chip they are making 65nm that is failing.[/quote]People are assuming that 65nm chip will make for a more stable 360 because it should run cooler.

It's correct that it should run cooler, though that doesn't make any difference if it's not being cooled correctly.

A 360 with a 65nm chip + redesigned heatsink system + redesigned MLB should run cooler, and in theory, be more reliable.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']Why are so many people equating the 65nm chip with a more stable 360?

There is absolutely no evidence to support the theory that a 65nm chip will make the 360 more reliable. Microsoft is pushing for the 65nm strictly for cost reduction in production.

The above is claiming they are working on the cooling issues that are causing abnormally high failure rates. This has more to do with a redesign of the motherboard, fans, and heatsinks.

I really wish this myth that 65nm somehow = more stable 360 would end. Since it isn't even that chip they are making 65nm that is failing. Every indication is that if they threw those 65nm chips in current 360's they would fail just as much.[/QUOTE]


The smaller chips run cooler, so that, along with the new fans, heat sinks etc. that are rumored to be included in the "falcon" should improve reliability. So it's more that we are waiting for the "falcon" for all of those, not just the chips. But the 65nm chips ARE part of the solution as the produce less heat than the 90nm chips.

As I've said before, $350 is still too fucking much for a console for me, period, much less for one with such a high failure rate. $300 and a redesign addressing cooling issues and I'll more strongly consider taking the plunge (though it's still really $50-100 more than I'd like to pay for a console).
 
YEEEEEESSSS!

Come on XBox Live - I want to bring it home. And finish the fight. Or whatever the slogans are. Now, I just need to figure out how to hook up all the HDMI enabled stuff. I guess I can just downgrade the cable box to component video, and put PS3 and X360 on the HDMI.

Unless there's a reasonably priced (< $50) HDMI splitter or something.

Too bad the damn Halo 3 edition doesn't have Halo 3. It will still probably be a "collector's item", but they should really have put together a bundle like an Elite + Halo 3 basic home edition for say $500. I'd even go for a bundle with the HD DVD player for say $550 or $600 with Halo 3.
 
I guess I can buy that the 65nm chips are part of the 'whole package' of redesign in an effort to make it more stable.

I just start to get annoyed ad so many posts that seem to really buy into this fan-based hype that the 65nm chips alone will solve all the problems when those chips rarely fail.
 
Why would the falcon *not* fix the problems the 360 is having?

They admitted to the systems having a potentially fatal flaw and issued $1 billion worth of warranties to avoid a recall and lawsuits...why the hell would they keep making broken systems? So they could keep having to band aid the problem and continue to get 1000s of systems to repair and a shit load of calls about RRoD?

of course they won't come out and say "oh hay, this fixed version is coming out, you can pass on all of our existing stock because it's all crap."
 
[quote name='karkyco']YEEEEEESSSS!

Come on XBox Live - I want to bring it home. And finish the fight. Or whatever the slogans are. Now, I just need to figure out how to hook up all the HDMI enabled stuff. I guess I can just downgrade the cable box to component video, and put PS3 and X360 on the HDMI.

Unless there's a reasonably priced (< $50) HDMI splitter or something.

Too bad the damn Halo 3 edition doesn't have Halo 3. It will still probably be a "collector's item", but they should really have put together a bundle like an Elite + Halo 3 basic home edition for say $500. I'd even go for a bundle with the HD DVD player for say $550 or $600 with Halo 3.[/quote]
If VGA or DVI (via VGA-to-DVI adapter) is an option for your TV, then I'd go with that as a backup plan on connecting the 360. I use VGA on my 360 and it looks fantastic.

Decent HDMI splitters tend to be more than $50, though the one on Monoprice seems to get acceptable reviews.
 
The Halo box is safe. Microsoft would not release any new SKU with defective hardware. That's just stupid.

Oh, and the heatsink supposedly stops the 360 from heating up to the point that the board warps and the chips come off. This + 65mn chips + epoxy would stop the 3RL. THough the heatsink inself supposedly does it. Heatsinks are put in most refurb systems being given to customers regardless of manufacturer date. Board warping / bad solders were the cause of 3RL. No consoles with heatsinks have gotten red ringed yet. The 65mn is cost effective and it can put a nail in the heating problem coffin. Also, there's a rumor of 45mn chips coming out late next year, but 65 mn chips should be the ticke.t

Now please explain to me why the heatsink+epoxy+65mn chips won't work ;)
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']I guess I can buy that the 65nm chips are part of the 'whole package' of redesign in an effort to make it more stable.

I just start to get annoyed ad so many posts that seem to really buy into this fan-based hype that the 65nm chips alone will solve all the problems when those chips rarely fail.[/QUOTE]


I think people just say 65nm as they know that will be part of an overall redesign to fix the issues.

As Apossum said, they aren't going to keep making flawed systems when they've already admitted that everyone of the current models is defective and may fail, and are losing a billion dollars on the warranty extension to cover them.

They want to get rid of the stock of flawed systems, and get the fixed redesigns out there. Arrival of 65nm chips has just been the keymarker for this redesign as it was the first planned changed rumored months ago so it's stuck around.
 
From the research I've done, Punk_Raven is right, the core issue is the motherboard warping and popping off solder points.

I guess if the 65nm runs a lot cooler, then it will help just fine. But yeah, that's just one change of several that will help.

Initial reports are the new heatsinks coming back on refurb consoles are mostly doing the trick though. But apposum, please don't think I'm saying Microsoft shouldn't redesign even if that's true.
 
Since we're on the topic, I have a question that I've been thinking of asking for a while. What if even with the Falcon chipset and heatsink your 360 got the 3RL after 6-8 years? Would that be acceptable for you? Would you buy a 360 knowing that that would happen?

Personally, with BC being standard for all consoles at this point, I wouldn't be too worried. The NES is so popular because you can't play those games ( literally, cartridges ) on another system. I can't see myself play the Xbox 360 8 years from now if the xbox 720 plays 360 games. Ofcourse, I could see myself not buying another MS console until i'm 100 percent sure that it won't be shitty. So if it does brick at that point I'll probably just go buy another one. I can picture them being like 250 8 years from now.
 
[quote name='Punk_Raven']Since we're on the topic, I have a question that I've been thinking of asking for a while. What if even with the Falcon chipset and heatsink your 360 got the 3RL after 6-8 years? Would that be acceptable for you? Would you buy a 360 knowing that that would happen?
[/QUOTE]

That would be fine, as I'd probably never get.

1. Not much chance I'd still be playing it that far down the road.
2. I don't game all that much, so mine would probably last longer than average anyway.

Consoles just need to last until I've played everything I want to play on them.
 
[quote name='Punk_Raven']Since we're on the topic, I have a question that I've been thinking of asking for a while. What if even with the Falcon chipset and heatsink your 360 got the 3RL after 6-8 years? Would that be acceptable for you? Would you buy a 360 knowing that that would happen? [/quote]

That would depend if I knew that the X-Box 3 would be fully backwards compatible with the first two. Honestly, if I knew it was going to die on me, I probably wouldn't invest in it or its games.

I can picture them being like 250 8 years from now.
Click to expand...

Not unless it's gone UP in price at that point. Should be WAY less than that. It should probably hit that price next year some time (or $300 at worst).
 
[quote name='Wolfpup']That would depend if I knew that the X-Box 3 would be fully backwards compatible with the first two. Honestly, if I knew it was going to die on me, I probably wouldn't invest in it or its games.

[/quote]
Uh.....

You don't have a 360 currently, right?
 
[quote name='Wolfpup']
Not unless it's gone UP in price at that point. Should be WAY less than that. It should probably hit that price next year some time (or $300 at worst).[/QUOTE]

Every piece of electronics ever made will fail at some point in time....
 
[quote name='Punk_Raven']Uh.....

You don't have a 360 currently, right?[/QUOTE]


But sounds like he'd be up for buying one if they fix the problems gathering from his posts in other threads on the topic.

I'm in the same boat, need to get fixed and hit $300 or less before I'll bite.
 
Yeah. You hit the nail right on the nose. I was just about to say that but I thought I'd catch heat for it. The whole thing about all electronics fail at one point in time. It's just that for most people it gets ot a point where you have to upgrade and you don't care about the old electronic or if it fails.
 
[quote name='Punk_Raven']Uh.....

You don't have a 360 currently, right?[/QUOTE]

I've been through three :bomb:

I'm REALLY scared to invest in games for it...but because of stuff like Lost Odyssey and Mass Effect and I guess Bioshock (since the PC version has "activation" means I pretty much HAVE to have one :(

Also in another thread someone's claiming Microsoft fixed the online store so that games are no longer tied to your hardware-you can run them on any new system you buy by using your gamertag, so that's cool (if true).
 
A hardware revision is desperately needed, but I've been reading rumors just like this for over a year now, and they've never panned out.

Will they eventually come true? Surely. Any rumor that tries to estimate the actual time frame in which it will come out, I come to dismiss out of hand. Too many of them have been wrong for me to put any stock in those that continue to come out and say "Ok, NOW the falcon's coming!"
 
[quote name='Wolfpup']Also in another thread someone's claiming Microsoft fixed the online store so that games are no longer tied to your hardware-you can run them on any new system you buy by using your gamertag, so that's cool (if true).[/QUOTE]
You've always been able to do that, you just have to log in to Live. He's claiming that you can do it offline as well, which is not a big difference really.
 
Shiiiiit...if that pans out and the price drops to $300, I think I will almost certainly have to make a purchase.
 
[quote name='Popnmusic']Do the elites that are current available have the new heatsink?[/QUOTE]
I've heard that the newer ones, made in July all do.
 
[quote name='zewone']I've heard that the newer ones, made in July all do.[/QUOTE]

Amazon has elites in stock and I'm itching to click confirm order. Its been awhile since they've had them. Any chance these will have the heatsinks?
 
[quote name='Popnmusic']Amazon has elites in stock and I'm itching to click confirm order. Its been awhile since they've had them. Any chance these will have the heatsinks?[/QUOTE]
I would guess it would be a higher chance if it's new stock they just got in.
 
[quote name='Popnmusic']Amazon has elites in stock and I'm itching to click confirm order. Its been awhile since they've had them. Any chance these will have the heatsinks?[/QUOTE]

No way to tell. Hasn't been confirmed that all Elites made in July have them for sure yet, and ordering online there's no way to tell when the one you're buying was made. But as noted, if they just came in you have a better chance. But still no way to tell.
 
[quote name='Popnmusic']I took a gamble and purchased one. I'll post up the manufactured date tomorrow. (yay for 3.99 one day shipping)[/quote]

Why wouldn't you just wait for the new chipset if its coming this month? That was idiotic.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']From the research I've done, Punk_Raven is right, the core issue is the motherboard warping and popping off solder points.

I guess if the 65nm runs a lot cooler, then it will help just fine. But yeah, that's just one change of several that will help.

Initial reports are the new heatsinks coming back on refurb consoles are mostly doing the trick though. But apposum, please don't think I'm saying Microsoft shouldn't redesign even if that's true.[/QUOTE]


I wasn't thinking that, just that it seems highly unlikely that this won't fix the problems.
 
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