The Raven vs. Tommy Dreamer eternal feud wrestling thread
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[quote name='ced']Honestly, how is somebody insane enough to book odds on a WWE match?[/QUOTE]
There was a line on the U.S. Presidential race, for a day, a month or two ago. (Right before the Nathan's Hot Dog Eating Contest.)
In consideration: A Chicago Bears-Brock Lesnar parlay at 160-percent profit. But, everything outside of fighting (and wrasslin, I suppose) I go off tips from friends, and it's something I rarely do. Triple H is 1-0 over Brock Lesnar, so unless WWE is going to completely bury Lesnar, Lesnar should win. However, putting money on wrasslin is just crazy. If I do bet, it'll be a small for-fun sum. Don't need WWE screwing up my success ratio.
[quote name='JJSP']
[/QUOTE]
:lol: Nice.
There was a line on the U.S. Presidential race, for a day, a month or two ago. (Right before the Nathan's Hot Dog Eating Contest.)
In consideration: A Chicago Bears-Brock Lesnar parlay at 160-percent profit. But, everything outside of fighting (and wrasslin, I suppose) I go off tips from friends, and it's something I rarely do. Triple H is 1-0 over Brock Lesnar, so unless WWE is going to completely bury Lesnar, Lesnar should win. However, putting money on wrasslin is just crazy. If I do bet, it'll be a small for-fun sum. Don't need WWE screwing up my success ratio.
[quote name='JJSP']
:lol: Nice.
pitfallharry219
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[quote name='Sway']I know he's retired and all but Edge really looks out of place in that poster.[/QUOTE]
If you watch the 2nd Edge DVD set, he's given up eating red meat, exercises by hauling wheelbarrows w/bricks, flipping 300 lb. tires, hiking, and canoeing at his mountain home and has lost 30 lbs. He does very little exercise with traditional gym equipment any more, even though he has a full setup in his home. The interviews for the DVD all took place in Sept.
If you watch the 2nd Edge DVD set, he's given up eating red meat, exercises by hauling wheelbarrows w/bricks, flipping 300 lb. tires, hiking, and canoeing at his mountain home and has lost 30 lbs. He does very little exercise with traditional gym equipment any more, even though he has a full setup in his home. The interviews for the DVD all took place in Sept.
mykevermin
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The HHH/Brock match sounds like something I'm hardly interested in.
I mean, let's be honest - we're not talking about the potential match up. We're discussing how backstage politics are going to influence the outcome of a shitshow match.
I mean, let's be honest - we're not talking about the potential match up. We're discussing how backstage politics are going to influence the outcome of a shitshow match.
[quote name='mykevermin']The HHH/Brock match sounds like something I'm hardly interested in.
I mean, let's be honest - we're not talking about the potential match up. We're discussing how backstage politics are going to influence the outcome of a shitshow match.[/QUOTE]
It feels familiar..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BXFVvUGkDw
Goldberg's last match, Lesnar announces he wants out..
I mean, let's be honest - we're not talking about the potential match up. We're discussing how backstage politics are going to influence the outcome of a shitshow match.[/QUOTE]
It feels familiar..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BXFVvUGkDw
Goldberg's last match, Lesnar announces he wants out..
Dr. Venkman
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[quote name='Scorch']It feels familiar..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BXFVvUGkDw
Goldberg's last match, Lesnar announces he wants out..[/QUOTE]
That has got to be one of the most disappointing matches in WM history with so much potential.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BXFVvUGkDw
Goldberg's last match, Lesnar announces he wants out..[/QUOTE]
That has got to be one of the most disappointing matches in WM history with so much potential.
007
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The problem (yes, that really should be pluralized, but let's keep this short) with the HHH/Lesnar match is all about the booking. Lesnar makes a big return, LOSES to Cena, then disappears for a few months. Regardless of what they want to storyline shove down our throats, it appears that Lesnar sort of just ran away with his tail between his legs, which isn't going to help sell anyone on his next match.
A bigger point would be that WWE is selling this match to... who, exactly? The younger Cena-era fans either just started watching when Brock was around, or simply have no idea who he is. They saw a guy come back, get beaten by Cena, and then sent his manager out to get beat by a woman. The younger fans, unless they watch UFC, have no reason to give a shit about Lesnar. Let's remember, this guy was last in a WWE ring EIGHT YEARS AGO. In WWE years, that's a lifetime.
The older fans know Lesnar, but they also likely know the backstory and, as you already pointed out, his 'last match'. Between his and HHH's toxic backstage history... well, myke hit on the head, for us it's more about the backstage politics of it, which doesn't inspire me to throw down the (how much is it now?) $50-60.
Sorry for constantly harping on the 'age' point, but it's easy for me to forget. It also sells these kids short on knowing history, but I'd venture that most of these kids knew Lesnar as 'that tattoo guy in WWE12' (gee, talk about not narrowing it down, huh?).
A bigger point would be that WWE is selling this match to... who, exactly? The younger Cena-era fans either just started watching when Brock was around, or simply have no idea who he is. They saw a guy come back, get beaten by Cena, and then sent his manager out to get beat by a woman. The younger fans, unless they watch UFC, have no reason to give a shit about Lesnar. Let's remember, this guy was last in a WWE ring EIGHT YEARS AGO. In WWE years, that's a lifetime.
The older fans know Lesnar, but they also likely know the backstory and, as you already pointed out, his 'last match'. Between his and HHH's toxic backstage history... well, myke hit on the head, for us it's more about the backstage politics of it, which doesn't inspire me to throw down the (how much is it now?) $50-60.
Sorry for constantly harping on the 'age' point, but it's easy for me to forget. It also sells these kids short on knowing history, but I'd venture that most of these kids knew Lesnar as 'that tattoo guy in WWE12' (gee, talk about not narrowing it down, huh?).
mykevermin
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Depends on what demographic you're talking about, 007. Under 10? Sure, they may not follow Lesnar's history or UFC anymore than I cared who Superstar Billy Graham was when he managed Don "The Rock" Muraco. But 11 and up, you get into territory where those people do follow UFC, do know Lesnar as a "fighter," etc.
The buildup to this has been extraordinarily poor, and the biggest problem is that WWE has spent a lot of time talking about the matchup, but not much time talking about the significance of the matchup. The writers seem to take for granted that the "bigness" of this feud is self-evident. Well, for starters, it isn't (though they seem to get that rather subtly, since the feud seems to be more about Heyman-v-McMahon than HHH-v-Lesnar, in a redux of the Invasion angle, where clearly the McMahons were more important than the feud people had dreamed of for decades).
Pardon the diversion into politics, but the way they have built up this feud reminds me of Mitt Romney's campaigning in recent days. During a stump speech he made reference to the need for "something dramatic" in order to help spurn the economy on, but refused to go into further detail. And it's kind of offensive to think that someone believes that passes as adequate detail to convince me of the necessity of something. Romney doesn't seem to think he needs to be more specific than "well, we need something dramatic." Likewise, WWE doesn't seem to think they need to offer more than, "well, it's Lesnar vs HHH." Since Lesnar has been made to look like a doofus since he returned (side note: if anyone other than HHH took such an obvious dump on selling an arm break in order to virtually ruin a high profile angle, they'd be jobbing to Tyler Reks for so long they'd think a move to FCW would be an upgrade), where's the heat? Where's my incentive to see this feud?
They also seemed to really drop the whole GM/CEO/CFO/talent relations/whatever power struggle stuff in the process. Which is fine - too much of that is bad news for writing a program, and leads to too much winky-winky-nudge-nudge shoot-work nonsense - but since the origin of this stuff was about HHH refusing to give Lesnar his Sooperstar™ contract, there truly is no need for this angle, and I don't get the interest.
Shrug. There's always TNA. Never thought I'd say that without irony.
The buildup to this has been extraordinarily poor, and the biggest problem is that WWE has spent a lot of time talking about the matchup, but not much time talking about the significance of the matchup. The writers seem to take for granted that the "bigness" of this feud is self-evident. Well, for starters, it isn't (though they seem to get that rather subtly, since the feud seems to be more about Heyman-v-McMahon than HHH-v-Lesnar, in a redux of the Invasion angle, where clearly the McMahons were more important than the feud people had dreamed of for decades).
Pardon the diversion into politics, but the way they have built up this feud reminds me of Mitt Romney's campaigning in recent days. During a stump speech he made reference to the need for "something dramatic" in order to help spurn the economy on, but refused to go into further detail. And it's kind of offensive to think that someone believes that passes as adequate detail to convince me of the necessity of something. Romney doesn't seem to think he needs to be more specific than "well, we need something dramatic." Likewise, WWE doesn't seem to think they need to offer more than, "well, it's Lesnar vs HHH." Since Lesnar has been made to look like a doofus since he returned (side note: if anyone other than HHH took such an obvious dump on selling an arm break in order to virtually ruin a high profile angle, they'd be jobbing to Tyler Reks for so long they'd think a move to FCW would be an upgrade), where's the heat? Where's my incentive to see this feud?
They also seemed to really drop the whole GM/CEO/CFO/talent relations/whatever power struggle stuff in the process. Which is fine - too much of that is bad news for writing a program, and leads to too much winky-winky-nudge-nudge shoot-work nonsense - but since the origin of this stuff was about HHH refusing to give Lesnar his Sooperstar™ contract, there truly is no need for this angle, and I don't get the interest.
Shrug. There's always TNA. Never thought I'd say that without irony.
[quote name='MSUHitman']If you watch the 2nd Edge DVD set, he's given up eating red meat, exercises by hauling wheelbarrows w/bricks, flipping 300 lb. tires, hiking, and canoeing at his mountain home and has lost 30 lbs. He does very little exercise with traditional gym equipment any more, even though he has a full setup in his home. The interviews for the DVD all took place in Sept.[/QUOTE]
I didn't know Stallone was marketing his Rocky 4 workout routine.
I didn't know Stallone was marketing his Rocky 4 workout routine.
[quote name='Clak']I didn't know Stallone was marketing his Rocky 4 workout routine.[/QUOTE]
It's the new fitness fad.
http://crossfit.com/
It's the new fitness fad.
http://crossfit.com/
pitfallharry219
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mykevermin
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So they use ROH footage for the commercial, but they don't actually have any of Punk's ROH matches on the video, right?
I recall seeing the match listing not too long ago, and I can't remember seeing any ROH stuff on there.
I recall seeing the match listing not too long ago, and I can't remember seeing any ROH stuff on there.
WWE diva Rosa Mendes told police her fiancé is a habitual woman-beater ... and she's afraid the guy will eventually try to kill her ... this according to a police report obtained by TMZ.
And sources tell TMZ ... the guy Mendes is afraid of is a former WWE talent.
According to the report, the San Antonio Police Dept. found Mendes crying in a bathroom stall at San Antonio International Airport late Sunday night, repeatedly stating that she needed help. Mendes had just flown from her home in Vegas to S.A. for a WWE event.
According to the police report, Mendes -- real name Milena Roucka -- told cops her fiancé had "hit her several times at their shared residence in Las Vegas."
And sources tell TMZ ... the guy Mendes is afraid of is a former WWE talent.
According to the report, the San Antonio Police Dept. found Mendes crying in a bathroom stall at San Antonio International Airport late Sunday night, repeatedly stating that she needed help. Mendes had just flown from her home in Vegas to S.A. for a WWE event.
According to the police report, Mendes -- real name Milena Roucka -- told cops her fiancé had "hit her several times at their shared residence in Las Vegas."
Fatality comes through again with the perfect avatar.
Regarding Triple H and Lesnar. I certainly cared when Lesnar returned "home" to professional wrestling. His stuff during his early WWE run was pretty amazing and considering that he crossed over to become a very successful fighter is like a dream come true. However, unless I'm missing something, Triple H's last two big matches were his back to back losses against Undertaker at WM. I don't believe for a second that Triple H will let himself lose three in a row.
Which comes back to Triple H's difficulty in properly building up many of his big matches. Based off my unscientific method of watching wrestling off and on for like as long as I can remember, Triple H never takes his opponents seriously. The one exception that springs to mind is when Foley transformed back into Cactus Jack in preparation for their Royal Rumble 2000 match.
What's especially frustrating is how successful that match was. Triple H's reaction and eventual victory did a few great things...
1. Elevated a fairly broken down and near-retired Foley to a believable main event guy for the match. I didn't go into the match knowing who would win. Therefor the false finishes were genuinely exciting and surprising.
2. Elevated Triple H permanently above his "Connecticut Blueblood" and/or "HBK's sidekick" persona that he was still struggling to escape from. Going into Royal Rumble 2000, The Rock and Austin were far and away the biggest names in the WWE. Coming off that amazing match, Triple H was lifted as close to their level as anyone could be.
3. Moving forward off the match, both guys were able to parley their greater roles into greater success for the company as a whole. Foley went on to "make" Randy Orton and Edge while Triple H's emergence as a very potent opponent made moments like HBK's return match that much more special.
TL;DR - Triple H should know that a proper match build helps everyone, including himself. I don't see why he doesn't do it as much.
Regarding Triple H and Lesnar. I certainly cared when Lesnar returned "home" to professional wrestling. His stuff during his early WWE run was pretty amazing and considering that he crossed over to become a very successful fighter is like a dream come true. However, unless I'm missing something, Triple H's last two big matches were his back to back losses against Undertaker at WM. I don't believe for a second that Triple H will let himself lose three in a row.
Which comes back to Triple H's difficulty in properly building up many of his big matches. Based off my unscientific method of watching wrestling off and on for like as long as I can remember, Triple H never takes his opponents seriously. The one exception that springs to mind is when Foley transformed back into Cactus Jack in preparation for their Royal Rumble 2000 match.
What's especially frustrating is how successful that match was. Triple H's reaction and eventual victory did a few great things...
1. Elevated a fairly broken down and near-retired Foley to a believable main event guy for the match. I didn't go into the match knowing who would win. Therefor the false finishes were genuinely exciting and surprising.
2. Elevated Triple H permanently above his "Connecticut Blueblood" and/or "HBK's sidekick" persona that he was still struggling to escape from. Going into Royal Rumble 2000, The Rock and Austin were far and away the biggest names in the WWE. Coming off that amazing match, Triple H was lifted as close to their level as anyone could be.
3. Moving forward off the match, both guys were able to parley their greater roles into greater success for the company as a whole. Foley went on to "make" Randy Orton and Edge while Triple H's emergence as a very potent opponent made moments like HBK's return match that much more special.
TL;DR - Triple H should know that a proper match build helps everyone, including himself. I don't see why he doesn't do it as much.
Demolition Man
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[quote name='mykevermin']So they use ROH footage for the commercial, but they don't actually have any of Punk's ROH matches on the video, right?
I recall seeing the match listing not too long ago, and I can't remember seeing any ROH stuff on there.[/QUOTE]
http://www.wwedvdnews.com/match-listing-wwe-cm-punk-best-in-the-world-dvd/25361/
I'd imagine that the WWE worked out a deal with ROH to use footage for the documentary itself but was unable to get matches to put on for the bonus material. Especially seeing that ROH is already selling several CM Punk DVDs already.
http://www.rohwrestling.com/product/samoa-joe-vs-cm-punk-collectors-edition-2-disc-set
http://www.rohwrestling.com/product/summer-punk-2-disc-set
I recall seeing the match listing not too long ago, and I can't remember seeing any ROH stuff on there.[/QUOTE]
http://www.wwedvdnews.com/match-listing-wwe-cm-punk-best-in-the-world-dvd/25361/
I'd imagine that the WWE worked out a deal with ROH to use footage for the documentary itself but was unable to get matches to put on for the bonus material. Especially seeing that ROH is already selling several CM Punk DVDs already.
http://www.rohwrestling.com/product/samoa-joe-vs-cm-punk-collectors-edition-2-disc-set
http://www.rohwrestling.com/product/summer-punk-2-disc-set
masked lemon
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Demolition Man
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bread's done