Why do we celebrate Columbus day?

JolietJake

JolietJake

Banned
So i've never been able to understand why we celebrate Columbus day in the US. I've always thought it would make more sense to celebrate Amerigo Vespucci than Columbus. Columbus didn't discover what we call America, like so many kids were taught in school.

So why were/are kids taught that Columbus discovered the Americas? Why don't we celebrate Vespucci day? Besides the fact that it sounds horrible.
 
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The same reason we celebrate Washington's birthday, he killed a bunch of people.
 
People will find any reason they can to celebrate anything and take work off. Europeans are much better at it, now, than Americans.

But I would say that just about every holiday that the government gives employees off, but most others have to work, is a bullshit holiday.
 
Dumbest thing here at OSU is that the city is named after this guy, so you would figure that this city of all places would celebrate, and we don't have the day off. They claim we "observe" it the day after Thanksgiving, which is basically just a big fuck you to give us one less day off.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']
So why were/are kids taught that Columbus discovered the Americas? Why don't we celebrate Vespucci day? Besides the fact that it sounds horrible.[/quote]

Why should we celebrate a European at all? People were already living there, so they didn't "discover" anything. If anything we could perhaps commemorate the meeting of two different worlds and leave it at that without having to put any one individual on a pedestal.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']So i've never been able to understand why we celebrate Columbus day in the US. I've always thought it would make more sense to celebrate Amerigo Vespucci than Columbus. Columbus didn't discover what we call America, like so many kids were taught in school.

So why were/are kids taught that Columbus discovered the Americas? Why don't we celebrate Vespucci day? Besides the fact that it sounds horrible.[/quote]

Because the only people that know who Amerigo Vespucci are wikipedia nerds. We've been celebrating it for like 300 years
 
[quote name='camoor']That's pretty ignorant.[/QUOTE]

Okay, I should have worded it differently. I understand the point of our holidays but I personally see about 95% of them as a waste of time.

We look for excuses to celebrate everything, it is pretty stupid, IMO.
 
Columbus demonstrated that the area West of Europe and East of Asia was not entirely water. The approximate size of the Earth was known since the 2nd century BC, but due to incompetence his proposals were based on a much smaller number. Experts of the day expected that he'd run out of food and water before he'd reach Asia, which is correct if there were no landmass in between.

Its celebrated for the most part because the Italians wanted a holiday they could call theirs after seeing St. Patrick's day. Columbus was that era's Hitler, maybe someday Austrian immigrants will want a Hitler day because they've got nobody else.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Columbus was that era's Hitler, maybe someday Austrian immigrants will want a Hitler day because they've got nobody else.[/quote]


Indeed. Columbus was responsible for genocides against the Arawak Indians.

"On the same day that the expedition landed on Guanahani, Columbus noted that the timid natives 'should make good servants.' Several weeks later he remarked in the journal: '… they are very meek and without knowledge of evil nor do they kill others or steal … and they are without weapons and so timid that one of our people can put a hundred of them to flight.'"

He sounds like a great guy.

"How can I exploit and use these peaceful natives to my own gain?" - Columbus
 
[quote name='Layziebones']Because the only people that know who Amerigo Vespucci are wikipedia nerds. We've been celebrating it for like 300 years[/quote]
Or people with an interest in history.:roll:
 
[quote name='Chase']Indeed. Columbus was responsible for genocides against the Arawak Indians.

"On the same day that the expedition landed on Guanahani, Columbus noted that the timid natives 'should make good servants.' Several weeks later he remarked in the journal: '… they are very meek and without knowledge of evil nor do they kill others or steal … and they are without weapons and so timid that one of our people can put a hundred of them to flight.'"

He sounds like a great guy.

"How can I exploit and use these peaceful natives to my own gain?" - Columbus[/QUOTE]
He destroyed the entire native populations of Cuba and Hispaniola (Dominican Republic/Haiti). The man was a ruthless murder, rapist, and enslaver. Its no coincidence that the height of his popularity was in a time where Indians and Blacks were still considered sub-human savages.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']Or people with an interest in history.:roll:[/quote]

I love history and have never even heard of Vespucci.

With a quick google search, we don't celebrate the fact that America was discovered today, we only celebrate the fact that Columbus landed on this day. Vespucci came after Columbus, and Columbus came after Leif Erikson and possibly some other people.
 
Fortunately alot of people are not content with celebrating it. It gets protested here in Olympia every year. Mostly by angsty-teenagers that went to college and are trying to make the world a better place. I see it as a noble cause in the wrong hands.
Back to OP, to hell with Columbus and anyone who celebrates his tyranny.
 
[quote name='Layziebones']I love history and have never even heard of Vespucci.

With a quick google search, we don't celebrate the fact that America was discovered today, we only celebrate the fact that Columbus landed on this day. Vespucci came after Columbus, and Columbus came after Leif Erikson and possibly some other people.[/quote]
But he never even landed on the North American continent, why do we celebrate that he discovered the Bahamas?
 
[quote name='JolietJake']But he never even landed on the North American continent, why do we celebrate that he discovered the Bahamas?[/quote]

I think it all just comes down to the fact that America is full of idiots. They are ignorant and frankly, they could probably care less about history in general, which is sad.

Columbus may have had some friends in high places, while Amerigo had no friends in no places. :D
 
[quote name='The Crotch']Without looking up Vespucci: how do you fund a trip across the ocean to tiger/dragon territory without friends in high places?[/quote]

Promising huge rewards to whoever has money. Or they may of hoped he just died, so they coughed up a couple bucks and sent him on his way.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']So i've never been able to understand why we celebrate Columbus day in the US. I've always thought it would make more sense to celebrate Amerigo Vespucci than Columbus. Columbus didn't discover what we call America, like so many kids were taught in school.

So why were/are kids taught that Columbus discovered the Americas? Why don't we celebrate Vespucci day? Besides the fact that it sounds horrible.[/quote]

From my understanding, it is because he served as a bridge between the "New World" and the "Old World"; someone who extended the umbilical cord between this land and imperial mother Europe.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']lol @ this thread

Columbus was a tyrant?[/quote]

Well more of a wanna-be tyrant, I guess. Really he was just a dick that really wanted fame and cash. Being an asshole got him both, so not too much has changed...
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']lol @ this thread

BTW, the belief that America was named after the Amerigo, is a myth.[/QUOTE]

Really? I thought there was actually some truth to the story and that the jury was still out.
 
[quote name='bmulligan']Really? I thought there was actually some truth to the story and that the jury was still out.[/quote]

I know I've heard it both ways. The Wikipedia entry - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americas#Naming - has 3 possibilities for the naming. So I guess it's just not certain, though the Vespucci claim is the most widely believed.
 
It's the Euro-centric point of view that's pushed down everyone's throat in school. Remember, you learn that Egypt, India, and China, and Africa were where people first gathered to form cities and then all you learn about is Europe. You better know that William the Conquerer and the Normans finished off the Saxons in 1066 but all you get about China is Marco Polo and the Great Wall and some fireworks and gunpowder or something.
 
[quote name='depascal22']It's the Euro-centric point of view that's pushed down everyone's throat in school. Remember, you learn that Egypt, India, and China, and Africa were where people first gathered to form cities and then all you learn about is Europe. You better know that William the Conquerer and the Normans finished off the Saxons in 1066 but all you get about China is Marco Polo and the Great Wall and some fireworks and gunpowder or something.[/quote]

What about ninjas :D
 
[quote name='SpazX']Well more of a wanna-be tyrant, I guess. Really he was just a dick that really wanted fame and cash. Being an asshole got him both, so not too much has changed...[/QUOTE]

Uh he was the boss and no one can claim that he treated his men or the natives fairly.

The natives were treated worse than dogs, it is just thrust being an ignorant tool again.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']lol @ this thread

Columbus was a tyrant?

BTW, the belief that America was named after the Amerigo, is a myth.[/quote]
Show me definitive proof and i'll believe you.
 
[quote name='The Crotch']Without looking up Vespucci: how do you fund a trip across the ocean to tiger/dragon territory without friends in high places?[/quote]
They believed he'd bring back things that would make funding the trip worth it.
 
[quote name='bmulligan']So, you're saying the Africans or the Chinese were responsible for naming America ? Yo no comprendo nada, NADA ![/quote]

All I'm saying is that Columbus is celebrated for the same reason that anyone is celebrated. Being at the right place at the right time. I'm also saying he's been canonized by educators because he represents the European ideal. The explorer. The adventurer. It didn't matter than people were already here and those people were treated worse than slaves by Columbus and his men. It made and still makes great press.

EDIT -- It just shows that the people that claim to be historians have little regard for the truth and like to romanticize the past in the way that they see fit. We celebrate Columbus because without him "taking a chance" we wouldn't be here today. The Pilgrims would've never gotten onto the Mayflower if people hadn't done it before. At least, that's what they want you to believe.
 
[quote name='depascal22']EDIT -- It just shows that the people that claim to be historians have little regard for the truth and like to romanticize the past in the way that they see fit. We celebrate Columbus because without him "taking a chance" we wouldn't be here today. The Pilgrims would've never gotten onto the Mayflower if people hadn't done it before. At least, that's what they want you to believe.[/quote]

That's like laying the blame on scientists because a small minority advocates creationism or argues that global warming isn't something to be concerned about. Sure there's always going to be a few puppets of mainstream politics/religion but you can't blame the whole academic discipline because a few nuts manage to put some letters after their names before they completely sell out their integrity.

Why don't you walk over to your local college and ask a history professor for his opinion on Columbus before maligning the entire profession.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']Show me definitive proof and i'll believe you.[/QUOTE]

Show me definitive proof that America was named after the Amerigo, and it's not just a common guess turned popular assumption.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']They believed he'd bring back things that would make funding the trip worth it.[/quote]"They" being... friends in high places?

Also, Snopes brings up nothing with regards to Vespucci. Last thing I remember reading was that while it Amerigo couldn't be ruled out as the source of the continents' names, he isn't the only possible candidate.
 
Eletronica Direct, a company I need to return something to, is out of their office "for the holiday" from Oct 13 to Oct 22... to make matters worse they have a 15-day return policy, and if you don't return it within 7 days from RMAing they charge a 10% restocking fee. I don't even know how that can be legal, considering they don't notify you of that policy until after you've already made the RMA.

Anyway, yeah, week and a half celebration of Columbus day... wtf...
 
[quote name='camoor']Why don't you walk over to your local college and ask a history professor for his opinion on Columbus before maligning the entire profession.[/quote]

You're confusing college educators with public school educators. Columbus Day is big in elementary schools and all kids are taught "Christopher Columbus sailed the ocean blue back in 1492." I brought up Vikings to my daughter's first grade teacher and she looked at me like I said I was voting Democrat.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']But he never even landed on the North American continent, why do we celebrate that he discovered the Bahamas?[/QUOTE]
In this aspect, it doesn't matter. He was the first European to demonstrate that the area West of Europe and East of Asia was not entirely ocean, and he also demonstrated that it was possible to navigate there and back in a reasonable amount of time by using the circular wind pattern of the Atlantic.

The point of no return (as far out as you can sail while still able to turn around and not run out of food and water) was well into empty ocean, and they also knew that Asia was far beyond the point where they'd exhaust all supplies. They knew it would be about 12,000 miles and a silly idea, but no one expected that there was anything else there. "The World" to that point was Eurasia and Africa.

He was a despicable human being, but his 'discovery' was significant in any case.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']Show me definitive proof that America was named after the Amerigo, and it's not just a common guess turned popular assumption.[/quote]
The burden of proof falls to you, i'm not trying convince anyone i'm right, i'm just going off what i've been taught.

Besides, i asked you first.
 
[quote name='The Crotch']"They" being... friends in high places?

Also, Snopes brings up nothing with regards to Vespucci. Last thing I remember reading was that while it Amerigo couldn't be ruled out as the source of the continents' names, he isn't the only possible candidate.[/quote]He had royal and wealthy benefactors. After he returned, he brought back gold and other things. That certainly piqued the interest of the Spanish royalty.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']The burden of proof falls to you, i'm not trying convince anyone i'm right, i'm just going off what i've been taught.

Besides, i asked you first.[/QUOTE]

No it doesn't, I'm not trying to claim a fact so I don't have to prove it.


There are several "theories" to where the name "America" came from. They are all myths. There is as much proof that America was named after the Amerigo as there is proof against it. That is to say none.

I just have a pet peeve where in some cases certain myths are popularized so much they are elevated past myth.
 
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