Game of Thrones discussion thread - Season 5 debuts April 12th

Well shit.
This was by far the most devastating episode since season one and I didn't see any of it coming. If I had been reading the books, I probably would have stopped and never touched the damn thing again. This series is sheer torture and I have no hope the Starks will ever see proper vengeance now. Hell, I'm not sure I'm even interested anymore because I don't see where they can go from here since there's nothing to rally behind as a viewer.

I do find it interesting that this episode put a few things in perspective for me, in that my emotional investment this whole time was revenge for Eddard Stark.
 
[quote name='Jodou']Well shit.
This was by far the most devastating episode since season one and I didn't see any of it coming. If I had been reading the books, I probably would have stopped and never touched the damn thing again. This series is sheer torture and I have no hope the Starks will ever see proper vengeance now. Hell, I'm not sure I'm even interested anymore because I don't see where they can go from here since there's nothing to rally behind as a viewer.

I do find it interesting that this episode put a few things in perspective for me, in that my emotional investment this whole time was revenge for Eddard Stark.
[/QUOTE]

Seems like everybody love screwing over the Starks.
 
[quote name='Indignate']In terms of the events themselves or that the adaption didn't coincide with what you had in mind/had hoped it would be?[/QUOTE]

The events themselves. They mostly followed the book.
 
Poop, meet circular air oscillator. That is all.

Best episode of the season, though that's been the mark of the 9th episode.

It's amusing to run Google searches on GOT and read the various reviews to see the bitching of people who hadn't read the books, didn't know what was coming and swearing off the show for what happened.

This one will certainly get a rewatch or two this week before the season finale.
 
Didn't they do that when Ned died too? I heard the two heads of the show got death threats.

I don't know how you don't see that particularly death coming anyways, being Sean Bean and all.
 
Even after knowing this would happen for about 7 years now I still was just sitting on the edge of my seat until they started playing Castamere.

One thing this show seems to avoid are the "half-wits" from the book. The jester that hangs out with Stannis' daughter and then the Fray son from the wedding.

I guess they decided to go a different way with Mrs. Robb. I know she was a different person entirely but thought something kind of similar would happen with her.
 
I've read the first two books so far and somehow hadn't had the red wedding spoiled for me yet so last night was a true punch to the fucking crotch.
I knew once Cat noticed the guy walking toward the door what was going to happen sweet holy Lord was it even worse than I imagined. I figured best case scenario Talisa would die but Robb and especially Cat too!?!?!? I mean I love this show and the first two books but for the love of God do any "bad" characters actually ever have anything bad actually happen to them? I'm just not quite so sure that beating the merciless fuck outta your "moral good" family is good writing or just constantly going for shock value. Robb was my favorite character on the show so obviously it sucks balls for me but for some reason Cat's death sucked way more than I thought it would, I just felt awful afterwards. I didn't think it was possible to feel worse than after Ned's death but yep I did last night. I mean at least with Ned it was Sean Bean so you knew he had to die at some point lol.

I know the last 2 books aren't nearly as well received as the first three, it's going to take some serious motivation on my part to read these books at all, let alone catch up to the show before Season 4 like I was originally planning on doing. One man can only take getting kicked in the nuts so many times....
 
[quote name='Dokstarr']Even after knowing this would happen for about 7 years now I still was just sitting on the edge of my seat until they started playing Castamere.[/QUOTE]


Was Castamere a throwback to earlier in the show or was that song something specifically book-based? I haven't read a single word of the books, but couldn't remember if it was heard previously.
 
My favorite comment from the last 24 hours: "The Roose is loose!"

[quote name='ActionKazimer']Was Castamere a throwback to earlier in the show or was that song something specifically book-based? I haven't read a single word of the books, but couldn't remember if it was heard previously.[/QUOTE]

It's been played previously in the show (an adaptation by a modern band in the credits), but it has special significance here and is played in the book at this point too. It's also a Lannister song.
 
[quote name='Anexanhume']It's been played previously in the show (an adaptation by a modern band in the credits), but it has special significance here and is played in the book at this point too. It's also a Lannister song.[/QUOTE]

Cool, I figured I just missed something pretty obvious. Thanks for clearing that up!
 
[quote name='shrike4242']It's amusing to run Google searches on GOT and read the various reviews to see the bitching of people who hadn't read the books, didn't know what was coming and swearing off the show for what happened.[/QUOTE]
It's honestly the biggest compliment people can pay this show, because the characters matter that much to us. I just feel like with this show being spread out over such a long time that fatigue is setting in and won't be as potent going forward. Remember when everyone was out for Joffrey's blood? Now it will be Fray and on and on and on. If we know not to expect any sort of payoff, when it finally does come it will feel cheap and belated. I would surmise if Joffrey finally died in the finale next week, nobody would care anymore.

I just hope the finale offers something of substance I can care about, because I don't see how the war could continue at this point.
[quote name='Indignate']Nothing to rally behind?

How about the Lannisters?

You need to choose your sides more carefully next time.[/QUOTE]
Tyrion, up until this season, was my favorite character hands down. Outside of his drunken outburst towards Joffrey, I can't say I respect his character anymore. He's for the most part been put in his place and did little to connive his way out.
 
The Red Wedding finally happened.

For me, the most greusome aspect was the unborn-baby shivving. That was really hard to watch. That event doesn't actually happen in the books. So seeing Robb's pregnant wife getting shanked as though she were in a prison shower was more than a little shocking. That was a level of darkness that you don't often see in films, let alone television series. Very brutal and disturbing.

They also swapped out Aegon Frey for Lord Walder's latest wife. So a young woman got her throat cut instead of a simpleton grandson. Also very dark.
 
[quote name='ActionKazimer']Was Castamere a throwback to earlier in the show or was that song something specifically book-based? I haven't read a single word of the books, but couldn't remember if it was heard previously.[/QUOTE]

It's sang before the battle of the Blackwater by Bronn and the solders in the pub and during the credits of the same episode. Tyrion can be seen whistling the tone sometimes.

Cersei also explains the song to Margaery eariler this season, I think right before Tyrion's wedding when she says how they're going to be sisters soon.

[quote name='Richard Kain']For me, the most greusome aspect was the unborn-baby shivving. That was really hard to watch. That event doesn't actually happen in the books. So seeing Robb's pregnant wife getting shanked as though she were in a prison shower was more than a little shocking. That was a level of darkness that you don't often see in films, let alone television series. Very brutal and disturbing.[/QUOTE]

Agreed, that was the worst death to me. Both because of the pregnancy and how it was just the most brutal of them. My stomach turned when it happened.

[quote name='Jodou']Tyrion, up until this season, was my favorite character hands down. Outside of his drunken outburst towards Joffrey, I can't say I respect his character anymore. He's for the most part been put in his place and did little to connive his way out.[/QUOTE]

Cersei, Jaime, Tywin?

I feel like I'm in a minority because I seem to be the only one who actually likes these characters.
 
[quote name='Indignate']It's sang before the battle of the Blackwater by Bronn and the solders in the pub and during the credits of the same episode. Tyrion can be seen whistling the tone sometimes.

Cersei also explains the song to Margaery eariler this season, I think right before Tyrion's wedding when she says how they're going to be sisters soon.

Cersei, Jaime, Tywin?

I feel like I'm in a minority because I seem to be the only one who actually likes these characters.[/QUOTE]

That's awesome. I can't wait to re-watch these.

Agreed in regards to the shivving. That was really rough.

And I'm with you on most of the Lannisters, save Cersei and Joffrey. Jaime's actually gone on to become a favorite of mine.
 
Cersei you understand more after that speech to Tywin about not being a boy.

Jeffrey is just a snivelimg cowardly little bitch. Tyrion smacking the shit out of him is the highlight of the show.
 
The Stark's are easy to like, they are set up from the beginning to be the loving, supportive household. They're the family that everyone wishes they could have had. A strong, upright and responsible father figure, a loving and nurturing mother, fun siblings with plenty of personality who get along with each other. The only weak link in the Stark family is Sansa, and that's mainly just because she's so naive.

The Lannisters are easy to hate. They are set up from the beginning as being incredibly disfunctional. Joffrey is a spoiled and frankly psychopathic monster. Circe is the queen bitch of Westeros. Jaime grows on you, but he starts off as being arrogant and insufferable. Tywin is a machiavelian asshole who has no problem manipulating and brow-beating his own children to get his way. The only real likable Lannister is Tyrion, and a lot of that is just the sheer contrast with the rest of his family. It's easy to look good when the rest of your family are such unsympathetic jerks.

At the same time, I often find the Lannisters and their interactions much more interesting to watch. For me it's not so bad that the Starks seem to perpetually get the short end of the stick. The Starks are so fair-minded that it doesn't really surprise me to see the grim world they live in taking advantage of them. The Starks are a tragic story, and they shine more brightly for the hardships they are being forced to endure.

The Lannisters are just a joy to behold. They are awful people, but their interactions with the characters around them are so much more interesting. I enjoy every scene with the Lannisters immensely, and look forward to seeing more of them next season.
 
My biggest question is what happens when Edmure finds out what happened? The other part I liked was just how close clan Stark got to being almost fully reunited for the first time since way back in episode 1 before the rug was completely pulled out from under them...

I'm pissed about the deaths too but to swear off the show because of it is silly. If you're watching Game of Thrones for only 1 or 2 characters and their story then you're approaching it all wrong.

This is the most absolute shocked I've been from a TV show since way back during The Shield's run and the "grenade episode" (which anyone who knows the show should know exactly what I'm talking about). I loved that episode, and I love this one mainly because they took the normal conventions of TV shows and flipped them completely on their head but not in a way that it was just a random plot twist for the sake of a plot twist.
 
[quote name='Jodou']Well shit.
This was by far the most devastating episode since season one and I didn't see any of it coming. If I had been reading the books, I probably would have stopped and never touched the damn thing again. This series is sheer torture and I have no hope the Starks will ever see proper vengeance now. Hell, I'm not sure I'm even interested anymore because I don't see where they can go from here since there's nothing to rally behind as a viewer.

I do find it interesting that this episode put a few things in perspective for me, in that my emotional investment this whole time was revenge for Eddard Stark.
[/QUOTE]

When I first read the red wedding chapter, I got so pissed. I stopped reading there and just kinda sat on what I'd just read for a while. Martin fucking hates the Starks I think.:lol:

edit- Forgot to say that when "you know who" croaks later I was a little cheered up.
 
After seeing last night's episode, I'm glad I didn't read the book first and know what was coming. That was one of THE most shocking moments I've ever witnessed on television.

I can't wait to see how they wrap up the season.
 
Damn, I just saw last night episode. I really need to read the books. Very few episodes end with out some twist or leave you hanging and wanting more.
 
I wouldn't say having read the book diminished the red wedding scene. I was still shocked by some of it honestly. I knew it was coming, but seeing some of that actually play out was pretty intense.
 
[quote name='Clak']I wouldn't say having read the book diminished the red wedding scene. I was still shocked by some of it honestly. I knew it was coming, but seeing some of that actually play out was pretty intense.[/QUOTE]

I haven't read the books and I can imagine the scene is pretty shocking in the books as well
but seeing Catelyn stand there as her son is murdered then the pause just before someone steps into scene to slit her throat, chilling, absolutely chilling. Her acting in the scene is what brought it from just a surprise to an absolutely haunting shock.
 
I guess when I imagine things like that in my mind, it's always more grand, more like a play maybe? Where as things in the show are much more, I guess deliberate would be the word? Like someone just walking up behind someone else and slitting their throat. No warning, no speech, just slice and it's over.
 
Went to listen to Rains of Castamere, saw this, had to share it:

IyXURTk.jpg
 
[quote name='Clak']I guess when I imagine things like that in my mind, it's always more grand, more like a play maybe? Where as things in the show are much more, I guess deliberate would be the word? Like someone just walking up behind someone else and slitting their throat. No warning, no speech, just slice and it's over.[/QUOTE]

There was a real sense of finality and realism to that scene. In most Hollywood productions the moment
when either Catelyn is standing there with the knife to the wife's throat or just before Rob gets shived is when something dramatic would happen and our heroes would be saved. Cause let's face it Rob's wife was doomed from the start, the pregnancy, the romance, all setting us up to feel worse when she eventually died (and frankly I expected her death to come when Lord Walder asked her to come forward kind of as a "hey now that you're single again which one of my daughters will you take?"). This was eerily reminiscent of how the first time you see the scene of Ned Stark being beheaded you expect a Robin Hood Prince of Thieves-type moment where the executioner is shot with an arrow and our hero escapes.

This show portrays it more like real life where the hero doesn't always get saved at the last minute. There was also a movie that came out in the last year or so that had a similar moment at the end where just mentioning the name of it spoils it but certainly leaves you with that same "real life" type feeling where the hero doesn't always make it out by some miraculous last minute save.
 
[quote name='IRHari']Went to listen to Rains of Castamere, saw this, had to share it:

IyXURTk.jpg
[/QUOTE]
Lol, god damn the internet. :lol:

One thing I don't see people talking about is how George further taunts us with the foreshadowing of Arya's scene. I should have known and picked up on it immediately, but I think we're caught up in the moment of being reassured by the Hound. It's this brilliance where characters transcend the screen and embody the viewer that makes this show so fucking amazing.
 
[quote name='Jodou']Well shit.
This was by far the most devastating episode since season one and I didn't see any of it coming. If I had been reading the books, I probably would have stopped and never touched the damn thing again. This series is sheer torture and I have no hope the Starks will ever see proper vengeance now. Hell, I'm not sure I'm even interested anymore because I don't see where they can go from here since there's nothing to rally behind as a viewer.

I do find it interesting that this episode put a few things in perspective for me, in that my emotional investment this whole time was revenge for Eddard Stark.
[/QUOTE]

The title of the TV series, Game of Thrones, tells you everything you need to know. GRRM is not trying to hide the carrot. He's not trying to sell you the same old fantasy tropes or the same cliche characters as most TV show's out there. GRRM wants you to be absolutely enthralled by the game (much like another great HBO show The Wire). The journey to power is like a speeding train and as Howard Zinn says "you can't be neutral on a moving train". Power is the driving force behind the show/books. The players change but the game remains the same.

One only needs to read The Prince by Machiavelli to understand that the game of thrones is not one for the faint of heart. Those who believe in kindness, righteousness and honesty are often doomed (see Edard Stark). These notions are outdated and the folks who live by such codes fall prey to more cunning and deceptive individuals. The Red Wedding is the perfect example of what happens to an upstart who either doesn't understand how the game is played or isn't fully committed to play the game.

Also, keep in mind that there are still 5 or 6 Stark kids roaming the 7 kingdoms. No one knows what the future holds. Winter might still be coming and the Stark family might still get their revenge before all is said and done.
 
[quote name='Jodou']Lol, god damn the internet. :lol:

One thing I don't see people talking about is how George further taunts us with the foreshadowing of Arya's scene. I should have known and picked up on it immediately, but I think we're caught up in the moment of being reassured by the Hound. It's this brilliance where characters transcend the screen and embody the viewer that makes this show so fucking amazing.[/QUOTE]

They cut out so many "hints" from last nights episode to not give away the ending. If you got the time you really should give the books a try. You won't be dissapointed. At least with the first 3.
 
I read the book 2 years ago after the first season. I knew it would happen before I got to the chapter, but I was tense reading it. Last night I was tense watching it. Even though I don't like Robb (he's dumb), it was gut-wrenching to see him, his wife, his men, Grey Wind and Cat die. I've been in such a depressed mood because of it. It wouldn't be so bad if I knew how the rest of the series turned out because I could be assured the Starks have some sort of revenge or know not to expect any.

That said, I LOVED the scene with Jon when he killed Orell and the scenes with Bran. Rickon never speaks but seeing him and Osha say good-bye was sad.

Looking forward to next week. Stannis is one of my favorite characters, I hope he does what I think he's going to do.
 
anybody else thinking the season finale will be a disappointment? theres no way to follow up the RW. and theyre saving all the goods for next year.
so no castle black, no purple wedding, no red viper, no trial at kings landing this year

 
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^ I think they'll end with the 2nd one you listed and at least beging the 1st and 3rd. Finales are longer than an hour iirc and the material is there so hopefully its not a let down

 
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With this season coming to an end I still think the first was far and away the best. As a non-reader it's been tough understanding the point of a lot of the subplots since then. Robb was mostly comprised of flirtatious dialogue with his wife this season, Bran is now a major character with a story arc even more dull than Season 2's Jon Snow, Sam has been a massive buzz kill since season 1 and his screentime only grows longer. Theon is essentially torture porn, and though Dany's little speech was a high point, she's becoming borderline corny in her new role. I love this series to death, but you know, just sayin...

Starting to think I should read the books because the show seems to act more as a fan service supplement than anything else. People keep saying "you'll find out later! it'll make sense then!" but when it comes down to it this is a standalone TV show, and I feel like the TV audience mostly just watches it for the shock value, which season 3 certainly delivered. 

 
I'd personally rate this as the worst season so far, with my favorite being last season and then season one.  That's not really saying much since the show has been good all the way through, but as far as personal tastes go I preferred certain characters more when they're kicking ass.  This season very rarely had me sitting up in my seat and thinking shit just got real.  There has also been very little that interests me in the way of dark fantasy this time around and quite frankly, not a whole lot of action.

I want to say the only two characters I'm really interested in anymore are Jon and Arya.  Now that the show is really driving home the point that nobody is safe, I get the feeling they'll be killed off too.  I'm somewhat afraid that there will be a breaking point where I'm no longer interested in any of the characters and that makes me sad.

 
I don't know how to hide spoilers with 3.0 but I will try to be vague as possible. So was that really you know who tied up by ropes on the horse? They mention in the book it was sewn on but from the look of the scene it look like it wasn't sewn on but nailed to a plank with the body nowhere near it.

 
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You know, I was really depressed watching this episode thinking the show had peaked and was all downhill because quite frankly, it was boring.  That is until Arya started shanking fools.  I really, really hope next season starts taking her seriously and develops her as an assassin.  I swear to god if she's killed off, I am done with the show.  There's literally nothing left in the show now for me to be excited for except her storyline.  Her relationship with the Hound now is also starting to pique my interest in a 'lone wolf and cub' kind of way.

Only, this cub has bite. :twisted:

Oh, and Theon's sister
suddenly championing his cause seems really fucking stupid.  I've never cared about the character before and as someone pointed out has just become torture porn this season.  I wish he'd just die so we could stop being shown pointless perspectives.

 
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A decent episode but underwhelming finale. It started off well with how it transitioned from scene to scene, then it just became messy with trying to get everyone in before the finale. Ending with Dany was pointless, nothing happened that we didn't know last week.

blueweltall said:
I don't know how to hide spoilers with 3.0 but I will try to be vague as possible. So was that really you know who tied up by ropes on the horse? They mention in the book it was sewn on but from the look of the scene it look like it wasn't sewn on but nailed to a plank with the body nowhere near it.
Click to expand...
It was kind of hard to see, but it was Robb's headless body on the horse. Grey Wind's head was on a spear that was shoved down Robb's body. It was all held together with the stitching. I think the wooden plank was mostly to support the body on the horse.

 
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