Xbox One on the way. DRM removed, more details to come.

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So everyone that's so mad about the family gamesharing thing disappearing, is it really so hard now to empathize with people who were affected by the disc DRM policy?

 
Wow, I must say I am really stunned by this.  I'll give MS credit, Xbox One went from being a console I wouldnt ever purchase to a console I will consider in the future.  I think the family sharing plan had potential but it was so poorly explained by MS that I dont understand why so many of you in this thread and on comment pages are acting like this is a grand funeral.  An unlaunched service that we knew no hard solid details of won't be happening right away.  That's all.

For me, I still dont think Xbox One is worth a launch purchase cause of the $499 price point and a lack of games that are drastically different than what is going to be on 360/PS3, but it is definitely a possibility for 2014 now at least.

I'm glad to see that Microsoft listened here.  Whether it was from shareholders or bad pre-order numbers or whatever else, I give them credit for recognizing what their customers want and making changes.

 
i called it i knew after e3 ms did not have a pair of well you know to keep all that garbage. hey ms lets also drop the price to 400 and we have a race for next gen at 100 dollers more it's still not worth it at launch.

 
TimboSliceGB said:
i called it i knew after e3 ms did not have a pair of well you know to keep all that garbage. hey ms lets also drop the price to 400 and we have a race for next gen at 100 dollers more it's still not worth it at launch.
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Yay, timbo is back. :wave:

 
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Blaster man said:
kill3r7 said:
Blaster man said:
kill3r7 said:
Yes it's always easy to make stawman arguments and speculate based on worse case scenario.
1) All digital games can go on it.

2) Unlimited library

3) 10 family members they can all share the same X1 account.

Oh wow now that sounds wonderful. See what I did there.
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None of that was documented. You're speculating and acting like it's fact. I was speculating and saying it wasn't ever fully stated. I'm sure you're well aware of this though but the only documents they put out about it doesn't say anything that you just typed.
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No I was not. I stated you were making as straw man argument and I followed suit by doing the same thing as you. You see there are always two sides to the coin. You only like to see things one way. That's fine, everyone got what they wanted. I will probably stick with the PS4 because outside of exclusives there are no differences between the consoles.
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I wasn't making strawman arguments. What exactly was the strawman? As I see it, I said, you don't know what MS had planned for the "Shared game library" and gave 3 examples of things that they never explained then I provided my opinion of what would have happened AND I admitted those were opinions. There is no strawman here, you don't know what a strawman argument is.
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Look I'm not one to call people out as I don't particularly give a shit but here's the definition of a straw man argument. Read it over and then re-read your first post.

"A straw man argument is a rhetorical device that is meant to easily prove that one’s position or argument is superior to an opposing argument. However, the straw man argument is regarded as a logical fallacy, because at its core, the person using the device misrepresents the other person's argument. The person does this because it then becomes easier to knock down the weaker version of the opposing argument with one's more substantial counter argument."

 
TimboSliceGB said:
i called it i knew after e3 ms did not have a pair of well you know to keep all that garbage. hey ms lets also drop the price to 400 and we have a race for next gen at 100 dollers more it's still not worth it at launch.
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If they had sold out of pre-orders day one then this wouldn't have ever happened. At least now they have a chance. The 25% more expensive console is still a huge problem and I hope they lower the price but at least it went from being "not a chance in hell" to "eh, I'll wait for price drop/hardware revision" for many of us. Personally I'm still getting PS4 first because it's cheaper and because I like what they did with their policy but I'll probably get an X1 at some point in the future (2-3 years from now).

 
htz said:
TimboSliceGB said:
i called it i knew after e3 ms did not have a pair of well you know to keep all that garbage. hey ms lets also drop the price to 400 and we have a race for next gen at 100 dollers more it's still not worth it at launch.
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Yay, timbo is back. :wave:
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i feel like i dick for ever sticking up for ms i really really do it's good for gamers they did this but they had no twins to stick with their plan.

guess what ms seeing you did not drop the price im still getting ps4 at launch :bouncy:

 
I'm sad to see this go as this means family plan/shared library is probably never going to happen.

Yes I saw both sides of this. DRM sucked for those without connection, but for myself it wouldn't have mannered that much. Especially for the positive it had (allowing sharing).

Oh well. Not gonna get worked up over it like everyone else.
 
FloodyFloats said:
Ashane said:
DNukem170 said:
One thing nobody has said: If I am reading the bullet point right, the 24 hour check-in is gone, but you still need to connect to the Internet during system setup. Does that mean that if you don't connect the Internet at least once it's bricked?

While nowhere near as many if they had stayed the course, I can still see a decent number of returns if true.
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It requires the internet to be connected because the firmware needs to be updated.

I'm sure once the initial batch of X1's are sold out, that they'll incorporate the firmware upgrade in and it will no longer require it.
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Source?
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UPDATE: Microsoft clarifies that the planned day-one Xbox One update, which Whitten told me, will "complete some of the software that won’t be there," is actually not a result of today's DRM policy change. Rather, it was always planned and will be simply be required for playing off-line, among other things. Not a patch, they say. But, yes, your new Xbox console would have to connect online once in order to do the things Microsoft described today. And then you can keep it offline and play games without re-connecting to the Internet forever.

http://kotaku.com/xbox-one-drm-reversal-cuts-features-requires-one-time-514419715

brandtron8000 said:
So everyone that's so mad about the family gamesharing thing disappearing, is it really so hard now to empathize with people who were affected by the disc DRM policy?
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Nope.

Why? Because there was a choice. If it effected you, you had a crystal clear choice: The PS4. Those of us who wanted to move toward a more PC like system now have no choice, but to stick with our PC's.

I could have clearly empathized if both consoles had attempted to go the DRM digital only direction. Probably woudnt have been defending it so vigirously either, since I could understand how it would be screwing over everyone. But with a clear choice, I could never really understand the bitching. My only thought was.. that most of you wanted a Xbox One anyway, and were praying for the changes to go through so you could buy it. /Shrugs, who knows. LOL.

 
now the question is did ms do this to see how people reacted and if we reacted positive they would keep it and after they seen how uprise it caused they went to plan b for the system.

 
kill3r7 said:
Blaster man said:
kill3r7 said:
Blaster man said:
kill3r7 said:
Yes it's always easy to make stawman arguments and speculate based on worse case scenario.
1) All digital games can go on it.

2) Unlimited library

3) 10 family members they can all share the same X1 account.

Oh wow now that sounds wonderful. See what I did there.
Click to expand...
None of that was documented. You're speculating and acting like it's fact. I was speculating and saying it wasn't ever fully stated. I'm sure you're well aware of this though but the only documents they put out about it doesn't say anything that you just typed.
Click to expand...
No I was not. I stated you were making as straw man argument and I followed suit by doing the same thing as you. You see there are always two sides to the coin. You only like to see things one way. That's fine, everyone got what they wanted. I will probably stick with the PS4 because outside of exclusives there are no differences between the consoles.
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I wasn't making strawman arguments. What exactly was the strawman? As I see it, I said, you don't know what MS had planned for the "Shared game library" and gave 3 examples of things that they never explained then I provided my opinion of what would have happened AND I admitted those were opinions. There is no strawman here, you don't know what a strawman argument is.
Click to expand...
Look I'm not one to call people out as I don't particularly give a shit but here's the definition of a straw man argument. Read it over and then re-read your first post.

"A straw man argument is a rhetorical device that is meant to easily prove that one’s position or argument is superior to an opposing argument. However, the straw man argument is regarded as a logical fallacy, because at its core, the person using the device misrepresents the other person's argument. The person does this because it then becomes easier to knock down the weaker version of the opposing argument with one's more substantial counter argument."
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And I don't think I misrepresented what you said...Again, I'm saying that they didn't provide enough details to say definitively what the "shared game library" is.

You said: "It wasn't as vague as make it out to be. There was going to be a digital library. I and a handful of other people could access said library from anywhere and that was enticing enough for me. I understand that you and many others didn't care for putting up with DRM but to me that was a small price to pay to get access to some of these features. Maybe if enough of us complain they'll implement some of those features back. "

So with that said, they never defined what it is for all you know it could be, "you have to be at the same IP address" as the other buyer. As in, hey, you have 3 kids and 5 Xbox and you can play it on another Xbox so long as you're at the same house as the buyer. Again, I'm pointing out that they did not explain it or define it well. It could very well have been what you think it is but it could have been a horrible feature. We don't know and to go about saying it's great without any final explanation of what it is....

 
One thing nobody has said: If I am reading the bullet point right, the 24 hour check-in is gone, but you still need to connect to the Internet during system setup. Does that mean that if you don't connect the Internet at least once it's bricked?

While nowhere near as many if they had stayed the course, I can still see a decent number of returns if true.


It requires the internet to be connected because the firmware needs to be updated.

I'm sure once the initial batch of X1's are sold out, that they'll incorporate the firmware upgrade in and it will no longer require it.

Source?


UPDATE: Microsoft clarifies that the planned day-one Xbox One update, which Whitten told me, will "complete some of the software that won’t be there," is actually not a result of today's DRM policy change. Rather, it was always planned and will be simply be required for playing off-line, among other things. Not a patch, they say. But, yes, your new Xbox console would have to connect online once in order to do the things Microsoft described today. And then you can keep it offline and play games without re-connecting to the Internet forever.

http://kotaku.com/xbox-one-drm-reversal-cuts-features-requires-one-time-514419715
So everyone that's so mad about the family gamesharing thing disappearing, is it really so hard now to empathize with people who were affected by the disc DRM policy?



Nope.

Why? Because there was a choice. If it effected you, you had a crystal clear choice: The PS4. Those of us who wanted to move toward a more PC like system now have no choice, but to stick with our PC's.

I could have clearly empathized if both consoles had attempted to go the DRM digital only direction. Probably woudnt have been defending it so vigirously either, since I could understand how it would be screwing over everyone. But with a clear choice, I could never really understand the bitching. My only thought was.. that most of you wanted a Xbox One anyway, and were praying for the changes to go through so you could buy it. /Shrugs, who knows. LOL.
Thanks for the link!:D
 



brandtron8000 said:
So everyone that's so mad about the family gamesharing thing disappearing, is it really so hard now to empathize with people who were affected by the disc DRM policy?
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Not really since you always had the option of picking up a PS4. Now both systems are the same with no major differences but for exclusives. So this begs the question, how is the industry advancing?. How is gaming evolving? Better graphics simply are not enough.

I hope that steam box when and if it comes shows Sony and M$ that digital only works.

 
1371680137133.gif


 
kill3r7 said:
brandtron8000 said:
So everyone that's so mad about the family gamesharing thing disappearing, is it really so hard now to empathize with people who were affected by the disc DRM policy?
Click to expand...
Not really since you always had the option of picking up a PS4. Now both systems are the same with no major differences but for exclusives. So this begs the question, how is the industry advancing?. How is gaming evolving? Better graphics simply are not enough.

I hope that steam box when and if it comes shows Sony and M$ that digital only works.
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Its still moving forward some. Cloud computing etc
 
Jimmienoman said:
I'm sad to see this go as this means family plan/shared library is probably never going to happen.

Yes I saw both sides of this. DRM sucked for those without connection, but for myself it wouldn't have mannered that much. Especially for the positive it had (allowing sharing).

Oh well. Not gonna get worked up over it like everyone else.
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The "Family Sharing" thing was nothing more then a PR stunt to help alleviate the whole DRM fiasco.

 
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WV Matsui said:
The X1 Just Got a Lot Worse and it's Our Fault

http://gizmodo.com/the-xbox-one-just-got-way-worse-and-its-our-fault-514411905
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Geez, another idiot who believed everything MS told him.

Yeah games would have been cheaper, cos MS has a history of lowering games prices right ?? Like on XBLA where there's effectively no competition on prices, games have gotten way cheaper....................oh wait.

Also MS lets devs give us free content if they want to like on PC right...........oh no, no they don't.

Guess what "Trust us and everything will be great" doesn't work for people who have half a brain !!

 
They should have just stuck it out with their policies.  Anyone else LESS excited about getting the Xbox One?  And it's not like people's opinions have changed of Microsoft.  "Oh well, i'm still getting a PS4."  or "Hey look, Microsoft tried to fuck us over and failed.  Still getting a PS4."  

Nothing has changed.  People getting a PS4 will still get a PS4.  The Xbox One now has a few less features.  Awesome.  

 
Wait a minute... didn't Major Nelson say something along the lines of the X1 being built with the DRM in mind? So either that was a lie or they're re-building the system in some shape/form.

 
Daywalker said:
They should have just stuck it out with their policies. Anyone else LESS excited about getting the Xbox One? And it's not like people's opinions have changed of Microsoft. "Oh well, i'm still getting a PS4." or "Hey look, Microsoft tried to fuck us over and failed. Still getting a PS4."

Nothing has changed. People getting a PS4 will still get a PS4. The Xbox One now has a few less features. Awesome.
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I am.

Actually seriously debating just skipping this gen now. Better graphics really dosent mean anything when even a moderate PC beats both in TFLOPS. Let alone a gaming PC.

Game I was most excited for was The Division, so I guess if it dosent come to PC then I'll need to get one or the other. But if it does, then there's absolutely no reason to get one aside from a gift for my kids, not really me playing it.

 
JP said:
I'm disappointed by the loss of the sharing.
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well this shows it will be easy for them to put everything they took away years down the road to put it back into the system. Seeing good chance systems are already been in production for awhile im sure it's software thing and which means can be changed with no notice years down the road.

 
with that said last night i told people im going to calm down on how much i post here and im keeping my word jsut wanted to chat about this after i seen it when i got home from work. i really think them keeping the price at 500 is sitll going to hurt the system and kinect is still needed to be connected for system to work.  :wave:

 
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Daywalker said:
They should have just stuck it out with their policies. Anyone else LESS excited about getting the Xbox One? And it's not like people's opinions have changed of Microsoft. "Oh well, i'm still getting a PS4." or "Hey look, Microsoft tried to fuck us over and failed. Still getting a PS4."

Nothing has changed. People getting a PS4 will still get a PS4. The Xbox One now has a few less features. Awesome.
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I'm LESS excited, yea.

 
Vinny said:
Wait a minute... didn't Major Nelson say something along the lines of the X1 being built with the DRM in mind? So either that was a lie or they're re-building the system in some shape/form.
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Yes with the drm getting thrown out the window the X1 is now a different console. The on the fly game swapping is now gone, the play another game when waiting for matchmaking is also gone along with other things since we haven't seen the OS yet. I'm guessing they will need to rework the a big part of the OS.

 
spoo said:
Vinny said:
Wait a minute... didn't Major Nelson say something along the lines of the X1 being built with the DRM in mind? So either that was a lie or they're re-building the system in some shape/form.
Click to expand...
Yes with the drm getting thrown out the window the X1 is now a different console. The on the fly game swapping is now gone, the play another game when waiting for matchmaking is also gone along with other things since we haven't seen the OS yet. I'm guessing they will need to rework the a big part of the OS.
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Doubtful. I'm sure the cloud option will still exist, and downloaded games from Live will still exist.
 
The sharing process would have been nice after the limitations but now that that's been removed I think it's fine they take that away too.

Really everybody is better off, digital games will still peak their head into next-gen and most likely some sort of sharing or gifting will occur down the line. As for the Kinect included, people haven't even noticed that the new Playstation Eye is not included with the PS4 so yeah that price difference is moot imo.

 
Spybreak8 said:
The sharing process would have been nice after the limitations but now that that's been removed I think it's fine they take that away too.
Really everybody is better off, digital games will still peak their head into next-gen and most likely some sort of sharing or gifting will occur down the line. As for the Kinect included, people haven't even noticed that the new Playstation Eye is not included with the PS4 so yeah that price difference is moot imo.
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It's only moot if you're planning on buying the Eye. And even then, PS4 is still $60 cheaper. Regardless, I'm happy about Xbox One-Eighty. I'm excited to play Ryse, Crimson Dragon, and Halo 5.
 
JP said:
I'm disappointed by the loss of the sharing.
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The more I think about it the more I see the sharing may still stick around, but only for games that have been purchased digitally. Wouldn't be that hard to look for a tagging that was built into the digital marketplace games. This way they can slowly build into the DRM scheme they want to do. That way both sides of the X1 field can be somewhat happy.

 
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spoo said:
Vinny said:
Wait a minute... didn't Major Nelson say something along the lines of the X1 being built with the DRM in mind? So either that was a lie or they're re-building the system in some shape/form.
Click to expand...
Yes with the drm getting thrown out the window the X1 is now a different console. The on the fly game swapping is now gone, the play another game when waiting for matchmaking is also gone along with other things since we haven't seen the OS yet. I'm guessing they will need to rework the a big part of the OS.
Click to expand...
Where are you getting these allocations? Why are they gone, we still don't' have any info on that matter. Those features were shown off with TV at the initial reveal, why would game DRM change that?

Game swapping, or swapping from one app to the other, will rely on if Microsoft still allows you to install the game for convenience and most likely if you had a digital game.

 
cancerman1120 said:
The game switching could still be used with digital games I would assume? So not completely lost I would guess.
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Yeah I don't get why they can't do it with digital games. We already know retail releases will be on the X1's digital store same day. Even the PS3 is able to share digital games with up to 2 consoles.

 
Spybreak8 said:
spoo said:
Vinny said:
Wait a minute... didn't Major Nelson say something along the lines of the X1 being built with the DRM in mind? So either that was a lie or they're re-building the system in some shape/form.
Click to expand...
Yes with the drm getting thrown out the window the X1 is now a different console. The on the fly game swapping is now gone, the play another game when waiting for matchmaking is also gone along with other things since we haven't seen the OS yet. I'm guessing they will need to rework the a big part of the OS.
Click to expand...
Where are you getting these allocations? Why are they gone, we still don't' have any info on that matter. Those features were shown off with TV at the initial reveal, why would game DRM change that?

Game swapping, or swapping from one app to the other, will rely on if Microsoft still allows you to install the game for convenience and most likely if you had a digital game.
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Because they just said that a disc has to be in the Xbox One to play a game?

htz said:
cancerman1120 said:
The game switching could still be used with digital games I would assume? So not completely lost I would guess.
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Yeah I don't get why they can't do it with digital games. We already know retail releases will be on the X1's digital store same day. Even the PS3 is able to share digital games with up to 2 consoles.
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Not sure why either. I'm not sure why we simply cant have two policies. Buy it digital, enjoy family sharing, disc-less play (obviously) and on the fly game swapping. Buy it with a disc, enjoy renting, trading in and selling your game.

Why oh why coudnt we simply have both? Is that a greedy thing to ask for? :/

 
Drclaw411 said:
Spybreak8 said:
The sharing process would have been nice after the limitations but now that that's been removed I think it's fine they take that away too.
Really everybody is better off, digital games will still peak their head into next-gen and most likely some sort of sharing or gifting will occur down the line. As for the Kinect included, people haven't even noticed that the new Playstation Eye is not included with the PS4 so yeah that price difference is moot imo.
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It's only moot if you're planning on buying the Eye. And even then, PS4 is still $60 cheaper. Regardless, I'm happy about Xbox One-Eighty. I'm excited to play Ryse, Crimson Dragon, and Halo 5.
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Yeah then Sony is running into the same problem Microsoft had this gen with the Kinect, since it didn't come with the system developers didn't want to be limited to the small userbase numbers (compared to everyone who had a 360).

 
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