2012 Election Thread

I'm not sure what kind of relationship that you guys had with your father, but I would not like someone calling mine a liar. Now if he would have lost it, rushed the stage, and punched the president, then we would have something to talk about. Both sides inferred that the other was lying, I'm sure both families were upset over that. Tagg (sigh) was being honest about his feelings. Maybe more was said behind closed doors, maybe not. Not much to twist your panties about here I think.
 
[quote name='egofed']I'm not sure what kind of relationship that you guys had with your father, but I would not like someone calling mine a liar. Now if he would have lost it, rushed the stage, and punched the president, then we would have something to talk about. Both sides inferred that the other was lying, I'm sure both families were upset over that. Tagg (sigh) was being honest about his feelings. Maybe more was said behind closed doors, maybe not. Not much to twist your panties about here I think.[/QUOTE]

Except for it being a constant barrage of insults, accusations, and insinuations from the right to marginalize and disrespect this President. From Tommy Thompsons's son saying we should send Obama back to Kenya to Tagg Romney wanting to punch the President the disrespect is out of control. These men learned this from the very people running for office, their fathers.
 
[quote name='egofed']I'm not sure what kind of relationship that you guys had with your father, but I would not like someone calling mine a liar. Now if he would have lost it, rushed the stage, and punched the president, then we would have something to talk about. Both sides inferred that the other was lying, I'm sure both families were upset over that. Tagg (sigh) was being honest about his feelings. Maybe more was said behind closed doors, maybe not. Not much to twist your panties about here I think.[/QUOTE]

It's a threat of physical assault.

If someone calls you a liar while you're on the job, do you deck them or threaten to deck them. You must be some fireman...
 
Hahahahahahaha...yes, I'm a fireman. And I believe in free speech and self control. I support people saying offensive things. It means our system is still working. Do you guys like Bill Maher? Same thing. And, if you can not tell a true verbal threat from someone explaining how they felt given a stressful time, then you might want to interact with real people a bit more. Whew, I want to meet you guys in real life. I gotta see who the heck really thinks that way.
 
I guarantee that if Obama had a son of s similar age and he mentioned wanting to deck Romney there would be a huge shit storm over it. But because "Tagg" is a white male of privilege from a wealthy family, it's just a thing. That's the double standard we live in, and it's bullshit through and through.
 
Idiot right wingers like Rush would blow a gasket, Clak. Just like all the idiots such as Maddow and Shultz. You are right, but that doesn't mean that us, rational, logical people should. They need controversy for ratings. We don't.
 
[quote name='egofed']Hahahahahahaha...yes, I'm a fireman. And I believe in free speech and self control. I support people saying offensive things. It means our system is still working. Do you guys like Bill Maher? Same thing. And, if you can not tell a true verbal threat from someone explaining how they felt given a stressful time, then you might want to interact with real people a bit more. Whew, I want to meet you guys in real life. I gotta see who the heck really thinks that way.[/QUOTE]

So saying offensive things should be the standard bearer of our modern political system? Got it. Also, big difference between Joe Blow expressing frustration about his boss or a comedian exercising his 1st Amendment Rights and the eldest son of potentially the next President saying he wants to physically hurt the current President. If threats against the President can so easily be made by the son of the Republican Presidential candidate then it legitimizes the thoughts of every kook out there that actually wishes to do it.
 
Wow, just wow....your logic has left me speechless. I'm hearing that Zoolander quote in my head, "How do you live?" EHehehhehehhehheheehe...lighten up.
 
[quote name='egofed']Idiot right wingers like Rush would blow a gasket, Clak. Just like all the idiots such as Maddow and Shultz. You are right, but that doesn't mean that us, rational, logical people should. They need controversy for ratings. We don't.[/QUOTE]
You're under the impression that there is equivalency between the people you mentioned, there isn't. Granted I don't even watch cable news, but I know enough about those people to know you can't compare Rachel Maddow to Rush Limbaugh.
 
[quote name='egofed']Wow, just wow....your logic has left me speechless. I'm hearing that Zoolander quote in my head, "How do you live?" EHehehhehehhehheheehe...lighten up.[/QUOTE]


The fact you find my logic baffling says everything I need to know about you.

It is an old article but I can only imagine it has gotten worse. You can hid behind the cover of "rational people" see understand what was being said but it is not the rational people we need to worry about. As a person running for office or the family of a person running for office you should be aware your actions or words can have an impact on people.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...reats-a-day-stretching-US-Secret-Service.html
 
Not to mention that the president of this country isn't just anyone. It's not the same as thinking you'd like to hit the dude that cut your dad off in traffic. This is the president of our country for crying out loud. If he'd said it aloud during the debate he very likely would have been made to leave (at best) if the SS had gotten wind of it. And he isn't just anyone, he's the son of the GOP presidential candidate, that actually means something.
 
For those who still can’t grasp the concept of white privilege, or who are looking for some easy-to-understand examples of it, perhaps this list will help.

White privilege is when you can get pregnant at seventeen like Bristol Palin and everyone is quick to insist that your life and that of your family is a personal matter, and that no one has a right to judge you or your parents, because “every family has challenges,” even as black and Latino families with similar “challenges” are regularly typified as irresponsible, pathological and arbiters of social decay.

White privilege is when you can call yourself a “fuckin’ redneck,” like Bristol Palin’s boyfriend does, and talk about how if anyone messes with you, you’ll “kick their fuckin’ ass,” and talk about how you like to “shoot shit” for fun, and still be viewed as a responsible, all-American boy (and a great son-in-law to be) rather than a thug.

White privilege is when you can attend four different colleges in six years like Sarah Palin did (one of which you basically failed out of, then returned to after making up some coursework at a community college), and no one questions your intelligence or commitment to achievement, whereas a person of color who did this would be viewed as unfit for college, and probably someone who only got in in the first place because of affirmative action.

White privilege is when you can claim that being mayor of a town smaller than most medium-sized colleges, and then Governor of a state with about the same number of people as the lower fifth of the island of Manhattan, makes you ready to potentially be president, and people don’t all piss on themselves with laughter, while being a black U.S. Senator, two-term state Senator, and constitutional law scholar, means you’re “untested.”

White privilege is being able to say that you support the words “under God” in the pledge of allegiance because “if it was good enough for the founding fathers, it’s good enough for me,” and not be immediately disqualified from holding office–since, after all, the pledge was written in the late 1800s and the “under God” part wasn’t added until the 1950s–while if you’re black and believe in reading accused criminals and terrorists their rights (because the Constitution, which you used to teach at a prestigious law school, requires it), you are a dangerous and mushy liberal who isn’t fit to safeguard American institutions.

White privilege is being able to be a gun enthusiast and not make people immediately scared of you.

White privilege is being able to have a husband who was a member of an extremist political party that wants your state to secede from the Union, and whose motto is “Alaska first,” and no one questions your patriotism or that of your family, while if you’re black and your spouse merely fails to come to a 9/11 memorial so she can be home with her kids on the first day of school, people immediately think she’s being disrespectful.

White privilege is being able to make fun of community organizers and the work they do–like, among other things, fight for the right of women to vote, or for civil rights, or the 8-hour workday, or an end to child labor–and people think you’re being pithy and tough, but if you merely question the experience of a small town mayor and 18-month governor with no foreign policy expertise beyond a class she took in college and the fact that she lives close to Russia–you’re somehow being mean, or even sexist.

White privilege is being able to convince white women who don’t even agree with you on any substantive issue to vote for you and your running mate anyway, because suddenly your presence on the ticket has inspired confidence in these same white women, and made them give your party a “second look.”

White privilege is being able to fire people who didn’t support your political campaigns and not be accused of abusing your power or being a typical politician who engages in favoritism, while being black and merely knowing some folks from the old-line political machines in Chicago means you must be corrupt.

White privilege is when you can take nearly twenty-four hours to get to a hospital after beginning to leak amniotic fluid, and still be viewed as a great mom whose commitment to her children is unquestionable, and whose “next door neighbor” qualities make her ready to be VP, while if you’re a black candidate for president and you let your children be interviewed for a few seconds on TV, you’re irresponsibly exploiting them.

White privilege is being able to give a 36 minute speech in which you talk about lipstick and make fun of your opponent, while laying out no substantive policy positions on any issue at all, and still manage to be considered a legitimate candidate, while a black person who gives an hour speech the week before, in which he lays out specific policy proposals on several issues, is still criticized for being too vague about what he would do if elected.

White privilege is being able to attend churches over the years whose pastors say that people who voted for John Kerry or merely criticize George W. Bush are going to hell, and that the U.S. is an explicitly Christian nation and the job of Christians is to bring Christian theological principles into government, and who bring in speakers who say the conflict in the Middle East is God’s punishment on Jews for rejecting Jesus, and everyone can still think you’re just a good church-going Christian, but if you’re black and friends with a black pastor who has noted (as have Colin Powell and the U.S. Department of Defense) that terrorist attacks are often the result of U.S. foreign policy and who talks about the history of racism and its effect on black people, you’re an extremist who probably hates America.

White privilege is not knowing what the Bush Doctrine is when asked by a reporter, and then people get angry at the reporter for asking you such a “trick question,” while being black and merely refusing to give one-word answers to the queries of Bill O’Reilly means you’re dodging the question, or trying to seem overly intellectual and nuanced.

White privilege is being able to go to a prestigious prep school, then to Yale and then Harvard Business school, and yet, still be seen as just an average guy (George W. Bush) while being black, going to a prestigious prep school, then Occidental College, then Columbia, and then to Harvard Law, makes you “uppity,” and a snob who probably looks down on regular folks.

White privilege is being able to graduate near the bottom of your college class (McCain), or graduate with a C average from Yale (W.) and that’s OK, and you’re cut out to be president, but if you’re black and you graduate near the top of your class from Harvard Law, you can’t be trusted to make good decisions in office.

White privilege is being able to dump your first wife after she’s disfigured in a car crash so you can take up with a multi-millionaire beauty queen (who you go on to call the c-word in public) and still be thought of as a man of strong family values, while if you’re black and married for nearly twenty years to the same woman, your family is viewed as un-American and your gestures of affection for each other are called “terrorist fist bumps.”

White privilege is when you can develop a pain-killer addiction, having obtained your drug of choice illegally like Cindy McCain, go on to beat that addiction, and everyone praises you for being so strong, while being a black guy who smoked pot a few times in college and never became an addict means people will wonder if perhaps you still get high, and even ask whether or not you ever sold drugs.

White privilege is being able to sing a song about bombing Iran and still be viewed as a sober and rational statesman, with the maturity to be president, while being black and suggesting that the U.S. should speak with other nations, even when we have disagreements with them, makes you “dangerously naive and immature.”

White privilege is being able to say that you hate “g**ks” and “will always hate them,” and yet, you aren’t a racist because, ya know, you were a POW so you’re entitled to your hatred, while being black and insisting that black anger about racism is understandable, given the history of your country, makes you a dangerous bigot.

White privilege is being able to claim your experience as a POW has anything at all to do with your fitness for president, while being black and experiencing racism and an absent father is apparently among the “lesser adversities” faced by other politicians, as Sarah Palin explained in her convention speech.

And finally, white privilege is the only thing that could possibly allow someone to become president when he has voted with George W. Bush 90 percent of the time, even as unemployment is skyrocketing, people are losing their homes, inflation is rising, and the U.S. is increasingly isolated from world opinion, just because a lot of white voters aren’t sure about that whole “change” thing. Ya know, it’s just too vague and ill-defined, unlike, say, four more years of the same, which is very concrete and certain.

White privilege is, in short, the problem.


http://www.timwise.org/2008/09/this-is-your-nation-on-white-privilege/
 
I believe I saw a facebook post that said something akin to "white privilege is the 'easy difficulty setting' in the video game that is life" which once made me chuckle.

I like a lot of what Tim Wise has to say, but have a hard time stomaching the smarm of his writing style. See also: Matt Taibbi.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']I believe I saw a facebook post that said something akin to "white privilege is the 'easy difficulty setting' in the video game that is life" which once made me chuckle.

I like a lot of what Tim Wise has to say, but have a hard time stomaching the smarm of his writing style. See also: Matt Taibbi.[/QUOTE]
That was a fairly long blog post somewhere if I remember correctly. I saw Tim Wise speak once a few years back, and Michael Eric Dyson the next week. Definitely enjoyed Dyson more. There is just something about Wise that tends to irk me. Maybe it's because he speaks about things he never has and never will experience.
 
[quote name='Clak']That was a fairly long blog post somewhere if I remember correctly. I saw Tim Wise speak once a few years back, and Michael Eric Dyson the next week. Definitely enjoyed Dyson more. There is just something about Wise that tends to irk me. Maybe it's because he speaks about things he never has and never will experience.[/QUOTE]

ehhhhhh, not so fast - being cognizant of white privilege is one way of experiencing racism, yes? in that you know you're "getting away with it." This one time I was being followed by (a really obvious and not at all subtle, therefore poor) loss prevention employee in a store a few years ago is an example of that - I reacted by feeling a bit flattered. Like "aww, how charming - this dude thinks I'm going to steal stuff. let him follow me for a bit and I'll keep looking back and forth as if to suggest I'm going to steal something."

I recognized that I was allowed to be "flattered" because I rarely experience that. It's not a part of my daily life - being pulled over for DWB, having racist shit shouted at me or muttered behind my back, having a job application denied because the name says "Mike" instead of "Jamal," etc. I was very aware of my white privilege at that point.

Wise is kind of a smarmy fucker, which is why I struggle with him. He's got that condescending attitude in his writing and speech. But I wouldn't say he doesn't experience what he discusses - he experiences the residual benefits of the systems he speaks of.
 
[quote name='egofed']Hahahahahahaha...yes, I'm a fireman. And I believe in free speech and self control. I support people saying offensive things. It means our system is still working. Do you guys like Bill Maher? Same thing. And, if you can not tell a true verbal threat from someone explaining how they felt given a stressful time, then you might want to interact with real people a bit more. Whew, I want to meet you guys in real life. I gotta see who the heck really thinks that way.[/QUOTE]

I don't like it. I don't like the violent rhetoric, the couched physical threats, the violent imagery (like targets over politician's heads).

You can try and gussy it up all you want, the guy said he wanted to punch the president and you support it. That's not right.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']I believe I saw a facebook post that said something akin to "white privilege is the 'easy difficulty setting' in the video game that is life" which once made me chuckle.

I like a lot of what Tim Wise has to say, but have a hard time stomaching the smarm of his writing style. See also: Matt Taibbi.[/QUOTE]
It was on Kotaku too.

I don't share your aversion to their style, but I agree that they don't pussy-foot around the issues. Taibbi tends to go out of his way to tear people a new one though.

[quote name='Clak']That was a fairly long blog post somewhere if I remember correctly. I saw Tim Wise speak once a few years back, and Michael Eric Dyson the next week. Definitely enjoyed Dyson more. There is just something about Wise that tends to irk me. Maybe it's because he speaks about things he never has and never will experience.[/QUOTE]
That's definitely a valid criticism of Wise. He walks this really awkward line of talking about whiteness and racism as both participant and observer and beneficiary. I don't doubt that he's genuine, but being white makes it problematic...especially when he makes like $15k per talk.

But yeah, Dyson is much better at doing it in terms of style and content while still giving biting criticisms.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']ehhhhhh, not so fast - being cognizant of white privilege is one way of experiencing racism, yes? in that you know you're "getting away with it." This one time I was being followed by (a really obvious and not at all subtle, therefore poor) loss prevention employee in a store a few years ago is an example of that - I reacted by feeling a bit flattered. Like "aww, how charming - this dude thinks I'm going to steal stuff. let him follow me for a bit and I'll keep looking back and forth as if to suggest I'm going to steal something."

I recognized that I was allowed to be "flattered" because I rarely experience that. It's not a part of my daily life - being pulled over for DWB, having racist shit shouted at me or muttered behind my back, having a job application denied because the name says "Mike" instead of "Jamal," etc. I was very aware of my white privilege at that point.

Wise is kind of a smarmy fucker, which is why I struggle with him. He's got that condescending attitude in his writing and speech. But I wouldn't say he doesn't experience what he discusses - he experiences the residual benefits of the systems he speaks of.[/QUOTE]

That isn't quite what I meant. When I heard Dyson speak he spoke of personal experiences and the effect it had on him, those were negative experiences, causing negative effects. What you're talking about is being aware of the privilege you enjoy, and understanding what that means, but like you said, you haven't expedienced the negatives of the other side, and for that matter neither have I. It has more resonance when someone can paint a picture of what it is like to experience something from their own personal experiences. I don't fault Wise, and I think he does good work, it's just it doesn't have the same impact as it would coming from someone who can tell you exactly what it's like because they've been there.

It would be like a white guy speaking about the plight of native americans. Sure he might be 100% right in what he says, but he lives in an middle class suburb, not on a poverty stricken reservation, he doesn't live that life ,so he'll always be on the outside looking in. It's experiencing racism more as a curiosity to study rather than actually living it, you understand what I'm trying to say?

That isn't to fault Wise or anyone else who speaks about racism, but isn't the target of it. It's just that they have to speak about it in a different way because they can't relate what it's like from personal experience. I can speak about how blacks were treated during the civil rights movement, but even if I were old enough to have lived back then, I couldn't tell you what it felt like because I wouldn't have been treated like that.

Hope that explains what I meant a little better.
 
[quote name='dohdough']It was on Kotaku too.

I don't share your aversion to their style, but I agree that they don't pussy-foot around the issues. Taibbi tends to go out of his way to tear people a new one though.


That's definitely a valid criticism of Wise. He walks this really awkward line of talking about whiteness and racism as both participant and observer and beneficiary. I don't doubt that he's genuine, but being white makes it problematic...especially when he makes like $15k per talk.

But yeah, Dyson is much better at doing it in terms of style and content while still giving biting criticisms.[/QUOTE]
Which in the talk he gave he did go out of his way to point out that he even understood it could ring a little hollow coming from someone such as him. He talked a little about how he grew up and all, so it's not like he's trying to act he's experience the stuff he talks about first hand.
 
[quote name='Clak']Which in the talk he gave he did go out of his way to point out that he even understood it could ring a little hollow coming from someone such as him. He talked a little about how he grew up and all, so it's not like he's trying to act he's experience the stuff he talks about first hand.[/QUOTE]
Oh I don't mean to sound like he doesn't acknowledge it, because he does and has in many different ways over the years. I think what he does is important and it comes from a genuine place, nor does he try to appropriate other people's experiences. What I mean to say is that although he actually does lots of good, being a white person that talks about racism/white supremacy is a good part of his celebrity, which he also acknowledges. So while fighting it, he also perpetuates it.

Kinda like that saying: you can't destroy the master's house with his own tools.
 
[quote name='Clak']That isn't quite what I meant. When I heard Dyson speak he spoke of personal experiences and the effect it had on him, those were negative experiences, causing negative effects. What you're talking about is being aware of the privilege you enjoy, and understanding what that means, but like you said, you haven't expedienced the negatives of the other side, and for that matter neither have I. It has more resonance when someone can paint a picture of what it is like to experience something from their own personal experiences. I don't fault Wise, and I think he does good work, it's just it doesn't have the same impact as it would coming from someone who can tell you exactly what it's like because they've been there.

It would be like a white guy speaking about the plight of native americans. Sure he might be 100% right in what he says, but he lives in an middle class suburb, not on a poverty stricken reservation, he doesn't live that life ,so he'll always be on the outside looking in. It's experiencing racism more as a curiosity to study rather than actually living it, you understand what I'm trying to say?

That isn't to fault Wise or anyone else who speaks about racism, but isn't the target of it. It's just that they have to speak about it in a different way because they can't relate what it's like from personal experience. I can speak about how blacks were treated during the civil rights movement, but even if I were old enough to have lived back then, I couldn't tell you what it felt like because I wouldn't have been treated like that.

Hope that explains what I meant a little better.[/QUOTE]

crystal. danke schoen.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']what's really sad is that this is your attempt to get involved in engaging political conversation.

Romney's 5 point plan? http://www.mittromney.com/JobsPlan
1) drill, baby, drill
2) go to war with China
3) magical jobs appear!
4) eliminate PBS and the deficit will disappear
5) cut income taxes, eliminate capital gains taxes. ignore #4.[/QUOTE]

Well to be fair:
1.) Production is down on public land. Not quite 14% but 13.77% would be lost on people. What Mitt fails to mention is that 3 of the last 5 years of W. that same production was down as much as 10% and that Obama's 1st couple of years the production amount was up 12 and 15% (both rounded up) and would have been higher if not for BP.
Second to that is the uninformed opinion of ANWR drilling. We're already drilling on 90-95% of Alaska's border at any given point of time.

2.) Thinly veiled threats of a trade war isn't quite tanks and jets. On the other hand, given how much of our currency they hold, a trade war with China will only serve to destroy our economy. This is Mitt not understanding that govt is not a business. You can lower prices at Staples and run a deficit to shutdown Office Max, but if you do that to a country then you can't hold the position. The middle class won't be squeezed or buried, it will be utterly destroyed. Cost of goods will skyrocket and wages won't keep up at all because employers will need to keep wages down when paying the higher cost for cheap plastic crap.

3.) They don't just appear, they're delivered by unicorns!

4.) Another thing Mitt doesn't understand: the shows on PBS are mainly produced by private companies and only broadcast on public airwaves. Just more job creation when those shows no longer have a place to air...

5.) Haven't we all figured out by now that (R)s only care about debt and deficit when they don't hold the White House? Even the Tea Party amongst the 112th congress have raised spending...
 
[quote name='nasum']2.) Thinly veiled threats of a trade war isn't quite tanks and jets. On the other hand, given how much of our currency they hold, a trade war with China will only serve to destroy our economy. This is Mitt not understanding that govt is not a business. You can lower prices at Staples and run a deficit to shutdown Office Max, but if you do that to a country then you can't hold the position. The middle class won't be squeezed or buried, it will be utterly destroyed. Cost of goods will skyrocket and wages won't keep up at all because employers will need to keep wages down when paying the higher cost for cheap plastic crap.[/QUOTE]
I don't think you understand the nature of the debt China holds. They buy T-Bills, T-Bonds, etc just like you or I could. The worst that could happen is that they could put them all on the market and we'd have to raise rates above the nothing they're at now. It would hurt the debt market - a little, and it might decrease the value of the dollar - a little.

You ignore the reason why China buys treasuries, the same reason Romney is criticizing them. They want to prop up the value of the dollar and keep the value of their currency low in order to benefit their export market. They would hurt themselves more than they hurt us if they took that action.

The dollar is already down and China is already decreasing its holdings of treasuries. They're almost at the point where they'll only be the 2nd biggest foreign holder of our debt behind Japan.
 
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Dohdough, that's not white privilege, it's rich privilege. Just like OJ, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, numerous minority sports stars, and corrupt preachers enjoy. Democrats didn't say rude and crude things about Bush? Oh, but he's white. You make it sound like every good thing that happens to a white person is because of the color of their skin, and every bad thing that happens to a black person is because of the color of their skin. I would like to see life through your eyes for just one day. Biggest acid trip ever......
 
[quote name='egofed']Dohdough, that's not white privilege, it's rich privilege. Just like OJ, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, numerous minority sports stars, and corrupt preachers enjoy. Democrats didn't say rude and crude things about Bush? Oh, but he's white. You make it sound like every good thing that happens to a white person is because of the color of their skin, and every bad thing that happens to a black person is because of the color of their skin. I would like to see life through your eyes for just one day. Biggest acid trip ever......[/QUOTE]

Although I have disagreed with you a lot recently I do agree with this for the most part. We can all argue about the reasons why someone gets in trouble but it is pretty clear that being rich seems to allow for more free passes on bad behavior. Regardless of creed or color.
 
"Not to mention that the president of this country isn't just anyone."

Dude, uhhh, the president is JUST another guy. If you are referring to respect for the office of president, well, defending Clinton's actions pretty much blows that out of the water.
 
Thanks, cancerman. I've reread some of my previous posts and realize that I'm letting my rhetoric become more belligerent and disrespectful. I apologize for that. Believe it or not, I respect anyone who stands up for what they believe in and is willing to put it up against the flames of open debate. I may not always agree with ya, but I will try to defend our right to argue;-)
 
[quote name='egofed']"Not to mention that the president of this country isn't just anyone."

Dude, uhhh, the president is JUST another guy. If you are referring to respect for the office of president, well, defending Clinton's actions pretty much blows that out of the water.[/QUOTE]

Who defends his actions? The problem I have is the people that think that because he got a blowjob suddenly this country went in the crapper. I'm more concerned with how the country is ran than what goes on his sexual life. The ones who put his sexual life first need to reorganize their priorities.

It's not like the second her lips touched his pecker the housing market crashed, the dow plummeted, war broke out, our foreign trade stopped, foreign relations crumbled, etc. Things went on like normal. That's what the people should be concerned about.
 
Uhh, dude, like totally, like seriously, uhh, the president isn't just some guy. "Another guy" doesn't have secret service protection. You truly are a dipshit.
 
[quote name='egofed']Dohdough, that's not white privilege, it's rich privilege.

Just like OJ, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, numerous minority sports stars, and corrupt preachers enjoy.[/QUOTE]
Enjoy things like what? OJ is ruined and people treat Jackson and Sharpton like they're jokes. Although, I can only wonder as to why you chose to group Jackson and Sharpton with OJ. It's a ridiculous comparison on any level especially when it comes to what they've done in their lives, muchless race and privilege.

Obama is "rich" and he got raked over the coals for Ayers and Wright when Todd Palin himself was openly calling for and supporting a nativist and separatist movement, which I'm sure wasn't something that the actual Native American residents were a big part of.

If you think that there wouldn't be any racist outcries if one of the Obama daughters got pregnant and had a kid next year, you're even more full of shit than there is shit on Bullshit Mountain.

Democrats didn't say rude and crude things about Bush? Oh, but he's white.
Watermelon patches and comparisons monkeys mean the exact same thing in reference to a white person and a black person right?:roll:

You make it sound like every good thing that happens to a white person is because of the color of their skin, and every bad thing that happens to a black person is because of the color of their skin.
And you make it sound like race doesn't matter at all. I'm not the one denying reality here; you are.

I would like to see life through your eyes for just one day. Biggest acid trip ever......
Why? Because the experience of a white male libertarian firefighter should somehow be considered the norm and the default experiences of everyone that's not white or male?
 
[quote name='egofed'] Democrats didn't say rude and crude things about Bush?[/QUOTE]

And do you know why people said horrible things about Bush? It was because he was A TERRIBLE fuckING PRESIDENT. He ignored several warnings that led to the 9/11 attacks, pissed away our surplus, got us into two expensive wars, eroded our Constitutional rights, gave tax breaks to the wealthy. I could go on, but I think I've made my point.

This isn't even an apples to oranges comparison here, folks.
 
[quote name='Purple Flames']Thanks to Ryan's little stunt at the soup kitchen the other day, The establishment's funding (which is mostly from private donations) is in jeopardy: http://freakoutnation.blogspot.com/2012/10/when-morals-politics-cross.html[/QUOTE]

but but charity always works, the Libertarians told me so. That's why we don't need social programs by the gubmint because you can always trust charitable donations to pick up the slack.
 
Lots of people think Obama is a TERRIBLE fuckING PRESIDENT. Either its ok to criticize the president or not. Freedom of speech is not limited to what you agree with or find unoffensive. Palin is a joke just as much as Jackson and Sharpton in my book. And OJ, he was found not guilty. Did his high paid lawyers effect that verdict? Having a ruined reputation is a lot better than being incarcerated as a double murderer. Race is a contributing factor in some opportunities, I do agree. But to limit it as the ONLY factor, and to downplay initiative and hard work, is just as idiotic as saying it plays none.

Clinton's BJ did not directly effect the economy, but it does put doubt as to his character and integrity when dealing with the country's affairs. Tagg said something that he shouldn't have during a campaign when every little nuance is dissected and used against the candidate. I just think too much is being made of stupid quotes instead of the real policies. IE "You didn't build that."

Doh, I want to see what personal experiences put this particular slant on your belief system. College or what? I respect that you feel strongly about this topic.

Clak, the day I put our president on a pedestal above anyone else, is the day we have a return to the monarchy. Its ok to be angry. Let it out. Here, I'll help. Obama is a ........wait for it....DIPSHIT!!!!
 
[quote name='egofed']Lots of people think Obama is a TERRIBLE fuckING PRESIDENT. Either its ok to criticize the president or not. Freedom of speech is not limited to what you agree with or find unoffensive. Palin is a joke just as much as Jackson and Sharpton in my book. And OJ, he was found not guilty. Did his high paid lawyers effect that verdict? Having a ruined reputation is a lot better than being incarcerated as a double murderer. Race is a contributing factor in some opportunities, I do agree. But to limit it as the ONLY factor, and to downplay initiative and hard work, is just as idiotic as saying it plays none.

Clinton's BJ did not directly effect the economy, but it does put doubt as to his character and integrity when dealing with the country's affairs. Tagg said something that he shouldn't have during a campaign when every little nuance is dissected and used against the candidate. I just think too much is being made of stupid quotes instead of the real policies. IE "You didn't build that."

Doh, I want to see what personal experiences put this particular slant on your belief system. College or what? I respect that you feel strongly about this topic.

Clak, the day I put our president on a pedestal above anyone else, is the day we have a return to the monarchy. Its ok to be angry. Let it out. Here, I'll help. Obama is a ........wait for it....DIPSHIT!!!![/QUOTE]

Here's the key differences between criticisms of Bush and Obama. People hate Bush because of afformentioned reasons (war, deficit, etc.) i.e. tangible, verifiable reasons that are grounded in reality. Most wingnuts on the right hate Obama because apparently he's a Kenyan-born socialist communist Muslim who was sent to Earth by the ghost of Hitler to destroy America with his army of gay aborted fetuses.

There are perfectly valid reasons to not like Obama policy-wise (not closing Gitmo, NDAA, drone strikes, etc.), but these folks hate him for completely made-up bullshit born from fear-mongering and racism (this is the part you're not getting).
 
You never hear anyone from the right complain about that stuff because it's stuff they have no problem with often times, they're conservative actions. I have no doubt that had McCain won in 2008 we'd currently be using drone strikes still, gitmo probably would still be open, and as far as the NDAA goes, no way would that not have happened.

Now these are the types of things libertarians sometimes complain about, and if they do, it's valid criticism. Those are all things Obama has/hasn't done that I don't like either. It's just that most republicans focus on shit that's ridiculous like mentioned above.
 
[quote name='egofed']Lots of people think Obama is a TERRIBLE fuckING PRESIDENT. Either its ok to criticize the president or not. Freedom of speech is not limited to what you agree with or find unoffensive.[/quote]
Funny because not all speech is protected and threatening the President is one of those things that isn't. Still have no idea what this has to do with privilege though.

Palin is a joke just as much as Jackson and Sharpton in my book.
Ummm...WHY?

And OJ, he was found not guilty. Did his high paid lawyers effect that verdict? Having a ruined reputation is a lot better than being incarcerated as a double murderer.
Lots of high profile cases with high priced lawyers don't always get their clients off. That still doesn't address the question of privilege.

Race is a contributing factor in some opportunities, I do agree. But to limit it as the ONLY factor, and to downplay initiative and hard work, is just as idiotic as saying it plays none.
You can't pull up your bootstraps if you have no boots.

Clinton's BJ did not directly effect the economy, but it does put doubt as to his character and integrity when dealing with the country's affairs. Tagg said something that he shouldn't have during a campaign when every little nuance is dissected and used against the candidate. I just think too much is being made of stupid quotes instead of the real policies. IE "You didn't build that."
Saying that the only thing stopping him from punching Obama in the face are Secret Service agents isn't something taken out of context, so thank you so much for your "nuance" and "dissection" of what was said.

Doh, I want to see what personal experiences put this particular slant on your belief system. College or what? I respect that you feel strongly about this topic.
My parents read me the Autobiography of Malcolm X as a bedtime story when I was a child...how about that? What difference does it make if I got "indoctrinated at a liberal college" or if I got jumped by black/white/Martian kids or at work or by watching Sesame St? If you have a point to make, then make it.

And I don't give a shit if you respect my ability to fart so loud at a restaurant that it makes the kitchen staff come out to see wtf happened. I don't want it nor do I need your validation. My arguments speak for themselves.

Clak, the day I put our president on a pedestal above anyone else, is the day we have a return to the monarchy. Its ok to be angry. Let it out. Here, I'll help. Obama is a ........wait for it....DIPSHIT!!!!
Is he as much, less, or more of a dipshit than you?
 
I disagree with Obama on many issues. I don't hate him. I dislike the Stimulus and Tarp. Bailing out the auto companies. Over use of executive privilege. Green energy waste. Union bias. Non transparency in his administration. Not cutting the deficit in half by the end of his first term like he pledged. Blasting bush for many policies that he continued. etc.

Idiots who hate him for being black or Kenyan born are as much fools as the Obama phone lady and all the corrupt Acorn workers. I think he is a smart, decent man. Can you admit that a lot of the left is being irrational with the hate towards Romney?
 
[quote name='dafoomie']I don't think you understand the nature of the debt China holds. They buy T-Bills, T-Bonds, etc just like you or I could. The worst that could happen is that they could put them all on the market and we'd have to raise rates above the nothing they're at now. It would hurt the debt market - a little, and it might decrease the value of the dollar - a little.

You ignore the reason why China buys treasuries, the same reason Romney is criticizing them. They want to prop up the value of the dollar and keep the value of their currency low in order to benefit their export market. They would hurt themselves more than they hurt us if they took that action.

The dollar is already down and China is already decreasing its holdings of treasuries. They're almost at the point where they'll only be the 2nd biggest foreign holder of our debt behind Japan.[/QUOTE]

Is there a Miz gif saying "Really?" readily available?
When they hold our debt instruments, what do they hold?
With their internal currency manipulation, how does that effect our payable that they hold? Do recall the general notion of buy low sell high here and match that to their fluctuation.
What is the purpose of threatening China with trade conflict? Going so far as Romney suggests perhaps even an actual ground war?


It's funny, it seems like sometimes you *almost* get it, but then you retract.
 
Alright fucknut, if he's just any old guy, you walk up to him and and say that like you would to my own face. Oh, you wouldn't? Yeah that's what I thought. You're so full of shit that somewhere in China a farmer just raised his head and thought "Wtf is that smell....".
 
[quote name='dohdough'] if I got jumped by black/white/Martian kids[/QUOTE]

The worst is them black martian kids. They fight dirty.
 
bread's done
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