Bruno Sammartino's wrestling topic

oh ya... forgot I was gonna say that the fake "Edges" last night were actually the Majors Brothers. Apparently they've alligned themselves with Edge and Vickie now. An interesting faction, obviously Vickie sticks out sorely like in a "Sesame Street one of these things doesn't belong" sort of way. Alas, better her than some idiot like Kristal.
 
[quote name='Blackout542']Can someone explain to me why HHH has beef with Jericho[/QUOTE]

If you ask me, it's just because Jericho is almost the complete opposite of HHH.

He's witty, humble, he doesn't play politics, he doesn't mind putting people over, he doesn't have a hard-on for title runs and isn't your average bulky/muscles wrestler.
 
[quote name='Sporadic']If you ask me, it's just because Jericho is almost the complete opposite of HHH.

He's witty, humble, he doesn't play politics, he doesn't mind putting people over, he doesn't have a hard-on for title runs and isn't your average bulky/muscles wrestler.[/quote]

Was there some sort of backstage fight or something along those lines?
 
I've said this before, and I'll say it again. I really think Triple H's disdain for Jericho stems from him perceiving Jericho as a threat to his spot.

When Jericho was a top heel, he beat Austin & Rock in one night (something even the H's hasn't done) and he was definitely accepted by the fans as a legit top heel.

Think about that for a moment... how many guys has WWE had besides HHH that have been a successful top heel in the past 5 years? You can probably count them on one hand.

Austin's heel run went completely awry, and Rock's hollywood heel run was marred by the fact that he wasn't around to develop his character in the way he did as "Corporation" Rock. Taker's heel run lasted only a couple months, and he was nowhere near the level of heel he was as Ministry Taker fighting Austin.

So, what does that leave you with? Edge? Whose heel heat seems to be mostly generated because people like Matt Hardy, not because they dislike Edge's character so much.

Orton has been an utter failure as a main eventer. The guy has what, 4 straight wins over HBK now, and yet I still can't take him seriously as doing anything but keeping the belt warm for HHH.

JBL? I'll give you that one, as JBL was a solid heel on SD, and had a good run with the belt that very few people actually saw. Plus, as Heyman said JBL was only holding that title because HHH wanted to take Tuesdays off.

Big Show was laughable at best as a top heel, since he lost all the time. Which, of course, was unbelievable as the man is 7ft and over 400lbs.

What's that leave you with then? Three guys? JBL (if you count him) and then Brock and Kurt. Brock and Kurt, who "coincidentally" were both moved over to SD and kept off HHH's show for the most part.

Call it what you want, but I really think a lot of the reason Jericho hasn't been pushed properly is because HHH knows damn well he's expendable with Jericho at the top of the card.

Think back to how crazy the people popped when Jericho "won" the title in the opening match of Raw 6 years ago. That was insane!

Let's look at some other potential factors too: Jericho is a WCW guy, HHH has always looked to bury WCW guys. With the exception of Big Show, who I believe got depushed mostly for being too lazy, guys like DDP, Booker T, and even Goldberg really didn't get a fair run in the WWE. Yes Booker, Goldie, Benoit and Eddie all got shorter title runs, and I give WWE credit for doing that. Still... I'm sure had the brand split never taken place those title reigns would have been much less likely to take place. Save for Goldberg's who was too big of a name not to chance putting the strap on.

Plus Jericho is a bit of a tweener. Vince and HHH love their men big and bulky. If you're not at least 6'4 (with lifts) you need not apply for the role of extended WWE champion.

Meanwhile WWE never hesitated to push their own talent even when it didn't make sense. How else can you explain Cena, Orton and Batista's repeated title reigns? All very long, all very flawed, all very bitter for the fans, when wrestlers like Jericho are on the roster.
 
Cena and Batista's reigns (especially Cena's) DREW A LOT OF MONEY, while Orton... well, they keep trying with him, and someday, they'll get it right. Hopefully a day when he isn't made to look like a chump as a champion whenever possible.

I think WWE and HHH are beyond burying people NOW because they were WCW guys - Hell, HHH himself was a "WCW guy" at one point. He just seems to always want to punch holes in Jericho's boat, and I think, like with the Rock, it's just a matter of jealousy.
 
[quote name='Demolition Man']Oh great.... can we just move on from this and get some wrestling on?[/QUOTE]

Seriously, what a giant waste of time. Are they trying to kill the crowd?
 
[quote name='Purple Flames']Is Vince gonna get blown up again at the end of the show or something?[/QUOTE]

I'm guessing most of the roster never made it through the road, so they need to fill in time.

fuck, now we get a HHH squash match. Screw raw, imma go play some Wii.
 
Oh yeah, there are major weather issues, and there was a fear yesterday that a lot of the crew couldn't make Raw. Still, long, long, LONG segment to build to... Regal and the Coach against HHH.
 
[quote name='JaytheGamefan']Cena and Batista's reigns (especially Cena's) DREW A LOT OF MONEY, [/quote]

They drew nowhere near Austin and Rock's avg gate, ratings, etc :roll:

And before your undoubtedly witty retort to how great Cena, Batista and present WWE creative is, consider this:

The actual profit to the number of gates.

Austin and Rock worked the same shows, all generally sold out, to huge ratings and big sponsorship deals. Batista and Cena may work to close to the same number of people, but the arenas are often half empty, the ticket prices have risen and the number of shows have been doubled.

To call Cena and especially Batista's title reigns successful is just plain silly. If Batista's reign was so damn great why was he moved over to SD?
 
[quote name='-Never4ever-']I'm guessing most of the roster never made it through the road, so they need to fill in time.

fuck, now we get a HHH squash match. Screw raw, imma go play some Wii.[/quote]

That is true... and explains the strange women's match to open the show. Still, as much as I'd like to see Flair beat Umaga and Y2J and JBL's segment, I think I'll do some paperwork and wrap Christmas presents or something until the main event.

I hate being sick, my tolerance for everything is dwindled drastically... especially the 10 inches of snow outside.
 
I'm sure they have two wrestlers backstage who could...I dunno...HAVE A MATCH?

I know it's thinking outside the box and all that, but...
 
Cena and Batista didn't draw as much as two ALL-TIME HIGH RECORD BREAKERS, no, but compared to most, their reigns (especially Cena's) did quite well. Merchandise sales went through the roof thanks to Cena, his house shows this year were routinely sold out (especially for the first half of the year), and while Batista hasn't had quite that much good fortune during his reign, business for SD has been stable, going up at times gradually.

I'm not sure why they moved Batista over to SD two years ago, but it might've been due to them thinking they'd done all they could with him on Raw, and wanted to give him fresh blood to face. WWE's had quite a few big ratings draws this year, including Rey (huge with the kid and Latino fanbase), Lashley (whose segments on Raw drew more than 500,000 viewers on a regular basis), and especially Cena, who drew 500,000 new viewers to his Raw segments regularly and far more often than Lashley).

After a few years of largely slipshod booking and stagnant business, I'm glad to see WWE turn things around in '07, as they brought back an emphasis on in-ring action, and allowed Raw to actually flourish as a wrestling show for a while, gave tag title main event status very briefly, and the booking for all of the brands improved quite a bit compared to how bad it was in just '06 alone.
 
Regal came out looking like gold in that segment and a Regal/HHH fued would be awesome. It was refreshing to see someone go... nose to nose with Triple H. I was rooting for Regal all the way and he looked awesome in the ring. Much better than the methodical way he used to go about it prior.
 
I was really hoping Coach would've punched HHH in the balls for the DQ.

- edit I also want to see Vince in full emo gear with mascara and everything, moping around listening to Hawthorne Heights.
 
I loved the 3 Stooges ending to that match. YAY, FLAIR PROMO!

Hot damn that promo ruled. One good thing about this show so far is that they're definitely not cutting things too short, although as a result, things have dragged. That promo wad definitely the highlight of this show.
 
[quote name='JaytheGamefan']One good thing about this show so far is that they're definitely not cutting things too short[/QUOTE]

It's 10PM, and there have been two wrestling matches that were both about 3 minutes long. I ff'd through the VKM/HHH blather, so I don't know if that crap really counted as a match.
 
They were short matches, but the tag title match didn't need to go any longer than it did, and neither did the divas match. Flair-Umaga has been really good so far, although there was a scary botched belly to belly where Flair's foot got caught up in the ropes as he was thrown down.
 
I don't believe former tag champs should be beaten in three minutes unless they were the former champs 30 years ago, and coming down the ramp on walkers.

I don't believe any match should go three minutes unless it's a squash or, yes, a divas "titty" match (not to be confused with Beth Phoenix, who can wrestle).
 
I'm guessing they're just filling time due to not having the full roster there? That beginning segment with Vince was brutally bad. The Flair promo was good though.

Hopefully we don't have another Vince is losin' it storyline that results in another bastard midget son...
 
[quote name='xcoax']I'm guessing they're just filling time due to not having the full roster there? That beginning segment with Vince was brutally bad. The Flair promo was good though.

Hopefully we don't have another Vince is losin' it storyline that results in another bastard midget son...[/QUOTE]

Well as long as no one on the roster snaps and kills himself, I doubt the latter will occur.
 
[quote name='-Never4ever-']Great promos from Y2J/JBL & Santino.

This is easily shaping up to be the worst Raw of the year.[/QUOTE]

That is really funny that we can go from what many thought to be the best RAW of the year to the worst RAW of the year in one week. I guess they blew their entire collective load last week.

I agree about the JBL Y2J promo. It went from me thinking it would be a yawn to something I'll pay attention to.
 
I don't understand the whole hoopla about JBL. He was a midcarder forever and then he becomes a rich redneck and Smackdown was kinda desperate for a champ and he just happened to be in the right place. I remember hating the time period of him being champ, and it ended up lasting almost a whole year! Jericho deserves better than to face JBL at Wrestlemania.

[quote name='-Never4ever-']Great promos from Y2J/JBL & Santino.

This is easily shaping up to be the worst Raw of the year.[/quote]

Nah the main event was good I've seen way worse this year.
 
Was I one of the only people who enjoyed this Raw almost completely from top to bottom? I felt they did a good job of setting up new storylines and continuing some old ones coming out of the PPV last night to start a build up to the Royal Rumble and following that the Road to Wrestlemania.
 
Aside from the HHH-Vince segment dragging on and on, and just leading to Regal and the Coach facing HHH, I found Raw to be quite enjoyable tonight. I liked the Three Stooges-style ending to the handicap match, Flair's first promo, the return of Psycho Vince, the JBL-Y2J exchange, Victoria and Layla dancing to Jillian's singing, the Santino-Carlito exchange after their tag match (complete with Ricky Martin-style dance from Santino and Maria alongside Carlito's theme), the Umaga-Flair match with a pretty creative ending that keeps Flair's career going and doesn't hurt Umaga, and the main event tag match was pretty decent, too.

The first Flair promo was non-stop awesome, full of emotion, and he had the fans eating out of the palms of his hands throughout both the promo and his match. It was definitely a great night for the Nature Boy, except for that scary spot in the Umaga match where Flair's foot got caught in the ropes during a belly-to-belly suplex.

It was a great night for JBL and Y2J too, as JBL cut his usual great, scathing, venomous promo, and Jericho actually held his own and acted seriously for once, which was refreshing. Overall, an enjoyable show.

I think I linked to the Impact script yesterday, but it's a must-read if folks missed it. Russo's name is ALL OVER IT, and so is D'Lo's... well, to a lesser extent.
 
I fell asleep after Flair's promo.

That Vince McMahon segment / Triple H match was absolutely brutal.

Triple H referring to Regal as Liberace only highlighted his unfunnyness.
 
I havent been watching, just reading results online. Is Jeff going to get a World Title push? Seemed kinda wierd that he'd be the one to tell vince off, and the one to oppose Orton in the tag match. I guess its not hard to see as they gave Edge an undeserved push, at least Jeff can do more than a spear and a move stolen from Gangrel. So Matt's going to have to watch his brother get pushed high above him, after watching the guy who stole his girl do the same.

You know, i'd love to see Jeff Hardy vs. Shawn Michaels in a ladder match. Wrestlemania maybe?
 
The Jeff Hardy/HHH match from Sunday at the PPV had a stip where the winner got a title shot at Royal Rumble. Hardy won, and Hardy/Orton's already been announced for the PPV.
 
In case anyone here is interest.. MCW is competiting with TNA this Thursday for the 10PM-EST time slot. If anyone gets FOX45 (Maryland, possibly DC VA maybe PA areas), do check it out.
 
[quote name='PhrostByte']In case anyone here is interest.. MCW is competiting with TNA this Thursday for the 10PM-EST time slot. If anyone gets FOX45 (Maryland, possibly DC VA maybe PA areas), do check it out.[/QUOTE]

What's the deal, is it part of the news or is MCW getting a local time slot?
 
[quote name='PhrostByte']In case anyone here is interest.. MCW is competiting with TNA this Thursday for the 10PM-EST time slot. If anyone gets FOX45 (Maryland, possibly DC VA maybe PA areas), do check it out.[/quote]

Just in time for me to head back to MD for the holidays. I'll be sure to check it out.
 
Well, I guess I was right. Tazz is most likely taking over JBL position as SD commentator, since JBL is start wrestling again on Raw.

As for Raw, holy crap that was a boring show. Even the main event(which they overhyped) was mediocre at best. The JBL/Y2J promo was the best thing last night.
 
[quote name='JJSP']

Don't know how long that'll last or if it'll work, but it's a fun read.
Alex Shelley/Chris Sabin against Team 3-D in Ultimate X at Final Resolution.
;)[/QUOTE]

:rofl:

That ultimate X match has train wreck written all over it.
 
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