HD DVD thread - Toshiba: HD DVD DISCONTINUED, REPAIR/SUPPORT CONTINUES, NO BLU PLANS

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[quote name='guyver2077']25? thats insane lol

I am still thinking about which movies to keep/sell[/QUOTE]

If people want to bail on a format, there's no reason for me not to profit.
 
[quote name='magiic']wweeee time to buy cheap HD-DVD's[/QUOTE]

I'd agree, but I think I have everything that I want at this point! I'll definitely grab that A35 though, probably this week since we'll start seeing "abandon ship" prices.

I'll probably give Batman Begins and one or two other Warner titles to my brother since he's buying my 360/AO from me since I have an elite on the way, but I don't see myself getting rid of many more discs besides that.
 
Better to end it now than drag it on pointlessly.


And I can't stand all the fanboys saying they'll stick with online rentals and normal DVDs. Is it really that serious?
 
[quote name='anomynous']Better to end it now than drag it on pointlessly.


And I can't stand all the fanboys saying they'll stick with online rentals and normal DVDs. Is it really that serious?[/QUOTE]

Depends on if you can afford a BD player. I can't, so it's blow-out pricing, rentals, or DVDs for me.
 
[quote name='anomynous']Better to end it now than drag it on pointlessly.


And I can't stand all the fanboys saying they'll stick with online rentals and normal DVDs. Is it really that serious?[/QUOTE]

There is no logical reason to spend >$150 on a movie player. Especially one that won't even support profile 2.0, unless you have a lot of disposable income.

Digital Downloads are the future, whether you like it or not. They aren't perfect yet. But I am perfectly happy renting movies if I need them in HD. I really doubt you will see Bluray gain that much market penetration. Digital Distributed movies are going to be higher bitrate and offer a better product before BluRay has the time to really get it's feet off the ground.

Oh and it doesn't help that after observing Sony the past 2 years, I would almost rather give my money to a Nazi memorial fund.
 
[quote name='anomynous']And I can't stand all the fanboys saying they'll stick with online rentals and normal DVDs. Is it really that serious?[/QUOTE]

What the fuck?

I don't want a BD player right now. I'll probably I'll get one eventually, but I've outlined the reasons why I don't want one right this second multiple times. Not sure why that means I'm being "serious" about this.
 
[quote name='SteveMcQ']

I wonder if we'll still get the free HD-DVDs that we sent in for? Still waiting for mine....[/quote]
That's irking me too. Sent mine in recently as well...
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']
Oh and it doesn't help that after observing Sony the past 2 years, I would almost rather give my money to a Nazi memorial fund.[/quote]If you want to be a fanboy, at least be subtle about it. PS3 isn't the one with $50 for a P2P online service that was down for 2 months straight a few weeks back, a 33% fail rate, etc. I understand that this is an Xbox 360 forum, but please stop personifying companies, and calling the kettle black.
 
[quote name='staplerwow']If you want to be a fanboy, at least be subtle about it. PS3 isn't the one with $50 for a P2P online service that was down for 2 months straight a few weeks back, a 33% fail rate, etc. I understand that this is an Xbox 360 forum, but please stop personifying companies, and calling the kettle black.[/QUOTE]

I'm not really disagreeing with him when it comes to disc media. To draw from what you said - this is an HD DVD thread, not a game console thread. Live being down and the console's failure rate don't have anything to do with HD DVD. I requested a separate subform but didn't get one, so the thread is here instead.

Now, I'm not going to speak for thrustbucket, but a lot of Sony's approach for Blu-Ray was the reason I preferred HD DVD in the first place, especially in regards to region coding.

That may not mean dick to you or other Blu-Ray supporters, that's fine. But since it's my money it's going to have to do in this case.
 
[quote name='staplerwow']If you want to be a fanboy, at least be subtle about it. PS3 isn't the one with $50 for a P2P online service that was down for 2 months straight a few weeks back, a 33% fail rate, etc. I understand that this is an Xbox 360 forum, but please stop personifying companies, and calling the kettle black.[/QUOTE]

I'm not really disagreeing with him when it comes to disc media. To draw from what you said - this is an HD DVD thread, not a game console thread. Live being down and the console's failure rate don't have anything to do with HD DVD. I requested a separate subform but didn't get one, so the thread is here instead.

Now, I'm not going to speak for thrustbucket, but a lot of Sony's approach for Blu-Ray was the reason I preferred HD DVD in the first place, especially in regards to region coding.

That may not mean dick to you or other Blu-Ray supporters, that's fine. But since it's my money it's going to have to do in this case.
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']I'm not really disagreeing with him when it comes to disc media. To draw from what you said - this is an HD DVD thread, not a game console thread. Live being down and the console's failure rate don't have anything to do with HD DVD. I requested a separate subform but didn't get one, so the thread is here instead.

Now, I'm not going to speak for thrustbucket, but a lot of Sony's approach for Blu-Ray was the reason I preferred HD DVD in the first place, especially in regards to region coding.

That may not mean dick to you or other Blu-Ray supporters, that's fine. But since it's my money it's going to have to do in this case.[/quote]Well, part of why I wanted HD-DVD to lose is the reason I bought an HD-DVD player in the first place last month: firesales. I'm not a fan for any side. I'm a fan of *cheap* high-def media. HD-DVD was destined to lose, but that's its appeal to me. In a few weeks, I'll be able to buy HD-DVD's catalog for incredibly cheap. I bought a PS3 so that in a few years I'll be able to buy its catalog for incredibly cheap. I'm a true cheap-ass fan of HDM, not of any particular format. :D
 
[quote name='dallow']That guy is a douche.
I also would like to email him.

There are burners in the USA, there's a whole thread about burning BD's at AVS, and you wouldn't be able to copy them on to HD DVD-R's because the bitrates exceed the limit of HD DVD.[/QUOTE]

Ah lemme clarify what I meant......HDDVD could come out with cheap storage and take over the next optical STORAGE format, BD is still stupidly expensive (what, $15-25 bucks per disc?).

However, as to bitrates, just like dvd's..the bitrates aren't usually needed to be anywhere near that high as they master them at. Which is why you can take an MPEG or AVC or VC1 HDDVD or BD and rip it down to an 8 or 10 gig file (from 20 to 40 gigs), and wind up with (for all intents and purposes) an identical playing copy.
(Visually)

My .02 cents anyhow
 
toshiba has to honor the MIR or they will get sued for fraud, so i think we're good there

however, they could run out of supply of certain movies and just replace them with whatever

i'm sure certain movies are more popular than others and they got like thousands of copies of darkman lying around that no one requested
 
[quote name='staplerwow']If you want to be a fanboy, at least be subtle about it. PS3 isn't the one with $50 for a P2P online service that was down for 2 months straight a few weeks back, a 33% fail rate, etc. I understand that this is an Xbox 360 forum, but please stop personifying companies, and calling the kettle black.[/QUOTE]

I have a launch 360 that's never broken and I haven't had an issue with live the past two months when I've tried to use it.

Regardless, Sony's tactics with Blu ray is what is in question here, it has nothing to do with game consoles.... Well except for the fact that they bet their entire future on trojan horsing blu ray with the PS3. But that's just one of many strong arm anti-consumer tactics Sony has shown in the past 2 years with the high def wars.
 
Is it more than likely that they're just going to pull all new releases that they haven't pressed any copies of yet? I've noticed that Amazon is starting to get pretty fucking aggressive with their pricing, and movies like American Gangster are going for well under their MSRP....before they release.

I'm probably going to be eschewing many more game purchases in the coming months, and instead redirecting that money towards cheap, cheap, cheap HD DVDs. When they get below $10 each, I'll even start double-dipping on non-essential titles.
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']Is it more than likely that they're just going to pull all new releases that they haven't pressed any copies of yet?[/QUOTE]

Well...we'll get this week's stuff I'm sure and probably next week's stuff (Beowulf) but beyond that, Magic 8 Ball tells me to piss off and try later. Not sure how ahead of time they press stuff.

With this news, though, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if Warner shitcans their plans to continue through May regardless of what Toshiba/Uni/Paramount does.
 
Just got 3 of my 5 free HD DVDs from the promo last summer.... plus a second copy of Apollo 13. What's even better is both copies of Apollo 13 were shaken loose in their cases (no scratches on the one I opened, though) and both have the classic cut-out bin scratch through the UPC. Classy.

Un-freakin'-believable how incompetently run this and the Blu Ray promos have been run.

So I guess my question is, does anybody have an 800 number where I can get a hold of these turkeys to sort it out?
 
[quote name='CocheseUGA']If people want to bail on a format, there's no reason for me not to profit.[/quote]

FYE (or any other transworld store) pays $36 cash or $43.50 credit for the Ultimate Matrix on HD-DVD as long as you trade it in with any bag. Save yourself the shipping supplies and sell it there.

At this rate it seems toshiba will sell the name to Universal and it'll be called UVD. I'm sad to see the announcement. But, at least it means ill hopefully be able to pick up all the stuff i wanted at some highly discounted prices.
 
What a shame, considering I made a pilgrimage to the holy land yesterday.

universalzn1.jpg
 
I don't care for HD-DVD or BluRay, but I do hate how:

a) This is seen as a loss for the 360.
b) The HD DVD owners got the sham. I honestly believe that something should be done (a firmware update to some players, or a replacement program of some sort) to reimburse those of you got ripped off.
 
[quote name='help1']I don't care for HD-DVD or BluRay, but I do hate how:

a) This is seen as a loss for the 360.
b) The HD DVD owners got the sham. I honestly believe that something should be done (a firmware update to some players, or a replacement program of some sort) to reimburse those of you got ripped off.[/QUOTE]

I don't feel ripped off.

My movies still work and I imagine I'll be able to buy a player (on eBay) for the rest of my life.
 
I didn't get ripped off...I got the worlds best upconverting DVD player, I've had the ability to watch HD Movies for a couple years, and I've still got the ability to do so as long as HDDVD's are around.
 
I feel my investment in HD-DVD has been extremely worthwhile.

I've got a solid collection of HD movies at my fingertips and I also have a very solid up-converting DVD player (something I was on the market for anyway).

Sure, Blu-Ray may be the future of HD movies on disc, but I don't feel robbed or cheated with HD-DVD and I never will.

I'm more upset/concerned with the potential of Sony jacking up prices on Blu-Ray movies (I'm not saying they will) or retailers not offering great deals with only one format (I'm not saying they won't either) than HD-DVD's inevitable death.
 
[quote name='help1']I don't care for HD-DVD or BluRay, but I do hate how:

a) This is seen as a loss for the 360[/QUOTE]

Well, in a way it is...this is just a much a "battle for the living room" as it is a battle for the game console industry. That's why I'm not sure where people are coming from when they think Microsoft is going to jump out of the game console business - they would never, ever just walk away and let Sony take over the living room without a fight.

That said, it's not a very big loss, because by the time it will really matter, the successor to the 360 will be either out or close to coming out, and it will have either a Blu-Ray drive (if Blu-Ray succeeds) or something else to keep it competitive (if it does not).

I do agree with "something should be done" but not that they should give people money back or replace our players or anything. I'm mostly concerned with...
a firmware update to some players
Click to expand...
...because continuing to put out firmware updates for the next several months will likely do wonders to not totally ruin the Toshiba name among the enthusiast consumer.


But I'll echo the previous few posts. Not sure where all this idiotic "durr, hope you didn't buy a HD DVD player" talk is coming from, I even saw it in an EGM today, not that that magazine is necessarily what I look to for high journalism in gaming. Sure, I wouldn't buy one NOW, but if you've had one for a while, what's the problem? Frankly, between gaming magazines like that, and then write-about-anything-but-mostly-gaming blogs like Kotaku and Joystiq spewing whatever second or third-hand information they have about the formats, I'm almost glad to see it coming to a close so I don't have to shake my head in exaspiration at their idiocy on the topic anymore.

But yeah - I haven't regretted buying the player for a moment. This format is pretty fucking awesome.
 
[quote name='help1']
b) The HD DVD owners got the sham. I honestly believe that something should be done (a firmware update to some players, or a replacement program of some sort) to reimburse those of you got ripped off.[/QUOTE]


Nobody got ripped off. It's a risk people take when they decide to early adopt. Especially when there are two competing new formats like this---everyone new one (or both) would die off.

If they bought in before now they were willing to take the risk of buying into the one that would lose the war and die off.
 
Honestly, this is nothing but good news for the VG industry. Sony (specifically, the PS3) needed this.

Now comes the question, how long can BRD last till it falls to DVD?
 
Yeah, I'm satisfied with what I have for HD-DVD, too. Honestly, I didn't invest too much ($170 on the 360 add-on and my 21 discs). And I can still pick up a few more in the future that I was eyeing too.

Let the fire sales begin!
 
Ah well, I guess we can finally stick a fork in this particular "format war".

But yeah, I'm satisfied with what I have for HD-DVD, too. Honestly, I didn't invest too much ($170 on the 360 add-on and my 21 discs). And I can still pick up a few more in the future that I was eyeing too.

Let the fire sales begin!
 
[quote name='HeadRusch']I didn't get ripped off...I got the worlds best upconverting DVD player, I've had the ability to watch HD Movies for a couple years, and I've still got the ability to do so as long as HDDVD's are around.[/QUOTE]Unless you have the XA2, all the players are poor upscalers. Not even mid-level.
 
[quote name='dallow']Unless you have the XA2, all the players are poor upscalers. Not even mid-level.[/QUOTE]

Wrong-O. The A35 has gotten strong praise as well.

The A3 and A30 are solid if unspectacular...not as good as the Onkyo but saying "not even mid-level" is a bit harsh.
 
[quote name='dallow']Unless you have the XA2, all the players are poor upscalers. Not even mid-level.[/QUOTE]

Hardly. The Anchor Bay chip is not going to match the Reon or other high-end chips, but it's definitely capable. The XA2 is arguably the greatest DVD upscaling player available, so obviously anything less will seem a bit lackluster.

So yeah, the XA2 (or Onkyo DV-HD805) would be ideal, but not like 4-500 dollars better (which is about what you'd pay to track one down new at this point). I am tossing around the idea of picking up an XA2 refurb since one can be had for around 300 bucks, but I'm a little uneasy about buying a used player. I know the XA2 has had some issues with the 1080p24 output, but I don't really care about that.
 
[quote name='dallow']Unless you have the XA2, all the players are poor upscalers. Not even mid-level.[/QUOTE]

Please don't crap on our upscaling ability.... it's all we have now!
 
[quote name='bill123']question for you guys Im planning on finally bitting on a copy of terminator 2 I looked on exploited and they have 2 versions which of those 2 would be the best bang for my buck. I'm thinking of the UK version http://xploitedcinema.com/catalog/terminator-judgment-release-p-13428.html[/QUOTE]
I believe you want the French version since it's two discs and the version you linked to is essentially one disc from that set. Wait for Sporadic to reply for confirmation though.

also do you think we'll ever see that ultimate edition that someone posted vids to on here?
Click to expand...
No idea. If it really was going to come out in March, then I'd say the chances are better than 50/50 that we will.


[quote name='Scobie']Please don't crap on our upscaling ability.... it's all we have now![/QUOTE]

It is?
 
[quote name='Scobie']I'm just funnin' with Dallow. Don't be a hard butt.[/QUOTE]

I apologize, and withdraw my absolutely ruthless and furious reply.

Here's the story that anomynous was referring to:

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/02/18/rumor-xbox-360-blu-ray-player-could-be-out-by-may/

I really doubt we'll see one that fast, but if they did bring out a similarly priced ($150ish) Blu-Ray add on, I'd probably buy. Price was the only reason I bought the HD DVD add-on originally. A low cost like that would at least somewhat offset my disappointment over buying a player that wouldn't necessarily be "fully capable" when the next hardware revision shows up, and let me start to build a library of titles on that side while waiting for a better standalone player to become reasonably priced.
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']Hardly. The Anchor Bay chip is not going to match the Reon or other high-end chips, but it's definitely capable. The XA2 is arguably the greatest DVD upscaling player available, so obviously anything less will seem a bit lackluster.

So yeah, the XA2 (or Onkyo DV-HD805) would be ideal, but not like 4-500 dollars better (which is about what you'd pay to track one down new at this point). I am tossing around the idea of picking up an XA2 refurb since one can be had for around 300 bucks, but I'm a little uneasy about buying a used player. I know the XA2 has had some issues with the 1080p24 output, but I don't really care about that.[/quote]I'd definitely try to find an XA2 if you are looking for a standalone to keep.

But no, I disagree about the upscaling capabilities of the other players.
Especially on the 3rd gen models in which the deinterlacing is broken.

It does it's job though.
I just wouldn't call it the 'greatest upscaler in the world' like the other poster did.




However, I think upscaling is rubbish anyway.
Pure HD all the way.

Digital downloads. thrustbucket, are you serious?
Bit-starved features with wimpy DD5.1.
I don't want HD Lite with macroblocking and colorbanding, this is what HD media (be it BD or HD DVD) was made to get away from.


Scobie:
I laughed. :)
 
[quote name='dallow']
Digital downloads. thrustbucket, are you serious?
Bit-starved features with wimpy DD5.1.
I don't want HD Lite with macroblocking and colorbanding, this is what HD media (be it BD or HD DVD) was made to get away from.
[/QUOTE]

Google stuff like XtremeHD CES which was announced at CES. That's just one of many products in the pipe that use queuing technology to allow a centralized server in your home to store hundreds of movies for purchase or rent that exceed the bitrate of even blu ray.

You're being very shortsighted if you believe digital delivery has to always be:
1- Instant streaming over the internet
2- Low bitrate/low quality

Those issues will be conquered in a matter of months, not years. And contrary to what a lot of people believe, the bottleneck is not necessarily broadband speeds. The tech is already here, it's just a matter of a company getting studio licenses at this point.
 
[quote name='dallow']I just wouldn't call it the 'greatest upscaler in the world' like the other poster did.[/QUTOE]

No, it's definitely not, but it's good enough for most people.

In regards to the XA2 vs. the A35, it depends on what you're really after - the XA2 has the better upscaler and better build quality while having 1080p24 issues (although did they fix that with 2.8 firmware? I haven't been reading up on it), while the A35 seems to load a bit quicker and actually provides a slightly sharper image on HD material, while having deinterlacing issues. Both of those issues may not even come into play depending on the user's setup.

It's kind of hard for me to decide, I was dead-set on getting an A35 but now I'm kind of leaning towards the XA2 refurb...if I can get over my qualms about buying a refurb.

However, I think upscaling is rubbish anyway.
Pure HD all the way.
Click to expand...
I agree, but it's not like we have a choice with most films at this point.
 
If you want something that'll benefit you more in the future, the XA2 is it.
I do believe the newest firmware fixes alot of the bugs.
Are you sure about it having a sharper picture on HD material?

Though you're about the A35 being faster.



Why did you buy into HD DVD then, Thrust, if you're banking on downloads?
 
[quote name='dallow']Are you sure about it having a sharper picture on HD material?[/QUOTE]

That seems to be the consensus at AVS, but I haven't actually seen an A35 to compare yet. Even if it's there it's probably nothing major, but if people didn't nitpick this stuff it wouldn't be any fun.

I'm reading about the 2.8 firmware for the XA2 now (instead of doing my work)...seems like people are rolling back to 2.7 if they have 1080p24 capable displays, otherwise 2.8 works fine...so I guess in that regard the previous firmware was actually better for 1080p24.
 
[quote name='dallow']Are you sure about it having a sharper picture on HD material?[/QUOTE]

That seems to be the consensus at AVS, but I haven't actually seen an A35 to compare yet. Even if it's there it's probably nothing major, but if people didn't nitpick this stuff it wouldn't be any fun.

I'm reading about the 2.8 firmware for the XA2 now (instead of doing my work)...seems like people are rolling back to 2.7 if they have 1080p24 capable displays, otherwise 2.8 works fine...so I guess in that regard the previous firmware was actually better for 1080p24.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']
Those issues will be conquered in a matter of months, not years. And contrary to what a lot of people believe, the bottleneck is not necessarily broadband speeds. The tech is already here, it's just a matter of a company getting studio licenses at this point.[/QUOTE]

Another problem is caps on download limits by ISPs. Many companies are talking about it with the advent of large movie downloads on iTunes, bittorrent users hogging bandwith etc. Some like Comcast already throttle connections of heavy users, though they don't have specific set limits yet.

So that could be an issue. They'll likely go to some tiered pricing system where you can pay more for more GBs of download a month. But then cost is a factor as you would have to pay more for your broadband access (which is already too expensive IMO) on top of whatever fee for the download service--be it a per movie fee or a set of monthly options ala download.

That said, I am getting more interested in the potential of a download service. I buy a lot less movies these days as I realize that I seldom watch any of the nearly 300 DVDs on my shelf as I tend to either watch something new I've bought or just watch whatever I've got from Netflix. Probably should go through and sell off a bunch of DVDs.

So to some degree a download system would basically be a more convenient substitute for Netflix. But IMO it will be a long time before the selection gets to Netflix's level (if it ever does) and for prices to get to an acceptable level for me. A/V quality doesn't worry me, I think the HD on demand stuff on Comcast already looks great, and I'm just not very picky about A/V quality. Definitely more picky than the average joe, but not a audio/videophile by any means.

The other barrier to downloads for me is I like to have a physical disc for stuff that I really want to own. But that doesn't mean that I couldn't use a download service in the manner that I use Netflix now. i.e. as a rental service and still by an HDM disc of the few movies I decide are worth owning.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Another problem is caps on download limits by ISPs. [/QUOTE]
I don't think this will be a very big issue. One word: Satellite services. Like XtremeHD. They are always broadcasting massive amounts of information and a cheap server could catch and store a lot of stuff for when you wan to use it.

When services like that start coming out and becoming popular, ISP's won't be capping anything if they want to compete.
The other barrier to downloads for me is I like to have a physical disc for stuff that I really want to own. But that doesn't mean that I couldn't use a download service in the manner that I use Netflix now. i.e. as a rental service and still by an HDM disc of the few movies I decide are worth owning.
Click to expand...
I think once this stuff starts taking off, so will managed copy. You will be able to put your movies on flash drives or discs somehow.

[quote name='dallow']
Why did you buy into HD DVD then, Thrust, if you're banking on downloads?[/QUOTE]

Easy. Because $150 for a great upconverting player and 7 free HD movies is a no-brainer to me. And I'd still argue, is a no-brainer as long as those players are out there to be bought.

I won't invest in blu-ray until I can get a profile 2.0 player for $150 or less. Hopefully Microsoft provides that. It would be awesome if they start undercutting Sony with an add-on for their own format. If you really think about it, Microsoft has the ability to make Blu-Ray's victory be far more painful for Sony than it already has been.
 
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