MMA (UFC, Strikeforce, Bellator, Invicta, etc.) Discussion Thread -- Version II

squishface said:
maybe it is just me, but I thought boxing has been going downhill the past few years. I hear less and less about it and see fewer fights talked about on tv with the exception of the names mayweather and pacquaio, oh and Wladmiar kilitschko.
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Boxing been very good lately. I actually enjoyed them more than the UFC fight lately. Back than I was a huge UFC watcher and prefer it over boxing. I even watched every UFC PPV fight, even watched all the undercards before the main event, now something changed with the UFC that I barely get excited to watch it. It's apparently not me either since their ratings have been declining.
 
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Here's the thing...you're either an MMA fan or you're not. Yes, the UFC has been losing its fad watchers. Its "American Idol Fans", if you will. But seriously...the company went through ridiculous dark days in the mid 2000s. They have been guilty of oversaturating the market...no question. But there was at least intent behind it.

I read an interesting article the other day talking about how the UFC is trying to reach a point like other sports where you don't have to watch every single event in order for them to survive. Dana and the Fertitas are trying to evolve the sport to where it's less like boxing and more like the NBA or NFL. We're seeing that with the Fox deal and the Reebok deal. They might even get to a point where they need PPV less and less (which would be smart considering PPV in general is in decline).

So, yeah, it is different. There are some things I like and some things I don't like. But I've been a fan of MMA since UFC 1 and Ken Shamrock. And the UFC is still the place to see the most skilled mixed martial artists compete. I'm not going to follow the dudebros and quit watching just because it's not as trendy as it used to be.

 
Also...

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2371160-anderson-silva-i-seek-the-truth-as-much-as-all-those-surprised

*sigh*, Anderson Silva, you make me so sad. I had a strong dislike for you during the Patrick Cote/Thales Leites/Demian Maia nonsense. And the way you lost to Chris Weidman the first time was moronic as well (in hindsight though...it's almost like he wanted somebody to beat him). But I couldn't dispute his ability and his pedigree. But this steroid thing is going to ruin him.

It seems that he really is taking the Barry Bonds route and claiming he doesn't know how he tested positive. And that the "things he was given" during his rehab are being analyzed "by specialists", lol. Again...what professional athlete doesn't know what they are pumping into their body? And even if we allow that, what remedial math doctor are you going to that is going to give you something that will make you fail a drug test on a night you know you're going to be tested well in advance?

I can understand being proud, but whatever "advisors" he says he has, they must be idiots. He could have mostly brushed this off as a one time thing...blame it on the pressure of recovering from a horrific injury at an advanced age...apologize...be humble...admit fear...get choked up...etc. So many other ways he could have played this to gain public favor and protect a decade's worth of work. Even if he had abused steroids his entire career, we would never know.

But being so pompous to question the results of THREE different tests just makes you look like a dirty liar and cheater. If he keeps it up, he could be written off as quickly and as harshly as Wanderlai was. What a freaking waste, man.

 
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n8rockerasu said:
Here's the thing...you're either an MMA fan or you're not. Yes, the UFC has been losing its fad watchers. Its "American Idol Fans", if you will. But seriously...the company went through ridiculous dark days in the mid 2000s. They have been guilty of oversaturating the market...no question. But there was at least intent behind it.

I read an interesting article the other day talking about how the UFC is trying to reach a point like other sports where you don't have to watch every single event in order for them to survive. Dana and the Fertitas are trying to evolve the sport to where it's less like boxing and more like the NBA or NFL. We're seeing that with the Fox deal and the Reebok deal. They might even get to a point where they need PPV less and less (which would be smart considering PPV in general is in decline).

So, yeah, it is different. There are some things I like and some things I don't like. But I've been a fan of MMA since UFC 1 and Ken Shamrock. And the UFC is still the place to see the most skilled mixed martial artists compete. I'm not going to follow the dudebros and quit watching just because it's not as trendy as it used to be.
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I hope you are not referring to me as a fad watcher because I watched the first UFC too and it was also in my hometown Colorado. What I was just trying to say is that I no longer have the desire to watch every UFC fight like I use too. Back than I watched every UFC fight, Strike Force, and WEC fight. It didn't matter who was fighting, I was watching it and enjoying it. Now I only have the desire to watch the championship match or top ranked guys and gals. I am not saying the UFC is dying or anything like that. I think that it has just reach its peak right now.

 
blueweltall said:
Well it looks like Mayweather is finally going to step up and fight Pacquiao. It is official. Also really sad about Silva.
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Yeah, about time. Wish it would have happened 5-6 years earlier but it is still the biggest fight that could be made right now. With all the good upcoming UFC cards I hope this year makes up for last year's disappointments. Fingers crossed everyone stays healthy and clean.

 
blueweltall said:
I hope you are not referring to me as a fad watcher because I watched the first UFC too and it was also in my hometown Colorado. What I was just trying to say is that I no longer have the desire to watch every UFC fight like I use too. Back than I watched every UFC fight, Strike Force, and WEC fight. It didn't matter who was fighting, I was watching it and enjoying it. Now I only have the desire to watch the championship match or top ranked guys and gals. I am not saying the UFC is dying or anything like that. I think that it has just reach its peak right now.
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No, I just mean in general. I guess what I would more direct at you is don't be influenced by their bandwagon nonsense. Everything seems to be so trend heavy these days. Music games, what movies are popular, what tv show is hip, which social media websites are cool, sports teams, political beliefs, etc.

Sometimes it just feels like one big flock of sheep moving from one fad to another. I never liked the UFC or MMA because it was "the cool thing", so it doesn't bother me if "most people" decide that it's not cool anymore. Like I said, that doesn't mean that the UFC hasn't made mistakes...but if we're talking about a decline in their ratings, I would attribute it more to these temporary fans having short attention spans.

 
n8rockerasu said:
No, I just mean in general. I guess what I would more direct at you is don't be influenced by their bandwagon nonsense. Everything seems to be so trend heavy these days. Music games, what movies are popular, what tv show is hip, which social media websites are cool, sports teams, political beliefs, etc.

Sometimes it just feels like one big flock of sheep moving from one fad to another. I never liked the UFC or MMA because it was "the cool thing", so it doesn't bother me if "most people" decide that it's not cool anymore. Like I said, that doesn't mean that the UFC hasn't made mistakes...but if we're talking about a decline in their ratings, I would attribute it more to these temporary fans having short attention spans.
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Now maybe we will see less people flocking to get all the tap out and affliction gear they can . Lol
I'm sure most of you all know what I'm talking about ?
 
Definitely do NOT miss all the Tap Out and Affliction clothing. UFC really took off for me after the first season of TUF. I really can't consider myself a hardcore fan of MMA but TUF season 1 started it all for me. I never watched Pride or Strikeforce but I can say I was a UFC / WEC fan. I'm not a big sports fan in general, I don't watch Baseball, Basketball, Soccer, Football or Hockey. MMA definitely captured my interest though.

I shouldn't even say MMA because UFC is the only organization I will watch. Not to say that there aren't any elite athletes in other organizations but whenever a champion from another organization comes into the UFC, they really end up looking mediocre. To be fair though, to this day, I still think Melendez took the fight vs Benson. Other than that: Nick diaz has not done anything, Eddie Alvarez was able to stand in there with Cerrone but never put him in any trouble, Luke Rockhold got KTFO by Belfort, DC was rag dolling guys in their 40s, Saffiedine was stopped by a technical fighter. Yeah, DC was holding his own vs some Heavyweights but when you stop and think about it... who did he really fight? Mir? Nelson? Then he drops down and fights Cummins and Henderson. Like I said, I'm definitely no MMA expert but I do still catch myself getting excited for UFC events. Any other organization? Not really.

 
blueweltall said:
Well it looks like Mayweather is finally going to step up and fight Pacquiao. It is official.
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Mayweather has two more fights left with Showtime(I think) and I can see him retiring after endcapping his career with Pacquiao. As much of a Pacquiao fan as I am, I just don't see him winning against Mayweather at this point. Mayweather is more hittable now, but Pacquiao is terrible at cutting off the ring and doesn't have the same punching volume as he used to by far.

I think a fight of this notoriety might motivate me to make a boxing megathread if there's enough interest.
 
Oh, heavyweight division... I never know what is going to happen. So, both Frank Mir and Andre Arlovski are relevant again by KO'ing Bigfoot. Mir claims he's a new man and has been training completely differently (he credited yoga and a legitimate boxing coach for his rejuvenated movement).

i was surprised he came in at 261, but didn't look as bloated as he did when he fought Lesnar. I still think he's got too many miles on him to do anything significant again...but in this division, who the hell knows, man. Arlovski vs Mir for the UFC Heavyweight Interim Throwback Belt. :lol:

 
bigpimpin24 said:
Browne is going to obliterate Arlovski before that happens lol
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lol no. Arlovski forever. <3

Seriously though, Browne has skills, but he just seems too arrogant sometimes and it makes him fight stupid. Wouldn't be surprised at all if Arlovski rocked his world.

 
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n8rockerasu said:
lol no. Arlovski forever. <3

Seriously though, Browne has skills, but he just seems too arrogant sometimes and it makes him fight stupid. Wouldn't be surprised at all if Arlovski rocked his world.
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Seems like he loses at the wrong times. First to TRT Silva and then on the cusp of a title shot after winning 3 straight, losing to Werdum. He apparently broke his hand on Werdum's face after dropping him.

 
Happy to see Mir get the win, but kind of hoping he was going to retire on an up note.

What to do with him now? Have him fight HW's out of the top 10?

As for the Bigfoot KO. BF being KO'd in the first round twice by aging fighters makes me think he is probably done (especially with no more TRT)

This Saturday is going to be a tough sell for the UFC. Women main event and then women co-main. I guess this will prove if Dana was right or full of it when he says women can sell as much as men.

 
Wow...so this Josh Neer thing is pretty fucked up. I just saw the video and he beats on the guy well after a freaking PROFESSIONAL fight would have been stopped. I get wanting to send a message to some jackass, internet tough guy. But once you've manhandled him and he's cowering in the fetal position, maybe you let up? He lands 10 unanswered strikes...and then kicks the guy while he's being pulled off. Jesus...

http://www.tmz.com/2015/02/24/iowa-state-athletic-commission-our-lawyers-are-examining-the-rule-book/

 
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Wow, Bellator is really getting desperate.  They are having Kimbo fight Ken Shamrock in June.  Neither one has fought in MMA since 2010 and they gave Shamrock a multifight deal.

 
Boo...I've already seen this one. Seth Petruzelli wins in the end.

Seriously, Shamrock was the reason I ever got into MMA...but this is just sad. I mean, I guess it's STILL more credible than letting CM Punk do anything inside the cage, but come on. Shamrock just turned 51. Though, I have to admit, part of me wants a 50 and up MMA league. Maybe Clint Eastwood can fund it and the requirements to fight in it are lots of sneering and wearing hideous plaid shirts.

Nevermind. I've talked myself into being excited for this fight. Can't wait! :lol:

 
Why do people run at Ronda and clinch? The women fighters have pretty much zero fight IQ. Pretty much no one she fights should be running and trying to clinch with her. It would be like people just diving headfirst into Werdum's guard or pulling guard on Werdum. It would be like someone just deciding to stand in front of Mark Hunt and trade punches back and forth.

Bleh - I don't get it The only one who should have thought she might've had a chance grappling with Ronda was McMann, but even then it wouldn't be in the clinch. It would be top game and shooting for the double leg.

 
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I believe she set a record for 0 strikes landed in a fight, lol. I knew she was going to win but not that quick lmfao. Whoever ordered the fight had to of been pissed off
 
I wonder if Kyra Gracie will ever make her MMA debut. That's been in the works for like 4 or 5 years now.  They were probably hoping she could run through all the other competitors Royce style from the early UFC events, but  Ronda has taken that spot so she probably is second guessing the whole thing.

I would be interested to see women's BJJ champ vs Judo champ.

Maybe the UFC should start trying to farm out some high level women Judoka. Women's Judo is a higher level internationally that women's wrestling, so they would probably have better luck there trying to get the international competitors looking to make some money now that they are done with Judo.

 
Dokstarr said:
Why do people run at Ronda and clinch? The women fighters have pretty much zero fight IQ. Pretty much no one she fights should be running and trying to clinch with her. It would be like people just diving headfirst into Werdum's guard or pulling guard on Werdum. It would be like someone just deciding to stand in front of Mark Hunt and trade punches back and forth.

Bleh - I don't get it The only one who should have thought she might've had a chance grappling with Ronda was McMann, but even then it wouldn't be in the clinch. It would be top game and shooting for the double leg.
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It's so weird because with a lot of male fighters, you'll hear about "He DOES NOT want to go to the ground with this guy". Or "You can tell how much he respects the striking prowess of his opponent." Do people really still believe that Ronda is overrated or something? I mean, I just can't believe that any decent coach would hear about Cat's plan to clinch with her and be like "Yeah, that's a great idea!" lol. I mean, maybe because Ronda's last two fights showcased her striking more, maybe Cat thought Ronda had started neglecting her ground game? It just seems crazy.

Until Ronda starts knocking people out Cyborg style, every single person who goes in against her should be trying to outbox her. In that regard, you would think Holly Holm would be a "more dangerous opponent" since that's her bread and butter. But personally, since she barely beat Pennington, I don't think she has a snowball's chance in hell of beating Ronda. 1. I wouldn't be surprised if Ronda actually hits harder than Holm does. And 2. I don't think she has any chance of stopping Ronda from taking her down. But at least Holm would have a better strategy than bullrush her and "hope she can't handle it".

Some friends and I were joking about it last night. What Zingano did was basically the equivalent of driving from New York to Las Vegas, walking into a casino, finding the first roulette wheel you see, immediately putting all of your chips on 23 red, and then being surprised when you lose and have to go home, lol. Just makes no damn sense.

 
Excited to see Pettis fight again. I imagine if Pettis gets this win his next opponent will be the winner of Khabib / Cerrone. I'm also curious to see how the Hendricks and Brown fight is gonna turn out. Brown proved he can hang in there in his 5 rounder against Lawler. Hendricks wrestling will definitely play a factor in this fight though
 
n8rockerasu said:
that regard, you would think Holly Holm would be a "more dangerous opponent" since that's her bread and butter.
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I agree. I was thinking about that after the fight. Holly did not look very impressive, but at least she would make a game plan to keep her distance while striking and stick to it.

That is really what all their strategies should be. Stay away, jab, chop away at lead leg, and whenever Ronda tries to clinch immediately try to break away/back off. Might be able to stifle Ronda and chopping away at her leg will slow her down and take a little pop out of her explosiveness for shoulder and hip throws.

Ronda probably doesn't have a great single leg or double leg shot because of her Judo background. Judo frowns upon shooting for a double, and like 5-ish years ago even compeltely banned it (it is a bit more complicated than that, but for the most part if you shoot in for a single or double leg you will be disqualified).

Someone really working at keeping the distance and circling out might be able to give Ronda problems, but so far not a single person has tried. Miesha looked like she was having maybe a tiny bit of sucess standing and then would dive for a double leg and be instantly dumped on her head. She did it like 3 times the last fight. Every time I wondered what the hell she was thinking. Miesha's wrestling background is nowhere as good as Ronda's Judo, but she should've tried to use her wrestling skills to defend, disengage and avoid. Chuck Liddel style. Chuck was a good wrester, but used his skills to stuff takedowns to make them stand with him.

 
I think that's it. The UFC women's bantamweight division just doesn't have a legitimate striker. It SHOULD have been Cat with her muay thai...but for whatever reason, she decided to go full retard. But practically all of the other fighters have some sort of a wrestling background (which I guess makes sense when you consider the history of women in wrestling as opposed to women in boxing/kickboxing).

And yeah, even seeing a fighter like Holm who is supposed to represent that...I don't know. Her style just feels very dated and not something that would work against high level MMA. Her kicks looked slow as hell with Raquel easily blocking almost every one. And the punches just didn't seem like they had much on them. Rogan even commented about how many of Holm's boxing matches went to decision. And I'm sorry, but trying to outlast and outpoint Ronda for 25 minutes while she's trying to murder you and rip your arm off just sounds terrifying, lol.

What this does though is beg for the Cyborg fight. She's the only one who has legitimate striking that could threaten Ronda. But we'll see what her cutting to 135 circus looks like this time.

 
http://mmajunkie.com/2015/03/jon-jones-back-on-heavyweight-train-believes-he-could-beat-champ-velasquez

Ya know, I just can't shake this feeling that Jon Jones' cocaine use was some kind of crazy plan to help his weight cut. Like it was controlled, planned out usage or something. Just the timing of everything feels too coincidental. First, he's interested in moving up to heavyweight. Then, after his win against Cormier, he says he's not thinking about it because he's comfortable at 205 and his weight cut was easy this time.

Then, he gets busted for cocaine...and now he's talking about fighting Cain and moving to heavyweight again. I just don't buy it. Using cocaine as a "diet plan" seems insane...especially coming from a trainer or something, but when you've got other fighters roiding up left and right, it doesn't seem that far fetched.

 
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I think the only way for Ali to win is for a straight up boxing match with the boxing gloves on. Other than that, it is a one sided fight. I think a better opponent for her is Holly holms .
 
http://www.tmz.com/2015/03/11/ronda-rousey-calls-out-laila-ali-ill-destroy-you/

Honestly, the media circus is making this out to be more than it even is. TMZ seems to have gone back to being full on trash. For one, if you watch the video, what Ali said wasn't particularly scathing. She thinks no woman can beat her. Ok...so does Ronda, and Ronda would probably tell you if you're a fighter you SHOULD think that.

Yeah, the part about her being the size of her daughter was a bit insulting, but she was kind of joking. And I'm sorry, but how many women are insulted because they're told they're not 160lbs? lol.

Then Ronda's response...where the fuck did TMZ get the "I'll Destroy You!" headline??? Reading the quotes they got from Ronda in the actual article, she said nothing like that. Even the "BRING IT ON!" line they use isn't a quote from Ronda. All she does is rationalize the comments and explain that her fighting style negates size.

Just seems like total sensationalism. We might as well be reading the National Enquirer.

 
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n8rockerasu said:
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jmmByrahFE[/youtube]

How long until the UFC (oh, who am I kidding...Bellator) signs him? :lol:
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Looks like not even Bellator but WSOF. UFC would have been interesting. He could have fought Phil Brooks/CM Punk, lol.

 
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Haha, yeah, I saw that this morning. And I actually did think about him being Punk's first opponent, but then I realized that even an unknown person (or remotely known in Fodor's case) who has actually trained for years would kick the living shit out of a celebrity who may be a tough guy, but has very little technical skill.

Honestly, I do think Punk needs a past his prime fighter who is slow and has no chin. Or an equally inexperienced fighter. Then there's another part of me that thinks Punk never fights in the UFC. Duke Roufus is saying he needs a year (from now). Any number of things could happen in that timespan to make a 37 year old rethink his desire to get punched in the face professionally.

 
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And that is how you beat Pettis. Pressure, pressure and more pressure. Dos Anjos executed a perfect gameplan and shut Pettis down for 5 rounds. If you don't give Pettis room to land those lethal kicks and keep moving forward you have a great chance. Wonder if Dana gives him an immediate rematch just cause of how they have been marketing Pettis. It was a complete shut out so I don't think he should. Winner of Khabib v Cerrone should get the shot and the loser of that should fight Pettis
 
i think Dana said on fox sports after the fights that Cerrone vs khabib is still the #1 contender match. and yeah pettis doesn't deserve an instant rematch because of the dominant performance by RDA.

im happy pettis lost. RDA had a great game plan. he also rocked him in the first and i dont think pettis really recovered from it.
 
Pettis said after the fight that the punch in the first round messed up his eye and completely closed it. So, he was fighting with one eye (and no depth perception) after that point. I do think he bought into his own hype a little bit though. The guy has loads of talent, but his takedown defense needs a crap ton of work. Basically, RDA just took what Clay Guida did to Pettis and magnified it times a thousand.

I was also pretty impressed with Johny Hendricks' performance. I've seen people on Sherdog bitching and calling it LNP, and even Dana has said he didn't love it, but I'm sorry...those were some pretty powerful takedowns. He was driving through Brown, and had him completely lifted up a couple times.

And he could have probably had a monster slam on that one if Brown hadn't latched onto the cage like a little bitch. If you're not going to scold a guy for breaking the rules and trying to cheat, how are you going to scold somebody for being "boring"? It's not like he was "Jake Shields'ing" the guy and just dragging him to the ground and then wrapping his legs around him like a wet blanket either. He was mauling, smothering, and suffocating. If Brown doesn't like it, get the fuck up or don't let him take you down in the first place.

Look what happened to Esparza when she couldn't get the takedown. Learn some defensive wrestling and you won't have that problem. I'm not saying it was the best Hendricks has ever looked, but I think it's the direction he needs to go in. Getting back to his wrestling is going to open up his striking again. I'm all for Hendricks getting back to his fundamentals. It's much better than the flabby one punch pony that showed up for the Lawler fights.

 
tylerh1701 said:
I was impressed with Hendricks as well but seems like most fans werent. He was way more active than that 2nd Lawler fight.
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Yeah, I just can't be upset watching somebody manhandle a high level opponent like that. Like I said, it would be different if he were just latching onto Brown and using his body weight and leverage to drag him down. But he was convincingly picking the guy up and dumping him. That's high level wrestling.

It always blows my mind when nobody places any blame on the guy who couldn't stop himself from being taken down. I mean, the RDA/Pettis fight felt strikingly similar, in my opinion. I mean, I guess RDA did more damage than Hendricks did...but the tone of the fight felt similar to me. Just brute strength and physical domination.

 
What's even more impressive now is the fact RDA was in there with a knee injury. He came out and said he hurt his knee a few weeks ago and his camp was telling him to pull out of the fight. That just makes the victory that much more impressive!
 
I don't know where Overeem and Roy go from here. I can't see Overeem making any waves after his knock outs from Rothwell, Big Foot and Browne. Even the few times Roy had him back up he just covered up and waited. I feel that a much more technical striker like Miocic, JDS or Hunt will put him down.

Roy just looks like Roy. He seems to be on the downward swing of his career. Roy is pretty much a perfect case of maybe getting in shape would help him. He isn't stocky like Hunt, he is just fat. Maybe if he was in better shape cardio he would've been able to mount a bit more offense against Overeem the few times he had him backed up instead of doing ugly take downs.

Hendricks and Brown both impressed me. I really like Brown's ground game and like how he attacks, attacks, attacks. Sadly he just couldn't get anything going against such a good wrestler like Hendricks.

Carla showed that women's MMA is still two decades behind men's.

I like RDA, but I'm afraid the Khabib rematch will be the same as the first.

 
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