Playstation 4: Rumors and Speculation, complete with fanboy rage!

[quote name='antlp89']Kotaku is a horrible website who only generates interest from outlandish claims and eye catching articles.

They are full of shit, similar to how yahoo news is complete trash. They are the yahoo news of videogame journalism.[/QUOTE]


Pretty much. I don't know why you guys are getting all worked up over an unfounded rumor about a product thats still years away from releasing.
 
[quote name='Golden Idol']As someone who makes games, the no used-game thing makes me happy.[/QUOTE]

Fine, then don't launch some things at $60. Neverdead is a recent example. Rogue Warrior, ugh.
 
[quote name='elessar123']Fine, then don't launch some things at $60. Neverdead is a recent example. Rogue Warrior, ugh.[/QUOTE]


hell yeah also dont release games full of bugs and shit that can erase saves or damage your console. and if you are be honest and let gamers know so they can wait for the necessary patches before buying a broken game. case in point re operation racoon city damn game is horrible across the board and the ai in the game is the worst ive seen ever.

your teammates will literally walk through fire or cross laser mines and get killed and even run into enemy fire take a few shots then run back to cover.
 
I love how the gaming industry and its defenders are just asking for another crash.

No used games = less potential buyers of a sequel. A healthy used game market is as good for publishers and the industry as it is for customers.

I only buy new games but imagine the irritation of re-registering or transferring games if your system fails (it will). Also you can't bring a game to a friend's house which would result in more lost sales.
 
[quote name='Golden Idol']As someone who makes games, the no used-game thing makes me happy.[/QUOTE]
I rarely buy used games except for the sales gamefly does but this will impact my decision on buying new games. I usually trade in or sell off my games after I finish them to recover the cost of my original purchase so I can put it toward my next new game purchase. If used games are no longer allowed, I can't sell off games I no longer want or having to sell them way below value. Less money means I will be more picky in deciding how many games I buy each year and also less chances of me buying games that are unknown/not triple A.

Is attacking the used market really such a good decision, where it could have an impact where other less popular gaming genres will disappear cause they don't get as much marketing hype?
 
theoretically if this article turns out to be true, there are some things i have a problem with. 1st, if they have such a problem with used games, then why make exclusive deals with gamestop. make gamestop pay out royalties to each of the game devs/pubs for each used game they sold. gamestop made a ton in profits in 2011. some of that could go back to the devs/pubs.

with the used cars thing and the dealers, why not sony just cut out the middle man(gamestop) and offer to buy back your games (or at least sony exclusives) and then they can resell them at a lower price point on their website.

i hate how the gaming devs cry foul with online crap saying that servers cost money. i realize that but what they dont get is that if i buy, say battlefield 3 and put 1000 hours into that game. there is no difference server side if i play it 1000 hours or if 10 different people play it for 100 hours or 20 for 50 hours, etc... the servers still see the same amount of hours. which is why all those online passes are complete bullshit.

if MS and SONY completely kill the used market, you will see another video game industry crash just like how it happened in the 80s.
 
[quote name='Golden Idol']As someone who makes games, the no used-game thing makes me happy.[/QUOTE]

One thing is for sure is that I don't want to be stuck with a shitty game I can't turn around and sell or trade.What are the consequences for this no used game model?Good or bad.Fewer 1st day sales,limited print runs(if disc based) if the game is shit, less impulse buying?That is the exact definition of shitting where you eat.
 
Part of the benefit of this no used game model is developers won't be so reliant on day/week one sales anymore...any time the game is sold, they get money in their pocket. And if (I repeat if) this does make any given game more profitable, this very well could mean more companies would be willing to experiment a little with games. If it takes a game a little while to find an audience and start moving units, it's not so big a problem. Compare that to now, that game would likely have a number of used copies on the shelf, so even a surge of interest wouldn't bring any money in.

That said, the implementation of a no-used games policy would kill the main reason I tend to buy games on consoles. I have a gaming-quality PC. I don't see PSN or XBL matching the sales and functionality of Steam or any other DD site. And my PC (almost) never has to worry about backwards compatibility.
 
I'd just go back to PC too. Only really switched to console and from 99% PC this generation anyways.

I often buy games new, and a used play copy, which I usually sell. I hate the digital model, because I have no idea when one day, something will be suddenly be unavailable. You can argue all you want that it'll never happen, but I know I have DRM files I can never access again because they decided to shut the servers, even without the company going under.

I don't lend out games much anymore anyways, so I don't care about that part. But we do pass down games to the GFs brother a lot, and he'll just lose the benefit. But it doesn't affect me that much.

All I know is, if they're going to be this restrictive next gen, I have enough games to last me well over a decade.
 
I don't understand why the gaming companies all think their on some platform higher then any other product in this world. Honestly this generation of gaming has done enough to severely decrease my interest in gaming. If this turns out to be true I doubt I'll even purchase the new consoles. Back to PC gaming.
 
[quote name='KingofOldSchool']There is a big difference between toilet paper and video games.

Obviously you're too fucking stupid to understand.[/QUOTE]

he's not stupid he was drop :lol:
 
i see 2 PS4 and Xbox 720 system coming

1.200-300 u cant play used games 2.500-600 uu can play used games
 
Think about it. In two generation. Three at the most, people will forget a used games market ever existed. Although there may be a boycott initially, it'll last as long as the outcry against Rush Limbaugh when the actual games start to come through.

Games sell system. Not features. If you guys want to concentrate on how the inability to play used games will affect yourself, that's fine, but in the long run some other young kid or parent who doesn't know better will take your place. Not saying your business is expendable. It's not. But the game industry will make more money over the course of ten years without the business of 100,000 individuals skipping on a console, if the other 39,900,000 million get accustomed to only buying "new" and kill the used game market in the process (1.81 billion dollars in lost sales).
 
[quote name='gettinmoney662']1. That doesn't affect my point. Car companies are getting a chunk of the market so they also benefit from used sales. Game companies do not. Furthermore, there is a significant difference in quality between a used car and a new car. There is no difference between a used game and a new game.

2. True, but like I said, the majority of the market is now in digital sales. Music companies no longer need to worry much about used sales.

3. The construction companies have no control over the housing market and therefore couldn't prevent used home sales even if they wanted to. Furthermore, they can be contracted for many other purposes. I highly doubt there is any such thing as a construction company that focuses only on building houses.

Just like you COULD sell the used games, but no one will want them. Just like no one wants your opened toilet paper.[/QUOTE]

1. Car manufacturers get $0 from used sales. Car dealers get a big chunk of profits from used sales.

Now you could argue that car dealers are necessary to get the product into the consumers hands and they would have to subsidize them if they didn't have used sales, but then the same thing could be said in a non-digital download world where many retailers push used game sales since they have a higher profit on those games.

2. Dissagree. When MP4s were sold and locked to devices, yes what you said was true. Amazon pushed MP3s and won. Now I can copy my digital downloads as much as possible and give them to friends/make cds for other people.

3. I think the point needs to be made that in the videogame market we have an oligopoly. So PS4 won't block used game sales unless Microsoft blocks them. Because that is their main competition and if they all do it you choices are limited to support them or not. The music/Car/House industry have dozens (housing hundreds) of suppliers of their products. So if one of them tried this you'd just go to another one. It gets back to the basics of supply and demand. Maybe a new console player would come on the market and allow used games sales to try and be competitive, but otherwise the current leaders could lead us to this market.

Being that this affects me negatively, I don't like it. I also don't think it's necessary. If not this generation, the next generation should be digital download anyway. That will take care of "used" sales.
 
[quote name='Golden Idol']Think about it. In two generation. Three at the most, people will forget a used games market ever existed. Although there may be a boycott initially, it'll last as long as the outcry against Rush Limbaugh when the actual games start to come through.

Games sell system. Not features. If you guys want to concentrate on how the inability to play used games will affect yourself, that's fine, but in the long run some other young kid or parent who doesn't know better will take your place. Not saying your business is expendable. It's not. But the game industry will make more money over the course of ten years without the business of 100,000 individuals skipping on a console, if the other 39,900,000 million get accustomed to only buying "new" and kill the used game market in the process (1.81 billion dollars in lost sales).[/QUOTE]

I agree the industry will keep on going even with a boycott from the gamer crowd. The game companies would rather sell 1 game for $70 to 10 million people once a year vs. $1,000 worth of games to 100,000 people once a year.

However, don't expect much more than the EA and Activiction yearly rehashes if this is the case.
 
[quote name='elessar123']I don't think they're going to make 2160p TVs any time soon.

It's probably that high so it can generate 120 fps at 1080p, for 3D. It's also possible they could be aiming for 4 people split-screen playing on one TV with glasses, similar to 2 player on the Playstation Display.[/QUOTE]

Actually, the term the AV people use is "4K" resolution ( for the 4000 part) and you can already choose from several 4k projectors. I read a MaxPC White Paper last year estimating first 4k TV in 2012 or 2013. Looking like 2013 now....
 
[quote name='willardhaven']
No used games = less potential buyers of a sequel. A healthy used game market is as good for publishers and the industry as it is for customers.

Also you can't bring a game to a friend's house which would result in more lost sales.[/QUOTE]So right, if people think that GS used $ will go directly into the new game market they're wrong SOME will but a large majority of cash strapped customers will make less purchases. Also, your so right about not being able to bring games to friends w/o taking the whole damn console will hurt word of mouth.

[quote name='8bitArtist']theoretically if this article turns out to be true, there are some things i have a problem with. 1st, if they have such a problem with used games, then why make exclusive deals with gamestop. make gamestop pay out royalties to each of the game devs/pubs for each used game they sold. gamestop made a ton in profits in 2011. some of that could go back to the devs/pubs.

with the used cars thing and the dealers, why not sony just cut out the middle man(gamestop) and offer to buy back your games (or at least sony exclusives) and then they can resell them at a lower price point on their website. [/QUOTE]I can't understand for the life of me why Sony/MS/Nintendo didn't just buy GS out along time ago since they make so much money. Now they would profit on both new & used gmes, be able to track their 2nd hand sales directly(which will help gain more info on if the online passes really work). They could also share cost/profit with devs to make everyone happy...except GS.
 
[quote name='smallsharkbigbite']
Being that this affects me negatively, I don't like it. I also don't think it's necessary. If not this generation, the next generation should be digital download anyway. That will take care of "used" sales.[/QUOTE]

The biggest problem I have with no used games and all digital delivery is that there is no incentive to lower prices due to limited competition.

And once a game is old(er), it's not like it's taking up shelf space like a physical copy at a retailer, so you will never see clearance type prices.

Maybe PSN and XBL will be like Steam with sales all the time, but for some reason I highly doubt it.
 
[quote name='Golden Idol']Games sell system. Not features. If you guys want to concentrate on how the inability to play used games will affect yourself, that's fine, but in the long run some other young kid or parent who doesn't know better will take your place. Not saying your business is expendable. It's not. But the game industry will make more money over the course of ten years without the business of 100,000 individuals skipping on a console, if the other 39,900,000 million get accustomed to only buying "new" and kill the used game market in the process (1.81 billion dollars in lost sales).[/QUOTE]

i think there are a lot of parents out there that buy their kid used games. thats why gamestop makes such ridiculous profits. any gamer with half a brain knows if youre going to buy used, ebay shows the true market value of the game. i honestly think its going to hurt the gaming industry way more than help it.

day 1/1st week sales wont nearly be as good. for example, there are a lot of people who bought resident evil: ORC who knew it might have been shitty, but they always had the back up plan of selling it on ebay or somewhere if the reviews turned out to be right (which they did). imo that game wouldnt have gotten nearly the 1st week sales it did if there wasnt that option to recoup $ on the steaming pile of shit you just bought for $60 that slant six/capcom had the audacity to actually release

i think the 1.81 billion in lost sales figure is a little skewed. that number is saying that every single person that bought that used game, WOULD have bought it new and that just isnt the case. again, the only people who buy $55 used games at gamestop are dumb parents trying to save a buck.

i remember an article saying how dead space only sold like(at the time) 2 million copies or something but the game has been on like 3 million ps3/xbox profiles. so they blamed the used market on how they lost 1 million sales. which is BS, not all those people were planning on buying their game. if they just want to rent it or borrow it from a friend, most have no intention of ever buying it. however, im sure some of those people went and bought dead space 2 new when it came out. renting/borrowing helped people on the fence buy into the series down the road.
 
If the PS4 has no BC to PS3 games
AND is going to lock out used games.

Then I simply will not buy it.

I think Sony should be trying to figure out how to make a better gaming experience with the PS4 instead of trying to cut out BC and used games.

No BC means sony will just get to charge you whatever they want for digital games of PS1,PS2,PS3,PSP games, They have full control of them at all times. GEE I can't wait to see those prices too. Over priced old games in digital format which you cannot sell . And physical copies of same games being sold used everywhere for a small fraction of the PSN prices.

No used games is a joke. I wonder who the publishers will blame when no used games are an option anymore and they continue to fail to sell XX amount of games to hit their goals.. what excuses will the use then?
 
[quote name='Golden Idol']But the game industry will make more money over the course of ten years without the business of 100,000 individuals skipping on a console, if the other 39,900,000 million get accustomed to only buying "new" and kill the used game market in the process (1.81 billion dollars in lost sales).[/QUOTE]

That's assuming they can convert the $1.81 billion on lost sales to new sales, which isn't going to happen. It's the argument for piracy; studios think every download is a monetary loss. It's not.

Also, how many games did the typical Wii owner buy? Something like 3. Relying on the casuals buying 5 games a system is not going to work.
 
[quote name='Ivanhoe']No used games is a joke. I wonder who the publishers will blame when no used games are an option anymore and they continue to fail to sell XX amount of games to hit their goals.. what excuses will the use then?[/QUOTE]

it was those damn pirates! they like, totally downloaded our game a trillion times!
 
[quote name='8bitArtist']it was those damn pirates! they like, totally downloaded our game a trillion times![/QUOTE]

lol yeah exactly.
 
welp I might be going back to PC gaming ie Steam gaming for most of next gen if this is the case. Then just buy cheap clearance PS only titles for when the system is at the end of its life. Pretty much stay one gen behind in consoles and in current gen on PC.
 
I'm ok with this as long as online passes and paid DLC goes the way of the Dodo.
I'd much rather devs get the money than Gamestop.
 
[quote name='Vader582']I'm ok with this as long as online passes and paid DLC goes the way of the Dodo.[/QUOTE]

:lol: boy, youre just setting yourself up for disappointment there bud. lol. dlc isnt going anywhere, in fact, itll probably just get worse next gen.
 
[quote name='SynGamer']Because wanting to keep money in the dev and publishers' pockets and not GameStops is such a terrible thing...[/QUOTE]

No other industry other then games does this, you can buy and resell movies, books and music all day. Why is the video game industry special? If they are losing money on releases, they need to rethink how much it costs to make games and how much they are charging for them. If PS4/720 are this way, i'll be a Wii U exclusive gamer next gen. I dont think these companys are that stupid, but i guess anything is possible at this point. Lets wait and see.
 
[quote name='8bitArtist']:lol: boy, youre just setting yourself up for disappointment there bud. lol. dlc isnt going anywhere, in fact, itll probably just get worse next gen.[/QUOTE]
I completely agree.
The days of free, unlockable content being on the disc/cart are long gone. That doesn't mean I wouldn't be ok with its return, however.
 
[quote name='Golden Idol']Think about it. In two generation. Three at the most, people will forget a used games market ever existed. Although there may be a boycott initially, it'll last as long as the outcry against Rush Limbaugh when the actual games start to come through.

Games sell system. Not features. If you guys want to concentrate on how the inability to play used games will affect yourself, that's fine, but in the long run some other young kid or parent who doesn't know better will take your place. Not saying your business is expendable. It's not. But the game industry will make more money over the course of ten years without the business of 100,000 individuals skipping on a console, if the other 39,900,000 million get accustomed to only buying "new" and kill the used game market in the process (1.81 billion dollars in lost sales).[/QUOTE]

You might be right. People here write multi-paragraph rants about how ending used games is the end of gaming, but similar multi-paragraph rants were written about stuff like DLC with little effect.

I'll tell you this though - if they do implement this "no new game" thing they better do a seamless job of it. If people have the slightest annoyance trying to access the content they bought, shit is going to get real.
 
i think there are a lot of parents out there that buy their kid used games. thats why gamestop makes such ridiculous profits. any gamer with half a brain knows if youre going to buy used, ebay shows the true market value of the game. i honestly think its going to hurt the gaming industry way more than help it.
Click to expand...

This is the key IMO. Kids buy used games = parents buy used games -- take that away and they're going to lose a massive amount of consumers. It may not matter to the hard-core gamer who buys everything day and date, so to speak, but if they want to simply blow up a huge percentage of their audience, in the end it's going to hurt them more than help it. I just don't see frugal parents who might spend literally a few bucks on used games for their kids suddenly plopping down $60 for a new title (or more) every month...they'll simply find some other form of entertainment instead, whether it's playing cheap games on their ipads or whatever. This goes for other consumers, and I'm guessing a lot of folks who use this site in particular, who don't feel the need to pay MSRP for every game.

To me this is almost like the video game crash in the 80s and could kill the future of consoles. It feels like a nearsighted move to gain more profits but in the end it's going to kill them far more than what they might gain in the short-term.
 
[quote name='starmask2k3']i see 2 PS4 and Xbox 720 system coming

1.200-300 u cant play used games 2.500-600 uu can play used games[/QUOTE]

Yeah this is probably true. Sony and MS will experiment and try it, it will backfire, and they will remove it.

Hopefully they are smart enough to make it so it can be turned off.
 
[quote name='camoor']You might be right. People here write multi-paragraph rants about how ending used games is the end of gaming, but similar multi-paragraph rants were written about stuff like DLC with little effect.[/QUOTE]

Ridge Racer on the Vita probably didn't do well. If it continues in that direction, there will be an effect.

The biggest problem is that they seem to be borrowing from free-to-play games, like Maple Story. The problem is, they charge an full price for the entry fee. If they do DLC-heavy games like Ridge Racer, the entry fee needs to be minuscule. They're expecting everyone to be ok paying $60 a game, then another $15-60+ for DLC, and now expect them to not be able to ever recoup any of that back. Yea, it's not going to happen. Maybe if the initial entry was close to free, but then we're back to a shareware model.
 
1. I swap games with family and friends
2. I buy games off of Ebay and Craigs List sometimes at a great discount.
3. I have over 70 games for my PS3 and a lot of money in DLC on it.
4. Playstation gets full price for their games in store.. What someone else does with it afterwards is none of their business and to limit the PS4 to only new games not any used games only shows their greedy fucks who don't give a shit about the consumer.
5. Anything I buy from movies, cds, clothes etc. as long as it's not a consumable.. I have the right to resell.
If this console is going to be like this they will not see a dime of my money and I hope someone hacks their shit again to give them a dose of reality. Gaming companies and Sony are beyond rich off of us, the gaming society. Give us what we want within reason. And Backwards compatibility is not unreasonable... used games are not unreasonable.
 
I know I wouldn't bother with either system if they use the no used game system. I buy lots of used for my kids. I accept there is a chance they might break/lost/whatever the disc so I try to keep the cost low. Plus the GameStop 7 day return for used games is great for kids. I have bought several games for my kids that they think they want. Only to turn out the game sucks or is too hard etc. I can return that game and be out nothing. On top of that I honestly couldn't tell you the last game I walked in and paid money for. Every game I have bought for years has been through trade in credit or gift cards. Take out the trade in system and I am out. I know I am one person so I am sure Sony could care less but I could also care less about giving them my money. I can play PC and my kids will be happy with the games they already have until they can use the PC as well. Add to it the fact a good PC will cost roughly the same or less than a PS4 I think the decision is pretty easy to make. The last PC I built cost around $700 and I have been able to play any game I want on it.
 
Day 1 anti-trust lawsuit.

If the Xbox 3 and PS 4 both have anti-used game protection then that would imply they discussed this prior to release, particularly if it's the same technology being used. This type of coordination between companies that is intended to destroy competition in the marketplace is illegal. Day one anti-trust lawsuits will hit them hard.
 
What's hilarious about this entire scenario, if played out, is that you'd see a heavy shift in market share to PC/Droid/iOS. Many games are seeing PC ports specifically because of digital distribution but if suddenly there were no market for console games, it would be a complete 180. Cost of computing keeps falling while console prices keep rising. Sony/M$/Nintendo would do well to remember who the real masters of gaming are.
 
[quote name='Jodou']What's hilarious about this entire scenario, if played out, is that you'd see a heavy shift in market share to PC/Droid/iOS. Many games are seeing PC ports specifically because of digital distribution but if suddenly there were no market for console games, it would be a complete 180. Cost of computing keeps falling while console prices keep rising. Sony/M$/Nintendo would do well to remember who the real masters of gaming are.[/QUOTE]

One thing is for sure, Nintendo won't have used-game protection. Normally their resistance to new technology is bad (like moving to HD) but in this case it would probably be a huge help for them. If the other two consoles do this and Nintendo doesn't, Nintendo will rule the next gen.

If the Wii U does end up having this technology then you can say with certainty that the other two will definitely have it as well.

I do have my doubts about this happening at all although the rumors have been flying for a while now.
 
If you don't like the policy then don't buy the product. If Sony does come out with a system that doesn't allow used games to be fully used, then they're going to have to release games at a cheaper starting point or games will have to drop in price a lot faster. After everything that went on with the PS3, I'm not going to early adopt on any console.
 
[quote name='Blaster man']One thing is for sure, Nintendo won't have used-game protection. Normally their resistance to new technology is bad (like moving to HD) but in this case it would probably be a huge help for them. If the other two consoles do this and Nintendo doesn't, Nintendo will rule the next gen.

If the Wii U does end up having this technology then you can say with certainty that the other two will definitely have it as well.

I do have my doubts about this happening at all although the rumors have been flying for a while now.[/QUOTE]
More likely there is confusion with their strategy to counter used game sales this next gen, which is generating idiotic rumors. If Sony and M$ were smart, they would crush any momentum Nintendo might have with WiiU by announcing their plans for next gen at E3. Nintendo will continue to dominate the handheld market and it's where their focus should be at this point. They've lost home console gamers for good.
 
First off, everyone realizes this is still RUMOR, right?

But what if it does happen? Why do you all care so much? Go play PC/smartphone games if you want. Go outside and do something else. If you dont want to pay for a product, dont. No one will stop you.

If the console manufacturers stop used games from being valuable and no one feels the need to buy their new product at MSRP, then supply will rise and prices will have to drop. BUT, if there are enough people still buying games and prices dont drop to a price you like, guess what? TOUGH SHIT. You either pay the going price, or oh my god, you cant play console games anymore! The horror.

What my post comes down to is that I think a lot of you are worried there will be enough people still buying new games that you wont be able to get really cheap games anymore (I doubt it, but it could happen). Again, tough shit if that happens. I want a Lambo, but those bastards wont sell it to me for 5 grand!
 
[quote name='wrencrest']First off, everyone realizes this is still RUMOR, right?

But what if it does happen? Why do you all care so much? Go play PC/smartphone games if you want. Go outside and do something else. If you dont want to pay for a product, dont. No one will stop you.

If the console manufacturers stop used games from being valuable and no one feels the need to buy their new product at MSRP, then supply will rise and prices will have to drop. BUT, if there are enough people still buying games and prices dont drop to a price you like, guess what? TOUGH SHIT. You either pay the going price, or oh my god, you cant play console games anymore! The horror.

What my post comes down to is that I think a lot of you are worried there will be enough people still buying new games that you wont be able to get really cheap games anymore (I doubt it, but it could happen). Again, tough shit if that happens. I want a Lambo, but those bastards wont sell it to me for 5 grand![/QUOTE]

I don't get this. I don't get that people don't care. If you don't give a shit about cheap games then why the hell are you here?
 
[quote name='smallsharkbigbite']1. Car manufacturers get $0 from used sales. Car dealers get a big chunk of profits from used sales.

Now you could argue that car dealers are necessary to get the product into the consumers hands and they would have to subsidize them if they didn't have used sales, but then the same thing could be said in a non-digital download world where many retailers push used game sales since they have a higher profit on those games.

2. Dissagree. When MP4s were sold and locked to devices, yes what you said was true. Amazon pushed MP3s and won. Now I can copy my digital downloads as much as possible and give them to friends/make cds for other people.

3. I think the point needs to be made that in the videogame market we have an oligopoly. So PS4 won't block used game sales unless Microsoft blocks them. Because that is their main competition and if they all do it you choices are limited to support them or not. The music/Car/House industry have dozens (housing hundreds) of suppliers of their products. So if one of them tried this you'd just go to another one. It gets back to the basics of supply and demand. Maybe a new console player would come on the market and allow used games sales to try and be competitive, but otherwise the current leaders could lead us to this market.

Being that this affects me negatively, I don't like it. I also don't think it's necessary. If not this generation, the next generation should be digital download anyway. That will take care of "used" sales.[/QUOTE]

First off, people need to stop comparing the video game industry to other industries on a 1:1 scale. They're not the same. But anyways:

1. But don't car manufacturers run/license these dealers? Every Honda dealership I see has a large used car lot right next to the new cars. Mercedes and other luxury brands runs ads on TV specifically for their used cars. They obviously benefit from the used car market in a way that Capcom/Sony/Activision/EA/etc. don't.

2. You downloading songs and giving them to your friends isn't the same as stores selling used products, but the music and movie industry are largely different from the video game industry because of one major point: multiple streams of revenue. If a band releases a song, they can make money in many different ways. They can sell it on a CD, they get royalties when it's played on the radio and Internet radio, they can put it on soundtracks to movies or TV shows, they can license it for use in commercials, and most importantly, they can play it during concerts. Movies are released at the theater, then on home video, then get licensed to HBO/premium cable channels, then they get licensed to cable/basic channels. Video games have one stream of revenue: selling it to the consumer. That's it.

3. That's another good point as to why the video game industry is much different. They are able to affect the used game market because there are only three video game system providers.

The bottom line in this whole debate is if the market supports it, it will continue to happen. Everyone was up in arms over $15 DLC map packs for COD, yet they ended up being the biggest selling DLC items. If people support a console that doesn't use used games, then it will happen. If not, then it'll go back to the way it was.

[quote name='Blaster man']I don't get this. I don't get that people don't care. If you don't give a shit about cheap games then why the hell are you here?[/QUOTE]

I love cheap games. I don't buy any used games. What's your point?
 
I have always said that the digital market has some benefits, mostly of convenience, but ultimately is about convenience for the producers. They maintain control of the product and you cannot resell it. Used markets will be greatly diminished and then so will the price fluctuations. Who then controls the price if there is no competitive used market? I should be able to sell my digital product. But, people need to refuse to partake in the digitally restricted market.

The sheeple consumers who don't really think about their purchasing (they are not programmed to by our consumer culture and marketing machine; informed consumer my ass), will end up applauding the taking away of their rights over products they purchase. In the future, you own nothing. You lease everything with all those terms and conditions blah blah blah. See, its already happening with TOS you need a JD to read. If you want to see the future now, see how farmers must lease seeds from Monsanto. And buy all their crap with it too. And now, they are finding major dangers with the seeds.

This digital market is not just games but music, books. Where is the bargain bin on Kindle books? Don't expect those any more. We are lemmings walking off a cliff.
 
The success of $15 PSN/XBLA games probably give Sony and Ms enough confidence to try this. There will be short term adjustment but huge long term benefits if this is true.
 
[quote name='gettinmoney662']I love cheap games. I don't buy any used games. What's your point?[/QUOTE]

You really don't understand it? It was stated clearly. If you don't give a shit about used games then you don't give a shit about cheap games. You aren't using your brain if you think that locking out used games is going to have no impact on your ability to buy cheap games. When there is no used game market, all games are new. When all games are new, there is little reason to reduce prices. Prices will come down much more slowly than before.

If you can't see that Ebay and Gamestop used game sales effects new game sales, then you obviously don't have any understanding of why they would implement this policy. Used sales has an impact on new sales. If there are no used games, new games will be more expensive for longer. It's called a monopoly. This is why I said that there will be a day 1 anti-trust lawsuit against them. They are getting together and agreeing to limit competition. Game console companies, car companies, trains, planes, Walmart and Netflix, etc, it doesn't matter. When companies get together and make an agreement that stifles competition, they are committing a crime. The problem is that it will take a few years to work that through the court. Then during that time, you and others that think it's no big deal will experience (and bitch about) stagnant high game prices.

Ebay is also a great way to get rid of your own games when you are done with them. Unlike some people that like to obsessively collect stuff, I have no such desire. If I'm never playing a game again, I'm selling it ASAP. If the game is a newer title then selling it ASAP after beating it is even more important since the price will be relatively high.
 
[quote name='joeboosauce']This digital market is not just games but music, books. Where is the bargain bin on Kindle books? Don't expect those any more. We are lemmings walking off a cliff.[/QUOTE]

I just bought the Hunger Games trilogy for $3.

And I paid $0.25 for Guns & Roses GH, so I'm not following.
 
[quote name='elessar123']I just bought the Hunger Games trilogy for $3.

And I paid $0.25 for Guns & Roses GH, so I'm not following.[/QUOTE]

There seems to be a vocal minority of people that seems to think anything a game console company does is fine. It almost seems like you're brainwashed. Amazon competes with TONS of other places including physical books, used books, EVEN LIBRARIES! What they describe for games is NOTHING like that. If every book could only be read by a single individual, there would be no libraries.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine

The first-sale doctrine is a limitation on copyright that was recognized by the Supreme Court of the United States in 1908 (see Bobbs-Merrill Co. v. Straus) and subsequently codified in the Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. § 109. The doctrine allows the purchaser to transfer (i.e., sell, lend or give away) a particular lawfully made copy of the copyrighted work without permission once it has been legally obtained. This means that the copyright holder's rights to control the change of ownership of a particular copy ends once ownership of that copy has passed to someone else, as long as the copy itself is not an infringing copy. This doctrine is also referred to as the "right of first sale," "first sale rule," or "exhaustion rule."
 
[quote name='elessar123']I just bought the Hunger Games trilogy for $3.

And I paid $0.25 for Guns & Roses GH, so I'm not following.[/QUOTE]

I went all digital a couple years ago with my music collection and have saved so much money because of it.

[quote name='Blaster man']You really don't understand it? It was stated clearly. If you don't give a shit about used games then you don't give a shit about cheap games. You aren't using your brain if you think that locking out used games is going to have no impact on your ability to buy cheap games. When there is no used game market, all games are new. When all games are new, there is little reason to reduce prices. Prices will come down much more slowly than before.

If you can't see that Ebay and Gamestop used game sales effects new game sales, then you obviously don't have any understanding of why they would implement this policy. Used sales has an impact on new sales. If there are no used games, new games will be more expensive for longer. It's called a monopoly. This is why I said that there will be a day 1 anti-trust lawsuit against them. They are getting together and agreeing to limit competition. Game console companies, car companies, trains, planes, Walmart and Netflix, etc, it doesn't matter. When companies get together and make an agreement that stifles competition, they are committing a crime. The problem is that it will take a few years to work that through the court. Then during that time, you and others that think it's no big deal will experience (and bitch about) stagnant high game prices.

Ebay is also a great way to get rid of your own games when you are done with them. Unlike some people that like to obsessively collect stuff, I have no such desire. If I'm never playing a game again, I'm selling it ASAP. If the game is a newer title then selling it ASAP after beating it is even more important since the price will be relatively high.[/QUOTE]

Yep, I'm sure all those cheap new games I get from Amazon and New Egg are due to the used game market.

Furthermore, how would this constitute a trust? Maybe if the retailers of new games were doing this to squeeze out GameStop but Sony isn't competing with GameStop. Microsoft isn't competing with GameStop. Capcom wants you to buy a new copy of Street Fighter X Tekken and not buy a used copy of Street Fighter X Tekken. Does that mean their competition is themselves? Gamers always love to scream for lawsuits, and they never go anywhere cause they have no idea what they are talking about.

[quote name='Blaster man']http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine

The first-sale doctrine is a limitation on copyright that was recognized by the Supreme Court of the United States in 1908 (see Bobbs-Merrill Co. v. Straus) and subsequently codified in the Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. § 109. The doctrine allows the purchaser to transfer (i.e., sell, lend or give away) a particular lawfully made copy of the copyrighted work without permission once it has been legally obtained. This means that the copyright holder's rights to control the change of ownership of a particular copy ends once ownership of that copy has passed to someone else, as long as the copy itself is not an infringing copy. This doctrine is also referred to as the "right of first sale," "first sale rule," or "exhaustion rule."[/QUOTE]

Like I previously said, you still have the right to sell your game, just no one will want it.
 
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