[quote name='thrustbucket']I didn't make those claims, those are your assumptions of what would happen without bailouts and takeovers I don't support.[/quote]
You would have us believe that the persons working for the US auto companies would still be working today, the companies that supply the US auto companies would be producing and supplying in the same amount as they currently are, and that the companies that auto workers pay for services, from rent/mortgage all the way down to the corner store for liquor and lotto tickets, would still have the same amount of revenue if the auto companies all went out of business?
You're out of your mind. I'm not making assumptions, I'm pointing out the very real consequences of what you want to see happen with the auto industry.
Besides, you didn't care what the negative ramifications were, and did not dispute them previously:
[quote name='thrustbucket']GM should have failed. They made the decisions that got them in the shit-can and they got bailed out. I know you will argue that it would have cascaded into a worse recession for the whole country, etc etc - but tough shit. Hard times must be had for growth in the future sometimes. That's how nature works.[/QUOTE]
"tough shit."
"hard times."
those are your words.
alternately, if you think that unemployment and the economy would be just the same as it is right now if we let the auto industry fail (i.e., if you're arguing the auto bailout had zero positive economic impact, and is a wholesale waste of money), find me an economist, find me an op-ed writer who makes that argument. Not just that it was a waste, but that it was a waste that had zero impact on the economy, positive or negative. Because that's a preposterous assumption to make.
Oh, goody.
You very much dislike how this country was set up. At best you think the foundation of this country was a noble effort that needs lots of tweaking, at worst - an outright aberration.
It didn't need tweaking? Should we return to white landowning males only being the ones to vote? Should we return to a meager criminal justice system? debtor's prisons? Should we dismantle education as an institution available for all citizens, remove standardization of curriculum and rigorous oversight of the accuracy of our education system? The same can be asked of health care. Should we return to lax labor laws, unsanitary/dangerous working conditions, child labor, and no minimum wage (and no weekends or retirement/health benefits)? No OSHA? No FDA? No state fire departments or police?
And, of course, that other thing; that most offensive of stains in our history. I don't need to mention it, but lest you think I forgot to include it for a moment, I have not.
Of course the government and the populace needs tweaking. You benefit from the tweaking. We all (largely) benefit from the tweaking. So, yeah, I like my meat inspected, my education tested, my criminals incarcerated, and, of course, my beer cold, my tv loud, and my homosexuals FLAMING.
So you got that right about me; I support a government that's different from what was establish in the late 18th Century. You do, too.
You'll stop at nothing to support politicians of the same mindset that plan to fundamentally "progress" (alter) America into something entirely different.
vague, vague, vague. why bother typing? you, I mean, not me.
You'd likely happily support a candidate that openly admitted to wanting to completely rewrite the constitution with a more socialist ink in their pen, while at the same time claiming your views aren't extreme.
you're not offering a baseline from which to establish 'extreme.' that and the whole you-don't-really-understand-the-difference-between-social-liberalism-and-socialism. They are not equivalent, and quite frankly you come off as a petulant, foolish blowhard to continue to conflate those two. I am a social liberal, which has a very distinct meaning and interpretation. You can continue to ignore that, at your intellectual peril.
See? I can play that game too. You didn't actually say those things, but they would be easy to conclude from reading most of your posts for years.
Your game is terrible. At no point have you done the same thing I have. You advocated a very specific policy (don't bailout the auto industry). I pointed to the very real consequences of allowing that to happen. You just threw out a polemic of every paint-by-numbers pejorative you have picked up from conservative talk radio, without regard to its actual application to this situation.
Tell you what, I'll give you a second chance; a thrustbucket bailout, as it were. Go to the "Tea Party Thread" and see some of the policy proposals I put up there in response to tivo (probably one of the last posts in that thread). Extrapolate from there the immeasurable damage I'd do to the US economy, and then you'll be cooking with equivalency, baby. Until then you're just prattling on.
Also, because I know you're lazy and non-industrious, I'll even link it for you:
http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7780684&postcount=35
ing signature, god dammit?
