The 'Jimmy King' Wrestling Thread

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No surprise at all that there wasn't a Cena heel turn. His merchandise sales are still through the roof and you won't see a heel turn from him until they drop significantly. Storylines are a distant second to the huge amounts of money being made on overpriced t-shirts and wristbands. C'mon, you all know this by now...don't you?

[quote name='pimpster4183']I feel sorry for anyone who paid $44.99 for an episode of Raw/Smackdown last night.[/QUOTE]

I don't. Fools and their money are easily parted.
 
I just....man, I don't buy the merchandise argument. Heels sell merch.

But if you want to parse the *amount* of merch, maybe you have a point.

nWo sold a boatload of t-shirts.
Cena sells shirts, necklaces, armbands, wristbands, and foam whatevers. That's a far larger ROI.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']I just....man, I don't buy the merchandise argument. Heels sell merch.

But if you want to parse the *amount* of merch, maybe you have a point.

nWo sold a boatload of t-shirts.
Cena sells shirts, necklaces, armbands, wristbands, and foam whatevers. That's a far larger ROI.[/QUOTE]

'Cool' heels sell a lot of merch. It's why nWo shirts sold. It's why Orton and Edge moved shirts. It's why you don't see a lot of Nexus shirts, or anything pertaining to Sheamus. It'd really be a question of what kind of heel Cena would be, and how much the 'IT'S STILL REAL TO ME, DAMMIT!' fans feel betrayed by him.

You are right, though, that it's the amount of merch sold. I, and I'm making these numbers up entirely, wouldn't be shocked if 50% of merchandise sales for WWE were Cena stuff. Even if that seems like a stretch, I'd even assert that at least a Cena/Mysterio combo moves 50% of the merch. Those numbers are ridiculous, but Cena's number *has* to be gigantic.

I admit, though, it amused during the PPV when he was 'grieving' and took off his FOUR armbands to lay in the middle of the ring. It was a great moment that really showed exactly why they won't turn him until he stops being a cash-cow. I kept hearing a 'cha-ching' sound in my head every time he put one down.
 
remember when PPVs use to finish off storylines and PPVs weren't just used as a build up to Wrestlemania. my biggest pet peive is when they have the RAW rematch of the main event of the ppv everyone just bought.
 
I see Cena merch sales as being somewhat comparable with 80's Hogan merch sales. A Hogan heel turn in the 80's was unthinkable and not just because of merch. I certainly don't see Cena's popularity on a par with Hogan's back then but Cena's appeal with kids is arguably second only to the first Hogan era. That kind of influence and the accompanying sales of whatever trinkets and tchotchkes is far more valuable to a company than the temporary heat of a storyline. Yes, heels sell merch, but we are in a TV-PG era and it's a different audience at this point. Plus, I don't think a heel Cena would be crazy popular like some heels of the past. IMO, it would viewed as a betrayal by his core fanbase and they wouldn't want to wear his name and image. The vocal minority of the IWC who might actually like the heel turn wouldn't even come close to making up the revenue difference. The majority of the IWC steals PPV feeds so why would they buy a t-shirt?

It's all just my personal theory. Do with it what you will.
 
[quote name='007']You are right, though, that it's the amount of merch sold. I, and I'm making these numbers up entirely, wouldn't be shocked if 50% of merchandise sales for WWE were Cena stuff. Even if that seems like a stretch, I'd even assert that at least a Cena/Mysterio combo moves 50% of the merch. Those numbers are ridiculous, but Cena's number *has* to be gigantic.

[/QUOTE]

When looked at in this perspective. It makes sense why Mysterio not just wins feuds, but buries his opponent in them. I would say that currently Rey Mysterio is more "super" than "Super" Cena. Right now, he's right under Hunter The Barburyer.
 
[quote name='007']I admit, though, it amused during the PPV when he was 'grieving' and took off his FOUR armbands to lay in the middle of the ring.[/QUOTE]

:rofl:

So, Cena did not turn, WWE showed they're afraid to take chances again. With that in mind, there's a PPV in 4 weeks. I'd like to see a little armchair booking from y'all: set up the Raw portion of the TLC PPV (or, at the very least, the Orton title match).
 
[quote name='dkreegz515']remember when PPVs use to finish off storylines and PPVs weren't just used as a build up to Wrestlemania. my biggest pet peive is when they have the RAW rematch of the main event of the ppv everyone just bought.[/QUOTE]

What's worse is when they don't even blow off at WrestleMania. How many times has WrestleMania been used as buildup for Backlash?
 
yeah that is true too. survivor series was one of the big 4 ppvs at one time... now its just another way to crap out some normal raw/smackdown matches... really a TIE... WTF.
 
The first half of the show was really good - Danielson-Dibiase was a perfect choice for an opener minus the lack of build for it. Crowd was still hot for parts of it due to Danielson though, and man was he ever smooth as silk countering the Million Dollar Dream. Gotta give some props to Ted for holding onto it through the Piper-Hart finish, and Danielson moving bit-by-bit to get the LeBelle Lock on ruled. Kaval-Dolph was also pretty good despite having absolutely zero heat. Dolph took a sick kick to the face and was still able to go on just fine despite getting his nose busted up - so yeah, he's a pretty tough dude. Hope they do something with Kaval, but I'm not holding my breath for that.

The traditional Survivor Series match was also pretty good. MVP came off like a fucking megastar here thanks to the crowd going nuts for him. So of course they jobbed him out first. Having Del Rio get KOed was a smart way to get over the big punch without having him actually lose. It's a shame they didn't build this up, because it was actually quite good.

Show fell of a cliff with Edge-Kane, and nothing else after it was particularly good. Nattie got a feel-good moment by winning the belt, which actually perfectly matches her gear, so perhaps it won't look so terrible now. Orton-Barrett wasn't particularly good. Orton's methodical style is great for a heel, but death for a face, and it's not like he's a very good face either. Cena did the right thing and will get "fired". They'll clearly kill this stip in time, but if they do it in a logical way (IE - have him come in as a fan, excuse me, MEMBER OF THE WWE UNIVERSE and beat up Nexus until Barrett demands that he be reinstated), I'll be fine with it.
 
I remember once seeing Ted Debiase on some hunting show, was just turning through the channels and was like "Hey...is that the million dollar man?". Almsot as weird as seeing Hulk Hogan on one of those televangelist shows.
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']Do you guys think that Cena will try UFC now that his WWE career is over?[/QUOTE]

No matter how much sarcasm was intended here, I couldn't help deep sighing and facepalming at this.
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']Do you guys think that Cena will try UFC now that his WWE career is over?[/QUOTE]

Mark.
 
Still waiting on Batista's first fight to happen.Last I heard him and Coker had an agreement on money but hadn't yet finalized the contracts and were working out a few things.Hershel Walker vs. Batista would be a nice freak show bout.
 
[quote name='JaytheGamefan']Cena did the right thing and will get "fired". They'll clearly kill this stip in time, but if they do it in a logical way (IE - have him come in as a fan, excuse me, MEMBER OF THE WWE UNIVERSE and beat up Nexus until Barrett demands that he be reinstated), I'll be fine with it.[/QUOTE]

Nah, watch them keep him off TV until the Royal Rumble, where he is a surprise entrant (why does he get a slot when he is fired? who cares!), wins and fights Barrett (who wins the title at RR or before?) at WrestleMania for the title (where Cena wins and we get to see RAPADOO NEVER GIVE UP DREAMS DO COME TRUE celebration before the fade to black)
 
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[quote name='pitfallharry219']Do you guys think that Cena will try UFC now that his WWE career is over?[/QUOTE]
tactical%20facepalm.jpg
 
[quote name='neocisco']He was joking.[/QUOTE]


Indeed he was. I actually grinned after I read his obvious jab towards Batista.

[quote name='mykevermin']:rofl:

So, Cena did not turn, WWE showed they're afraid to take chances again. With that in mind, there's a PPV in 4 weeks. I'd like to see a little armchair booking from y'all: set up the Raw portion of the TLC PPV (or, at the very least, the Orton title match).[/QUOTE]


Tonight, Barrett will dismiss Cena, and Cena will leave after giving a flat, dramatic speech, saying how he "did the right thing, et cetera."

Then Randy Orton will sneak-attack Barrett, 'cause that's what faces do, and thank "John." He'll say how he will find a way to thank him, and Barrett will cut in, and those two will have a war of words. Nexus will swarm Orton, Orton will fight them off for a bit, until "the numbers game" renders in the Nexus favor.

Nexus will leave Orton "battered and broken, bah gawd", the Miz will cash-in his title shot, and beat Orton for the WWE Title title belt. (I always wondered why they named it the "WWE Championship." It makes little sense. Sorta surprised WWE hasn't renamed the title to the WWE Universe championship.)

So, then we'll have Orton, Miz, and Barrett in a feud, which will see its apex as a Triple Threat TLC match at the TLC PPV.

Sorta wondering how long it takes Cena to film a film. In what part of his WWE career did he film Legendary and Fred: The Movie? I can't remember the last time he left WWE TV.

[quote name='mogamer']When looked at in this perspective. It makes sense why Mysterio not just wins feuds, but buries his opponent in them. I would say that currently Rey Mysterio is more "super" than "Super" Cena. Right now, he's right under Hunter The Barburyer.[/QUOTE]


Rey Jr. and John Cena are on par with burying their colleagues in feuds. I think Rey Jr. puts people over more often, but when they execute the "comeback" portion of his matches, he does shovel more dirt, at a quicker pace, than Cena.

[quote name='neocisco']I see Cena merch sales as being somewhat comparable with 80's Hogan merch sales. A Hogan heel turn in the 80's was unthinkable and not just because of merch. I certainly don't see Cena's popularity on a par with Hogan's back then but Cena's appeal with kids is arguably second only to the first Hogan era. That kind of influence and the accompanying sales of whatever trinkets and tchotchkes is far more valuable to a company than the temporary heat of a storyline. Yes, heels sell merch, but we are in a TV-PG era and it's a different audience at this point. Plus, I don't think a heel Cena would be crazy popular like some heels of the past. IMO, it would viewed as a betrayal by his core fanbase and they wouldn't want to wear his name and image. The vocal minority of the IWC who might actually like the heel turn wouldn't even come close to making up the revenue difference. The majority of the IWC steals PPV feeds so why would they buy a t-shirt?

It's all just my personal theory. Do with it what you will.[/QUOTE]


To teens, bad guys are 'cool' and cheered. That's what teens do: They rebel against the norm.

To younger kids, bad guys are 'jerks' and booed. That's what kids do: They want to believe that good will always triumph over evil.

The more I think about it, the less I believe they'll turn Cena heel. WWE lacks faces, and turning their biggest face just doesn't make sense. If anything, they should turn Orton heel, as he's a natural heel/awkward face. Plus, it makes more sense, in the storyline. Orton tells Cena to do the right thing, Cena gets fired, and Orton laughs and reveals, "It was me all along, Austin!"

I dislike the entire character that is Randy Orton--but he's a lot more tolerable as a heel than face. Plus, Orton has said himself that he prefers to be heel. It's a win-win situation: WWE puts over Orton as a big heel, and Orton stops crapping in gym bags.

The only negative factor is that Barrett would be buried in an Orton-Cena feud, and this turn would lead to nowhere new.

I guess, in regards to leading to new avenues, I still support pushing Orton as a face and turning Cena to a heel. But, WWE doesn't have enough super-faces to do this. Their biggest faces draws are Big Show, Rey Jr., Randy Orton, MVP, and maybe Edge (as Edge, to kids, is probably more villain than good guy). If executed properly, Bryan Danielson and Santino could be hugely popular face names. Santino gets an incredible pop during his matches, and Danielson is always well-cheered.
 
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Take this for what it's worth: Jericho tweeted earlier "Off to Orlando...".

RAW is live tonight in Orlando, FL. Please let him return tonight.
 
He could just be visiting backstage. Not that I'm trying to be a Debbie Downer, because I'd like to see him back. He could be the new face that we need.

EDIT: Holy shit. Bombastic news for TNA under the spoiler. Hold onto your hats, folks:
728dixie.jpg
 
[quote name='Mr. Beef']EDIT: Holy shit. Bombastic news for TNA under the spoiler. Hold onto your hats, folks:
728dixie.jpg
[/QUOTE]

I'll say it again. Mark.
 
[quote name='JJSP']It's an event that will change the landscape of TNA forever.[/QUOTE]
Until next week when they change the landscape of TNA forever -- AGAIN.
 
[quote name='neocisco']Go play with your dolls.[/QUOTE]

I definitely have no idea what Chuplayer is doing.

For the sake of us all, here's the Wikipedia definition: "...a mark is a professional wrestling fan who believes that everything associated with pro wrestling is real, rather than recognizing the existence of kayfabe (that is, it is a work)..."

And: "...In sarcasm, ridicule or mockery is used harshly, often crudely and contemptuously, for destructive purposes. It may be used in an indirect manner, and have the form of irony..."
 
[quote name='Chase'](Good fucking god, there has to be an easier way to upload and post pictures from my iPhone.)[/QUOTE]
I thought most image hosts had mobile versions that could be accessed from iphones and the like? I know Photobucket has one.
 
[quote name='Mr. Beef']He could just be visiting backstage. Not that I'm trying to be a Debbie Downer, because I'd like to see him back. He could be the new face that we need.

EDIT: Holy shit. Bombastic news for TNA under the spoiler. Hold onto your hats, folks:
728dixie.jpg
[/QUOTE]

What was that picture? Seems like TNA pulled it

- edit Found it.

728dixie.jpg

:rofl:
 
[quote name='neocisco']Is he injured right now?[/QUOTE]

Some type of freak injury when he took a DDT from Edge at Bragging Rights
 
[quote name='Survivalism']49 games? I guess that's about right. Needs need moar Wrestlefest!

Edit: And I can't stand the E10 rating.[/QUOTE]

What's this all about?

EDIT: Oh, KOTR is next week during Raw in Philadelphia? Hmmm. I have things to do, so guess I'm not going. No big loss.

EDIT2: I walked away for half a second - what's the story w/ Randy Orton's knee?
 
[quote name='mykevermin']What's this all about?

EDIT: Oh, KOTR is next week during Raw in Philadelphia? Hmmm. I have things to do, so guess I'm not going. No big loss.

EDIT2: I walked away for half a second - what's the story w/ Randy Orton's knee?[/QUOTE]

He got gang banged by nexus and they hurt his knee.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']What's this all about?[/QUOTE]

The giant on-screen graphic that said there have been 49 WWE games.

I'm all for the Miz cashing in but I can't help but feel like this is a bit of a waste.
 
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