The Randy "The Ram" Robinson Wrestling Thread

[quote name='Brak']WCW Nitro was golden from 1996 - 1998, in my opinion.[/quote]

It most certainly was.

[quote name='BustaUppa']Haha it was such a weird atmosphere when he won undisputed belt from Hulk Hogan and had that weird music for the first time.
We also got this:
5a9104702b16c2ba6842bc8da806968e151.gif



His previous heel stint (the evil Amishtaker and his Ministry) supplied some good moments too!
xgbkic.gif

But alas, Cena ain't the Rock, as much as they want him to be! I have to agree that there's no way they could get Cena cheered if he went against 'Taker.[/quote]


Cena is at a disadvantage in the PG-rated era we are in now. While Cena was never at the level of the Rock on the mic, even when Cena was A heel, he was better than most of the roster. But if the "JBL is poopy" sign was any indication, his mic skills ae going to be curtailed for the forseeable future.

The only way Cena will be universally cheered is if he goes heel again, which is unfortunate. I have no problem with him the way he is and I really don't understand the hate he gets at all.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Spanky.

I also thought the same thing about the gifs the other day when I saw the Power Rangers/Jeff Hardy one. :lol:[/QUOTE]

AKA THEE Brian Kendrick :)
 
[quote name='GuilewasNK']The only way Cena will be universally cheered is if he goes heel again, which is unfortunate. I have no problem with him the way he is and I really don't understand the hate he gets at all.[/QUOTE]

Simple. Because Cena has been shoved down our throats too hard and honestly most of us feel that his act is very artificial. Honestly I never miss him when he's away from the product regardless of him shooting a movie, injury, etc.
 
Exactly. I don't hate Cena, I hate what they make him do. He genuinely seems like an okay guy... he's also got mic skills and some semblance of in-ring ability, but both are hampered by what WWE makes him do.

I can say this, though... he's 100% more entertaining when they keep him away from the belt. Even the stuff with Big Dave (ha) was fairly okay. The issue is the same as it is with Trips... if they're around, you the belt will come into play sooner rather than later. With the roll he was on, there was zero benefit from taking the belt off Jericho and putting on Cena, but they did it anyway. It's one of my issues with the top faces... they don't seem to have any idea what to do with them if the story DOESN'T involve the belt. Cena has mic skills, USE THEM. Create a feud between him and someone that doesn't involve a title at all... it can work, and it would freshen his act up tremendously.
 
His mic skills are what made me like him during that feud he had with Lesnar. I don't remember the feud 100%, but I do remember Lesnar was making a group of heels, and heel Cena decided not to join, and turned face right afterwards.
 
IMO, a worse problem then Cena being "shoved down our throats" would be the promos that they write for him. That's what I find most irritating about him, anyway. He SPEAKS well, but I don't like his promos. They are generally some combination of:

- champ is HURRRRRRR HOW YOU DOIN [CITY]
- shhhhh serious voice serious voice look at camera serious voice
- HURRRRRRR I'M INTENSE I'M INTENSE
- now i'm serious again respect respect respect shhhhh
- pop culture reference
- gay/poop joke
- bad Rock impression
- HURRRRR LOUD AGAIN
- mix up, repeat next week

I feel like his face character is still undefined. Meanwhile his heel character was very distinct... even if it was somewhat derivative, it was very entertaining and you knew who he/his gimmick was.
 
My wrestling DVD Review collection is up.

I set it up kind of weird. Instead of starting a website or a blog, I signed up for a Yuku forum and disabled new threads from users. You don't have to register to view the reviews, but you do if you want to comment on any of them. I currently have 65 reviews uploaded. I've been accused of being long-winded and overly smart-assed in them. But I think they're highly informative and very opinionated. And maybe even kind of funny, if you can put up with a pitch-black sense of humor (Chris Benoit jokes all over the place).

They're found at http://5star.yuku.com

Latest DVD review is for the Edge DVD, which I was pretty disappointed with. I think overall it actually exposed him as... sort of overrated. His moveset is limited and low-impact for the most part, and his matches all seem kind of samey.
 
[quote name='BustaUppa']- champ is HURRRRRRR HOW YOU DOIN [CITY]
- shhhhh serious voice serious voice look at camera serious voice
- HURRRRRRR I'M INTENSE I'M INTENSE
- now i'm serious again respect respect respect shhhhh
- pop culture reference
- gay/poop joke
- bad Rock impression
- HURRRRR LOUD AGAIN
- mix up, repeat next week[/quote]

:lol: How did you get your hands on a Raw script?
 
He puts charisma into his promos for sure. I don't know that criticizing it for being cookie cutter is proper, since many many wrestlers do that. Catch phrases and all that.

Cena just doesn't connect with me at all. I don't identify with his dress, his personality, and I don't find him the slightest bit interesting in the ring.

It could be a number of things. First and foremost among them, as I've said before and I'll say again, Cena somehow conveys that there's not a single rebellious bone in his body. He's a company man through and through. Something about his tv presence shows that he's the quickest to say "How high, sir?" when Vince McMahon says "jump."

He's a conformist. A tagalong. Not a rebel. Not a badass. He's the guy at Burger King who would volunteer to scrape the grease and clean out the fryers. He's the guy who wouldn't allow for any bad talk about the management, or that it was a shitty job. The guy who would tell the manager if you put down two cans of beer in your car during your last smoke break.

That's the problem with Cena. He's a fucking do-gooder, a kiss-ass, a teacher's pet, and a mama's boy, all wrapped up into one.

Remember how much you hated the smarmy, friendless, super-smart kid who won all the academic contests in elementary school? Yeah, that guy too.

There's also, as someone mentioned a few posts ago, the "superman tier" of the upper-card babyfaces. Except Jeff Hardy, :lol:. Triple H is in a feud? Who wins? Undertaker is in a feud? Who wins? Cena is in a feud? Who wins. I think this is a plausible rationale as well, primarily because I failed to realize what a fantastic main-event storyline the JBL/HBK stuff was. I didn't care. I'm not interested. Couldn't give a fuck.

Why? Because Cena wins. No matter what. Didn't he even win the fucking belt in his very first match back from surgery at Survivor Series?

That's why. I'd like to be able to predict who wins matches, to not feel like it's a given. Some people think that it makes them look better when they do lay down. So beating Triple H is a big deal, or beating Cena. Problem is, I don't have much interest in who they feud with, because I expect them to go over. Because they do. There's little uncertainty. And when they finally do the job, it's unsatisfying, because it feels like they're doing "charity work," for lack of a better phrase.

I honestly don't know that Cena could do a thing to make me like him. Not that he should be concerned with that, as he's paid well enough irrespective of how I feel. The closest I could imagine with people liking him is if they did some DDP thing, where his ribs were busted up for a month or two straight, but he still fought back. Do that. Have him drop the title to some heel that broke his ribs by attacking him with a pipe. But have him lose, but in a "Stone Cold at WM13" kind of way.

Stone Cold lost that match, but nobody noticed, because it did so, so, so, SO fucking much to get him over and establish him as a main event guy the crowd could get behind. And he was the heel!
 
You know, for all the bitching about Superman Cena, he actually went on a high-profile match losing streak in 2008. I think he dropped like six out of seven pay per view matches or something like that before he went down with a second injury.
 
[quote name='Survivor Charlie']You know, for all the bitching about Superman Cena, he actually went on a high-profile match losing streak in 2008. I think he dropped like six out of seven pay per view matches or something like that before he went down with a second injury.[/QUOTE]

You're a liar, or your memory sucks ass.

Cena lost 3 PPV matches in 2008. 2 to Triple H :)lol:), and 1 to JBL. That doesn't really show a lack of "superman"-ness. Lest we forget how he returned from injury, TWICE, in 2008, first to win the Royal Rumble, and second to win the WWE Whatever Title Was on Raw?

Besides, there were more than 12 wrestlin' shows last year. Cena wasn't beating the entire tag team division single-handedly at "Backlash" or something else.

Stick to telling us things I can't look up, like how Cena jerked off Candace Michelle onto Mark Henry's forehead as he was napping on a dare from Linda McMahon.
 
Doing my research on the subject, I found that Cena actually lost five PPV matches last year.

myke, you're missing his losses to Orton at WM and to Batista at Summerslam.

But I agree with your last statement.
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']Doing my research on the subject, I found that Cena actually lost five PPV matches last year.

myke, you're missing his losses to Orton at WM and to Batista at Summerslam.

But I agree with your last statement.[/QUOTE]Batista was THREE SECONDS BETTER than Cena!!!!!!

Michael Cole would say that about 30 times per show in the weeks following Summer Slam. It amused me because the same could be said about everyone who's ever lost a match but Cole was putting it over like it was some unprecedented thing.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Fair enough. I wasn't being misleading, I simply hadn't had my coffee. ;)[/quote]

Understood. Everybody knows mykevermin only spits truth.

[quote name='BustaUppa']Batista was THREE SECONDS BETTER than Cena!!!!!!

Michael Cole would say that about 30 times per show in the weeks following Summer Slam. It amused me because the same could be said about everyone who's ever lost a match but Cole was putting it over like it was some unprecedented thing.[/quote]

If that's the case, Brooklyn Brawler was a lot more competitive than I thought.
 
Ha, I actually did the research on it, too... though he lost to HHH twice, he technically was eliminated from the Fatal 4 Way by Orton, not HHH. I do love how much that shows the company hierarchy... Mania Triple Threat: HHH not only has Cena get pinned instead of himself, he still looks good because it was HHH who put Cena 'down' for Orton to even pin him.

Anyway... outside of JBL (x3) and Batista, his matches were ALWAYS for a title.

Plus, hell, he won the Rumble, which almost negates anything else that happened in the beginning of the year. Ugh. It wasn't a title match, but it's close enough.

Sidenote... I didn't realize how long that awful JBL feud lasted. I think I mentioned earlier about him being more interesting when not going for a title... yeah, this feud sort of proves that wrong, doesn't it?
 
I'm watching YouTube video from the dark days of WCW, and I forgot how over KroniK was.
 
Same reason the Acolytes were over in the late 90's. They squashed everybody they wrestled. Pretty effective tool.

For some reason, I can't think of the Acolytes anymore without thinking of the APA t-shirt that said "ALWAYS POUNDING ASS" on it. :lol:
 
[quote name='007']Sidenote... I didn't realize how long that awful JBL feud lasted. I think I mentioned earlier about him being more interesting when not going for a title... yeah, this feud sort of proves that wrong, doesn't it?[/quote]

The only thing I can remember about that feud, other than the lame NYC Street Fight or whatever, is Cena writing "JBL is poopy" on the limo. And this comes from someone who hasn't missed an episode of Raw in probably eight years.
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']The only thing I can remember about that feud, other than the lame NYC Street Fight or whatever, is Cena writing "JBL is poopy" on the limo. And this comes from someone who hasn't missed an episode of Raw in probably eight years.[/QUOTE]hahaha you just reminded me of this pic I took on my phone a while ago. Me and some of my wrestling school buddies wanted to do some "targeted" promotion for our shows, so we hit up the Nassau Coliseum area on the day of the Great American Bash PPV. It was a fun atmosphere in the Coliseum parking lot, with lots of people throwing little tailgate parties and stuff. But most amusing of all was THIS:
JBLispoopy.jpg

Who knows if they were ironically poking fun, or if that van was full of legit Cena marks... either way, that absurd sight made my day. Way to go, "WWE Universe"! :D
 
van = traveling pack of drunken "dudes" = probably smarks = ironic phrasing.

But the uncertainty is the very nature of wrestling, no? So it doesn't matter if it's ironic or not.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']You're a liar, or your memory sucks ass.

Cena lost 3 PPV matches in 2008. 2 to Triple H :)lol:), and 1 to JBL. That doesn't really show a lack of "superman"-ness. Lest we forget how he returned from injury, TWICE, in 2008, first to win the Royal Rumble, and second to win the WWE Whatever Title Was on Raw?

Besides, there were more than 12 wrestlin' shows last year. Cena wasn't beating the entire tag team division single-handedly at "Backlash" or something else. [/QUOTE]

Ok, he so he lost FIVE TIMES on Pay Per View...

How many Pay Per Views did he do total in 2008?

And bitching that he was in title matches... he's a main eventer! What do you expect him to do, open the show against Carlito?
 
[quote name='mykevermin']



I honestly don't know that Cena could do a thing to make me like him. Not that he should be concerned with that, as he's paid well enough irrespective of how I feel. The closest I could imagine with people liking him is if they did some DDP thing, where his ribs were busted up for a month or two straight, but he still fought back. Do that. Have him drop the title to some heel that broke his ribs by attacking him with a pipe. But have him lose, but in a "Stone Cold at WM13" kind of way.

Stone Cold lost that match, but nobody noticed, because it did so, so, so, SO fucking much to get him over and establish him as a main event guy the crowd could get behind. And he was the heel![/quote]



They absolutely should've done that ending against Jericho, especially since he was using the real Lion Tamer on him for a few weeks
 
[quote name='Survivor Charlie']

And bitching that he was in title matches... he's a main eventer! What do you expect him to do, open the show against Carlito?[/quote]

It's that kind of logic that's killing WWE for me right now. No, Cena shouldn't be opening a show against Carlito... but he doesn't need to ONLY have the title as his character's driving force. It's the Batista/Smackdown issue, that for literally a year he had NO storyline that wavered from 'me want belt' or 'me defend belt'. Opponent after opponent was thrown at him, with exactly the same storyline. It gets real fucking old. The belt is a crutch for poor writing, period.

Even if they're going after the belt month after month, WRITE A fuckING FEUD. The end of the Michaels/Jericho feud did it perfectly... it wasn't a World Title feud, it was a feud that happened to have title matches in it. That ladder match, personally, was the best title match we've seen in years, because we weren't just rooting for the good guy against the bad guy for a belt, there was a REASON behind it. That's all I ask for.

Wrestling has always been called a 'soap opera for men', but at this point they're giving us neither the wrestling action NOR the character intrigue to keep it interesting to me. I don't even need both... but I need at least one in order to give a shit.
 
I didn't say he had be in the title picture. I just said I expect him to be given top billing in most situations.

Quite frankly, I think he should have turned heel years ago. When his hometown crowd booed him at Summerslam 2006 against Edge, that really should have been all she wrote for his babyface run.

And since the fans have been reacting positively to everything the heelish Randy Orton does, they should just double switch them.

Of course, they won't do that. They'll give Stephanie to Orton and have him win the Rumble, then try like crazy for two months to get the fans to boo Orton and not Cena at Wrestlemania, which won't happen either.
 
Ah... then that's fair. I was complaining about the title matches specifically, I have no illusions about him likely topping a card.

I'm glad you brought up the Orton thing, since I was thinking about it earlier. I'm real curious to see if we eventually reach a point where they're forced into redoing an Austin push with Orton. Orton is in real danger of becoming the tweener anti-hero character, and Cena is so goody-goody that it doesn't work quite right. Sort of sounds like two wrestlers from about a decade ago, which makes me wonder how this all plays out in the coming 1-3 years.
 
[quote name='007']Ah... then that's fair. I was complaining about the title matches specifically, I have no illusions about him likely topping a card.

I'm glad you brought up the Orton thing, since I was thinking about it earlier. I'm real curious to see if we eventually reach a point where they're forced into redoing an Austin push with Orton. Orton is in real danger of becoming the tweener anti-hero character, and Cena is so goody-goody that it doesn't work quite right. Sort of sounds like two wrestlers from about a decade ago, which makes me wonder how this all plays out in the coming 1-3 years.[/QUOTE]

The ironic thing? People would cheer for a heel Cena. They may cheer for a babyface Orton, but maybe not. I think they still have this weird old WWF mentality where they insist that the babyfaces smile all the time. I remember Nash discussing it years ago, where he thought it made no sense whatsoever for his persona to smile and high five folks in the crowd. If you look at Lesnar's goofy hee-haw grin during his babyface run, there's further evidence it's forced. And doesn't make much sense. I could see a stern, angry Cena working to a degree. Whether or not that made his matches enjoyable is another issue.
 
[quote name='mykevermin'] I think they still have this weird old WWF mentality where they insist that the babyfaces smile all the time. I remember Nash discussing it years ago, where he thought it made no sense whatsoever for his persona to smile and high five folks in the crowd. If you look at Lesnar's goofy hee-haw grin during his babyface run, there's further evidence it's forced. [/QUOTE]

Austin did it too. And Savage. And Hogan. And the Warrior. And Bret. And Michaels. And Sid. And the Rock. etc etc.

The only exception I can think of to the rule is the Undertaker. Every baby face champion smiled. I don't get it myself, but for whatever reason that was the way it was done.

The ideal way for Orton to turn face is to stay the same bowed-up cocky asshole he is now only instead of wrestling faces he wrestles heels. Doesn't seem that difficult. Besides, as the babyface Orton has to be in peril most of the match and that works for him and his limited ability. Chinlock use in the WWE would drop by 75% by itself.

Likewise, if Cena turns heel he should stay the same "Ahhh shucks" apple pie eating hero he is now, only be totally delusional about the fans love of him. Think Kurt Angle.
 
They have a problem with jumping the gun way too soon, when it comes to face turns. Sometimes a guy will get a smattering of cheers over a few weeks and then BAM, they knee-jerk turn the guy instead of milking the heat. Orton's 2004 face turn was poorly done. Kennedy's face turn was disastrous.

Oddly enough, I think the most well-executed face turn over the past few years was Batista's. It seemed like they actually learned their lesson from Orton a few months prior. Instead of turning Batista against Evolution right away, they let the story simmer until the crowd was absolutely RABID for him to turn on Triple H. When he finally did, it was a great moment. And like him or not, it turned Batista into one of their biggest draws.

But most of the time they're just too damn impatient!
 
[quote name='Survivor Charlie']The ideal way for Orton to turn face is to stay the same bowed-up cocky asshole he is now only instead of wrestling faces he wrestles heels. Doesn't seem that difficult.[/quote]

Doesn't seem that difficult, but isn't that likely either. Unfortunately. Turning babyface = kissing babies and pressing palms. Like you're running for office.

Likewise, if Cena turns heel he should stay the same "Ahhh shucks" apple pie eating hero he is now, only be totally delusional about the fans love of him. Think Kurt Angle.
Click to expand...

Ooh, now that's an idea!
 
When Shawn Michaels turned heel in 2005 to face Hulk Hogan, he was so perfect in that role that I can't believe they turned him face as soon as the ref slapped three, then had him feud Chris Masters of all people.

It was pathetic. But for a SMALL window of a couple weeks after he jobbed to Hogan, he was exactly what I want John Cena to be now. A dippy, smiling, "I'm heroic so love me" kiss ass heel who was totally oblivious to the fans.

Come to think of it... that's sort of what Cena is now. Only thing they need to do is change who he fights.
 
Perfectly acceptable Impact this week. The main event was quite good, and about what I expected between Angle and Styles - the finish was excellent, with Styles just slamming his face into the table after trying to do to Kurt what he did to Kip at the PPV and failing, then getting Angle Slammed through to give Angle the win and give Kurt the chance to mangle AJ's leg. Good stuff there.

I also liked the tension built up between Sting and Angle, and enjoyed the X division and Abyss/Morgan vs. Beer Money matches. The former had some fast action, but was otherwise forgettable, while the latter FINALLY moved the Abyss/Morgan love story along and amused me with Tenay noting that there were refs around the ring with blood IN CASE there was blood...in a first blood match. I have no idea how such an idiotic line stayed in a pre-taped show, but I'm thankful it did because it was awesome. Oh, and Angle acting like the biggest deal in the world after taking over the HD Impact Zone ruled, too.
 
Associating with a company that will never be competition doesn't do anything bad for them, but WWE associating themselves with an Oscar nominee can only do good, even if it portrays wrestling badly in their eyes.
 
Speaking of that, I saw The Wrestler tonight. It is one depressing movie. I'm pretty sure Aronofsky has seen Beyond the Mat, considering the storyline with his daughter. This is probably the only roll that Rourke's bad plastic surgery actually played to his benefit. A well made movie but definitely no Cinderella ending. BTW, Marissa Tomei has been crazy naked in her last 2 movies. I wonder what that's all about. She looks really good, particularly for someone in her 40's.

[quote name='mykevermin']no kidding? WWE/The Wrestler cross-promotion?

Guess McMahon will ride on anyone's coattails, even if he hates 'em.[/quote]

Cash
Rules
Everything
Around
McMahon
 
[quote name='neocisco']Cash
Rules
Everything
Around
McMahon[/QUOTE]haha!!!! dolla dolla bill yall!

not much Smackdown talk here but I found it quite refreshing to see a good tag-team match between two "real" teams! meanwhile, both of these teams had tag-team belts... haha. They REALLY only need one pair of tag titles. Especially in light of how freely they disregard the brand separation these days.

Seriously, I never noticed until someone else pointed it out, but Miz & Morrison are literally on EVERY SHOW. Like, they actually WRESTLED on Raw, ECW, and Smackdown this week. I mean they're always throwing the brand extension to the wind, but Miz & Morrison in particular are EVERYWHERE!
 
[quote name='BustaUppa']
Seriously, I never noticed until someone else pointed it out, but Miz & Morrison are literally on EVERY SHOW. Like, they actually WRESTLED on Raw, ECW, and Smackdown this week. I mean they're always throwing the brand extension to the wind, but Miz & Morrison in particular are EVERYWHERE![/QUOTE]

I know. WWE leans hard on those two. It's got be more than "because the crowd loves to hate em'". Morrison is good in the ring and Miz has come a LONG way since hanging around with Morrison. They have some credibility in every match they are in, but aren't they going to burn out quickly? There has to be other guys who can get the job done on other shows.
 
Will you guys shut up about the Wrestler and the WWE?

Do you realize how badly this can go?

We could see Ernest Miller vs. Mickey Rourke at Wrestlemania!!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

*grabs bell and sandwich board*

BRING OUT YOUR DEAD! BRING OUT YOUR DEAD!
 
Well they seem to be the only over mid-card heels at the moment. Plus I think Triple H has taken an interest in Morrison (for better or worse). They weren't even completely buried in the small feud with DX, which should be a sign they are well liked.
 
[quote name='neocisco']
Cash
Rules
Everything
Around
McMahon[/QUOTE]

touche. And well said.

I've pointed out that Miz and Morrisson have been on every show for months now.
 
[quote name='Survivor Charlie']Will you guys shut up about the Wrestler and the WWE?

Do you realize how badly this can go?

We could see Ernest Miller vs. Mickey Rourke at Wrestlemania!!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

*grabs bell and sandwich board*

BRING OUT YOUR DEAD! BRING OUT YOUR DEAD![/quote]


i will now prematurely apologize for this....

oh my GOD the wrestler was awesome, went with some friends tonight and we all sat there in amazement the entire time cause it was me and 2 of my close friends who are also really into wrestling, dont wanna spoil anything, seriously, just go
 
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