CAG Infraction System Now Active (Beta/Trial)

Status
Not open for further replies.
[quote name='crystalklear64']I stand by my statement that the CAGcomic was no more a personal attack than my drawing.[/QUOTE]
Stand by it all you want, doesn't make you any less incorrect.
 
[quote name='WhipSmartBanky']Stand by it all you want, doesn't make you any less incorrect.[/QUOTE]
Anyone who saw it as a personal attack only did so because thats what they wanted to see out of it.
 
[quote name='CocheseUGA']
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: you're cracking down on the wrong shit.

This thread: wrong (and don't try to tell me a simple mod edit makes it ok, when piracy talk isn't allowed at all)

This thread: wrong.

This thread: wrong, I'm pretty damn sure of it.

So, I ask again: why is the little nitpicky stuff getting trounced on, with no forethought to the spirit of the rule, and big stuff like that allowed? Whether it's real or not, the perception is that it's there because certain people are benefitting by it.[/quote]

I'm not sure what the "certain people are benefiting" line means, but I have been investigating the above threads and I have locked the Amazon one, cleaned up the XBMC one, and contacted Microsoft about XBLM sharing.

As I mentioned in the OP, this system is currently being tested out. We can change it up as we find out what works (and doesn't) for our community.
I've definitely learned a few things from the goings-on in this thread. Let's all keep our heads on straight and I think we can make this work.
 
[quote name='CheapyD']I'm not sure what the "certain people are benefiting" line means, but I have been investigating the above threads and I have locked the Amazon one, cleaned up the XBMC one, and contacted Microsoft about XBLM sharing.

As I mentioned in the OP, this system is currently being tested out. We can change it up as we find out what works (and doesn't) for our community.
I've definitely learned a few things from the goings-on in this thread. Let's all keep our heads on straight and I think we can make this work.[/QUOTE]

Thank you. That's all I wanted (same treatment across the board, and a willingness to listen to the base).
 
[quote name='Rocko']How can you say that when you're guilty of the same?[/QUOTE]

I have read every single complaint and have tried to address people's concerns to the best of my empowerment, despite the fact that much of what I have read are complaints for the sake of bitching or outright paranoid lunacy. I never said you'd like what I had to say or even that I could give you results that you would be happy with. But at least you weren't ignored. Take that for what it's worth.

But if he does it again, will he get punished beyond a warning?

Yes.
Click to expand...

I've spoken my peace with regards to Djkunai's problem.

And that's the problem. It doesn't matter if it's a warning or not, it's the fact that action was taken against him for such a thing. You seem to be missing this point.
Click to expand...

No, I see the point. I just don't agree with it and that pisses everyone off. Nothing I can do about that.
 
It still boggles my mind that so many people have such a hard time following rules and being civil to each other.
I know it's the internet and insulting others is the cool easy epeen thing to do, but seriously. Is it really that hard to act like a decent person and read instructions?

All these infractions and penalties would be moot if people didn't try to stretch the rules.
 
[quote name='Noodle Pirate!']It still boggles my mind that so many people have such a hard time following rules and being civil to each other.
I know it's the internet and insulting others is the cool easy epeen thing to do, but seriously. Is it really that hard to act like a decent person and read instructions?

All these infractions and penalties would be moot if people didn't try to stretch the rules.[/quote]


Agreed, also people wonder why the mods keep everything quiet, it's because no matter what they are wrong right?:roll: I mean just look at this thread, it's just a simple discussion thread of the new system. Already we have people in here crying because they got a point that they don't feel was deserved. Maybe you should grow up some if you got a point, change the way you are/post. If you got a point for trolling, there is a reason why you got it, the mods didn't just decide hey lets give so and so a point for trolling because I feel like it. You should consider yourself lucky if you got a warning to start with, as thats a privilege not a right and if you push it then you get what you deserve. Also people wonder why there isn't a banned user thread? Perfect examples in here, I'd keep everything on the low down to.
 
[quote name='Silent Assassin120']Agreed, also people wonder why the mods keep everything quiet, it's because no matter what they are wrong right?:roll: I mean just look at this thread, it's just a simple discussion thread of the new system. Already we have people in here crying because they got a point that they don't feel was deserved. Maybe you should grow up some if you got a point, change the way you are/post. If you got a point for trolling, there is a reason why you got it, the mods didn't just decide hey lets give so and so a point for trolling because I feel like it. You should consider yourself lucky if you got a warning to start with, as thats a privilege not a right and if you push it then you get what you deserve. Also people wonder why there isn't a banned user thread? Perfect examples in here, I'd keep everything on the low down to.[/QUOTE]

Really? We've seen warnings given that in the past, even mods were guilty of (especially the trolling/disruptive post one).

Is it expected for everyone to be able to change their posting habits overnight, when some of those habits were not only allowed before, but even encouraged?
 
You can only see your own infractions (on your profile page).
Most of the time, the posts would be deleted so seeing other's infractions wouldn't serve much purpose.
 
[quote name='CocheseUGA']Really? We've seen warnings given that in the past, even mods were guilty of (especially the trolling/disruptive post one).

Is it expected for everyone to be able to change their posting habits overnight, when some of those habits were not only allowed before, but even encouraged?[/quote]


The only thing that is expected is to just follow the rules, it's just really that simple. The mods do not have to give you a warning contrary to popular belief a warning is a privilege not a right. If it was allowed before and or encouraged it is not allowed anymore. That is also why this topic/system exists to let you know what wont be tolerated, and how many points it will cost you from now on. So if that means you have to change your posting habits then so be it. How hard is it not to personal attack someone? All the rules are pretty simple to follow and if your lucky enough to get a warning then cut the shit right then and there.
 
Lots of warranty fraud talk going on in the "my 360 died" topic...

Also I'm not sure why so many people are ragging on my XBMC topic when they themselves have posted in it and benefited from its contents. The topic itself did not have anything encouraging piracy or facilitating it or anything of the sort. I also don't see why some of the things in that topic were censored (such as the name of some of the modchip). Just FYI, but modchips themselves are not illegal because they ship with a bios that does not allow the bypassing of copyright protection.

If having a few names was such a problem, then I'm not sure why the thread was deemed fine since late November and is only now coming under scrutiny.
 
[quote name='Silent Assassin120']The only thing that is expected is to just follow the rules, it's just really that simple. The mods do not have to give you a warning contrary to popular belief a warning is a privilege not a right. If it was allowed before and or encouraged it is not allowed anymore. That is also why this topic/system exists to let you know what wont be tolerated, and how many points it will cost you from now on. So if that means you have to change your posting habits then so be it. How hard is it not to personal attack someone? All the rules are pretty simple to follow and if your lucky enough to get a warning then cut the shit right then and there.[/QUOTE]

I compare that situation favorably to this one:

You and your boss sit around at work for years having beers in his office after every shift. It's all good. One day, he comes in, sees you holding a beer in his office and tells you having alcohol on the job is punishable up to and including termination.

A lot of people don't even know this is going on, right or not. I'm simply advocating that when visitors to your site are the only reason the site has had this success, you may want to take their concerns and input into consideration before such rules are made and/or enforced.

It's all well and good to be 'right', but at what cost?
 
[quote name='Silent Assassin120']The only thing that is expected is to just follow the rules, it's just really that simple. The mods do not have to give you a warning contrary to popular belief a warning is a privilege not a right. If it was allowed before and or encouraged it is not allowed anymore. That is also why this topic/system exists to let you know what wont be tolerated, and how many points it will cost you from now on. So if that means you have to change your posting habits then so be it. How hard is it not to personal attack someone? All the rules are pretty simple to follow and if your lucky enough to get a warning then cut the shit right then and there.[/quote]

moz-screenshot-7.jpg
photo.img
"Establishment establishment, you always know what's best! Hey shut up and follow the rules!"

I don't think people have a problem with following the rules. Without a set of rules this site (and mods doing the thankless job of cleaning things up) it would become a spammer and thread crappers paradise. The problem people are having is that the rules are not black and white. There's a lot of subjectivity and CAGs just want to get an idea of what's acceptable, what's not, and they want the rules enforced equally across the board. IMHO.
 
Now, how is this for subjectivity? In this thread: http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4146001&posted=1#post4146001

I posted a simple question/comment expressing my confusion at the OP (now deleted):

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sporadic
I ended up buying Saw, Silent Hill and Brothers Grimm for 44,14 EUROs shipped ($67.04) which is $1.84 cheaper than buying the American Blu-Rays from Amazon :)

No offense, but...you went through all that hassle and imported movies on a discontinued format...to save less than $2 on a $70 purchase?

That's just...silly. :applause:

I mean, I'm still buying HD movies...but they're at BlockBuster and $10 each, or less if I have trade-in credit...
Click to expand...

And, THIS was flagged as disruptive and trolling? Questioning a deal as "silly" because it involves importing from Europe for a 1.8% savings on MSRP? No profanity, no personal attacks, just simple bewilderment. I now know, after posting there AGAIN that there is more to it than simply the $2 savings that wasn't reflected in the OP.

I'm sorry I attempted to discuss the deal posted. Maybe I should have also gotten points for posting in the wrong forum by attempting to DISCUSS in the DEALS forum, too.

Please, if an offhand comment like THAT is "trolling," you really haven't been on the internet very long.

I'm sorry the Mod that happened to be trying to snag the "deal" didn't get it and decided to get all butthurt and hyper-sensitive and claim my post was violating some non-existent "don't question anything" policy that I have yet to see.
 
[quote name='Slim Gatsby']Now, how is this for subjectivity? In this thread: http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4146001&posted=1#post4146001

I posted a simple question/comment expressing my confusion at the OP (now deleted):



And, THIS was flagged as disruptive and trolling? Questioning a deal as "silly" because it involves importing from Europe for a 1.8% savings on MSRP? No profanity, no personal attacks, just simple bewilderment. I now know, after posting there AGAIN that there is more to it than simply the $2 savings that wasn't reflected in the OP.

I'm sorry I attempted to discuss the deal posted. Maybe I should have also gotten points for posting in the wrong forum by attempting to DISCUSS in the DEALS forum, too.

Please, if an offhand comment like THAT is "trolling," you really haven't been on the internet very long.

I'm sorry the Mod that happened to be trying to snag the "deal" didn't get it and decided to get all butthurt and hyper-sensitive and claim my post was violating some non-existent "don't question anything" policy that I have yet to see.[/QUOTE]

By chance, were you given the infraction by LinkinPrime?

If so, I can see this as being a problem since he is a huge HD-DVD fanboy.

But, I'll leave it at that until you reply.
 
That's really lame that he would let his bias make an impact on his moderating.

Any other mod on this site wouldn't have thought twice about your post, but he is overly sensitive when it comes to HD-DVDs.

I would take this up with Cheapy himself so similar situations aren't handled as poorly as Linkin has shown today.
 
And it definitely isn't the first time his affinity for HD-DVD has impacted his posts in a negative way.

I'm sure you recall the whole DVD deal issue when he refused to note Blu-Rays on sale.
 
[quote name='Chitown021']
moz-screenshot-7.jpg
photo.img
"Establishment establishment, you always know what's best! Hey shut up and follow the rules!"

I don't think people have a problem with following the rules. Without a set of rules this site (and mods doing the thankless job of cleaning things up) it would become a spammer and thread crappers paradise. The problem people are having is that the rules are not black and white. There's a lot of subjectivity and CAGs just want to get an idea of what's acceptable, what's not, and they want the rules enforced equally across the board. IMHO.[/quote]


The rules seem pretty "black and white" to me.


Posted in Wrong Forum:

Don't post in the wrong forum, you wouldn't put a trading thread in a system thread. PS3, X360, Wii board ect.

Signature Too Large: Don't have a huge ass signature. In the TOS it tells you the max height and width of sigs allowed here.

Multiple Trade Lists: Don't make more then one trade list in the trading board.

Trolling / Disruptive Posts: Don't go out of your way to be a troll. Don't post stuff like "This game sucks, you all suck for liking this game" Ect in say a Gears of War 2 thread.

Spamming / Self-Promotion: Don't start spamming the boards with your websites.

Personal Attacks / Harassment: Don't insult other people, if they annoy you add them to your ignore list and be done with it. Don't post something like "Go kill yourself" to someone.

Inappropriate Content: Pretty simple enough to post link to porn sites, or anything else that is not appropriate.

Facilitating Game Piracy: I am pretty sure this is the only one that is being questioned on what they will allow and what they wont allow. I don't think they have came to that decision just yet. Personally I don't have anything to do/talk about piracy as I just avoid it 100%. I suggest everyone else do the same.
 
[quote name='CocheseUGA']I compare that situation favorably to this one:

You and your boss sit around at work for years having beers in his office after every shift. It's all good. One day, he comes in, sees you holding a beer in his office and tells you having alcohol on the job is punishable up to and including termination.

A lot of people don't even know this is going on, right or not. I'm simply advocating that when visitors to your site are the only reason the site has had this success, you may want to take their concerns and input into consideration before such rules are made and/or enforced.

It's all well and good to be 'right', but at what cost?[/quote]


It seems to me that they ARE taking people concerns/input into consideration. Daphatty has replied to 90% of everyone that has had issues about this. If they weren't doing that then they just would announced this system and locked the thread and been done with it. The rules have always been enforced, but it went on behind the scenes. Most posts that were trolling and what not were just deleted, until one day you logged in and saw you were banned, and you had no clue why you were banned. This way you know ahead of time of whats going on and how close you are to getting banned.
 
[quote name='Slim Gatsby']Well, I didn't want to name names, but it was indeed from the mod in the thread.[/QUOTE]

Thats bullshit, and its not the first time that has happened.
 
Too bad, there's been some lively discussion.

Hearsay? The forums have been crawling with the trolling/disruptive posts since I can remember. In the OT, even some mods have called people stupid, or other such remarks.

When you say the rules have always been enforced, that's all inclusive. They 100% have not, even if it only concerns the troll/disruptive portion of those rules. There's been abusive behavior on these boards for a long time, it's not readily enforced.
 
I'd also like to note the Linkin has responded in the OTT sarcastically to the mentioning of this issue, but apparently doesn't want to address it here.
 
At this point, I don't really care about Linkin's take on it.

I would just like to hear what Cheapy has to say about it.
 
[quote name='Rocko']I'd also like to note the Linkin has responded in the OTT sarcastically to the mentioning of this issue, but apparently doesn't want to address it here.[/quote]

He also sent me a particularly accusatory and non sequitur PM regarding my issue with my so-called "infraction," claiming that I was trying to start a Blu-Ray vs. HD debate and insulting people who were buying HD DVDs.
 
[quote name='Slim Gatsby']He also sent me a particularly accusatory and non sequitur PM regarding my issue with my so-called "infraction," claiming that I was trying to start a Blu-Ray vs. HD debate and insulting people who were buying HD DVDs.[/quote]

Oh no he di'int!
 
[quote name='CocheseUGA']Too bad, there's been some lively discussion.

Hearsay? The forums have been crawling with the trolling/disruptive posts since I can remember. In the OT, even some mods have called people stupid, or other such remarks.

When you say the rules have always been enforced, that's all inclusive. They 100% have not, even if it only concerns the troll/disruptive portion of those rules. There's been abusive behavior on these boards for a long time, it's not readily enforced.[/quote]


Hear say as in proof of a mod saying " We don't really enforce the rules" if you don't have proof of a mod saying that then I don't believe it. Like I said they don't do shit out in public, most of the modding takes place behind closed doors. I strictly remember Daphatty saying this and know it to be real. Also the OTT isn't modded the same way as other boards, as they let more shit slide in there but it isn't bullet proof either. You have your opinion and I have mine it's obvious neither of us are going to change our opinions so we might as well let this drop. IMO they have enforced the rules pretty well, and it will only continue to get better with this new system.
 
It either happened as I say it did, or it didn't. Either way, it's not opinion.

What I'm discussing happened outside the OTT, in the OT forum. But a mod shouldn't insult someone, even if they're in the OTT. Especially if they received no insults to set them off (like what happened to me last night).
 
[quote name='Silent Assassin120']No thanks, I don't waste my time in one of those and I don't believe that hear say either.[/QUOTE]

:???::???::???:

[quote name='CocheseUGA']Too bad, there's been some lively discussion.

Hearsay? The forums have been crawling with the trolling/disruptive posts since I can remember. In the OT, even some mods have called people stupid, or other such remarks.

When you say the rules have always been enforced, that's all inclusive. They 100% have not, even if it only concerns the troll/disruptive portion of those rules. There's been abusive behavior on these boards for a long time, it's not readily enforced.[/QUOTE]

I may remember this wrong but didn't Sneaky Penguin go off on people quite regularly
 
[quote name='jlarlee']I may remember this wrong but didn't Sneaky Penguin go off on people quite regularly[/quote]

Yes. There is quite the selection of elitist assholes here who make it a point to always point out how much better they are than everyone else.

On a different note, my only real problem with the rules is that we can't discuss piracy. I've always been quite shocked that we can't discuss mod chips, as they aren't exclusively used for piracy. Before I bought a Japanese PS2, I was going to buy a mod chip to play import games. There is no reason to continue this ban on mod chip discussion. While I am not going to suggest that Cheap Ass Gamer promote piracy, I really do not see why we can't discuss it. Many of the methods used for piracy can lead to other (non-illegal) things, and those should be allowed.
 
[quote name='prmononoke']Yes. There is quite the selection of elitist assholes here who make it a point to always point out how much better they are than everyone else.

On a different note, my only real problem with the rules is that we can't discuss piracy. I've always been quite shocked that we can't discuss mod chips, as they aren't exclusively used for piracy. Before I bought a Japanese PS2, I was going to buy a mod chip to play import games. There is no reason to continue this ban on mod chip discussion. While I am not going to suggest that Cheap Ass Gamer promote piracy, I really do not see why we can't discuss it. Many of the methods used for piracy can lead to other (non-illegal) things, and those should be allowed.[/QUOTE]

More often than not, mod chips are used for pirating. Talking about them openly would more than likely lead down the road Cheapy does not want to go.
 
Pretty sure according to Cheapy that we're allowed to discuss pirating stuff, we just can't provide links on where to obtain anything.

So you can have a mod chip discussion but you can't provide a link to where to buy one. Although I think most mods just automatically up and delete/lock a thread that has anything to do with piracy. Even homebrew threads get shit-canned for having a piracy association.
 
[quote name='zewone']More often than not, mod chips are used for pirating. Talking about them openly would more than likely lead down the road Cheapy does not want to go.[/quote]

Yes...that does tend to be a slippery slope, unfortunately.
 
[quote name='prmononoke']Yes. There is quite the selection of elitist assholes here who make it a point to always point out how much better they are than everyone else.

On a different note, my only real problem with the rules is that we can't discuss piracy. I've always been quite shocked that we can't discuss mod chips, as they aren't exclusively used for piracy. Before I bought a Japanese PS2, I was going to buy a mod chip to play import games. There is no reason to continue this ban on mod chip discussion. While I am not going to suggest that Cheap Ass Gamer promote piracy, I really do not see why we can't discuss it. Many of the methods used for piracy can lead to other (non-illegal) things, and those should be allowed.[/quote]

In the latest CAGCAST I seem to remember Cheapy saying that we could discuss piracy in general terms but we're not allowed to give specifics about how it's done. No specific instructions as to how to mod a system or providing links to sites that would help a person do it for example.
 
[quote name='zewone']More often than not, mod chips are used for pirating. Talking about them openly would more than likely lead down the road Cheapy does not want to go.[/quote]

Be that as it may, it's unfortunate that a product with one nefarious use cannot be discussed when it has so many legitimate uses.

[quote name='yukine']Pretty sure according to Cheapy that we're allowed to discuss pirating stuff, we just can't provide links on where to obtain anything.

So you can have a mod chip discussion but you can't provide a link to where to buy one. Although I think most mods just automatically up and delete/lock a thread that has anything to do with piracy. Even homebrew threads get shit-canned for having a piracy association.[/quote]

That is my main problem with it. While a quick Google search can lead to information about mod chips and where to get them, I want to be able to discuss the various methods with people I trust, which I can find here. If we post the name of a mod chip, that seems like cause for an infraction (in the mods' eyes, at least). Being able to compare the products with people on here would be quite useful.

I realize we can't always get what we want, and it is Cheapy's site, but still. In my eyes, the legitimate uses of mod chips would be, at least for me, the justification of mod chip discussion. Besides, we all know that Cheapy downloads video (porn, at least, and I assume movies) illegally, so I am pretty sure that he doesn't have a problem with piracy himself.

[quote name='Chitown021']In the latest CAGCAST I seem to remember Cheapy saying that we could discuss piracy in general terms but we're not allowed to give specifics about how it's done. No specific instructions as to how to mod a system or providing links to sites that would help a person do it for example.[/quote]

In the XBox media center thread, Cheapy removed the mere mention of a mod chip. That seems to go against what you just said (I'm not saying you're wrong, or that Cheapy is, rather, there seems to be no real set rule on the matter).
 
[quote name='gareman']What I don't get, in particular--the target clearance/"trade" postings is, why is "trading/request" the only thing being targeted?

Shouldn't someone get a warning for:

"oh folklore is sub-15 is this game good/worth it?"
(game discussion)

"Has anyone seen title X at X target?"
(deal request/ regional)

"I picked up X and y for xx.xx! at target tonite. I can't believe they had this on clearance, I never find the titles listed on this thread"

(shopping discussion/bragging)

etc.

All I am saying if someone can't find something listed on the Target thread or can find a ton its not off subject to request/supply someone with information. Is it about a clearance game and is about target? YES. Its not off subject.

I know people are going to say, "well the point of the thread is to list target finds." That is BS because I would be willing to bet 95% of the post on that thread is:
"I got this game"
"Yea I saw that price too"
"X title is clearance but still over MSRP"
"Is that game with xx.xx dollars fun."
"Man I can't find this"

and on and on.

This system would make sense if it was a website (if we were members than sent deals to mods and were posted on a page), but this is a "FORUM'. Its like a conversation its going to get a little off subject, people are going to mention and respond to things people say, and people are going to make jokes etc.[/quote]

I would really like to hear a response to my above post. It seems that you want to eliminate all non-relevant, discussion, and responses to a topic. That is fine, but why instead of enacting this point system that , why not just create a main page were all confirmed, ymmv, etc are just posted as links to lists (like the first post of the thread like the k-mart one). Like I said, send messages to MODs they post them on pages. I do not want this I enjoy the forum styles, but if you want to eliminate all the things that are listed as infractions, this system will just make it very dry with no personility. Personality and openess are the benfits of a forum. On topic, objective, dry information is for a news blog/site.
 
Did RyogAkari get banned or something? His profile disappeared - I tried to leave him feedback for a purchase, but it links to nothing.
 
[quote name='shrike4242']I guess this is the result of 3-5 points worth of infractions, from the custom title?

http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/member.php?u=88962[/quote]

I believe so. I think it was stated earlier in the thread that infractions are a private matter and the only way you'll know someone is in trouble is by the custom title.

[quote name='prmononoke']
In the XBox media center thread, Cheapy removed the mere mention of a mod chip. That seems to go against what you just said (I'm not saying you're wrong, or that Cheapy is, rather, there seems to be no real set rule on the matter).[/quote]

Hmm interesting... I was listening to the CAGCAST earlier this afternoon and at one point Cheapy and Wombat get into a discussion about talking about piracy in the forums. I think Cheapy will allow general discussion of piracy but discussing mod chips might me be to specific and therefore is not allowed at all.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
bread's done
Back
Top