Oh no! GGT #37's dark past has come back to haunt it!

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[quote name='ihadFG']That's actually a fair complaint. I guess whether you like the game or not boils down to how much you can forgive the gameplay in favor of enjoying the writing.[/QUOTE]

Yep. That's why I can't get into the genre. Games are all about gameplay for me, story/writing is just the icing on the cake.

And I just don't dig the gameplay in text adventures. Games have to be pretty action oriented for me to enjoy them. I've never dug games where you're just picking options from menus etc.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Yep. That's why I can't get into the genre. Games are all about gameplay for me, story/writing is just the icing on the cake.

And I just don't dig the gameplay in text adventures. Games have to be pretty action oriented for me to enjoy them. I've never dug games where you're just picking options from menus etc.[/QUOTE]

Same, bro. If I wanted a good story, I'd read a book. Since I read all day, I don't want to read when I game. And since I make choices all day, I don't want to do that either. When it's time to game, I want to just shut my brain off and watch shit blow up. :bouncy:
 
There's plenty of legitimate reasons to dislike the phoenix wright style of game. Personal preference being one. What JSP is doing is being reductionism in his criticism rather than being more reasonable about the game's qualities which don't personally appeal to him. Basically because he doesn't want to read a lot of the story when playing a game doesn't make the game bad automatically.

But to imply that no game can have a story that compares to a book is pretty ignorant, I think. There's nothing stopping someone from creating great characters and interesting situations for them to be in. It seems odd to me that anyone would not want that or not want developers to aim for that, instead limiting themselves to "blowing shit up", which some games do very well, but there should be more available than that.

I think Alan Wake had an excellent story and really helped drive me to continue playing that game. The gameplay was good on it's own, but the story and atmosphere were as big a part of enjoying that game.
 
So I'm going to buy the first Left 4 Dead instead of going straight to the sequel. I'll get that next.

Anyways, any of you up for playing it later?
 
[quote name='hankmecrankme']Same, bro. If I wanted a good story, I'd read a book. Since I read all day, I don't want to read when I game. And since I make choices all day, I don't want to do that either. When it's time to game, I want to just shut my brain off and watch shit blow up. :bouncy:[/QUOTE]

Yep. Books, movies, TV shows etc. take care of my need for experiencing great stores.

When I play games I want to largely shut my brain off and veg out. Story can help with that by making it more immersive. But it's moot if I don't like the gameplay.
 
[quote name='jer7583']But to imply that no game can have a story that compares to a book is pretty ignorant, I think. There's nothing stopping someone from creating great characters and interesting situations for them to be in. It seems odd to me that anyone would not want that or not want developers to aim for that, instead limiting themselves to "blowing shit up", which some games do very well, but there should be more available than that.
[/QUOTE]

Dude, Gears of War has a great story. The whole part about Dom's wife tugged at my heartstrings as he shot her in the head with a magnum that was 3x the size of her head. :D

The problem is, most developers do limit themselves to "blowing shit up" simply because they slap some cliché storyline you've seen 1000x before. Rockstar takes all of its storylines and plot twists from movies. So original. So when the story is lame and been done before, and isn't even done well, you have to resort to liking a game for its gameplay. This is the norm, not the exception.

And when somebody does try to craft a deep story, people cry about "OMG TOO MANY CUTSCENES!!"

The last game that had a story and characters that I gave a shit about or can remember anything about was Heavy Rain.
 
I think games can have great stories. I'll never like them as well as movies, books, tv shows etc. as I'm not big on interactive storytelling. But that's just me, and why I'll always be more into those things than gaming.

But I agree it's silly to think gaming can't be a great medium for storytelling. It certainly can, and I can admit that even though it doesn't appeal to me much on the story telling front as my use of games is just for mindless fun.
 
I don't think that a focus on story necessarily takes anything away from a game. I think it's one of those things that can only make a game better, not worse. If the story sucks, you ignore it or skip it. if it's good, the game is going to stick with you that much more.

It's not like the writers are the same guys working on the game mechanics these days anyway, so what they do shouldn't limit or change what the other side of development does.

And I'm pretty sure most screenwriters and directors take just as much from literature as Rockstar takes from film. Most everything these days is some derivative of something else, so that's not really a point to argue.

I look at it like Just Cause 2 vs Red Dead Redemption. I love both of those games, but for different reasons. I'll play Just Cause 2 with a podcast or other music on because the story is dogshit and I just want to surf on planes and blow things up. With Red Dead the story does matter so I'll pay that much more attention to what's going on, but it's still fun to ride horses around and get in shootouts.

But in the end, Red Dead is the game that's going to stick with me and be more memorable because of that story and those characters.
 
Games are the literary equivalent of cheap pulp fiction. Some are fun, most are trash. And you'll never gain or learn anything real from them.
 
[quote name='jer7583']I don't think that a focus on story necessarily takes anything away from a game. I think it's one of those things that can only make a game better, not worse. If the story sucks, you ignore it or skip it. if it's good, the game is going to stick with you that much more.
[/QUOTE]

Agreed, mostly.

It's just a matter of finding a way to tell the story that doesn't involve tons of cut scenes, long passages of listening to dialogue etc.

I think the Mass Effect games (and other similar RPGs) have a good balance. Having the dialogue and choice options is more active. I enjoy that, where as I don't like JRPGs where I'm just reading tons of dialogue and banging through it trying to get back to the gameplay.
 
[quote name='dallow']Games are the literary equivalent of cheap pulp fiction. Some are fun, most are trash. And you'll never gain or learn anything real from them.[/QUOTE]

Amen.
 
I think it gets a little ridiculous sometimes when people complain about too much story in games because to me it seems like 95% of games released are mostly about the gameplay. People who don't care at all about story should stop playing the games dedicated to story because it will only lead to them complaining about too many cutscenes. If you only care about shooting things mindlessly, don't waste your time with story-driven games. People shouldn't play Metal Gear Solid if they just want to shoot things mindlessly without any cutscenes, there are plenty of other games that are much better for that.

One of the great things about the video game market being so huge is that we can have both story driven games and fun action games. In order for games to become better at story-telling, we have to allow some companies to try to tell better stories, even if they are still mostly crap. Gaming is still a very young medium, it will get better for stories over time as long as we let the developers learn to walk before they run. It's inevitable that they will fall flat on their faces quite a few times before they get the hang of it.
 
[quote name='ihadFG']I think it gets a little ridiculous sometimes when people complain about too much story in games because to me it seems like 95% of games released are mostly about the gameplay.[/QUOTE]

I really, really, REALLY wish this were true. We might actually have more fun games then.
 
[quote name='distgfx']I really, really, REALLY wish this were true. We might actually have more fun games then.[/QUOTE]

Hey, I'm not saying that the developers succeed in fun gameplay :lol:. (especially when they are rushed out the door while trying to copy the latest successful multiplayer shooter)

I'm just saying that most don't care about story at all. I think this is made apparent by the amount of generic FPS games released in the past few years.
 
[quote name='dallow']Games are the literary equivalent of cheap pulp fiction. Some are fun, most are trash. And you'll never gain or learn anything real from them.[/QUOTE]

there are games that attempt to get across an author's message or a certain emotion but they're mostly smaller indie games, and they're not usually very successful, both artistically and financially.

I just don't think it's impossible for a game to have real significance or to address social issues. It's just not what makes money and that's what any big publisher is after.

It's kind of a cycle that we can't get out of. The people who watch powerful, emotionally moving films or read books that have cultural significance don't play games because no games provide that kind of "entertainment". No games provide that kind of entertainment because people who want that aren't playing games.

Maybe someday it'll be different and we'll have more of a balance between real "mature" types of games but it's so much easier to interact with a game world by means of a gun or a sword than through thoughtful dialog and powerful dramatic performances. And it sells better too.
 
I remember Xenosaga having tons of story (the series), but that's one reason I love Xenosaga so much (my favorite series last gen).

Story lines are still important for some games, especially the emotional ones that made me teary eyed.
 
you are a parody of yourself

xenosaga/gears are both shitty

I have a code for a copy of MS Pac Man for XBLA from the controller/game pack I bought at TRU.

Who wants it? (not JSP)

Post your favorite game based solely on story/characters and I'll pick one
 
[quote name='jer7583']there are games that attempt to get across an author's message or a certain emotion but they're mostly smaller indie games, and they're not usually very successful, both artistically and financially.

I just don't think it's impossible for a game to have real significance or to address social issues. It's just not what makes money and that's what any big publisher is after.

It's kind of a cycle that we can't get out of. The people who watch powerful, emotionally moving films or read books that have cultural significance don't play games because no games provide that kind of "entertainment". No games provide that kind of entertainment because people who want that aren't playing games.

Maybe someday it'll be different and we'll have more of a balance between real "mature" types of games but it's so much easier to interact with a game world by means of a gun or a sword than through thoughtful dialog and powerful dramatic performances. And it sells better too.[/QUOTE]

I think you hit the nail on the head with the whole money issue. That's exactly why you won't see Activision releasing the next Braid anytime soon. There's just too much money to be made selling the next Call of Duty sequel for them to care about making a game that actually says something meaningful. I kind of disagree with your assertion that no one who likes emotionally moving films cares about games (because I am one of those people and I know of plenty others like that). As the game industry grows though, I think there is a growing market for art games though just like there is a small but enthusiastic market for art films. It will just take time for this market to grow big enough for anyone other than small indie devs to even attempt to make those type of games.
 
Final Fantasy VI - Pretty generic evil empire vs rebels story but with an incredible cast of characters with a wide variety of motivations for coming along for the ride. Also no whiny Hope-types.
 
I'd like the XBLA code but I really cannot think of a game I liked purely for the story...

I guess it's a toss-up between Resident Evil 1 and Final Fantasy 7, because although they have been exceeded in terms of story and presentation, they were super original for their time (to me, at least). I also liked Fallout for the story, although I know overall it was kind of generic, it had some cool things I hadn't seen in other games.
 
Well I know this is probably not going to get me the code because from what I've understood Jer isn't too fond of the PS3, but I think as far as story AND characters, I'm going to throw my two cents in and say Folklore. It's a truly underrated game that has such a variety of characters and the story is very interestering.
 
[quote name='jer7583']Post your favorite game based solely on story/characters and I'll pick one[/QUOTE]

Hrmm. Hard to say.

I could name a tons of characters I like, but it's hard to find a story where they all just meld together.

Probably Metal Gear Solid -- It's like a james bond film in a video game -- it tries to be reality based and somewhat plausible but it's got memorable villains like Psycho Mantis, and Sniper Wolf. Token Badasses like Snake and the Cyborg Ninja. Double crosses, the story is told really well by mixing the cutscenes and radio transmissions... yeah, that's probably my favorite based solely on characters/story.
 
[quote name='Jimbo Slice']I'd like the XBLA code but I really cannot think of a game I liked purely for the story...

I guess it's a toss-up between Resident Evil 1 and Final Fantasy 7, because although they have been exceeded in terms of story and presentation, they were super original for their time (to me, at least). I also liked Fallout for the story, although I know overall it was kind of generic, it had some cool things I hadn't seen in other games.[/QUOTE]

Are you sure you liked RE1 for it's story? It had a great atmosphere, but the story/writing were b-movie cheese.

--

For me I'd have to say Hotel Dusk was a game that I like solely for the story, though I'll admit it can't compete with a great mystery novel. And I also really enjoyed MGS3's story and Bioshock's story/backstory, but I liked those games for more reasons than just the story.
 
[quote name='Halo05']Final Fantasy VI - Pretty generic evil empire vs rebels story but with an incredible cast of characters with a wide variety of motivations for coming along for the ride. Also no whiny Hope-types.[/QUOTE]

I don't know -- I thought have the cast was pretty whiny. Locke/Celes/Terra/Relm/Setzer/Cyan were all whining about something. I liked some of them, yeah, and hated the rest, but yeah, I'd cast them as "whiny". :p
 
[quote name='ihadFG']Are you sure you liked RE1 for it's story? It had a great atmosphere, but the story/writing were b-movie cheese.

For me I'd have to say Hotel Dusk was a game that I like solely for the story, though I'll admit it can't compete with a great mystery novel. And I also really enjoyed MGS3's story and Bioshock's story/backstory, but I liked those games for more reasons than just the story.[/QUOTE]

Just because you also liked the gameplay doesn't disqualify it, I don't think. :p
 
[quote name='ihadFG']Are you sure you liked RE1 for it's story? It had a great atmosphere, but the story/writing were b-movie cheese.

For me I'd have to say Hotel Dusk was a game that I like solely for the story, though I'll admit it can't compete with a great mystery novel. And I also really enjoyed MGS3's story and Bioshock's story/backstory, but I liked those games for more reasons than just the story.[/QUOTE]

The dialogue may have been, but Wesker's deception and the whole idea of Umbrella was cool. Plus it came out early in the PS1 days so the fact that it had voices and some actual characters was cool to me.
 
My favorite games for story and characters is Metal Gear. I absolutely adore Solid Snake and the trials and tribulations he goes through.
 
[quote name='jer7583']Personal preference being one. What JSP is doing is being reductionism in his criticism rather than being more reasonable about the game's qualities which don't personally appeal to him. Basically because he doesn't want to read a lot of the story when playing a game doesn't make the game bad automatically.[/QUOTE]

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I don't mind story but the story scenes in PW that I've seen are annoying. When the screen shakes violently and flashes every ten seconds so a character can switch from normal face to ANGRY SURPRISED FACE is lame. And the little psychic girl was stupid.
 
Story and characters alone, huh? Wind Waker. That game had a lot of really fleshed out characters.

1000g in Sonic Racing, it really didn't take long, maybe 13 hours (it could've gone about 2 hours faster if I didn't just set it to auto pilot for a few hours). I guess I'll go back to Lara Croft and try to do some more challenges.
 
My vote for best characters/story would probably go to Silent Hill 2, like the gameplay isn't all that great (just really basic combat and the controls are (intentionally?) kind of sluggish); but the atmosphere and the characters are amazing... and the ending blew my mind.
 
How about I give 24 hours from my post and assign numbers to the posts then use a random number generator? Just to keep it fair. You can add it in a regular GGT nonsense post too guys.

What cheska? I love sony! ;)
 
Just kidding jsp I'll assign you a number

If anyone wants a 48 hour XBL trial that's on the card too. here it is.

KVCB2-F72YJ-KF3MJ-HFGBF-GHWFG

I would give away the Geometry Wars and Lumines Live too but they came on a disc with Bomberman.. for some reason Ms PacMan was the only actual download game.
 
I wish my best buys had Sonic All Star Racing in stock. I really liked the demo. $20 is the right price.
 
I wish I had a Best Buy.

Can someone link to me how to cancel my ECA thing? I know they fixed it eventually so you could do it online.
 
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[quote name='Jesus_S_Preston']I wish I had a Best Buy.

Can someone link to me how to cancel my ECA thing? I know they fixed it eventually so you could do it online.[/QUOTE]

I would, but mine is supposedly cancelled, so I can't log in to figure out where to navigate to.
 
Apparently I need to change my XBL GT. I was pretty surprised at this, seeing as I almost never play online, and have had the tag for a couple years.

I'm hoping they won't make me change it, as I like having the same username across gaming communities.
 
[quote name='SL4IN']My favorite game based on characters/story is Half-Life 2.[/QUOTE]

That's a good one...somehow I forgot about that. But I'd say it definitely leans more towards characters than story for me, although I guess I'd consider characters as part of the whole story package, so that would work.

And this is only somewhat related, but I love the way in which the Left 4 Dead games tell there stories through the writing on the walls. It's a great way to tell a (minimalist) story without cutscenes.

And while Portal's plot is nothing special, the writing for Glados is fantastic. Valve knows their stuff when it comes to writing for games.
 
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