Wii MotionPlus and Wii Sports Resort - General Info - Out now

[quote name='Koggit']so this $20 add-on doesnt fix existing games?

seriously?

wtf...[/QUOTE]

Why would you think the Motion Plus data would "automagically" integrate into existing code?
 
it makes sense to assume the imprecision is due to shoddy hardware rather than shoddy code -- afterall, they're releasing a peripheral to fix it, not a software update. i don't understand why you think 'motion plus data' must be distinctly different from the data already sent by the wiimote. all it has to do is tell the machine where the wiimote is, in a timely manner. you can use a fast-response 6000 dpi mouse on the same code as a trackball mouse because all the code does is say "hey, mouse, where are you?" -- i don't understand why wii games would be any different. the games should only be saying "hey, where's the input cursor right now?" and the system/wiimote should be saying "at (437,248)"... updates to firmare and/or hardware (e.g. this peripheral) should be able to fix it.

why do you think it should involve an update to the game?
 
[quote name='Koggit']
why do you think it should involve an update to the game?[/QUOTE]

This isn't the vs forum - you don't need to be a joke here as well.
 
troll less strell

other input devices are regularly updated/improved and work swell with legacy code, it's not unreasonable that i expect the same of the wiimote
 
It is if the game code only registers on the level of "swing? y/n" and then executes a pre-made animation. Emphasis on pre-made animation.

You're suggesting old games would magically recognize a new hardware device that wasn't in existence when they were programmed and then alter animations, input registers, memory pointers, and a host of other things, when their programming is only listening for X.

It's not even a question worth asking unless you want to look like a fool, but you're pretty skilled in that, so maybe that's your aim.
 
maybe i dont understand with the peripheral does -- doesn't it make the wiimote more accurate? what new movement does the motion plus add? i thought it fixes the lag and inaccuracy that ruined elebits for me
 
It more or less can read where the remote is in space physically, meaning the motion itself and the speed can now be read.

The original remote just worked on accelerometers and really could only pick up "am I moving? y/n." Yeah, you could augment it a bit and have it know the difference from a vertical slash against a horizontal one, but even that was limited. The point is that the tech in the 'mote doesn't really sense a whole lot, which is why so many games have devolved into waggle.

WM+ is an attempt to fix this by forcing the direction and types of motion by the player to be read. So it can physically tell "I'm at position XYZ" and record differences in a new position from it. On top of that, it can measure the speed you're moving the thing. So it's far more 1:1, which is why a golfing game will now feel more like holding a putter.

I don't recall lag and inaccuracy, but I didn't really play Elebits, so if those problems are there, chances are a WM+ version might still have them. That might all be dependent on shoddy coding and/or the tech itself. WM+ should help them either way.

But it's not legacy driven (there's no way it can be), and it's supposed to improve accuracy and allow for more technical and complex movements to be read, interpretted, and handled.

Make sense?
 
Here, let's break it down into byte size:

It makes it more accurate, but you need the coding to take advantage of that. It's that simple.
 
if the motion plus is just an accelerometer i get how it could affect pointer accuracy, but okay, if you say so

i really just want a new wiimote and/or sensor bar that makes pointing faster and more accurate
 
WM+ isn't just an accelerometer. I don't actually know what the guts are. I know that it can calculate where it is in physical space and use that data accordingly.

The mote itself just has accelerometers, which are inherently limited, which has been shown in the software implementations since the system was launched.

Where did I talk about pointer accuracy? You're confusing me by jumping around a lot and mincing what I've said.
 
i think i left out a "don't" where it should've been and that sort of ruined a sentence or two but whatever, i think ultimately the point is the motion plus isn't going to fix what i wanted it to (and thought it did) fix, sounds like it's only gonna help games like zak & wiki and not games like elebits
 
I think you should blame Konami then, because their support for the system has been the equivalent of chlamydia.

Good pointer functionality was present in Metroid Prime 3, for example. I think it's already fixed, or your standards are hopelessly high.
 
I'll assume that Koggit is earnest in his confusion.

The Wii Remote has two methods to detect motion. A accelerometer and the infrared sensor. The accelerometer detects motion in straight lines on three axis. The infrared sensor detects orientation with respect to the sensor bar above or below the TV.

The Motion Plus device adds a gyroscope to the mix to double detect angular or twisting motion in the device. It also adds a second accelerometer, but that is used to calibrate the gyroscope.

Before some games simulated twisting motions by reading the two light points from the sensor bar. Even the Wii home page firmware does that, which is why your cursor rotates in a circle if you twist the Wii Remote in a circle while pointing at the screen. But, as I assume you are guessing, if you point your Wii Remote away from the sensor bar it has to rely solely on the accelerometers, which do not do spatial orientation. You can try to guess from the X, Y, and Z data, but it appears to be very imprecise.

So, why wont Motion Plus improve existing games? Because the data isn't an improvement in detail of any previous data as the accelerometers and infrared sensor will still provide the same data. Motion Plus rather adds an additional set of values the Wii can poll for use in game.

Why wasn't the gyroscope included originally? Largely pragmatism, as Nintendo couldn't get what it needed in the size, quality and quantity for use with the Wii Remote.

I will toss in a bit of a lament regarding Motion Plus, as the Motion Plus only adds data for the Wii Remote, which is limiting in that the Nunchuck is still limited to just an accelerometer. Meaning that in Wii Sports- Jet Ski resort the suggested motion of twisting the Nunchuck is largely just for show.

Edit: I wanted to post a link to an Iwata Asks page that explained this further, but it appears to be down when I use the links I'm finding on Google.
 
I will never buy this unless they incorporate it into the new Wii remotes.

The Wii controller functionality is just horrible and cumbersome. If you have the wii remote, motion plus, and a condom too, that thing is getting ridicuously annoying.
 
In part, it's also due to a really poor architecture of the system. As foltzie mentioned the data is being sent in two different forms, one for the Wiimote, and another set for motion plus, but that's only part of the issue.

Each game runs under its own IOS, and the Wii houses many versions of IOS for each game (some are shared). If any new features are available, a new IOS is created for a game, but that IOS is not readily available to older games. Had there been any shared system code, I imagine it would have been possible to somewhat increase the accuracy of older games, but because of afore mentioned reasons, it's impossible. I'm not sure for what reasons Nintendo designed it this way, but we won't be seeing improvements for older games at all. They'll only be able to receive Wiimote information.

I don't know how you expect pointer functionality to really be improved, right now is about as good as it gets. The sensor bar really does the brute of the work and any additional data that Motion Plus provides isn't going to be all that useful.
 
[quote name='V4oLDbOY']I will never buy this unless they incorporate it into the new Wii remotes.

The Wii controller functionality is just horrible and cumbersome. If you have the wii remote, motion plus, and a condom too, that thing is getting ridicuously annoying.[/QUOTE]
I'll never buy it unless I can be sure I'm going to get it in colors to match the new Wii remotes. Cough.

I'm not sure what your second paragraph means. Are you trying to say that the functionality of the Wii remote is crappy or that the remote itself is clunky? Your sentences are going in different directions. I'll agree with the lacking functionality to a point but the problem is being addressed by the WM+ peripheral. As far as the Wii remote being clunky I have to disagree. The original bare remote felt too light to me and I wasn't a fan of the surface. WM+ will add some much needed heft and the condom actually allows me to grip it without my hands sliding off. I would have loved a matte finish (the one on the underside of the 'chuck is dandy) originally and maybe a slightly more flexible rubber on the condom.
 
[quote name='foltzie']Edit: I wanted to post a link to an Iwata Asks page that explained this further, but it appears to be down when I use the links I'm finding on Google.[/QUOTE]

http://us.wii.com/iwata_asks/wiimotionplus/vol1_page1.jsp
Above is the link, but it appears that the site is down right now. So here are the Google cache backup pages:
Page 1
Page 2
Page 3
Page 4

Also, there are some other sites related to the Wiimote that are of interest. Popular Science is the more well-known cross-section, due to its short, stylized look. Sparkfun did a full-on teardown of the Wiimote, going over the notable components.

EDIT: Might as well post the Japanese commercials and trailer for WSR that are popping up on Youtube:
Golf 1
Golf 2
Swordplay
Archery
Trailer
 
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Hmmm. I wonder if WM+ still turns on/transmits data even when you are playing games that don't utilize it, and thus shorten battery life somewhat.

I don't really care since I'm planning to get one of these, but I don't know if those will still work with WM+ added to the controller.

Also, I think I saw that GS is trying to sell 'em for 24.99, so don't even bother picking them up there, kids. That's the same $5 GS tax that they've been running on DS games for years now.
 
Yeah - I'm going to be picking up a Tiger Woods bundle on Tuesday and if they suggest I should buy extra M+'s I'm going to tell them that I would consider it if their price weren't $5 higher then everywhere else.
 
[quote name='Strell']Hmmm. I wonder if WM+ still turns on/transmits data even when you are playing games that don't utilize it, and thus shorten battery life somewhat.

I don't really care since I'm planning to get one of these, but I don't know if those will still work with WM+ added to the controller.[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't bet on those working with WM+ attached. Induction normally has a fairly narrow "window".
 
[quote name='Strell']I don't really care since I'm planning to get one of these, but I don't know if those will still work with WM+ added to the controller.[/QUOTE]

Well, I looked at PDP's site for that charger. Theory: If it turns out that the bottom stand is removable, then you might be able to position the charger like in the top banner, able to fit a WM+ Wiimote. Then again, the box does mention some sort of WM+ compatibility, so perhaps the charging area is large enough to accommodate either configuration.

----------------

Some more WSR commercials, this time from the Japan Nintendo Channel. These "experience" videos follow a format, where a comedian goes up against a pro in the sport while the other part of the duo narrates/moderates. (Ninety-Nine is the name of the comedy duo; They previously worked on the Hot Mario series of commercials) After the competition, the pro talks about playing the game.
[hiddenlist]Swordplay
Archery
Golf part 1
Golf part 2[/hiddenlist]
 
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[quote name='Cao Cao']Well, I looked at PDP's site for that charger. Theory: If it turns out that the bottom stand is removable, then you might be able to position the charger like in the top banner, able to fit a WM+ Wiimote. Then again, the box does mention some sort of WM+ compatibility, so perhaps the charging area is large enough to accommodate either configuration.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAwY3ikbVPg[/QUOTE]

I don't know how that particular charger is set up (in regards to where the charging "zone" is), but another option is to place the remote in to the charger backwards (window/D pad pointing down, with the 1/2 buttons at the top). That works with the InCharge induction charger I have (still charges "upside down").
 
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gamestop has the motion plus for $25, are they ripping people of?

i'm waiting for wii sports resort for release to get the bundle package along with an extra motion dongle. just 1 more month to go.
 
[quote name='pochaccoheaven']gamestop has the motion plus for $25, are they ripping people of?
[/QUOTE]

Yes. It retails for 19.99. This is the infamous "Gamestop Tax." They've been doing it on DS games for years now.

Do not buy additional dongles at GS. Either buy game bundles or go elsewhere.
 
[quote name='foltzie']Does Wii Sports Resort break Wii Sports?[/QUOTE]
Obviously not, but a baseball came with accurate controls would have been awesome especially at the start of summer. I would have loved me some Mii baseball on rainy summer days.
 
Thank you for agreeing with me, cocheseseakdjfksdjfs. I loved getting random Mii teams, and laughing when I got someone I liked, or didn't like.
 
[quote name='Strell']Yes. It retails for 19.99. This is the infamous "Gamestop Tax." They've been doing it on DS games for years now.

Do not buy additional dongles at GS. Either buy game bundles or go elsewhere.[/QUOTE]

That is true if you paying for the WM+ straight up, but if you have already made 2x your money or more via flips, then you are talking $12.50 or less. So... whether or not you should pay the "tax" depends on how you are paying for it. If I buy another WM+ I'll be buying it from Gamestop for that reason. Unless, of course, I can transfer my credit to another establishment. So far I haven't found even break even trades to Amazon, at least not enough to make even their minimum trade amount.

But, in the end I'm just going to wait for Wii Sports Resort to get a second, which they aren't charging a tax for, as I don't have a reason right now to have more then one WM+, only having Tiger Woods 10.
 
Has there been any mention of possible online for bowling? I will get it no matter what, but that would be perfect.
 
[quote name='blueweltall']Do you have to update your WII to use the motion plus?[/QUOTE]

Nope, I didn't need any update for Tiger Woods.
 
the video changed my mind, i was gonna give up on it becoz of the ign au review, but it looks like it could be fun, and those are the only core gameplay, if there will be practice or training mode like wii sports does, im goin to buy it first day launch
for those of you who have played it already (jp version or demo), will u still keep the original wii sports? i shipped it out via goozex, wondering if i should get it back via goozex
 
What a discrepancy: 6.5 vs. 8.9. I'm still getting this anyway. Do you need M+ for everything though? Makes simultaneous multiplayer difficult.
 
[quote name='Lone_Prodigy']What a discrepancy: 6.5 vs. 8.9. I'm still getting this anyway. Do you need M+ for everything though? Makes simultaneous multiplayer difficult.[/QUOTE]

Yes, and Indeed it shall.
 
Question: Will this be in stores on the 26th, or is it one of those deals where it ships to stores on the 26th and is available on the 27th?
 
[quote name='Cry Havoc']Question: Will this be in stores on the 26th, or is it one of those deals where it ships to stores on the 26th and is available on the 27th?[/QUOTE]

Sunday releases tend to be shipped before the release date, so they usually appear on shelves on (or sometimes before) the release day.
 
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