Xbox One on the way. DRM removed, more details to come.
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4thHorseman
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I would believe an anonymous poster (who has been backed up by people with a reliable history) over executives from a company who wouldn't say anything bad about their system, and as shown in recent months, never seem to have accurate information in the first place.
While I'm a member of that forum, I certainly dont worship the ground CBoat walks on like a majority of the guy's there.
Every time he is wrong (and it's been far more then once, twice, or even five times) they always excuse it away as "Oh well, details change.." which in my opinion is bullshit.
https://twitter.com/aegies/status/347748309550645249
Polygon also reports it as not a time limit.
At this point, you could have Sony VP come out and say it wasnt a time limit and odds are people still woudnt believe it ;P
Every time he is wrong (and it's been far more then once, twice, or even five times) they always excuse it away as "Oh well, details change.." which in my opinion is bullshit.
https://twitter.com/aegies/status/347748309550645249
Polygon also reports it as not a time limit.
At this point, you could have Sony VP come out and say it wasnt a time limit and odds are people still woudnt believe it ;P
Erad30
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That's really a failure on MS' part then though. They took no opportunity to promote/explain this feature. And it may not be a limited demo, but there had to be some restrictions or that would do far more damage than any perceived damage used games does (and there is plenty of evidence that it helps sales of new games, maybe that would even out with cheaper prices of digital software, but again no one believed that would happen because MS has no trust from consumers) in terms of publishers/developers bottom line.
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PenguinMaster
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Okay, so why can't any of this be implemented in the downloaded games now? If family sharing was the primary selling point of a system that requires online, why can't it be the selling point of a downloaded version of a game?
If they're smart, they'll use tactics like that to entice people to buy digital instead of discs. Allow some sharing. Make them cheaper than disc games. Include some extra features only available in the digital version (no major gameplay DLC as that would just piss people off, but alternate outfits, weapon skins and things like that). Maybe put out digital versions a week or two earlier.
Incentivize buying digital despite not being able to resell etc. That's the way to get people downloading games. Not the half assed plan they had with install discs etc. Keep the discs the same and make digital versions more appealing.
4thHorseman
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Ugh. Arthur Gies. The most arrogant, assholish, Microsoft biased journalist in the industry possibly. Can't stand that man.
So MS execs couldn't be clear about the feature before it was removed, but now that it's removed and there will never be any accountability they can be clear about it? Yeah I believe them. /sarcasmhttps://twitter.com/notwen/status/348092374842474497
https://twitter.com/aarongreenberg/status/347911202057379840
Surprised no one posted it. So, do we believe the anon. pastebin or two different executives?
Completely agree with the article as well, as I've said before. Clear choice was taken away, and we've hit a road with no progress, no innovation, virtually nothing new. While the X1 still has a few of its bell's and whistle's (TV Switching, Snap, etc) it also lost more then a few.
Oh well, done with the DRM discussion. Some of us are fine with it, and dont have little tinfoil hats on. Other's arent. To each their own. Neither side is going to convince the other, and it's obvious those who are against DRM won't concede any points, so the discussion should just stop in my opinion. You cant have a debate when one side wont budge... which is odd since it echo's what's going on in the US right now
You do realize Polygon is a Microsoft funded news source?
I cannot believe how delusional people are to believe publishers were going to allow you to give away 10 copies of a game. Unreal!
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Well, if you are going to remove the always online requirement completely... then cant I simply log in, download the game, and disconnect the Xbox completely, having the free game "forever" in a sense?
Unless you make two completely different software solutions, one for on disc, one for download... which I guess they could do, but seeing how it's been reported the tri-os is taking up a fair bit of its memory, how much more do they want to add? Or can they even add something like that in at launch, perhaps they need more time to put it in?
I'd agree with your thoughts about it being in however, and I've certainly emailed the appropriate people about it as have many others. (On r/xboxone we put up some default copy/paste stuff to do it quickly)
//Edit//
Rippn, I dont think that at all. Nor does anyone else. That was simply a best case scenario, that we all knew woudnt happen. The majority of people who supported the program were under the assumption that it was you (the owner) + one other family member at a time.
In return, the publishers would have gotten more direct control over their revenue stream, by having the ability to access fees to used games directly to the retail outlets, and other such controls. The pro's would certainly outweigh the con's as a publisher.
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That is still very generous and a little unbelievable. Yes, sure, for the hot new title that you and your 9 Internet friends all want to play multiplayer together with, that is restrictive. But consider the case a few years down the line where a long-time Xbox One owner can "lease" his huge library of games out to some dude on the Internet who just picked up the console. The second user would get access to a whole bunch of games that the first guy is probably done playing with. The second user would not have to buy a single game himself. I could see threads here and whole forums elsewhere dedicated to "leasing" out content-rich sharing slots for X1 games. And with a big library there is a much smaller chance for conflict between your 9 share subleases over any one particular game. It would kill the sales of older games (and by older I mean those out more than 3-4 months). How would that work out for publishers/developers?
And I really do think a lot of people upset over the loss of the gamesharing thought it was a 10 person free-for-all. I'm basing that on comments I've seen on articles on other sites. I don't think most CAGs thought that - but a lot of low information hardcore gamers certainly did.
I also don't get your comment about anti-DRM people not "budging" or "conceding". Most of us are perfectly fine with digital DRM - it is the application of that to disc-based games that bothers us. As many have said, MS could have done the family share thing (in whatever form it turns out to be) with the digital stuff just as easily as before. Sony has been doing that for years now - why can't MS too? Most of us are open to givng MS's ideas a shot on the digital side as long as there are options. I could ask you why are you being so hard-headed and uncompromising in wanting to restrict choice and force us down one particular, narrow path?
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Jimmienoman
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What does it matter? You're debating a feature of a system that was scrapped. Very little details are out about it. Yet you want to hold to how it "would have been"So MS execs couldn't be clear about the feature before it was removed, but now that it's removed and there will never be any accountability they can be clear about it? Yeah I believe them. /sarcasmhttps://twitter.com/notwen/status/348092374842474497
https://twitter.com/aarongreenberg/status/347911202057379840
Surprised no one posted it. So, do we believe the anon. pastebin or two different executives?
Completely agree with the article as well, as I've said before. Clear choice was taken away, and we've hit a road with no progress, no innovation, virtually nothing new. While the X1 still has a few of its bell's and whistle's (TV Switching, Snap, etc) it also lost more then a few.
Oh well, done with the DRM discussion. Some of us are fine with it, and dont have little tinfoil hats on. Other's arent. To each their own. Neither side is going to convince the other, and it's obvious those who are against DRM won't concede any points, so the discussion should just stop in my opinion. You cant have a debate when one side wont budge... which is odd since it echo's what's going on in the US right now
You do realize Polygon is a Microsoft funded news source?
Why? Because you had options. Those options were not good enough for you, so everyone made a big enough stink so that now those of us who were excited about such prospects have no options.
So let's reverse that question. If you had a crystal clear choice, why wasnt that good enough for you? I know, I'll get the standard "It's about OUR RIGHTS! FREEEEEDDDDOOOMMMM" and all that jazz.
I never understood why you simply coudnt get over the hump that now games on the X1 were all digital. That's exactly what it was. That disc was nothing more then a holder for the content so you didnt have to download the game.
Completely disagree with "most of us" as well. It's painfully obvious reading this thread that "most of us" is incorrect. The thread *only* came around to the idea when MS backed down on the idea of all digital. Before that, absolutely no one on the Anti-DRM side of things gave a single inch in any subject ever.
StryderOmega
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brandtron8000
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If the "big enough stink" drowned out the praise it got, it just goes to show that the excitement level wasn't there enough to keep it.
Besides, can't we share digital games on 2 systems on both current gen consoles now? And even if inconvenient, de/re-activate up to 8 more systems to the same effect, if we all agree it would've been 2 people max simultaneously anyways?
I don't think you make swappable parts, but I think you could do a refresh say every 4 years.
This refresh would have doubled the memory, went with a recent processor, larger storage, and a Blu-Ray drive that was compatible with the current 360 games. It would not only run new games, but the older games would look even better and run smoother.
The only time you would have to truly release a new generation is if it got to the point where even upgrades no longer advanced anything, and you had to start the OS fresh.
Of course I am also one of these crazy people who want to see a universal console design and an end to the traditional console wars.
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Universal console means that there is no incentive to innovate or push the limits of technology. Intel basically has a damn near monopoly in the PC market and look at how their incentive to innovate has been crushed. 2 years of upgrades since Sandy Bridge has yielded all of a 12-15 percent increase in power.
Also your idea of console refreshes is terrible. That segments the market and makes it confusing to consumers. Kind of like the stupid shit Nintendo pulled with the N64 and the RAM pack.
Bad example to be honest.
While from a pure power perspective CPU's have indeed been on the lower end of raw power, they have made extreme leaps in the form of lower TDP and great strides in integrated graphics potential, which is becoming more and more relevant as users switch to dual or tri monitor setups.
A near 50% reduction in TDP is pretty impressive between Sandy (which is 150TDP for a 3970X 3.5GHZ) vs Haswell. (4770K 3.5GHZ sitting at 84TDP)
I think that's getting off topic, but just wanted to say it's very narrow sighted to simply look at the raw speed and say no progress is being made.
Microsoft sure did a great job in the past few weeks. Never thought gaming can be so complicated and confusing. The below quote from Kotaku sums it up pretty nicely.
The company seems to lack the sort of leadership that would've stopped this kind of clusterfrom transpiring in the first place. From the moment the Xbox One was announced, its messaging has been a mess of corporate-speak, contradictions and vaguely menacing obfuscations, wandering around aimlessly and pissing off everyone it stumbles into. Compared to Microsoft, Sony appears poised and ready, a company with seemingly strong leadership and a number of clearly defined goals. They've set out to win over developers and land exclusive games and content, they have a robust indie recruitment strategy, and they seem to take their customers very seriously. (Or, at the very least, they take courting their customers very seriously.)
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Nope not a bad example because your counter-points highlight exactly what I am talking about. Intel doesn't have any types of pressure in the desktop market so it has done pretty much nothing (no one really cares about integrated graphics or power consumption in that market). Every upgrade they have made in the past two years is targeted at the laptop market. There is competition there so there is a need to upgrade. Phones and tablets are eating away at their market share so they are doing something to entice consumers to stay with Intel and purchase their products.
MetalSlugger
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I love how Ashane keeps changing to completely different arguments because even he knows that there is no excuse for how badly MS botched this product reveal.
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TimboSliceGB
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come launch in nov no one will even care about it anymore it's already old news they did a dumb mistake move on.
people pretty much forgot the mistakes sony did at ps3 launch so ms is not the only company that does dumb things at launch.
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I'm actually not changing arguments at all, I just realized that the people posting in this thread are complete hypocrites and it's a pointless discussion.
'MERICA!
Regardless of what points anyone brings up, a excuse is always present. Regardless of who says what, it's always a lie, unless it proves your point.. then it's truth.
We believe a anon source about the family share plan, but dont believe a anon source that says Sony wanted DRM too. Etc Etc.
You'd fit right in with reddit a week ago.../circlejerk the guy off to your left k?
TimboSliceGB
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it needs to be changed ms sucks threadI'm actually not changing arguments at all, I just realized that the people posting in this thread are complete hypocrites and it's a pointless discussion.
'MERICA!
Regardless of what points anyone brings up, a excuse is always present. Regardless of who says what, it's always a lie, unless it proves your point.. then it's truth.
We believe a anon source about the family share plan, but dont believe a anon source that says Sony wanted DRM too. Etc Etc.
You'd fit right in with reddit a week ago.../circlejerk the guy off to your left k?
VoltronGuy
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Erad30
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Uh no they didn't it took years for Sony to get where they are now. It was extremely easy to find a PS3 at launch, they weren't selling:
DNukem170
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The fact that people are willing to believe the pastebin post highlights one of the biggest problems the X1 has had.
The PlayStation 3 was launched in United States on 17 November 2006. Presales on eBay reached a high of just over US$170500 on November 17. During its first week of release in the United States, PlayStation 3 systems were being sold on eBay upwards of $2000. It was originally announced that there would be 400,000 units available, however less than a week before launch reports emerged that Sony did not meet its shipping quota in time, resulting in about 40% of systems not appearing at launch. It is not known exactly how many systems were available on launch day. As the initial release price topped $300 dollars, the PlayStation 3 console was sold out during the first day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3_launch
While I love penny arcade, that's not very accurate ;P
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3_launch
While I love penny arcade, that's not very accurate ;P
Erad30
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Yeah I worked the PS3 launch at Best Buy, the initial allotment sold out, but when those second/third shipments started coming, they just sat on shelves. Also that last sentence makes no sense. As it topped $300 it was sold out the first day? It took a long time to get to $300.
Topped implying that it was "above" $300.
The PS3 did very good numbers all the way around. Citing it as some sort of failure at launch is silly. While it didnt hit what the 360 did, it certainly broke anything previous. (We arent talking about Nintendo right? I mean, I know they won, but who cares right?)
The PS3 did very good numbers all the way around. Citing it as some sort of failure at launch is silly. While it didnt hit what the 360 did, it certainly broke anything previous. (We arent talking about Nintendo right? I mean, I know they won, but who cares right?
)But every 2-4 years they would be revisiting the hardware as part of the hardware refresh. As a result their would be competition if they wanted to complete for the processor/gpu every refresh. It would be no different then the competition now every time a console comes around.
But yeah this is off topic and didn't mean to derail the thread.
TimboSliceGB
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sounds like something they call the wii u. before wii u launch everyone went crazy on this websit saying if you ddi not pre order one you would not get one for months their has yet been a time i did not see one in a store i walked in since launch.
Nobody believes the pastebin post, they believe the confirmation of the pastebin post confirmed by insider CBOAT @ neogaf who has leaked accurate information for years. And it's far more believable than any rumored description of what it was supposed to be.
So no, the problem is Microsoft message, they throw out vague ideas and descriptions of what they do and then let people fill in the blanks and think what they want. What was funny though is when people thought of something to negatively major nelson or some other Microsoft exec would be quick to come out and correct it, but when people went off on something positive they just let people run with it without correction or confirmation. Even now they put out statements correcting negative spin on an idea that no longer exists, why would they do that? Before the Xbox One reveal Microsoft was known for this comment: "Microsoft does not comment on rumors or speculation." and now they do? Whole thing is a botched mess on Microsoft's part and only staunch fanboys argue otherwise.
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TimboSliceGB
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that's why im keeping both prorder on amazon till a couple days before it ships i still have not decided if im getting both,one,none
Dr.Zoidberg
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I just dropped $2k on an autographed basketball that will just sit in a case and do nothing and I have no plans on buying a new console right away so don't think just people aren't buying the system can't "afford" it.
Why would you have to check in to play downloaded titles offline (unless it was purchased on a different console and you haven't transferred the license to the new console)?
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Monsta Mack
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If your backlog is so damn big you probably shouldn't be buying a next gen system.
Because by the time you finish your backlog the system will be cheaper and so will the games.
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Well I'm gonna buy one anyways. lol.
Because by the time you finish your backlog the system will be cheaper and so will the games.
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Well I'm gonna buy one anyways. lol.
Kazuya
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LOL... just the presence of this banner is the living embodiment of Microsoft's spinelessness. It might as well just say, "Dear Microsoft, we will design the Xbox One and get back to you later with the details. Just try to keep out of our way, okay?"
One article I read today referenced the old Henry Ford quote in a discussion about Microsoft's lack of direction: "If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”
That jpg is mostly spot on. It keeps all their ideas intact and still placates the consumer. It's amazing the tens of millions of dollars they spend paying idea men and they couldn't come up with something similar in a two hour brainstorming session.
There's a reason Sony dropped the price $100 by July. No one was buying.
NPD Numbers for early 2007 prior to the price drop:
Jan: 244k
Feb: 127k
Mar: 130k
Apr: 82k
May: 81k
June: 98k
July: 159k
As mentioned, the first few shipments were fine, but shipments after that started to pile up. The infamous Tretton "$1200" quote was in Feb. I snapped a photo of a wall of PS3s at BB. I went back a couple times that week and the wall didn't shrink all that much.Topped implying that it was "above" $300.
The PS3 did very good numbers all the way around. Citing it as some sort of failure at launch is silly. While it didnt hit what the 360 did, it certainly broke anything previous. (We arent talking about Nintendo right? I mean, I know they won, but who cares right?
There's a reason Sony dropped the price $100 by July. No one was buying.
NPD Numbers for early 2007 prior to the price drop:
Jan: 244k
Feb: 127k
Mar: 130k
Apr: 82k
May: 81k
June: 98k
July: 159k
Dr.Zoidberg
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Ok, how wrong is it that I am hoping that the Xbox one doesn't sell many to begin with so I can get one on the cheap? My other purchase listed above was the result of not enough sleep and pain meds due to a blood clot in my head...was flying high....weeeeeee....ahem...my friend was.
phantomfriar2002
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This is just my guess, but I think MS is going to end up doing just fine with the XB1. I think the $100 additional price tag -- while nobody wants to pay it -- isn't so exorbitant that it's going to stop those who love Xbox Live from switching over to the PS4. Now that the DRM has been dropped and really the big selling point (price aside) for Sony has been negated (let's face it, for most people, until they had that "our console plays used games!" moment in E3, Sony's press conference was pretty boring especially where games were concerned), I think the XB1 is going to sell and sell well. The exclusives look a bit stronger (Knack reminds me of Kameo and not in a good way for Sony) on the MS side for the moment.
Personally I preordered both consoles and will keep the preorders until everything shakes down. That said, I prefer Xbox Live and the controller over the Playstation Network and Dualshock, so I'm likely going with the XB1 now that the DRM issue was dropped...even if I'm forced (dammit!) to use the new Kinect...which I think we'd all prefer not to have.
Personally I preordered both consoles and will keep the preorders until everything shakes down. That said, I prefer Xbox Live and the controller over the Playstation Network and Dualshock, so I'm likely going with the XB1 now that the DRM issue was dropped...even if I'm forced (dammit!) to use the new Kinect...which I think we'd all prefer not to have.
It's not silly. Because it was so expensive and sales were so sluggish, Sony lost ground to MS that it never made up throughout the course of this last generation in the U.S. Have to remember that Sony was on top in the PS/PS2 era and lost the last round to MS precisely because the PS3 was a slow seller, and was priced far too high, when it initially came out. That high price tag opened the door for the 360 to become a bigger seller and carve out more of a share in the marketplace, which it ended up doing. In that regard, yeah, the PS3 was absolutely a failure at launch. I'm sure Sony would do it differently if they could have (and indeed they are this time, being at $399 and under the competition. They certainly aren't repeating the problems they had with the PS3's launch this time around).
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Funny thing is I believe Sony showed as many if not more games. I think the pacing of the conference was the problem, that and they had to focus on 3 systems. Had they given more time to the indies rather than that quick 20 seconds of each game, maybe people would count those. Plus Microsoft just showed a bunch of teasers that people seem to credit as games shown, Like Quantum Break, Sunset Overdrive and especially Halo (5). Also Sony showed gameplay from games we already saw in February, and showing Last of Us was lame too since it was releasing a couple days later.
To me it just appeared that Microsoft is going to just be more of the same cookie cutter bro box stuff and Sony is and always has had a far more diverse library. Sony also has 20 ips they still are set to announce, and Gamescom and TGS are supposed to be pretty big for them. Add in that multiplats will likely be better on PS4 and the better price point and it's PS4 at launch for me. Xbox One and Wii U will be later when they get price cuts/ hardware revisions and a bunch of exclusives. Plus I don't trust Microsoft not to patch back in DRM later and/or to lose focus on gaming like they did with the 360, so waiting will allow time to see if they can be trusted.
To me it just appeared that Microsoft is going to just be more of the same cookie cutter bro box stuff and Sony is and always has had a far more diverse library. Sony also has 20 ips they still are set to announce, and Gamescom and TGS are supposed to be pretty big for them. Add in that multiplats will likely be better on PS4 and the better price point and it's PS4 at launch for me. Xbox One and Wii U will be later when they get price cuts/ hardware revisions and a bunch of exclusives. Plus I don't trust Microsoft not to patch back in DRM later and/or to lose focus on gaming like they did with the 360, so waiting will allow time to see if they can be trusted.
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spatenfloot
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I think they will sell out of their initial allotments, so don't get your hopes up.
WV Matsui
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Funny thing is I believe Sony showed as many if not more games. I think the pacing of the conference was the problem, that and they had to focus on 3 systems. Had they given more time to the indies rather than that quick 20 seconds of each game, maybe people would count those. Plus Microsoft just showed a bunch of teasers that people seem to credit as games shown, Like Quantum Break, Sunset Overdrive and especially Halo (5). Also Sony showed gameplay from games we already saw in February, and showing Last of Us was lame too since it was releasing a couple days later.
To me it just appeared that Microsoft is going to just be more of the same cookie cutter bro box stuff and Sony is and always has had a far more diverse library. Sony also has 20 ips they still are set to announce, and Gamescom and TGS are supposed to be pretty big for them. Add in that multiplats will likely be better on PS4 and the better price point and it's PS4 at launch for me. Xbox One and Wii U will be later when they get price cuts/ hardware revisions and a bunch of exclusives. Plus I don't trust Microsoft not to patch back in DRM later and/or to lose focus on gaming like they did with the 360, so waiting will allow time to see if they can be trusted.
This is truly laughable. The Sony conference was a snore until they announced their policies at the end. That long ass tech demo of what "could" be possible on the PS4 was awful.
The X1 conference had a great pace and they showed a ton of great games. Hell they showed off MGS V which Sony didn't even mention! Hell Kojima was at the conference which Sony fanboys used to go bonkers over. The only thing people remember about the X1 conference was the price and I don't blame them.
But if you take out the ends of both conference the X1
conference was way better.
Hell for the first 45-50 minutes Sony talked about the Vita and PS3.
To me it just appeared that Microsoft is going to just be more of the same cookie cutter bro box stuff and Sony is and always has had a far more diverse library. Sony also has 20 ips they still are set to announce, and Gamescom and TGS are supposed to be pretty big for them. Add in that multiplats will likely be better on PS4 and the better price point and it's PS4 at launch for me. Xbox One and Wii U will be later when they get price cuts/ hardware revisions and a bunch of exclusives. Plus I don't trust Microsoft not to patch back in DRM later and/or to lose focus on gaming like they did with the 360, so waiting will allow time to see if they can be trusted.
This is truly laughable. The Sony conference was a snore until they announced their policies at the end. That long ass tech demo of what "could" be possible on the PS4 was awful.
The X1 conference had a great pace and they showed a ton of great games. Hell they showed off MGS V which Sony didn't even mention! Hell Kojima was at the conference which Sony fanboys used to go bonkers over. The only thing people remember about the X1 conference was the price and I don't blame them.
But if you take out the ends of both conference the X1
conference was way better.
Hell for the first 45-50 minutes Sony talked about the Vita and PS3.
I said the pacing was the problem, thanks for confirming what I said. And so they gave Konami a moneyhat for a multiplat trailer, big deal! I was talking exclusives not multiplat nonsense. I could have brought up the final fantasy 15 and Kingdom hearts 3 trailers if I gave a crap about multiplats.
WV Matsui
CAG Newbie
This is truly laughable. The Sony conference was a snore until they announced their policies at the end. That long ass tech demo of what "could" be possible on the PS4 was awful.
The X1 conference had a great pace and they showed a ton of great games. Hell they showed off MGS V which Sony didn't even mention! Hell Kojima was at the conference which Sony fanboys used to go bonkers over. The only thing people remember about the X1 conference was the price and I don't blame them.
But if you take out the ends of both conference the X1
conference was way better.
Hell for the first 45-50 minutes Sony talked about the Vita and PS3.
I said the pacing was the problem, thanks for confirming what I said. And so they gave Konami a moneyhat for a multiplat trailer, big deal! I was talking exclusives not multiplat nonsense. I could have brought up the final fantasy 15 and Kingdom hearts 3 trailers if I gave a crap about multiplats.
You truly are special
The X1 conference had a great pace and they showed a ton of great games. Hell they showed off MGS V which Sony didn't even mention! Hell Kojima was at the conference which Sony fanboys used to go bonkers over. The only thing people remember about the X1 conference was the price and I don't blame them.
But if you take out the ends of both conference the X1
conference was way better.
Hell for the first 45-50 minutes Sony talked about the Vita and PS3.
I said the pacing was the problem, thanks for confirming what I said. And so they gave Konami a moneyhat for a multiplat trailer, big deal! I was talking exclusives not multiplat nonsense. I could have brought up the final fantasy 15 and Kingdom hearts 3 trailers if I gave a crap about multiplats.
You truly are special
Awe are you taking your ball and going home now? Just like Microsoft did with the family share plan. No wonder you love the company so much, you were made for each other.
WV Matsui
CAG Newbie
[quote name="RiPPn" post="10851094" timestamp="1371907286"]
[quote name="WV Matsui" post="10851090" timestamp="1371906945"]
You truly are special[/quote]Awe are you taking your ball and going home now? Just like Microsoft did with the family share plan. No wonder you love the company so much, you were made for each other.[/quote]
Dude you have been warned once by mods for your awesome ability to troll. Back off of me and take a deep breath for a second. You truly are making this more personal than the spirit of debate.
[quote name="WV Matsui" post="10851090" timestamp="1371906945"]
You truly are special[/quote]Awe are you taking your ball and going home now? Just like Microsoft did with the family share plan. No wonder you love the company so much, you were made for each other.[/quote]
Dude you have been warned once by mods for your awesome ability to troll. Back off of me and take a deep breath for a second. You truly are making this more personal than the spirit of debate.
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