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Amazon PCDD $15 Walking Dead, $10 TERA ($15 CE) + BOGO


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#3031 bizarrorollins

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:46 AM

That one you linked doesn't even say what graphics card it has?


I understand that it's difficult shopping for a computer... much less a gaming computer.. but: The laptop mentioned has a NVIDIA 540M.

I don't really understand something "not being a gaming laptop". The specs put against "gaming laptops" are nearly identical, with the "gaming laptop" often having less RAM and a weaker processor. What's up with that?


If you want to use a laptop to play video games, you need to a DEDICATED graphics card. Bottom line. You're not going to get the same type of performance from anything else and really you're not going to be able to play anything other than some cheap casual-bin video games on an integrated graphics card. But since you said: "I really want something that will play games well at the highest settings at the right FPS," I'm guessing that's not the case.

But then swap the graphics card out for one that will work fine with games? Because that's a really good price in comparison to the other systems on Newegg that are being linked, except for the fact that it has a cruddy graphics card. Wouldn't it be more cost effective to buy the best and cheapest and swap the graphics card?


Nope. It's really as difficult as possible to upgrade any piece of hardware inside of a manufacturers laptop. Other than increasing ram, you're not going to be given too many options.

I've heard really good things about Vaios and their reliability, not to mention a friend of mine just bought one and is really happy with it. That's why I'm kind of steering in that direction. Still, I'm not set on one, but when I see links to these other laptops they really just don't seem worth the price.


I'm guessing your friend has very different intentions for their laptop. If you're going to browse the internet, play casual card games or web games or bejeweled or whatever, then I'm sure a cheap $400 walmart computer would work fine, but you just simply can't expect it to perform the same as any dedicated gaming computer.

And when it comes to this laptop (which is the only other one I've seen that seems more reasonable), even though it has a better card, it's got a weaker processor and less RAM.


You're comparing an i7 to an i5. i7 > i5 in most cases. And while I'll agree that 4GB of ram might be a tad bit low for serious computing use, ram is one of the easiest and cheapest components to change in any laptop so you shouldn't fuss over that.
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#3032 Drabelincoln

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:47 AM

thinking about biting on Last Remnant, has there been a better price?


it was 10 dollars before on steam

#3033 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:47 AM

A couple people have said it's been at $10 before. I personally would wait for a lower price point, since you can buy it brand new for a console for $15 or so; even cheaper used.

Also, what would anyone say about this laptop?

http://www.amazon.co...7485069&sr=1-12

The only kicker there seems to be the processor. How good is that graphics card though, and would that processor kinda kill the deal?

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3034 zeldaking

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:49 AM

Thanks Op for shrinking the text down on the sale game list. That really big text was hard to read.

#3035 spoderman

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:50 AM

A couple people have said it's been at $10 before. I personally would wait for a lower price point, since you can buy it brand new for a console for $15 or so; even cheaper used.

Also, what would anyone say about this laptop?

http://www.amazon.co...7485069&sr=1-12

The only kicker there seems to be the processor. How good is that graphics card though, and would that processor kinda kill the deal?


That laptop has integrated graphics.. so I'd skip it. As others have said, you need a dedicated GPU for a gaming laptop.

#3036 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:51 AM

HD in the name of the card = Integrated graphics, huh? I'm so effin' clueless.

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3037 spoderman

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:54 AM

HD in the name of the card = Integrated graphics, huh? I'm so effin' clueless.


When it says "integrated on APU" that means that it has no dedicated GPU:

AMD Radeon HD 6320 graphics (integrated on APU)

#3038 thegreatest

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:54 AM

That one you linked doesn't even say what graphics card it has?

I don't really understand something "not being a gaming laptop". The specs put against "gaming laptops" are nearly identical, with the "gaming laptop" often having less RAM and a weaker processor. What's up with that?

I do understand that the ones linked have better graphics cards, but is that worth an extra $200-300 when you're actually getting WEAKER other components? I don't understand that.

Would it be possible to buy something like this:

http://www.walmart.c...remium/19536281

But then swap the graphics card out for one that will work fine with games? Because that's a really good price in comparison to the other systems on Newegg that are being linked, except for the fact that it has a cruddy graphics card. Wouldn't it be more cost effective to buy the best and cheapest and swap the graphics card?

I've heard really good things about Vaios and their reliability, not to mention a friend of mine just bought one and is really happy with it. That's why I'm kind of steering in that direction. Still, I'm not set on one, but when I see links to these other laptops they really just don't seem worth the price.


I'm starting to think that you don't know the difference between a processor and a graphics card. The two Sonys I linked to have the same processor and the one you linked to for $850 has that same processor as well. The main price difference between the two I linked to is the fact that one has a blu ray drive and the other does not.

In order for something to be a gaming PC it needs a gaming graphics card. Processor and RAM really doesn't matter all that much. Honestly, those Sonys are very far behind when it comes to gaming capabilities.

Here is a good site to look at to get an idea of how a card will perform. The different cards are ranked along the right side.

http://www.notebookc...0M.48313.0.html

Also, for your reference, I have a gaming laptop and I thought it may be helpful to link to an actual laptop made for gaming since none of the ones discussed so far really are. They have the ability to play some games (not very well), but aren't made for gaming. Here is the laptop I have:

http://www.newegg.co...N82E16834230142

#3039 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 03:59 AM

I'm starting to think that you don't know the difference between a processor and a graphics card. The two Sonys I linked to have the same processor and the one you linked to for $850 has that same processor as well. The main price difference between the two I linked to is the fact that one has a blu ray drive and the other does not.

In order for something to be a gaming PC it needs a gaming graphics card. Processor and RAM really doesn't matter all that much. Honestly, those Sonys are very far behind when it comes to gaming capabilities.

Here is a good site to look at to get an idea of how a card will perform. The different cards are ranked along the right side.

http://www.notebookc...0M.48313.0.html

Also, for your reference, I have a gaming laptop and I thought it may be helpful to link to an actual laptop made for gaming since none of the ones discussed so far really are. They have the ability to play some games (not very well), but aren't made for gaming. Here is the laptop I have:

http://www.newegg.co...N82E16834230142

No, I know the difference between a processor and graphics card. The problem was that I was seeing far cheaper laptops with 2.5GHz processors and 6GB of RAM put next to far more expensive laptops with 2.2GHz processors and 4GB of RAM. That didn't make sense to me, but the 2.2GHz i7 processors surpass the 2.4GHz i5 processors, right?

Going along the lines of RAM and processing speed not being a big deal, what's the lowest processor one should settle for in favor of a better graphics card? I'm trying to be extremely frugal here, which is annoying and sucks, but I don't really have a choice.


EDIT: How do the two cheapest ones on this page look? How are those graphics cards?

http://shop.lenovo.c...enu-id=products

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3040 bizarrorollins

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:03 AM

Here is the laptop I have:

http://www.newegg.co...N82E16834230142


That's a great spec laptop (even a bit of overkill w/ 12GB of ram), but it sure is ugly as sin.. although to be honest, that's clearly not the intention. I kind of like how the bulk of the laptop gives that extra angle to the keyboard.
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#3041 pantsattack

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:08 AM

"But the 2.2GHz i7 processors surpass the 2.4GHz i5 processors, right?"

I'm not so computer literate so someone humor me. Is this quote correct or is the Ghz measure universal in that a higher number is always a better performer?

#3042 Chariblaze

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:17 AM

"But the 2.2GHz i7 processors surpass the 2.4GHz i5 processors, right?"

I'm not so computer literate so someone humor me. Is this quote correct or is the Ghz measure universal in that a higher number is always a better performer?


A slightly higher number like that isn't always a better performer, especially when number of cores and threads comes into play.

#3043 bizarrorollins

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:20 AM

"But the 2.2GHz i7 processors surpass the 2.4GHz i5 processors, right?"

I'm not so computer literate so someone humor me. Is this quote correct or is the Ghz measure universal in that a higher number is always a better performer?


Well I guess I misspoke earlier. I didn't mean to imply that one processor is really that much better than the other. The i7 and i5 at that clock speed won't show a huge difference in performance but the value of the i7 is greater which is why the price is so much higher. The benefit from an i7 is that you'll have the ability to use hyperthreading... although that won't be apparent in most applications and really not at all in games.
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#3044 thegreatest

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:22 AM

No, I know the difference between a processor and graphics card. The problem was that I was seeing far cheaper laptops with 2.5GHz processors and 6GB of RAM put next to far more expensive laptops with 2.2GHz processors and 4GB of RAM. That didn't make sense to me, but the 2.2GHz i7 processors surpass the 2.4GHz i5 processors, right?

Going along the lines of RAM and processing speed not being a big deal, what's the lowest processor one should settle for in favor of a better graphics card? I'm trying to be extremely frugal here, which is annoying and sucks, but I don't really have a choice.


EDIT: How do the two cheapest ones on this page look? How are those graphics cards?

http://shop.lenovo.c...enu-id=products


You can check those graphics cards on the notebookcheck website I linked to before. It isn't bad, not the best, but not bad at all.

http://www.notebookc...5M.41933.0.html

As for the processors, in order to have a quad core processor in a laptop you have to have an i7. All i5's are dual core. The i7 you were talking about would have 4 cores running at 2.2ghz a piece. The i5 has 2 cores running at 2.4ghz, so yes the i7 would perform better.

That's a great spec laptop (even a bit of overkill w/ 12GB of ram), but it sure is ugly as sin.. although to be honest, that's clearly not the intention. I kind of like how the bulk of the laptop gives that extra angle to the keyboard.


I actually really like the look of it. It is very quiet and cool too. The bulkiness of it, to me anyway, makes it seem more durable too. Which I want when I spend $1.500.

#3045 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:26 AM

Well I guess I misspoke earlier. I didn't mean to imply that one processor is really that much better than the other. The i7 and i5 at that clock speed won't show a huge difference in performance but the value of the i7 is greater which is why the price is so much higher. The benefit from an i7 is that you'll have the ability to use hyperthreading... although that won't be apparent in most applications and really not at all in games.

I guess that factor just hits me a little harder. I definitely need to find a system with an i5 (or lower, if it doesn't matter) processor to cut down the cost. Obviously I need a good dedicated graphics card, but I don't think I'll need an i7 processor if the difference is negligible and it makes the price so much higher.

What do you think of this system?

http://www.zdnet.com...hz-3mb/35081021

And the direct Lenovo listing (no pictures for some reason).

http://shop.lenovo.c...001C9:00001746:

Is there a reason why this laptop is cheaper than the rest? Is that graphics card not so good?

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3046 thegreatest

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:27 AM

I guess that factor just hits me a little harder. I definitely need to find a system with an i5 (or lower, if it doesn't matter) processor to cut down the cost. Obviously I need a good dedicated graphics card, but I don't think I'll need an i7 processor if the difference is negligible and it makes the price so much higher.

What do you think of this system?

http://www.zdnet.com...hz-3mb/35081021

And the direct Lenovo listing (no pictures for some reason).

http://shop.lenovo.c...001C9:00001746:

Is there a reason why this laptop is cheaper than the rest? Is that graphics card not so good?


Look at my post right above that. ;)

And i7s are definitely better. They are actually at least twice as good due to the fact that they are quad core and the i5s and i3s are dual core. Plus the i7s have several more features like hyperthreading mentioned above.

#3047 pantsattack

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:29 AM

Well I guess I misspoke earlier. I didn't mean to imply that one processor is really that much better than the other. The i7 and i5 at that clock speed won't show a huge difference in performance but the value of the i7 is greater which is why the price is so much higher. The benefit from an i7 is that you'll have the ability to use hyperthreading... although that won't be apparent in most applications and really not at all in games.


Hmm. If not applications or games what's hyper threading used for?

Tony is going to clean this thread up real good once his puppy comes home. Oh, man.

#3048 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:31 AM

It isn't bad, not the best, but not bad at all.

Well, I don't think I can afford the best, lmao. But along those lines, is that card going to play a graphically intense game at that resolution (1366 x 768)? Or am I going to have to cut back on settings and/or experience a drop in FPS?

That honestly looks like the best deal I've come across so far (in one day of looking, ahem).

Tony is going to clean this thread up real good once his puppy comes home. Oh, man.

rofl, I know right? But hey, this discussion influences the games I buy through this sale, so in an odd sort of way, it's right on topic!

And as for the i5 vs. i7 discussion, am I really going to see a difference while playing games depending on which one I have if I have a worthy graphics card instead?

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3049 thegreatest

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:36 AM

Well, I don't think I can afford the best, lmao. But along those lines, is that card going to play a graphically intense game at that resolution (1366 x 768)? Or am I going to have to cut back on settings and/or experience a drop in FPS?

That honestly looks like the best deal I've come across so far (in one day of looking, ahem).


rofl, I know right? But hey, this discussion influences the games I buy through this sale, so in an odd sort of way, it's right on topic!


Did you look at this link?

http://www.notebookc...5M.41933.0.html

I'm not sure what games you are wanting to play, but that will give you an idea of what you can expect. If you click on the numbers (which would be your fps) it will show you the exact build the laptop had they tested on. Most will have an i7, but gaming wise it isn't too big of a difference. Maybe 5 fps lower with an i5 if any. Some games it won't matter, but games like BF3 or Skyrim it will and a quad core will run much better. Some games will recommend a quad core processor, but I don't think any games have required it... yet.

#3050 exaznkid

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:37 AM

thanks for the feedback guys, i think ill hold out just a bit longer on this one

#3051 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:41 AM

Okay, that link overwhelmed me at first, but after looking closer I get it. Basically the 555M is only going play graphically intense games at low settings, huh? Looks like if you set it higher the FPS is always going to be 30 or worse (or terrible, like on Skyrim, which is one that I'd like to be able to run well, lol).

Doesn't 30 FPS and lower look like shit?

And further, would buying the next step up Lenovo system for $90 more to get the i7 and a 2GB graphics card as opposed to a 1GB graphics card make all the difference in playing a game like Skyrim? Or would it be negligible?

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3052 thegreatest

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:50 AM

Okay, that link overwhelmed me at first, but after looking closer I get it. Basically the 555M is only going play graphically intense games at low settings, huh? Looks like if you set it higher the FPS is always going to be 30 or worse (or terrible, like on Skyrim, which is one that I'd like to be able to run well, lol).

Doesn't 30 FPS and lower look like shit?


Skyrim you could probably pull off medium, but really, low is fine as long as you are at the proper resolution it should look fine.

Your frame rate really has nothing to do with how it looks (unless it is something ridiculous like 5fps or something). It is more about screen lag. It is said that anything at 25-30fps is fast enough for your eyes not to notice any lag (for reference consoles usually run at 30fps). Anything above 20fps is usually playable on anything besides an fps. With an fps you want as high of a frame rate as possible and at least 30fps or you are at a clear disadvantage. It will give you a delayed reaction time.

As for that Lenovo, it is a far better brand, and for the money I'm not sure you can beat it. It should be able to run most games on at least low settings (nothing like BF3 and probably The Witcher 2). The problem I see is that it isn't future proof at all. I doubt you will be able to run the next wave of games like Assassins Creed 3 at all on it. If you can wait, I'd save up and buy something like an ASUS G Series. At least there you have some sort of future proof hardware that will last at least 3-4 years if not longer.

#3053 pantsattack

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:51 AM

Constant 30 fps is what some games shoot for and many console games play at. It's not that bad. Action games at less than that gets hairy.

#3054 Chariblaze

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:52 AM

Hmm. If not applications or games what's hyper threading used for?

Tony is going to clean this thread up real good once his puppy comes home. Oh, man.


It's make a difference if you're running like 7 non-backround prgrams at once, but otherwise, virtualization and video editing.


And as for the i5 vs. i7 discussion, am I really going to see a difference while playing games depending on which one I have if I have a worthy graphics card instead?


I don't believe so.

#3055 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:54 AM

Yeah, but those (ASUS Gs) are way out of my budget at $1000 or more. Hell, $600 is out of my budget, but eh.

I mostly play console games, but since my current laptop is falling apart and really can't keep up with new games, I want something that's respectable and capable. I can't really expect to be able to play the latest greatest PC games in the future I guess.

Would anteing up $90 for the i7 and 2GB card make for a big difference?

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3056 TctclMvPhase

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 04:59 AM

Im late to this conversation, but do you really need a laptop? For gaming, value-wise, its tough to be a desktop. If you're going to be dropping a G, why not buy a laptop for about $500 and build a gaming desktop for about $500. You'll be far more future-proofed than buying a laptop, which should be cheaper in the long run.

For me, it also has the added benefit of diversifying your game playing. I keep all my indie and classic titles on the laptop and then my big games on my home PC. That way I get a good hour or two to play my indies during my commute each day, which helps keep the back log down.

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#3057 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 05:01 AM

Im late to this conversation, but do you really need a laptop? For gaming, value-wise, its tough to be a desktop. If you're going to be dropping a G, why not buy a laptop for about $500 and build a gaming desktop for about $500. You'll be far more future-proofed than buying a laptop, which should be cheaper in the long run.

For me, it also has the added benefit of diversifying your game playing. I keep all my indie and classic titles on the laptop and then my big games on my home PC. That way I get a good hour or two to play my indies during my commute each day, which helps keep the back log down.

It's worth thinking about, but I'm planning on being a little more mobile in coming years. Might be moving around, etc. I think having something portable is a deal breaker in this case.

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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#3058 thegreatest

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 05:03 AM

Yeah, but those (ASUS Gs) are way out of my budget at $1000 or more. Hell, $600 is out of my budget, but eh.

I mostly play console games, but since my current laptop is falling apart and really can't keep up with new games, I want something that's respectable and capable. I can't really expect to be able to play the latest greatest PC games in the future I guess.

Would anteing up $90 for the i7 and 2GB card make for a big difference?


No not really. The amount of memory a graphics card has isn't really the kicker. The chipset is. Something that supports Directx 11 is always going to be better than something that supports Directx 10. PC gaming really is confusing at first, but after a little research into what makes a graphics card perform will clear things up. You are going to want to look at core clocks, shader clocks, memory clock, DDR3 vs DDR5, etc. That's what's really important.

In the higher end Geforce cards (gtx 460, gtx 560, etc) many 1.5gb cards out perform 2gb and even 3gb cards.

I'm going to hit the sack now though. Good luck on some research, and hopefully you decide on the best thing for you. IMO if you do most of your gaming on consoles anyway and don't have the money to get something that will last awhile I'd get a cheaper laptop for internet browsing or just keep what you have. It's really not worth it to spend $800 on a laptop t for gaming that won't be able to run games that come out this Aug-Nov.

Im late to this conversation, but do you really need a laptop? For gaming, value-wise, its tough to be a desktop. If you're going to be dropping a G, why not buy a laptop for about $500 and build a gaming desktop for about $500. You'll be far more future-proofed than buying a laptop, which should be cheaper in the long run.

For me, it also has the added benefit of diversifying your game playing. I keep all my indie and classic titles on the laptop and then my big games on my home PC. That way I get a good hour or two to play my indies during my commute each day, which helps keep the back log down.


You can't build a good gaming desktop for $500 from scratch. You are still looking at $800-1000 at least to get a good gaming desktop. Yes, you can upgrade the processor and graphics card, not just the RAM and HDD like with a laptop, but upgrading your processor leads to new mobo too. When you do a total upgrade of desktop (processor, RAM, graphics card, PSU) it puts you close to $800 again. It's really not much cheaper than buying a laptop every 5-6 years when you would usually upgrade a desktop. The mobility really is worth it too.

#3059 twztid13

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 05:04 AM

Metro 2033 is a beast unto itself. Even the 680 feels pain running that game.

Yeah, I have 2gb GTX 560 (fermi)'s SC in SLI w/ 866 core clock (which I could easily go higher, but haven't had the need to). I just hate the instability of the framerate, not that it takes alot to run it. I'd much more prefer a smooth 50-60 over a 30 - 180, lol.

Edited by twztid13, 20 May 2012 - 05:18 AM.


#3060 Idiotekque

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 05:08 AM

Well, I guess there are still a good deal of computer games that I'd like to play that are currently out. Hell, I bought the Bioshock bundle and I'm sitting here with a half broken laptop that gets slower every minute that it's on (the virtual memory slowly becomes lower and lower; good fun). It's hard to play anything really; last one I tried was King's Bounty Legend and the first Penumbra, and I had to turn shadows off on KB Legend to play at an okay FPS, and while Penumbra plays quick, the lighting is fucked (everything is multicolor; it looks like a disco which kinda detracts from the "spooky" vibe of the game).

That's why I'm looking to grab something worthy of being a nice laptop for the basics (since I'm a freelance writer and graphic artist who needs things like Word and Photoshop on hand), as well as being strong enough to fire up a game like Skyrim or New Vegas if I want to. I get your point though; we'll see. The one I'm looking at right now is $700 though, not $800.

Terraria - $2 (Steam),  X3: Terran Conflict - $2 (Steam)Fable: The Lost Chapters - $2 (Steam)

 

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