CAGcast #154: Rantastic!
- Thread starter CheapyD
- Start date
[quote name='jkanownik']Have you played RE5? I'm over 15 hours played and will easily hit 30 hours before I'm done with the straight retail version.
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I am trying to find the best 10 hours in podcasts I can find to listen to and right now the CAGcast is out.[/QUOTE]
I said more then once that I feel that RE5 is worth 60 bucks, that wasn't my complaint. I don't think the DLC is worth 5. In fact I pretty much agree with everything you said which is why I feel this is such an awful idea. Why dedicate a staff for something that no one may want? Why release an unproven mode as paid content? Would it have been a better business desicion to relase this as free content, so maps can be charged for if it is well recieved? Why not take that risk, if the company is willing to make the content, why separate it. Do they know it not very good? I think these are all valid questions.
Oh and no one cares about how busy you are making games you won't name in your argument, makes you sound like an elitest douche bag.
......
I am trying to find the best 10 hours in podcasts I can find to listen to and right now the CAGcast is out.[/QUOTE]
I said more then once that I feel that RE5 is worth 60 bucks, that wasn't my complaint. I don't think the DLC is worth 5. In fact I pretty much agree with everything you said which is why I feel this is such an awful idea. Why dedicate a staff for something that no one may want? Why release an unproven mode as paid content? Would it have been a better business desicion to relase this as free content, so maps can be charged for if it is well recieved? Why not take that risk, if the company is willing to make the content, why separate it. Do they know it not very good? I think these are all valid questions.
Oh and no one cares about how busy you are making games you won't name in your argument, makes you sound like an elitest douche bag.
People are upset of the RE5 PDLC because it's essentially done and Capcom unwisely let people know that by putting it in the strategy guide and in their response saying it's weeks away. If no one knew about it, and in April or May, Capcom announced a new online mode they're offering for $5, there would be far less whining.
I'm sure 90% of companies that do DLC create it during the core game's development cycle, or at least start it, and withhold it to be sold at a later date. They just happened to do a better job than Capcom with keeping it a secret.
I'm sure 90% of companies that do DLC create it during the core game's development cycle, or at least start it, and withhold it to be sold at a later date. They just happened to do a better job than Capcom with keeping it a secret.
DesertEagleXIX
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Has anyone actually downloaded the RE5 DLC content, or are we all speculating on its entertainment to dollar ratio?
Would people feel differently if it was priced at 200 points,or even 100 points?
Would people feel differently if it was priced at 200 points,or even 100 points?
kashwashwa
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Cheapy, you kid about obtaining the license for Joust, but if it would cost even a fair bit of money, I don't see how you couldn't easily make your money back. You've already got some people ready and willing to create it - and now with Xbox Live's community games, you could get something released pretty effortlessly.
It doesn't even matter what the game actually consists of. Get an an animated picture of yourself riding an ostrich shouting "IM A SPACE PIMP", and you know your little caglings will lap that up at 200 or 400 points.
What do you want in life? To be known as a cheapassgamer? Or to be known as a cheapassgamer who ruined a once loved video game license?
In all reality though if you got superprogrammer john and maybe a few others involved (for art, sound etc.), kept to the original gameplay mechanics, but just updated it with some kind of goofy story (as Wombat volunteered to do), and maybe some new multiplayer modes you could easily sell that thing for 200 or 400 points to thousands of people.
Even selling the game for 200 points - if you sold 10,000 copies, that would bring in $25,000. How much of that goes to Microsoft I dont know, but that's gotta cover the cost.
It doesn't even matter what the game actually consists of. Get an an animated picture of yourself riding an ostrich shouting "IM A SPACE PIMP", and you know your little caglings will lap that up at 200 or 400 points.
What do you want in life? To be known as a cheapassgamer? Or to be known as a cheapassgamer who ruined a once loved video game license?
In all reality though if you got superprogrammer john and maybe a few others involved (for art, sound etc.), kept to the original gameplay mechanics, but just updated it with some kind of goofy story (as Wombat volunteered to do), and maybe some new multiplayer modes you could easily sell that thing for 200 or 400 points to thousands of people.
Even selling the game for 200 points - if you sold 10,000 copies, that would bring in $25,000. How much of that goes to Microsoft I dont know, but that's gotta cover the cost.
LiK
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[quote name='Walt Jay']People are upset of the RE5 PDLC because it's essentially done and Capcom unwisely let people know that by putting it in the strategy guide and in their response saying it's weeks away. If no one knew about it, and in April or May, Capcom announced a new online mode they're offering for $5, there would be far less whining.
I'm sure 90% of companies that do DLC create it during the core game's development cycle, or at least start it, and withhold it to be sold at a later date. They just happened to do a better job than Capcom with keeping it a secret.[/quote]
and i also think it's because Capcom already burned people by selling the SFIV costume packs that are already in the game disc which is ridiculous. looks like Capcom is following Namco Bandai's model with their so-called DLC (which is basically an unlock key).
I'm sure 90% of companies that do DLC create it during the core game's development cycle, or at least start it, and withhold it to be sold at a later date. They just happened to do a better job than Capcom with keeping it a secret.[/quote]
and i also think it's because Capcom already burned people by selling the SFIV costume packs that are already in the game disc which is ridiculous. looks like Capcom is following Namco Bandai's model with their so-called DLC (which is basically an unlock key).
Cheapy and Wombat, I disagree with your RE5 DLC rant.
I don't see what reasoning makes you feel that 100% of what a game development team is able to produce within the game's development cycle should be sold to you at the price of retail $60. More content and more gameplay modes requires more manpower and therefore more MONEY to develop. No one is expecting a resident evil game to have a VS mode, and no one would have complained about value of the game if a VS mode was never available on the $60 disc. Somewhat similar games, Bioshock and Dead Space had NO multiplayer, and no one complained about value on those. Would you be happier if RE5 cost $65 on the disc and came with the VS mode?
If Capcom wants to go above and beyond, allocate additional resources for extra, non-essential DLC content for a little bit more money, then I say let them. I doubt the team finished up early and were sitting around watching hampsterdance until the marketing folks were like, "Hey guys, if you've got nothing to do, I'll find you something to do. Go make a VS mode." It costs extra money to make something like this, and surprise, they would like to make extra money for their extra effort. I don't see what's so confusing about this. And as always, if you don't feel it is worth it (both the content on the disc, and the DLC), then don't purchase it.
I don't see what reasoning makes you feel that 100% of what a game development team is able to produce within the game's development cycle should be sold to you at the price of retail $60. More content and more gameplay modes requires more manpower and therefore more MONEY to develop. No one is expecting a resident evil game to have a VS mode, and no one would have complained about value of the game if a VS mode was never available on the $60 disc. Somewhat similar games, Bioshock and Dead Space had NO multiplayer, and no one complained about value on those. Would you be happier if RE5 cost $65 on the disc and came with the VS mode?
If Capcom wants to go above and beyond, allocate additional resources for extra, non-essential DLC content for a little bit more money, then I say let them. I doubt the team finished up early and were sitting around watching hampsterdance until the marketing folks were like, "Hey guys, if you've got nothing to do, I'll find you something to do. Go make a VS mode." It costs extra money to make something like this, and surprise, they would like to make extra money for their extra effort. I don't see what's so confusing about this. And as always, if you don't feel it is worth it (both the content on the disc, and the DLC), then don't purchase it.
controlcommerce
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Hello Cheapy D and Wombat,
I've been listening to the podcast since #1 but I've never talked in the show notes before. The reason I'm posting is not for praise. I'm sorry. But I'll to do a little trade off. I'll post a positive itunes review afterward.
I don't like negative shows. I listen to podcast for enjoyment. I stopped listening to many (1up, joystiq) because all they do is complain. I'm one of the nerds who listens to each show at least twice, but this weeks is close to unlistenable. Cheapy, I understand the $5 DLC is a ripoff. No one should disagree with you there (except Capcom), great move on. Please don't spent an hour and ten minutes talking about it. And then bring it back up during other unrelated segments. Wombat you need to moves things moving along and ask him to drop it when it gets excessive. He does that for you at the right time of your rants and it makes a better show.
Also I would like to call Wombat out as a flip-flipper. The last 2 shows he's taken a big fat shit on R5. Weeks before the game come out. You did the "I WANT TO WALK AND SHOOT!" rant twice. I been looking forward to your review because I knew you would put your foot in your mouth. But Cheapy D interrupted twice with his "
Capcom" speech, ruining the moment. As a day one CAGcast fan, you should redo that moment for me Wombat 
.
I've been listening to the podcast since #1 but I've never talked in the show notes before. The reason I'm posting is not for praise. I'm sorry. But I'll to do a little trade off. I'll post a positive itunes review afterward.
I don't like negative shows. I listen to podcast for enjoyment. I stopped listening to many (1up, joystiq) because all they do is complain. I'm one of the nerds who listens to each show at least twice, but this weeks is close to unlistenable. Cheapy, I understand the $5 DLC is a ripoff. No one should disagree with you there (except Capcom), great move on. Please don't spent an hour and ten minutes talking about it. And then bring it back up during other unrelated segments. Wombat you need to moves things moving along and ask him to drop it when it gets excessive. He does that for you at the right time of your rants and it makes a better show.
Also I would like to call Wombat out as a flip-flipper. The last 2 shows he's taken a big fat shit on R5. Weeks before the game come out. You did the "I WANT TO WALK AND SHOOT!" rant twice. I been looking forward to your review because I knew you would put your foot in your mouth. But Cheapy D interrupted twice with his "
Capcom" speech, ruining the moment. As a day one CAGcast fan, you should redo that moment for me Wombat .
[quote name='jkanownik']
Look. I'm taking time out of my busy day because I care very passionately about video games. I really wanted to get into work early this morning to get some stuff done but I'm writing this instead. [/quote]
I'm taking time out of my normal work slacking to lol at this comment.
Look. I'm taking time out of my busy day because I care very passionately about video games. I really wanted to get into work early this morning to get some stuff done but I'm writing this instead. [/quote]
I'm taking time out of my normal work slacking to lol at this comment.
oscargrouch
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[quote name='usickenme']Whenever I see Robert Gibbs (presidential spokesperson), I am reminded of Wombat.
[/quote]
Ugh. Why would you do that to Wombat? Wombat is way more intelligent.
[/quote]
Ugh. Why would you do that to Wombat? Wombat is way more intelligent.
SeanNOLA
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Hey Cheapy & Wombat,
I thought I'd weigh in on the RE5 controversy:
I think the exclusion of this content from the game has little to do with Capcom's money-grubbing schemes and more to do with them attempting to control review scores. There may have been a fear that if the multiplayer modes were viewed negatively by the press, it would mean lower scores for the game overall. "Tacked-on" multiplayer modes seem to be a negative bullet point in a lot of reviews these days, so I think the decision to withhold the new multiplayer modes was a smart move from Capcom's Point of view.
That being said, charging for them, especially when the $60 hole in my wallet is still warm, is not necessarily a good idea either. If they had held onto the multiplayer modes and released them later to rejuvenate the audience, then I guess people would be okay with it. In fact, I think planning DLC ahead of time to add to a game's longevity is a smart maneuver, but releasing it right after launch and asking for more money seems to be a sore spot with gamers.
That was a little long-in-the-tooth, but to summarize I think that Capcom removing multiplayer and offering it separately was a smart move, but they should have either offered it for free or kept it up their sleeve for at least a few months.
I thought I'd weigh in on the RE5 controversy:
I think the exclusion of this content from the game has little to do with Capcom's money-grubbing schemes and more to do with them attempting to control review scores. There may have been a fear that if the multiplayer modes were viewed negatively by the press, it would mean lower scores for the game overall. "Tacked-on" multiplayer modes seem to be a negative bullet point in a lot of reviews these days, so I think the decision to withhold the new multiplayer modes was a smart move from Capcom's Point of view.
That being said, charging for them, especially when the $60 hole in my wallet is still warm, is not necessarily a good idea either. If they had held onto the multiplayer modes and released them later to rejuvenate the audience, then I guess people would be okay with it. In fact, I think planning DLC ahead of time to add to a game's longevity is a smart maneuver, but releasing it right after launch and asking for more money seems to be a sore spot with gamers.
That was a little long-in-the-tooth, but to summarize I think that Capcom removing multiplayer and offering it separately was a smart move, but they should have either offered it for free or kept it up their sleeve for at least a few months.
[quote name='controlcommerce']
Also I would like to call Wombat out as a flip-flipper. The last 2 shows he's taken a big fat shit on R5. Weeks before the game come out. You did the "I WANT TO WALK AND SHOOT!" rant twice. I been looking forward to your review because I knew you would put your foot in your mouth. But Cheapy D interrupted twice with his " Capcom" speech, ruining the moment. As a day one CAGcast fan, you should redo that moment for me Wombat .[/QUOTE]
for the record, that's Cheapy who complained about the controls, I have always said that I kinda like 'em. My complaints were that the demo seemed too actiony when compared with RE4. That I was happily wrong about. So maybe a half foot in mouth
Also I would like to call Wombat out as a flip-flipper. The last 2 shows he's taken a big fat shit on R5. Weeks before the game come out. You did the "I WANT TO WALK AND SHOOT!" rant twice. I been looking forward to your review because I knew you would put your foot in your mouth. But Cheapy D interrupted twice with his "
Capcom" speech, ruining the moment. As a day one CAGcast fan, you should redo that moment for me Wombat .[/QUOTE]for the record, that's Cheapy who complained about the controls, I have always said that I kinda like 'em. My complaints were that the demo seemed too actiony when compared with RE4. That I was happily wrong about. So maybe a half foot in mouth
KingBroly
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[quote name='Wombat']for the record, that's Cheapy who complained about the controls, I have always said that I kinda like 'em. My complaints were that the demo seemed too actiony when compared with RE4. That I was happily wrong about. So maybe a half foot in mouth[/quote]
I don't like your cheery tone, Wombat. Get back to watching College Hoops like the rest of us
I don't like your cheery tone, Wombat. Get back to watching College Hoops like the rest of us
[quote name='Wombat']I said more then once that I feel that RE5 is worth 60 bucks, that wasn't my complaint. I don't think the DLC is worth 5. In fact I pretty much agree with everything you said which is why I feel this is such an awful idea. Why dedicate a staff for something that no one may want? Why release an unproven mode as paid content? Would it have been a better business desicion to relase this as free content, so maps can be charged for if it is well recieved? Why not take that risk, if the company is willing to make the content, why separate it. Do they know it not very good? I think these are all valid questions.
Oh and no one cares about how busy you are making games you won't name in your argument, makes you sound like an elitest douche bag.[/quote]
As I said I can't listen anymore, so I don't know what I said. I actually agree with what you are saying. Your argument has merit, but there is no reason to be angry with Capcom for the reasons you stated. There really isn't a history for any of this so they're taking a chance either way. I don't think there is a right answer for any of this right now. No one knows. Change to the status quo is inevitable because the current model is broken.
I PM'd you the company I work for and named the names of the games. Given that my username is actually my real name I'd rather not mention it publicly. The bottom line is that you've lost a voice within the industry because of the negative tone lately. In the past if you had a gripe about something my company (or all game companies) did I would look further into the details of it and if there was something I could do about it I would. I'm not saying I could change anything or that I'm anyone special, but you should realize that people do listen to what you have to say and take that seriously if you want your voice heard (or not, it's your choice).
Oh and no one cares about how busy you are making games you won't name in your argument, makes you sound like an elitest douche bag.[/quote]
As I said I can't listen anymore, so I don't know what I said. I actually agree with what you are saying. Your argument has merit, but there is no reason to be angry with Capcom for the reasons you stated. There really isn't a history for any of this so they're taking a chance either way. I don't think there is a right answer for any of this right now. No one knows. Change to the status quo is inevitable because the current model is broken.
I PM'd you the company I work for and named the names of the games. Given that my username is actually my real name I'd rather not mention it publicly. The bottom line is that you've lost a voice within the industry because of the negative tone lately. In the past if you had a gripe about something my company (or all game companies) did I would look further into the details of it and if there was something I could do about it I would. I'm not saying I could change anything or that I'm anyone special, but you should realize that people do listen to what you have to say and take that seriously if you want your voice heard (or not, it's your choice).
Dr Mario Kart
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The razor and blades business model is also known as the loss leader strategy. Its not meant to be a direct comparison to actual razors and blades. Its not offensive.
The loss leader strategy also only works if you can get significant marketshare. They cant drop the price right now, and they shouldnt. They are correctly focusing on profitability, because they are basically doomed either way. Better to be doomed with a billion less dollars lost in subsidizing hardware. They've already lost every dollar made during the entire Playstation 2 era and they're starting to cut into money that they made at the very start with the PS1, they're not anxious to keep going down that road.
The loss leader strategy also only works if you can get significant marketshare. They cant drop the price right now, and they shouldnt. They are correctly focusing on profitability, because they are basically doomed either way. Better to be doomed with a billion less dollars lost in subsidizing hardware. They've already lost every dollar made during the entire Playstation 2 era and they're starting to cut into money that they made at the very start with the PS1, they're not anxious to keep going down that road.
Code:
FY* Sony** Nintendo Microsoft
1998 974,000,000 629,000,000
1999 1,130,000,000 645,000,000
2000 730,000,000 421,000,000
2001 -409,000,000 726,000,000
2002 623,000,000 800,000,000 -750,000,000
2003 939,000,000 560,000,000 -1,191,000,000
2004 650,000,000 316,000,000 -1,215,000,000
2005 404,000,000 777,000,000 -485,000,000
2006 75,000,000 894,000,000 -1,262,000,000
2007 -1,969,000,000 1,489,000,000 -1,892,000,000
2008 -1,265,000,000 2,480,000,000 426,000,000
2009 51,000,000 1,026,000,000
Totals 1,953,000,000 10,762,000,000 -6,369,000,000
[quote name='jkanownik']The bottom line is that you've lost a voice within the industry because of the negative tone lately.[/quote]
But on a serious note, people expect to get their half-baked multiplayer experience in the box. It doesn't matter how you explain away the choice to make it paid-for DLC, whenever you try charging for something that people are used to getting for free, there will be an uproar.
But on a serious note, people expect to get their half-baked multiplayer experience in the box. It doesn't matter how you explain away the choice to make it paid-for DLC, whenever you try charging for something that people are used to getting for free, there will be an uproar.
h3llbring3r
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Props for Wombat for recognizing the comedic genius of Ted Knight in Caddyshack.
Playing an over-the-top straightman is much harder than playing an over-the-top ass (R.D.)
Ted Knight (The honorable Elihu Smalls) lines are also a good way to test supposed Caddyshack fans;
Toss out a "wanna Fresca?" or a "How would you like to come over and mow my lawn? Mmm, mmmw?"
Also, I caught it in HD over the Holidays. Lacey Underall in HD ≡ Win.
Playing an over-the-top straightman is much harder than playing an over-the-top ass (R.D.)
Ted Knight (The honorable Elihu Smalls) lines are also a good way to test supposed Caddyshack fans;
Toss out a "wanna Fresca?" or a "How would you like to come over and mow my lawn? Mmm, mmmw?"
Also, I caught it in HD over the Holidays. Lacey Underall in HD ≡ Win.
kashwashwa
CAGiversary!
[quote name='jkanownik'] I'm not saying I could change anything or that I'm anyone special, but you should realize that people do listen to what you have to say and take that seriously if you want your voice heard (or not, it's your choice).[/quote]
I guess Goomba should have just been understanding, and not voiced his 'negative tone' with regards to the credit card drama as well right?
(Hint: I think Wombat was hoping his voice is heard.)
I guess Goomba should have just been understanding, and not voiced his 'negative tone' with regards to the credit card drama as well right?
(Hint: I think Wombat was hoping his voice is heard.)
Bucknut
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[quote name='jkanownik']
I PM'd you the company I work for and named the names of the games. Given that my username is actually my real name I'd rather not mention it publicly. [/quote]
Why would you present this info? Now the internets can google and figure out you work for activision.
I PM'd you the company I work for and named the names of the games. Given that my username is actually my real name I'd rather not mention it publicly. [/quote]
Why would you present this info? Now the internets can google and figure out you work for activision.
ShinAkumA21
CAGiversary!
i can't wait until Capcom make us pay 60 dollars for a demo and the rest of the game will be DLC for 5 dollars each level :lol:
usickenme
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[quote name='Wombat']for the record, that's Cheapy who complained about the controls, I have always said that I kinda like 'em. My complaints were that the demo seemed too actiony when compared with RE4. That I was happily wrong about. So maybe a half foot in mouth[/QUOTE]
You've convinced me to pick the game up. Wife and 1 kid is gone this weekend.
You've convinced me to pick the game up. Wife and 1 kid is gone this weekend.
This is so OT, but Wombat's argument of the fourth Indy film not following the "theology" theme is not necessarily true. One thing you need to consider is that generally speaking, the movies supposedly follow a chronology and history of the world from the 40s on and the fourth movie follows a logical progression. I don't think the fourth movie necessarily abandons what the previous movies did just because of that as the period of the 50s on really did reflect an interest in aliens, and subjects that aren't necessarily explained by theology. Besides, the third movie kind of takes care of the whole secular man coming to grips with religious events idea.
n11n12
CAGiversary!
Imagine if in Burnout Paradise you were charged fifty cents every time you started a new race for the first time. I know it's pessimistic, but I've got a feeling that's where we're headed with DLC.
Oh and Wombat, I think you look like a cross between a young David Paymer with a little Wayne Knight.
Oh and Wombat, I think you look like a cross between a young David Paymer with a little Wayne Knight.
Gunslinger5000
CAGiversary!
Cheep D sounds like a giant homo
XTommyDonX
CAGiversary!
Listening now, but great so far!
The new podcast should be great. It's great to know that CAG should soon be seeing big guests and contacts coming with Workman's new show. Exciting!
I really hope that absolutely no one buys the RE5 DLC. Few people will buy it and those people will feel cheated when they pay the $5, as well as when everyone else stops playing it, thus making it useless. It's hard to recommend this game and have the explain to friends that you have to PAY for a regular multiplayer mode. It's makes me feel embarassed for Capcom. What a shame.
The new podcast should be great. It's great to know that CAG should soon be seeing big guests and contacts coming with Workman's new show. Exciting!
I really hope that absolutely no one buys the RE5 DLC. Few people will buy it and those people will feel cheated when they pay the $5, as well as when everyone else stops playing it, thus making it useless. It's hard to recommend this game and have the explain to friends that you have to PAY for a regular multiplayer mode. It's makes me feel embarassed for Capcom. What a shame.
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Phished0ne
CAG Veteran
It was interesting hearing the RE5 discussion, it reminded me of something they brought up on an episode of RebelFM, they were talking about recession gaming, and they said in the future companies should look into releasing games as single-player only, with a possible multiplayer released as DLC. The only caveat is that the single-player only games should be released at a lower price(so, all-in-all it doesn't really apply to the RE5 dicussion also do to the co-op nature of RE). I think capcom could've saved a lot of face if RE5 was released at a slightly cheaper price-point and charging 5 dollars for the Vs mode.
[quote name='Dr Mario Kart'] fun chart [/quote]
Couldn't agree more. Although game publishers and consumers would love a cheap PS3, from Sony's perspective, I can see why they would reject that idea.
Unless they drop the price of the PS3 to $249, or maybe even $199 or lower, they have no shot in catching the Wii, and in some regions, the 360. The price was very high to begin with; mix in the worldwide recession and the end result is a guaranteed bronze in marketshare.
They're better off focusing on profits, because they are not going to takeover the top spot in install base for a very long time, if ever.
Couldn't agree more. Although game publishers and consumers would love a cheap PS3, from Sony's perspective, I can see why they would reject that idea.
Unless they drop the price of the PS3 to $249, or maybe even $199 or lower, they have no shot in catching the Wii, and in some regions, the 360. The price was very high to begin with; mix in the worldwide recession and the end result is a guaranteed bronze in marketshare.
They're better off focusing on profits, because they are not going to takeover the top spot in install base for a very long time, if ever.
mrfreeziexp
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Oh, man, Wombat, you don't want to go on Jimmy Fallon.. Did you see Kevin Rose and Alex Albrecht from diggnation on Jimmy Fallon the other night? It was so awkward and it felt like they didn't belong there. I think it would just be embarrassing for Wombat and Cheapy to go on there.
Loonknight
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I too was quite angered by the Sven's "BS" call on the Ask Capcom forums. I was upset for a few days, and I'll not pick up RE5 new because of it. This type of BS didn't go on last generation, and again, I agree with CheapyD, they have the oportunity to milk us via Xbox's Marketplace and the PSN so they do. And of course Capcom is not the only one, they are just the most recent offenders in my mind.
Ack, I'm getting upset again. Great show this week, and good luck with Tai walking all over the place. ^^
Ack, I'm getting upset again. Great show this week, and good luck with Tai walking all over the place. ^^
mrfreeziexp
CAGiversary!
I forgot to mention how awesome Henry Hatsworth is. First of all, Wombat has it wrong. completing puzzle combos and whatnot do NOT control Henry Hatsworth. you're still platforming. Basically, it's a straight up platformer with little planet puzzle league breaks peppered into the gameplay. While you're platforming and killing baddies, the puzzle on the lower screen is slowly rising towards the top screen and you have to press X and clear out the puzzle before it reaches the top or else the blocks come out and start attacking you. When you clear out a bunch of the blocks, you charge up your golden suit and that's how turn into a giant robot.(I forgot, you can turn into a giant robot.)
The plot is that you are trying to collect all of this magical golden suit. I think everytime you get a new piece of the suit, it unlocks a new power, I'm not sure because I haven't made it that far.. But I do know that when you get the hat, which is right when you start the game, it unlocks the ability to turn into a robot. A golden robot, at that.
I really like Henry Hatsworth, the game's protagonist. he's so nice and well spoken, even when facing down a boss. I've only made it to the first "boss" where you fight the guy in the giant mechanical top hat and he was so cool about it. He even laid down this major diss: "you seem to be confusing wealth and class. The former you have in spades, but the latter you are lacking." SNAP SON.
There's really too many little things to note here, but this game really oozes charm from every corner. From Hatsworth cleaning his little monocle when you stop moving, to the little tea time cut scene when you turn into the robot.
Honestly, this is all you need to know: Henry Hatsworth drinks tea and can turn into a giant super golden robot to fight giant mechanical top hats. That, and the fun puzzle/platforming gameplay.
the whole Henry Hatsworth in the Puzzling Adventure game is so charming and cute(don't forget fun). I really like it, it's a shame it's not getting proper attention. I seriously recommend it. I wish Wombat would play it and talk about it on the next show, that would be really cool.
The plot is that you are trying to collect all of this magical golden suit. I think everytime you get a new piece of the suit, it unlocks a new power, I'm not sure because I haven't made it that far.. But I do know that when you get the hat, which is right when you start the game, it unlocks the ability to turn into a robot. A golden robot, at that.
I really like Henry Hatsworth, the game's protagonist. he's so nice and well spoken, even when facing down a boss. I've only made it to the first "boss" where you fight the guy in the giant mechanical top hat and he was so cool about it. He even laid down this major diss: "you seem to be confusing wealth and class. The former you have in spades, but the latter you are lacking." SNAP SON.
There's really too many little things to note here, but this game really oozes charm from every corner. From Hatsworth cleaning his little monocle when you stop moving, to the little tea time cut scene when you turn into the robot.
Honestly, this is all you need to know: Henry Hatsworth drinks tea and can turn into a giant super golden robot to fight giant mechanical top hats. That, and the fun puzzle/platforming gameplay.
the whole Henry Hatsworth in the Puzzling Adventure game is so charming and cute(don't forget fun). I really like it, it's a shame it's not getting proper attention. I seriously recommend it. I wish Wombat would play it and talk about it on the next show, that would be really cool.
Last edited by a moderator:
NotJamesXBL
CAG Veteran
Awesome Show But I Could Come Up With A Better Title Like
" Get Your Twits Out"
" Get Your Twits Out"
GamerInterface
CAGiversary!
Firstl, another excellent and thought-provoking show. Always a pleasure to listen to the exchange of ideas between you two excellent hosts, and to get more perspective on those ideas by the details of your private lives that you share. As you will see below, my thoughts get very provoked by the show - so I'm deciding this time to share. (Yes, this isn't the usual way that someone comments on the show - but I've never been one to follow the crowd.)
Cheapy - Was there video monitoring in the love hotel? Or is it just a REALLY good place to take someone to murder them with no witnesses? (I think of this because I'm in the middle of a mystery book series, NOT because I'm looking for a good location.)
Cheapy - when leaving feedback to your show, if I look and find that there are already 200+ replies to the show post, should there be another way to more effectively communicate that feedback? (Note - feedback is a different concept than post-show conversation with the audience.)
Cheapy - you could get a mixing board to raise the pitch of your voice. Could raise the show up in the eyes of animal activists - "Wombat and Chipmunk, Gamer Mammals".
Cheapy - Indy in the fridge last week turned into coleslaw, and this week into mashed potatoes. A) Why does he never turn into ACTUAL MEAT (like meat loaf), and B) Have you thought about eating larger breakfasts before recording the 'Cast?
Cheapy - With the two guys choosing the money over the porn star on the Stern show (a RADIO show, I remind you), are we sure this is not a situation created by the porn star and not the economy? Not all porn stars look good close up.
Wombat - While Indy and Noah's Ark would have been cool, Indy and EXCALIBUR would have been awesome. Or even Siege Perilous.
Cheapy - "Magical Guy in the Sky" sounds familiar as a reference for Divine-Creator-Force. Are you a George Carlin fan?
Both - If you agree that Sony needs to go DLC-only for the PSP, why is the DSi online capability something you're not interested in (even though the stuff on it is NOW limited, it's a channel that will be used)? And why shouldn't MS, Sony and Nintendo just dump discs altogether? Defend discs in the wake of this statement that the PSP doesn't need them.
Both - Regarding hardcore gamers: hardcore gamers haven't needed love for fifteen years. Hardcore gamers have bought into games WAYYYYY past when they were just crap, and they *knew* they were getting crap. It is NOT just the long-dead memories of Sonic 2 that makes Sega keep pumping out Sonic 3D uselessness - it's that WE BUY THEM. I think the entire success of the Wii has been realizing that hardcore gamers *don't* need the love - but that casual gamers DO. After all, what's more hardcore as a gamer than to b!tch about the rise of casual gaming? Taken in a certain way, Wii Sports and Wii mini-game compilations IS love for the hardcore gamer. Because to be "hardcore" is to want to feel superior.
(Oh, and I've actually sold three of my friends on XBox because of the boardgamer connection - Carcassonne, Catan, Lost Cities, Ticket to Ride and upcoming hits like Puerto Rico and Power Grid. So there are other communities that can be reached outside hardcore besides the casual.)
Both - I notice that in responding to the comparison to Rebel FM, you didn't *really* respond to the "don't play games" criticism. Given the demands on your time now that you have children, is it too unreasonable to consider changing the site to "cheapassperson.com"? Remember that you took 50 minutes to even get to game shopping news, ya know. Give us an honest estimate of how many hours per week you spend gaming, and whether those numbers give you the credibility to still call yourselves "hardcore".
I *hate* that term, BTW. Hardcore in the gaming community has been generally synonymous with "uselessly narrowminded and self-aggrandizing". I consider myself a SERIOUS gamer, as I probably put around 24 hours a week into gaming (including portable gaming). But I'm generally a bit too open-minded to call myself hardcore.
Wombat - Braid ISN'T worth $10 - go you. (My take - Braid is designed for OCDs who want to play games where the jump has to be within two pixels to land safe, but don't like game load times.)
Both - Can we get a CAGCast Game Night for something OTHER than a 36-player game? How about a tournament organized through an XBox Live party run in brackets?
Both - How would you fix the GTA mission structure system? Maybe a mini-checkpoint or two inside the mission? Curious - let's assume for a second that Rockstar isn't out to just BF their players - what is the design imperative or goal that produces this rather frustrating mechanic? Why do you really think this happened? You're both seasoned game professionals with lots of experience in game design analysis - think on it for a bit.
Cheapy - Regarding RE5:
As to the defense by marketing - yah, that's crap. I think all that happened was that some exec, totally immersed inside the world of business markets and budgets, lost his grip on the reality that budgets are NOT natural law, but set in place by management. To him, the game's budgets ARE physical definitions. I'm not as willing to put it down to cold manipulation - people fool THEMSELVES far more often than they attempt to fool other people.
That being said - if the content wasn't on the disc because it WASN'T READY YET (and indeed, since it isn't out yet, it isn't ready NOW), then extra development time was spent after the game went gold, and that time was not included in the $60 pricetag. Would you rather Capcom charged $65 for the game, and told you that you were paying for content you couldn't get yet?
And lastly - the use of the XBox and PS marketplaces is to SELL YOU THINGS. Don't get confused. If something doesn't sell, that's a message back to MS/Sony. They adjust the price, free markets work, Adam Smith continues to feel you up with his Invisible Hand. But there's nothing noble or egalitarian about the marketplaces. They gives you the stuff *you* want if you pays the money *they* want. There is no set price for games except what they say you have to pay to get it. And the fact that games are selling so well at $60 - that gives publishers credibility to release games at $60 even when they (Legendary) don't deserve it.
I suspect that the multiplayer DLC won't sell well for RE5 for a different reason - most of your RE fans *DON'T* *LIKE* multi. See Wombat's comments about not wanting even an AI player there. And the players who like multi don't like standstill shooting - they want to bounce around the arena like a crackhead. But there is no right or wrong to marketplace prices, there's only buy and don't-buy. And while you certainly can tell us whether you bought, and why we should buy or not buy - all of that is economics, not ethics. Nobody is -wrong- here. It's not "you would *have* to pay $5", it's "if you WANT it enough to pay $5, then you're in luck."
Wombat's responses to these kinds of issues, where he basically outlines a scenario that might have made the publisher more MONEY and made the gaming community happier at the same time - these are much more thought-provoking and deserving of discussion.
Wombat: Regarding Hasbro Game Night (HGN).
A) These are all games that have sold millions of copies over the years. THAT is their credibility for being on a console. EVEN Connect 4.
B) Again - the free market will decide here. Yes, Connect 4 online is lame. We'll tell them that, and they'll answer (probably by some kind of deal or bundle). I suspect the same fate is in store for Sorry Sliders.
C) The other two reasons for people to get these games:
1) Yes, many of these have a visceral feel to them and should be played physically. However, sometimes people are far away from each other. If only they could be played in some ONLINE way...
2) Many of these games capture experiences from our youth (or our gamer youth). But that being said, they don't always demand shelf space. Being able to play it whenever, for ten bucks, and not having to break out tables or what-have-you - this is not a valueless benefit.
Both:
Let's splice together a discussion here: What is the potential for modular game purchasing? Consider this:
RE5 lands on shelves. It's $20. It allows you to play the basic game. It also allows you to download access keys for:
Insane Difficulty Playthrough: $5
Extra Weapons: $5
Online Co-Op: $5
Offline Co-Op: $5
Extra Costumes: $5
Side Missions: $5
Something: $5
Something Else: $5
Multiplayer: $5
This is essentially the same type of approach that HGN has taken to using the Marketplace. You're DAMN right that I don't want to pay for Connect 4 - most adults without children won't. But I have friends with whom Scrabble, Yahtzee and Boggle (which you forgot to mention) will be really cool to play with using these online applications. Can I go to the store, get the Wii version that only has those three games, and pay 60% less? Nope. Can I do this on the 360? Absoooo-lutely.
The HGN/RE5 issues raise an issue similar to the one the PSP-online issue did earlier - what is the place of physical media and inseparable game content in today's game market? If games were totally DLC, and you could download EXACTLY the components you wanted to pay for, then the marketplaces would seem to be at their full utility in passing market information from consumer to publisher. Did the people who played Mirror's Edge like the story more (in which case, some extra story mission would be the hot ticket), or did they like the mechanics more (which was tested when the Time Trial levels went up)?
I think it is appropriate for the sheer power of the marketplace to determine what we gamers (both serious and casual) want out of our games, and for game publishers to offer us new options that we have the ability to accept or decline at our pleasure. I will be picking up just those games for HGN that I like, as a testament of my support for this model of game publication. And I am -excited- that the virtual shelf in the HGN home base appears to have a LOT of empty shelves.
And honestly, I think there is a large UNDERESTIMATION of the people who would want to buy Half-Life 2 and Resistance 2 *WITHOUT* multiplayer, if it would save them $10 or even $5. Not everyone enjoys the sheer volume of prejudice, hate speech and unpleasant in-game behavior that the online community offers. I bought Halo 3, Gears of War 1, Grand Theft Auto 4 and The Orange Box. I've played each online for approximately 20 minutes. I've played each offline for several hours. If I could have saved money by not getting multiplayer, damn straight I would have.
And I am NOT alone, however small a minority I may be included in with this statement. So having the marketplace honor this difference with different pricing is a STRENGTH. If I liked RE5, having the option to pay $65 for multi or $60 for offline would be valuable.
Cheapy: So now that you're playing Peggle, have you changed into a 50-year-old grandmother? Huh?
As someone who has dumped 110+ hours into Fallout 3, finished the storyline of Dead Space once and started again, finished two playthroughs of Mass Effect - and YET has put significant time into Lumines, Peggle, Puzzle Quest (a variant of Bejeweled, yet another 'casual game') and even Pipe Mania, I would humbly request an apology from your pimp-a$$ self to those who enjoy casual gaming for the addictive yet relaxing gameplay they offer. Casual games are as appealing to serious gamers as to casual gamers, and are just as viable a commercial offering on that basis. (Yes, it doesn't tickle hardcore gamers - but they'll go on marching to their own testosterone-drenched beat regardless of what happens.)
Cheapy - Razor blades. While the process of designing a game IS a high-end, high-talent effort of gargantuan proportions - they ARE in fact as a physical product manufactured in a factory. And while razor blades sound simple to design, the research into new technology in even such basic fields as razor blades isn't free nor easy. From metallurgy to laser physics to ergonomics and medicine - the DESIGN of a razor blade is not a given, nor is it free. While it *IS* a bit misleading to compare games to razor blades - it's not as much BS as you would purport it to be.
Both - Yeah, limiting access to demos is stupid. Unless it's a crappy demo, or a good demo of a crappy game. When the publisher HIDES a demo behind a money commitment - it's a bad sign. Marketing at Gamestop is not as cost-effective as launching a universally-available demo.
Both: As far as celebrity lookalikes go, Telly (a young Telly) is in fact best shot for Cheapy. For Wombat, I might go with maybe Philip Seymour Hoffman. Just me.
Both: One thing needs to be changed in 90% of Gamestop retail outlets to make them better. Make them SQUARE. All these stupid rectangles where the counter faces a wall two feet away just screams bottleneck. (Yes, I am a...um..."robust" gamer, much like Wombat. How did you guess? )
Cheapy - It was REALLY weird seeing Ship's white-van-and-candy Twitter *before* hearing the CagCast.
*whew*
Again - great show, followed you for a long time now. Decided this was just the time to start speaking up a bit.
(And yes, A BIT. Go ask Shipwreck - this is *A BIT*.)
Cheapy - Was there video monitoring in the love hotel? Or is it just a REALLY good place to take someone to murder them with no witnesses? (I think of this because I'm in the middle of a mystery book series, NOT because I'm looking for a good location.)
Cheapy - when leaving feedback to your show, if I look and find that there are already 200+ replies to the show post, should there be another way to more effectively communicate that feedback? (Note - feedback is a different concept than post-show conversation with the audience.)
Cheapy - you could get a mixing board to raise the pitch of your voice. Could raise the show up in the eyes of animal activists - "Wombat and Chipmunk, Gamer Mammals".
Cheapy - Indy in the fridge last week turned into coleslaw, and this week into mashed potatoes. A) Why does he never turn into ACTUAL MEAT (like meat loaf), and B) Have you thought about eating larger breakfasts before recording the 'Cast?
Cheapy - With the two guys choosing the money over the porn star on the Stern show (a RADIO show, I remind you), are we sure this is not a situation created by the porn star and not the economy? Not all porn stars look good close up.
Wombat - While Indy and Noah's Ark would have been cool, Indy and EXCALIBUR would have been awesome. Or even Siege Perilous.
Cheapy - "Magical Guy in the Sky" sounds familiar as a reference for Divine-Creator-Force. Are you a George Carlin fan?
Both - If you agree that Sony needs to go DLC-only for the PSP, why is the DSi online capability something you're not interested in (even though the stuff on it is NOW limited, it's a channel that will be used)? And why shouldn't MS, Sony and Nintendo just dump discs altogether? Defend discs in the wake of this statement that the PSP doesn't need them.
Both - Regarding hardcore gamers: hardcore gamers haven't needed love for fifteen years. Hardcore gamers have bought into games WAYYYYY past when they were just crap, and they *knew* they were getting crap. It is NOT just the long-dead memories of Sonic 2 that makes Sega keep pumping out Sonic 3D uselessness - it's that WE BUY THEM. I think the entire success of the Wii has been realizing that hardcore gamers *don't* need the love - but that casual gamers DO. After all, what's more hardcore as a gamer than to b!tch about the rise of casual gaming? Taken in a certain way, Wii Sports and Wii mini-game compilations IS love for the hardcore gamer. Because to be "hardcore" is to want to feel superior.
(Oh, and I've actually sold three of my friends on XBox because of the boardgamer connection - Carcassonne, Catan, Lost Cities, Ticket to Ride and upcoming hits like Puerto Rico and Power Grid. So there are other communities that can be reached outside hardcore besides the casual.)
Both - I notice that in responding to the comparison to Rebel FM, you didn't *really* respond to the "don't play games" criticism. Given the demands on your time now that you have children, is it too unreasonable to consider changing the site to "cheapassperson.com"? Remember that you took 50 minutes to even get to game shopping news, ya know. Give us an honest estimate of how many hours per week you spend gaming, and whether those numbers give you the credibility to still call yourselves "hardcore".
I *hate* that term, BTW. Hardcore in the gaming community has been generally synonymous with "uselessly narrowminded and self-aggrandizing". I consider myself a SERIOUS gamer, as I probably put around 24 hours a week into gaming (including portable gaming). But I'm generally a bit too open-minded to call myself hardcore.
Wombat - Braid ISN'T worth $10 - go you. (My take - Braid is designed for OCDs who want to play games where the jump has to be within two pixels to land safe, but don't like game load times.)
Both - Can we get a CAGCast Game Night for something OTHER than a 36-player game? How about a tournament organized through an XBox Live party run in brackets?
Both - How would you fix the GTA mission structure system? Maybe a mini-checkpoint or two inside the mission? Curious - let's assume for a second that Rockstar isn't out to just BF their players - what is the design imperative or goal that produces this rather frustrating mechanic? Why do you really think this happened? You're both seasoned game professionals with lots of experience in game design analysis - think on it for a bit.
Cheapy - Regarding RE5:
As to the defense by marketing - yah, that's crap. I think all that happened was that some exec, totally immersed inside the world of business markets and budgets, lost his grip on the reality that budgets are NOT natural law, but set in place by management. To him, the game's budgets ARE physical definitions. I'm not as willing to put it down to cold manipulation - people fool THEMSELVES far more often than they attempt to fool other people.
That being said - if the content wasn't on the disc because it WASN'T READY YET (and indeed, since it isn't out yet, it isn't ready NOW), then extra development time was spent after the game went gold, and that time was not included in the $60 pricetag. Would you rather Capcom charged $65 for the game, and told you that you were paying for content you couldn't get yet?
And lastly - the use of the XBox and PS marketplaces is to SELL YOU THINGS. Don't get confused. If something doesn't sell, that's a message back to MS/Sony. They adjust the price, free markets work, Adam Smith continues to feel you up with his Invisible Hand. But there's nothing noble or egalitarian about the marketplaces. They gives you the stuff *you* want if you pays the money *they* want. There is no set price for games except what they say you have to pay to get it. And the fact that games are selling so well at $60 - that gives publishers credibility to release games at $60 even when they (Legendary) don't deserve it.
I suspect that the multiplayer DLC won't sell well for RE5 for a different reason - most of your RE fans *DON'T* *LIKE* multi. See Wombat's comments about not wanting even an AI player there. And the players who like multi don't like standstill shooting - they want to bounce around the arena like a crackhead. But there is no right or wrong to marketplace prices, there's only buy and don't-buy. And while you certainly can tell us whether you bought, and why we should buy or not buy - all of that is economics, not ethics. Nobody is -wrong- here. It's not "you would *have* to pay $5", it's "if you WANT it enough to pay $5, then you're in luck."
Wombat's responses to these kinds of issues, where he basically outlines a scenario that might have made the publisher more MONEY and made the gaming community happier at the same time - these are much more thought-provoking and deserving of discussion.
Wombat: Regarding Hasbro Game Night (HGN).
A) These are all games that have sold millions of copies over the years. THAT is their credibility for being on a console. EVEN Connect 4.
B) Again - the free market will decide here. Yes, Connect 4 online is lame. We'll tell them that, and they'll answer (probably by some kind of deal or bundle). I suspect the same fate is in store for Sorry Sliders.
C) The other two reasons for people to get these games:
1) Yes, many of these have a visceral feel to them and should be played physically. However, sometimes people are far away from each other. If only they could be played in some ONLINE way...
2) Many of these games capture experiences from our youth (or our gamer youth). But that being said, they don't always demand shelf space. Being able to play it whenever, for ten bucks, and not having to break out tables or what-have-you - this is not a valueless benefit.
Both:
Let's splice together a discussion here: What is the potential for modular game purchasing? Consider this:
RE5 lands on shelves. It's $20. It allows you to play the basic game. It also allows you to download access keys for:
Insane Difficulty Playthrough: $5
Extra Weapons: $5
Online Co-Op: $5
Offline Co-Op: $5
Extra Costumes: $5
Side Missions: $5
Something: $5
Something Else: $5
Multiplayer: $5
This is essentially the same type of approach that HGN has taken to using the Marketplace. You're DAMN right that I don't want to pay for Connect 4 - most adults without children won't. But I have friends with whom Scrabble, Yahtzee and Boggle (which you forgot to mention) will be really cool to play with using these online applications. Can I go to the store, get the Wii version that only has those three games, and pay 60% less? Nope. Can I do this on the 360? Absoooo-lutely.
The HGN/RE5 issues raise an issue similar to the one the PSP-online issue did earlier - what is the place of physical media and inseparable game content in today's game market? If games were totally DLC, and you could download EXACTLY the components you wanted to pay for, then the marketplaces would seem to be at their full utility in passing market information from consumer to publisher. Did the people who played Mirror's Edge like the story more (in which case, some extra story mission would be the hot ticket), or did they like the mechanics more (which was tested when the Time Trial levels went up)?
I think it is appropriate for the sheer power of the marketplace to determine what we gamers (both serious and casual) want out of our games, and for game publishers to offer us new options that we have the ability to accept or decline at our pleasure. I will be picking up just those games for HGN that I like, as a testament of my support for this model of game publication. And I am -excited- that the virtual shelf in the HGN home base appears to have a LOT of empty shelves.
And honestly, I think there is a large UNDERESTIMATION of the people who would want to buy Half-Life 2 and Resistance 2 *WITHOUT* multiplayer, if it would save them $10 or even $5. Not everyone enjoys the sheer volume of prejudice, hate speech and unpleasant in-game behavior that the online community offers. I bought Halo 3, Gears of War 1, Grand Theft Auto 4 and The Orange Box. I've played each online for approximately 20 minutes. I've played each offline for several hours. If I could have saved money by not getting multiplayer, damn straight I would have.
And I am NOT alone, however small a minority I may be included in with this statement. So having the marketplace honor this difference with different pricing is a STRENGTH. If I liked RE5, having the option to pay $65 for multi or $60 for offline would be valuable.
Cheapy: So now that you're playing Peggle, have you changed into a 50-year-old grandmother? Huh?
As someone who has dumped 110+ hours into Fallout 3, finished the storyline of Dead Space once and started again, finished two playthroughs of Mass Effect - and YET has put significant time into Lumines, Peggle, Puzzle Quest (a variant of Bejeweled, yet another 'casual game') and even Pipe Mania, I would humbly request an apology from your pimp-a$$ self to those who enjoy casual gaming for the addictive yet relaxing gameplay they offer. Casual games are as appealing to serious gamers as to casual gamers, and are just as viable a commercial offering on that basis. (Yes, it doesn't tickle hardcore gamers - but they'll go on marching to their own testosterone-drenched beat regardless of what happens.)
Cheapy - Razor blades. While the process of designing a game IS a high-end, high-talent effort of gargantuan proportions - they ARE in fact as a physical product manufactured in a factory. And while razor blades sound simple to design, the research into new technology in even such basic fields as razor blades isn't free nor easy. From metallurgy to laser physics to ergonomics and medicine - the DESIGN of a razor blade is not a given, nor is it free. While it *IS* a bit misleading to compare games to razor blades - it's not as much BS as you would purport it to be.
Both - Yeah, limiting access to demos is stupid. Unless it's a crappy demo, or a good demo of a crappy game. When the publisher HIDES a demo behind a money commitment - it's a bad sign. Marketing at Gamestop is not as cost-effective as launching a universally-available demo.
Both: As far as celebrity lookalikes go, Telly (a young Telly) is in fact best shot for Cheapy. For Wombat, I might go with maybe Philip Seymour Hoffman. Just me.
Both: One thing needs to be changed in 90% of Gamestop retail outlets to make them better. Make them SQUARE. All these stupid rectangles where the counter faces a wall two feet away just screams bottleneck. (Yes, I am a...um..."robust" gamer, much like Wombat. How did you guess?
)Cheapy - It was REALLY weird seeing Ship's white-van-and-candy Twitter *before* hearing the CagCast.
*whew*
Again - great show, followed you for a long time now. Decided this was just the time to start speaking up a bit.
(And yes, A BIT. Go ask Shipwreck - this is *A BIT*.)
eJohnny
CAGiversary!
Good show guys, your opinions were really on point.
With regards to Microsoft shooting for casual gamers, you're right, they should forget about them and stick to the traditional gamer. Just because Nintendo is doing well with casual gamers doesn't mean Microsoft is failing (or should copy the strategy), because the casual gamer was not their target to begin with! I'm pretty sure the "X" in Xbox stands for "X-treme" or something similar. The original Xbox was about bringing PC level power to the console while leaving behind the hassles of PC gaming. I think they've lost track of that.
On to RE5 DLC... It wasn't too long ago everyone was outraged when prices went to $60. That increase was supposed to cover increasing development costs. Now, we're being nickel and dimed with shady DLC for what should be standard features. Where does it end? How about we form some sort of club and collectively agree to boycott products like this? It might give us a louder voice in the community, and get more people on board.
Last point... Forget about Joust. I want to know what happened with CheapyD buying that retro game collection and donating it to a museum?? There was a lot of talk about it and then suddenly never mentioned again.
Peace out ya punk bitches.
With regards to Microsoft shooting for casual gamers, you're right, they should forget about them and stick to the traditional gamer. Just because Nintendo is doing well with casual gamers doesn't mean Microsoft is failing (or should copy the strategy), because the casual gamer was not their target to begin with! I'm pretty sure the "X" in Xbox stands for "X-treme" or something similar. The original Xbox was about bringing PC level power to the console while leaving behind the hassles of PC gaming. I think they've lost track of that.
On to RE5 DLC... It wasn't too long ago everyone was outraged when prices went to $60. That increase was supposed to cover increasing development costs. Now, we're being nickel and dimed with shady DLC for what should be standard features. Where does it end? How about we form some sort of club and collectively agree to boycott products like this? It might give us a louder voice in the community, and get more people on board.
Last point... Forget about Joust. I want to know what happened with CheapyD buying that retro game collection and donating it to a museum?? There was a lot of talk about it and then suddenly never mentioned again.
Peace out ya punk bitches.
h3llbring3r
CAGiversary!
- Feedback
- 58 (100%)
[quote name='GamerInterface']Firstl, another excellent and thought-provoking show. Always a pleasure to listen to the exchange of ideas between you two excellent hosts, and to get more perspective on those ideas by the details of your private lives that you share. As you will see below, my thoughts get very provoked by the show - so I'm deciding this time to share. (Yes, this isn't the usual way that someone comments on the show - but I've never been one to follow the crowd.)
Cheapy - Was there video monitoring in the love hotel? Or is it just a REALLY good place to take someone to murder them with no witnesses? (I think of this because I'm in the middle of a mystery book series, NOT because I'm looking for a good location.)
Cheapy - when leaving feedback to your show, if I look and find that there are already 200+ replies to the show post, should there be another way to more effectively communicate that feedback? (Note - feedback is a different concept than post-show conversation with the audience.)
Cheapy - you could get a mixing board to raise the pitch of your voice. Could raise the show up in the eyes of animal activists - "Wombat and Chipmunk, Gamer Mammals".
Cheapy - Indy in the fridge last week turned into coleslaw, and this week into mashed potatoes. A) Why does he never turn into ACTUAL MEAT (like meat loaf), and B) Have you thought about eating larger breakfasts before recording the 'Cast?
Cheapy - With the two guys choosing the money over the porn star on the Stern show (a RADIO show, I remind you), are we sure this is not a situation created by the porn star and not the economy? Not all porn stars look good close up.
Wombat - While Indy and Noah's Ark would have been cool, Indy and EXCALIBUR would have been awesome. Or even Siege Perilous.
Cheapy - "Magical Guy in the Sky" sounds familiar as a reference for Divine-Creator-Force. Are you a George Carlin fan?
Both - If you agree that Sony needs to go DLC-only for the PSP, why is the DSi online capability something you're not interested in (even though the stuff on it is NOW limited, it's a channel that will be used)? And why shouldn't MS, Sony and Nintendo just dump discs altogether? Defend discs in the wake of this statement that the PSP doesn't need them.
Both - Regarding hardcore gamers: hardcore gamers haven't needed love for fifteen years. Hardcore gamers have bought into games WAYYYYY past when they were just crap, and they *knew* they were getting crap. It is NOT just the long-dead memories of Sonic 2 that makes Sega keep pumping out Sonic 3D uselessness - it's that WE BUY THEM. I think the entire success of the Wii has been realizing that hardcore gamers *don't* need the love - but that casual gamers DO. After all, what's more hardcore as a gamer than to b!tch about the rise of casual gaming? Taken in a certain way, Wii Sports and Wii mini-game compilations IS love for the hardcore gamer. Because to be "hardcore" is to want to feel superior.
(Oh, and I've actually sold three of my friends on XBox because of the boardgamer connection - Carcassonne, Catan, Lost Cities, Ticket to Ride and upcoming hits like Puerto Rico and Power Grid. So there are other communities that can be reached outside hardcore besides the casual.)
Both - I notice that in responding to the comparison to Rebel FM, you didn't *really* respond to the "don't play games" criticism. Given the demands on your time now that you have children, is it too unreasonable to consider changing the site to "cheapassperson.com"? Remember that you took 50 minutes to even get to game shopping news, ya know. Give us an honest estimate of how many hours per week you spend gaming, and whether those numbers give you the credibility to still call yourselves "hardcore".
I *hate* that term, BTW. Hardcore in the gaming community has been generally synonymous with "uselessly narrowminded and self-aggrandizing". I consider myself a SERIOUS gamer, as I probably put around 24 hours a week into gaming (including portable gaming). But I'm generally a bit too open-minded to call myself hardcore.
Wombat - Braid ISN'T worth $10 - go you. (My take - Braid is designed for OCDs who want to play games where the jump has to be within two pixels to land safe, but don't like game load times.)
Both - Can we get a CAGCast Game Night for something OTHER than a 36-player game? How about a tournament organized through an XBox Live party run in brackets?
Both - How would you fix the GTA mission structure system? Maybe a mini-checkpoint or two inside the mission? Curious - let's assume for a second that Rockstar isn't out to just BF their players - what is the design imperative or goal that produces this rather frustrating mechanic? Why do you really think this happened? You're both seasoned game professionals with lots of experience in game design analysis - think on it for a bit.
Cheapy - Regarding RE5:
As to the defense by marketing - yah, that's crap. I think all that happened was that some exec, totally immersed inside the world of business markets and budgets, lost his grip on the reality that budgets are NOT natural law, but set in place by management. To him, the game's budgets ARE physical definitions. I'm not as willing to put it down to cold manipulation - people fool THEMSELVES far more often than they attempt to fool other people.
That being said - if the content wasn't on the disc because it WASN'T READY YET (and indeed, since it isn't out yet, it isn't ready NOW), then extra development time was spent after the game went gold, and that time was not included in the $60 pricetag. Would you rather Capcom charged $65 for the game, and told you that you were paying for content you couldn't get yet?
And lastly - the use of the XBox and PS marketplaces is to SELL YOU THINGS. Don't get confused. If something doesn't sell, that's a message back to MS/Sony. They adjust the price, free markets work, Adam Smith continues to feel you up with his Invisible Hand. But there's nothing noble or egalitarian about the marketplaces. They gives you the stuff *you* want if you pays the money *they* want. There is no set price for games except what they say you have to pay to get it. And the fact that games are selling so well at $60 - that gives publishers credibility to release games at $60 even when they (Legendary) don't deserve it.
I suspect that the multiplayer DLC won't sell well for RE5 for a different reason - most of your RE fans *DON'T* *LIKE* multi. See Wombat's comments about not wanting even an AI player there. And the players who like multi don't like standstill shooting - they want to bounce around the arena like a crackhead. But there is no right or wrong to marketplace prices, there's only buy and don't-buy. And while you certainly can tell us whether you bought, and why we should buy or not buy - all of that is economics, not ethics. Nobody is -wrong- here. It's not "you would *have* to pay $5", it's "if you WANT it enough to pay $5, then you're in luck."
Wombat's responses to these kinds of issues, where he basically outlines a scenario that might have made the publisher more MONEY and made the gaming community happier at the same time - these are much more thought-provoking and deserving of discussion.
Wombat: Regarding Hasbro Game Night (HGN).
A) These are all games that have sold millions of copies over the years. THAT is their credibility for being on a console. EVEN Connect 4.
B) Again - the free market will decide here. Yes, Connect 4 online is lame. We'll tell them that, and they'll answer (probably by some kind of deal or bundle). I suspect the same fate is in store for Sorry Sliders.
C) The other two reasons for people to get these games:
1) Yes, many of these have a visceral feel to them and should be played physically. However, sometimes people are far away from each other. If only they could be played in some ONLINE way...
2) Many of these games capture experiences from our youth (or our gamer youth). But that being said, they don't always demand shelf space. Being able to play it whenever, for ten bucks, and not having to break out tables or what-have-you - this is not a valueless benefit.
Both:
Let's splice together a discussion here: What is the potential for modular game purchasing? Consider this:
RE5 lands on shelves. It's $20. It allows you to play the basic game. It also allows you to download access keys for:
Insane Difficulty Playthrough: $5
Extra Weapons: $5
Online Co-Op: $5
Offline Co-Op: $5
Extra Costumes: $5
Side Missions: $5
Something: $5
Something Else: $5
Multiplayer: $5
This is essentially the same type of approach that HGN has taken to using the Marketplace. You're DAMN right that I don't want to pay for Connect 4 - most adults without children won't. But I have friends with whom Scrabble, Yahtzee and Boggle (which you forgot to mention) will be really cool to play with using these online applications. Can I go to the store, get the Wii version that only has those three games, and pay 60% less? Nope. Can I do this on the 360? Absoooo-lutely.
The HGN/RE5 issues raise an issue similar to the one the PSP-online issue did earlier - what is the place of physical media and inseparable game content in today's game market? If games were totally DLC, and you could download EXACTLY the components you wanted to pay for, then the marketplaces would seem to be at their full utility in passing market information from consumer to publisher. Did the people who played Mirror's Edge like the story more (in which case, some extra story mission would be the hot ticket), or did they like the mechanics more (which was tested when the Time Trial levels went up)?
I think it is appropriate for the sheer power of the marketplace to determine what we gamers (both serious and casual) want out of our games, and for game publishers to offer us new options that we have the ability to accept or decline at our pleasure. I will be picking up just those games for HGN that I like, as a testament of my support for this model of game publication. And I am -excited- that the virtual shelf in the HGN home base appears to have a LOT of empty shelves.
And honestly, I think there is a large UNDERESTIMATION of the people who would want to buy Half-Life 2 and Resistance 2 *WITHOUT* multiplayer, if it would save them $10 or even $5. Not everyone enjoys the sheer volume of prejudice, hate speech and unpleasant in-game behavior that the online community offers. I bought Halo 3, Gears of War 1, Grand Theft Auto 4 and The Orange Box. I've played each online for approximately 20 minutes. I've played each offline for several hours. If I could have saved money by not getting multiplayer, damn straight I would have.
And I am NOT alone, however small a minority I may be included in with this statement. So having the marketplace honor this difference with different pricing is a STRENGTH. If I liked RE5, having the option to pay $65 for multi or $60 for offline would be valuable.
Cheapy: So now that you're playing Peggle, have you changed into a 50-year-old grandmother? Huh?
As someone who has dumped 110+ hours into Fallout 3, finished the storyline of Dead Space once and started again, finished two playthroughs of Mass Effect - and YET has put significant time into Lumines, Peggle, Puzzle Quest (a variant of Bejeweled, yet another 'casual game') and even Pipe Mania, I would humbly request an apology from your pimp-a$$ self to those who enjoy casual gaming for the addictive yet relaxing gameplay they offer. Casual games are as appealing to serious gamers as to casual gamers, and are just as viable a commercial offering on that basis. (Yes, it doesn't tickle hardcore gamers - but they'll go on marching to their own testosterone-drenched beat regardless of what happens.)
Cheapy - Razor blades. While the process of designing a game IS a high-end, high-talent effort of gargantuan proportions - they ARE in fact as a physical product manufactured in a factory. And while razor blades sound simple to design, the research into new technology in even such basic fields as razor blades isn't free nor easy. From metallurgy to laser physics to ergonomics and medicine - the DESIGN of a razor blade is not a given, nor is it free. While it *IS* a bit misleading to compare games to razor blades - it's not as much BS as you would purport it to be.
Both - Yeah, limiting access to demos is stupid. Unless it's a crappy demo, or a good demo of a crappy game. When the publisher HIDES a demo behind a money commitment - it's a bad sign. Marketing at Gamestop is not as cost-effective as launching a universally-available demo.
Both: As far as celebrity lookalikes go, Telly (a young Telly) is in fact best shot for Cheapy. For Wombat, I might go with maybe Philip Seymour Hoffman. Just me.
Both: One thing needs to be changed in 90% of Gamestop retail outlets to make them better. Make them SQUARE. All these stupid rectangles where the counter faces a wall two feet away just screams bottleneck. (Yes, I am a...um..."robust" gamer, much like Wombat. How did you guess? )
Cheapy - It was REALLY weird seeing Ship's white-van-and-candy Twitter *before* hearing the CagCast.
*whew*
Again - great show, followed you for a long time now. Decided this was just the time to start speaking up a bit.
(And yes, A BIT. Go ask Shipwreck - this is *A BIT*.)[/quote]
Cheapy - Was there video monitoring in the love hotel? Or is it just a REALLY good place to take someone to murder them with no witnesses? (I think of this because I'm in the middle of a mystery book series, NOT because I'm looking for a good location.)
Cheapy - when leaving feedback to your show, if I look and find that there are already 200+ replies to the show post, should there be another way to more effectively communicate that feedback? (Note - feedback is a different concept than post-show conversation with the audience.)
Cheapy - you could get a mixing board to raise the pitch of your voice. Could raise the show up in the eyes of animal activists - "Wombat and Chipmunk, Gamer Mammals".
Cheapy - Indy in the fridge last week turned into coleslaw, and this week into mashed potatoes. A) Why does he never turn into ACTUAL MEAT (like meat loaf), and B) Have you thought about eating larger breakfasts before recording the 'Cast?
Cheapy - With the two guys choosing the money over the porn star on the Stern show (a RADIO show, I remind you), are we sure this is not a situation created by the porn star and not the economy? Not all porn stars look good close up.
Wombat - While Indy and Noah's Ark would have been cool, Indy and EXCALIBUR would have been awesome. Or even Siege Perilous.
Cheapy - "Magical Guy in the Sky" sounds familiar as a reference for Divine-Creator-Force. Are you a George Carlin fan?
Both - If you agree that Sony needs to go DLC-only for the PSP, why is the DSi online capability something you're not interested in (even though the stuff on it is NOW limited, it's a channel that will be used)? And why shouldn't MS, Sony and Nintendo just dump discs altogether? Defend discs in the wake of this statement that the PSP doesn't need them.
Both - Regarding hardcore gamers: hardcore gamers haven't needed love for fifteen years. Hardcore gamers have bought into games WAYYYYY past when they were just crap, and they *knew* they were getting crap. It is NOT just the long-dead memories of Sonic 2 that makes Sega keep pumping out Sonic 3D uselessness - it's that WE BUY THEM. I think the entire success of the Wii has been realizing that hardcore gamers *don't* need the love - but that casual gamers DO. After all, what's more hardcore as a gamer than to b!tch about the rise of casual gaming? Taken in a certain way, Wii Sports and Wii mini-game compilations IS love for the hardcore gamer. Because to be "hardcore" is to want to feel superior.
(Oh, and I've actually sold three of my friends on XBox because of the boardgamer connection - Carcassonne, Catan, Lost Cities, Ticket to Ride and upcoming hits like Puerto Rico and Power Grid. So there are other communities that can be reached outside hardcore besides the casual.)
Both - I notice that in responding to the comparison to Rebel FM, you didn't *really* respond to the "don't play games" criticism. Given the demands on your time now that you have children, is it too unreasonable to consider changing the site to "cheapassperson.com"? Remember that you took 50 minutes to even get to game shopping news, ya know. Give us an honest estimate of how many hours per week you spend gaming, and whether those numbers give you the credibility to still call yourselves "hardcore".
I *hate* that term, BTW. Hardcore in the gaming community has been generally synonymous with "uselessly narrowminded and self-aggrandizing". I consider myself a SERIOUS gamer, as I probably put around 24 hours a week into gaming (including portable gaming). But I'm generally a bit too open-minded to call myself hardcore.
Wombat - Braid ISN'T worth $10 - go you. (My take - Braid is designed for OCDs who want to play games where the jump has to be within two pixels to land safe, but don't like game load times.)
Both - Can we get a CAGCast Game Night for something OTHER than a 36-player game? How about a tournament organized through an XBox Live party run in brackets?
Both - How would you fix the GTA mission structure system? Maybe a mini-checkpoint or two inside the mission? Curious - let's assume for a second that Rockstar isn't out to just BF their players - what is the design imperative or goal that produces this rather frustrating mechanic? Why do you really think this happened? You're both seasoned game professionals with lots of experience in game design analysis - think on it for a bit.
Cheapy - Regarding RE5:
As to the defense by marketing - yah, that's crap. I think all that happened was that some exec, totally immersed inside the world of business markets and budgets, lost his grip on the reality that budgets are NOT natural law, but set in place by management. To him, the game's budgets ARE physical definitions. I'm not as willing to put it down to cold manipulation - people fool THEMSELVES far more often than they attempt to fool other people.
That being said - if the content wasn't on the disc because it WASN'T READY YET (and indeed, since it isn't out yet, it isn't ready NOW), then extra development time was spent after the game went gold, and that time was not included in the $60 pricetag. Would you rather Capcom charged $65 for the game, and told you that you were paying for content you couldn't get yet?
And lastly - the use of the XBox and PS marketplaces is to SELL YOU THINGS. Don't get confused. If something doesn't sell, that's a message back to MS/Sony. They adjust the price, free markets work, Adam Smith continues to feel you up with his Invisible Hand. But there's nothing noble or egalitarian about the marketplaces. They gives you the stuff *you* want if you pays the money *they* want. There is no set price for games except what they say you have to pay to get it. And the fact that games are selling so well at $60 - that gives publishers credibility to release games at $60 even when they (Legendary) don't deserve it.
I suspect that the multiplayer DLC won't sell well for RE5 for a different reason - most of your RE fans *DON'T* *LIKE* multi. See Wombat's comments about not wanting even an AI player there. And the players who like multi don't like standstill shooting - they want to bounce around the arena like a crackhead. But there is no right or wrong to marketplace prices, there's only buy and don't-buy. And while you certainly can tell us whether you bought, and why we should buy or not buy - all of that is economics, not ethics. Nobody is -wrong- here. It's not "you would *have* to pay $5", it's "if you WANT it enough to pay $5, then you're in luck."
Wombat's responses to these kinds of issues, where he basically outlines a scenario that might have made the publisher more MONEY and made the gaming community happier at the same time - these are much more thought-provoking and deserving of discussion.
Wombat: Regarding Hasbro Game Night (HGN).
A) These are all games that have sold millions of copies over the years. THAT is their credibility for being on a console. EVEN Connect 4.
B) Again - the free market will decide here. Yes, Connect 4 online is lame. We'll tell them that, and they'll answer (probably by some kind of deal or bundle). I suspect the same fate is in store for Sorry Sliders.
C) The other two reasons for people to get these games:
1) Yes, many of these have a visceral feel to them and should be played physically. However, sometimes people are far away from each other. If only they could be played in some ONLINE way...
2) Many of these games capture experiences from our youth (or our gamer youth). But that being said, they don't always demand shelf space. Being able to play it whenever, for ten bucks, and not having to break out tables or what-have-you - this is not a valueless benefit.
Both:
Let's splice together a discussion here: What is the potential for modular game purchasing? Consider this:
RE5 lands on shelves. It's $20. It allows you to play the basic game. It also allows you to download access keys for:
Insane Difficulty Playthrough: $5
Extra Weapons: $5
Online Co-Op: $5
Offline Co-Op: $5
Extra Costumes: $5
Side Missions: $5
Something: $5
Something Else: $5
Multiplayer: $5
This is essentially the same type of approach that HGN has taken to using the Marketplace. You're DAMN right that I don't want to pay for Connect 4 - most adults without children won't. But I have friends with whom Scrabble, Yahtzee and Boggle (which you forgot to mention) will be really cool to play with using these online applications. Can I go to the store, get the Wii version that only has those three games, and pay 60% less? Nope. Can I do this on the 360? Absoooo-lutely.
The HGN/RE5 issues raise an issue similar to the one the PSP-online issue did earlier - what is the place of physical media and inseparable game content in today's game market? If games were totally DLC, and you could download EXACTLY the components you wanted to pay for, then the marketplaces would seem to be at their full utility in passing market information from consumer to publisher. Did the people who played Mirror's Edge like the story more (in which case, some extra story mission would be the hot ticket), or did they like the mechanics more (which was tested when the Time Trial levels went up)?
I think it is appropriate for the sheer power of the marketplace to determine what we gamers (both serious and casual) want out of our games, and for game publishers to offer us new options that we have the ability to accept or decline at our pleasure. I will be picking up just those games for HGN that I like, as a testament of my support for this model of game publication. And I am -excited- that the virtual shelf in the HGN home base appears to have a LOT of empty shelves.
And honestly, I think there is a large UNDERESTIMATION of the people who would want to buy Half-Life 2 and Resistance 2 *WITHOUT* multiplayer, if it would save them $10 or even $5. Not everyone enjoys the sheer volume of prejudice, hate speech and unpleasant in-game behavior that the online community offers. I bought Halo 3, Gears of War 1, Grand Theft Auto 4 and The Orange Box. I've played each online for approximately 20 minutes. I've played each offline for several hours. If I could have saved money by not getting multiplayer, damn straight I would have.
And I am NOT alone, however small a minority I may be included in with this statement. So having the marketplace honor this difference with different pricing is a STRENGTH. If I liked RE5, having the option to pay $65 for multi or $60 for offline would be valuable.
Cheapy: So now that you're playing Peggle, have you changed into a 50-year-old grandmother? Huh?
As someone who has dumped 110+ hours into Fallout 3, finished the storyline of Dead Space once and started again, finished two playthroughs of Mass Effect - and YET has put significant time into Lumines, Peggle, Puzzle Quest (a variant of Bejeweled, yet another 'casual game') and even Pipe Mania, I would humbly request an apology from your pimp-a$$ self to those who enjoy casual gaming for the addictive yet relaxing gameplay they offer. Casual games are as appealing to serious gamers as to casual gamers, and are just as viable a commercial offering on that basis. (Yes, it doesn't tickle hardcore gamers - but they'll go on marching to their own testosterone-drenched beat regardless of what happens.)
Cheapy - Razor blades. While the process of designing a game IS a high-end, high-talent effort of gargantuan proportions - they ARE in fact as a physical product manufactured in a factory. And while razor blades sound simple to design, the research into new technology in even such basic fields as razor blades isn't free nor easy. From metallurgy to laser physics to ergonomics and medicine - the DESIGN of a razor blade is not a given, nor is it free. While it *IS* a bit misleading to compare games to razor blades - it's not as much BS as you would purport it to be.
Both - Yeah, limiting access to demos is stupid. Unless it's a crappy demo, or a good demo of a crappy game. When the publisher HIDES a demo behind a money commitment - it's a bad sign. Marketing at Gamestop is not as cost-effective as launching a universally-available demo.
Both: As far as celebrity lookalikes go, Telly (a young Telly) is in fact best shot for Cheapy. For Wombat, I might go with maybe Philip Seymour Hoffman. Just me.
Both: One thing needs to be changed in 90% of Gamestop retail outlets to make them better. Make them SQUARE. All these stupid rectangles where the counter faces a wall two feet away just screams bottleneck. (Yes, I am a...um..."robust" gamer, much like Wombat. How did you guess?
)Cheapy - It was REALLY weird seeing Ship's white-van-and-candy Twitter *before* hearing the CagCast.
*whew*
Again - great show, followed you for a long time now. Decided this was just the time to start speaking up a bit.
(And yes, A BIT. Go ask Shipwreck - this is *A BIT*.)[/quote]
[quote name='eJohnny']On to RE5 DLC... It wasn't too long ago everyone was outraged when prices went to $60. That increase was supposed to cover increasing development costs. Now, we're being nickel and dimed with shady DLC for what should be standard features. Where does it end? How about we form some sort of club and collectively agree to boycott products like this? It might give us a louder voice in the community, and get more people on board.[/quote]
Due to PS3 console sales being MUCH lower than expected (roughly half of initial projections) and development costs being higher than expected the $60 price isn't even covering the increased costs. Consumers aren't getting screwed right now (at least not next gen consumers).
It's not like the publishers are making a ton of money. The big 3 US 3rd party publishers all lost money last year.
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=THQI&annual
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=ATVI&annual
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=ERTS&annual
If you want to see the impact of lower prices all you have to do is look at the quality of games on the Wii. N'Gai Croal was correct when he suggested that gaming companies would be better off financially developing for the Wii and then porting to next gen consoles. Boycotting creative attempts of publishers to generate alternative revenue will only expedite that path.
Due to PS3 console sales being MUCH lower than expected (roughly half of initial projections) and development costs being higher than expected the $60 price isn't even covering the increased costs. Consumers aren't getting screwed right now (at least not next gen consumers).
It's not like the publishers are making a ton of money. The big 3 US 3rd party publishers all lost money last year.
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=THQI&annual
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=ATVI&annual
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=ERTS&annual
If you want to see the impact of lower prices all you have to do is look at the quality of games on the Wii. N'Gai Croal was correct when he suggested that gaming companies would be better off financially developing for the Wii and then porting to next gen consoles. Boycotting creative attempts of publishers to generate alternative revenue will only expedite that path.
serenitygod
CAGiversary!
- Feedback
- 2 (100%)
Yeah, Cheapy upset in this cast! Interesting I think the love hotel voice-over is hilarious!
I don't trust the cleanliness of those places though how do you know the beds aren't sesspools?
I don't trust the cleanliness of those places though how do you know the beds aren't sesspools?
FriskyTanuki
CAGiversary!
- Feedback
- 36 (100%)
The whole RE5 DLC thing is BS when the multiplayer modes are detailed in the strategy guide as being a part of the game with no mention that they would be DLC.
:lol: @ Cheapy not having a clue if Resistance even had an online mode.
[quote name='Wombat']for the record, that's Cheapy who complained about the controls, I have always said that I kinda like 'em. My complaints were that the demo seemed too actiony when compared with RE4. That I was happily wrong about. So maybe a half foot in mouth[/quote]
You also couldn't defend your stance on why the controls are the best ones for the RE5.
There are a lot of succesful MMO's out there, but whether you define beating WoW as being successfu or notl is probably going to widen or shrink your view on the subject.
Wombat looks nothing like Kevin Smith from the pics he's posted.
Good show.
:lol: @ Cheapy not having a clue if Resistance even had an online mode.
[quote name='Wombat']for the record, that's Cheapy who complained about the controls, I have always said that I kinda like 'em. My complaints were that the demo seemed too actiony when compared with RE4. That I was happily wrong about. So maybe a half foot in mouth[/quote]
You also couldn't defend your stance on why the controls are the best ones for the RE5.
There are a lot of succesful MMO's out there, but whether you define beating WoW as being successfu or notl is probably going to widen or shrink your view on the subject.
Wombat looks nothing like Kevin Smith from the pics he's posted.
Good show.
GamerInterface
CAGiversary!
Hey, what am I supposed to do? I think a lot.
I am a CAG Newbie and this is my first post.
My 2 cents on Capcom’s DLC strategy and what I would do as a CAG. I am involve in managing software projects, development budget is planned ahead and readjusted during the project cycle if needed. If development cost becomes an issue,, implementation of some function will be put on hold, and address in the next update, where development budget needs to be estimated again.
What if these DLCs are planned new features but completed ahead of schedule? Do you withhold them for an extended period of time and then release it as DLC? Or do you put them all on the disc and raise the MSRP for the original game, with features that might only interest an isolated community?
I am with you guys on how Capcom handled their DLCs and I am not buying any of it. Although not 100% sure, but it's pretty obvious that these DLCs are planned to be part of the original game.
As a gamer, I just want to play games, so boycott is not going to do me any good. As a consumer though, we need to think if the game + DLC is worth it. Do you think RE5 with the new mode is worth $65? If not, wait for the game to become cheap, then buy the DLC. With 4 million copies in circulation worldwide, I am sure there will be some deals on CAG soon.
My 2 cents on Capcom’s DLC strategy and what I would do as a CAG. I am involve in managing software projects, development budget is planned ahead and readjusted during the project cycle if needed. If development cost becomes an issue,, implementation of some function will be put on hold, and address in the next update, where development budget needs to be estimated again.
What if these DLCs are planned new features but completed ahead of schedule? Do you withhold them for an extended period of time and then release it as DLC? Or do you put them all on the disc and raise the MSRP for the original game, with features that might only interest an isolated community?
I am with you guys on how Capcom handled their DLCs and I am not buying any of it. Although not 100% sure, but it's pretty obvious that these DLCs are planned to be part of the original game.
As a gamer, I just want to play games, so boycott is not going to do me any good. As a consumer though, we need to think if the game + DLC is worth it. Do you think RE5 with the new mode is worth $65? If not, wait for the game to become cheap, then buy the DLC. With 4 million copies in circulation worldwide, I am sure there will be some deals on CAG soon.
bread's done