CAGcast #267: We Hope They Serve Pancakes In Hell

I forgot to bring that up. These are my beliefs on gays/lesbians. For starters I am not a homophobe of any kind. my closest cousin is gay and we are still very close.

I firmly believe that marriage is an institution that is for a man and a woman together. That being said, I also believe that all gays and lesbians deserve the same legal rights that married couples have in this country. They should be allowed to adopt children. They should be allowed to put each other in their wills. They should be allowed to be given hospital visiting rights that couple's spouses recieve. As human beings we are given unalienable rights including pursuit of happiness. Gays and lesbians should be allowed to live happily together.

I actually didn't become a catholic until I was 17, and that was by choice. Please don't judge me without asking me first. Cool?
 
[quote name='mik']It's not hard to hide a PC tower, Cheapy. I did it:
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fGFxd.jpg
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I love the set-up. Alot cleaner than my room!
 
[quote name='mik']It's not hard to hide a PC tower, Cheapy. I did it:

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fGFxd.jpg
[/QUOTE]

Any reason you didn't do a custom build? It wouldn't make it any smaller, probably would be bigger but custom builds are always better.

And Josh, how are gays supposed to have the rights married people do when they can't get married? Magic?
 
Right on about the CBS ad, Wombat. It pissed me off too.

In the U.S. there's often a close connection between religious views and political views. In the past NBC and FOX have both decided not to sell political ads during NFL playoff games so as to not alienate certain viewers or promote a particular agenda. By airing a Focus on the Family ad AGAIN (they had a pro-life Tebow ad during the Superbowl last year - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/02/07/tim-tebow-super-bowl-ad-v_n_436383.html), CBS is the exception. In the past, they've also refused to air ads by MoveOn and PETA during the Super Bowl (http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0116-01.htm). So CBS is either more interested in money than fairness OR they side with FotF and their politics. Or both. Neither is a good thing.

So I absolutely think your boycott is well grounded, and I applaud you for making this an issue that people are talking about.
 
I bought Saints Row in the Steam Sale (£20 UK) and because of my 120 hr + playtime of Skyrim I only got around to starting it the other day, which it turns out was perfect timing for the Cheapy D DLC.

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So load my most recent save, see that Cheapy is available as a homie and call him up. He arrives and I notice that we are only a hundred or so yards from an enemy gang hideout. As you can see in the screenshot I have the the Predator Missile equipped. Long story short, the Predator slams into the middle of the enemy hideout killing 10 people instantly and destroying the hideout. Cheapy yells:

"That's going in the podcast!"


Nailed it sir. Nailed it. :applause:
 
Wombat, I totally agree on the CBS ad. Shit's annoying. It's a problem when you consider the bias towards Christianity our society has - if basically any other religion made a commercial like that saying that if you aren't a Muslim or a Jew that you'd be going to Hell, people would be upset. Same with an atheist ad.

On to the real reason I came in to post...

I was kind of disturbed by a joke made near the beginning of the episode. After discussing the SR3 DLC (which looks awesome, by the way, as a longtime listener of the CAGCast I think it's really cool) you all talked about whether or not it would get you laid.

Cheapy then essentially made a rape joke concerning drugging his wife, saying he only got laid because he drugged her. Wombat followed it by saying, "Yeah, a little ether goes a long way."

I don't care what the context of a relationship is, rape is rape and rape is not funny. I appreciate the toilet humor, the poop stories, the dick jokes, all of it. But this kind of stuff is never funny. I realize the joke was kind of made in passing, but that's part of the problem. I've had a number of friends who have been sexually assaulted, raped, or victims of other non-consentual sex acts and there's nothing humorous about it.

I usually love the show, but I had trouble enjoying the remaining hour or so because I was so disappointed and annoyed to hear this shit.
 
[quote name='Microshock'][/spoiler]

Any reason you didn't do a custom build? It wouldn't make it any smaller, probably would be bigger but custom builds are always better.

And Josh, how are gays supposed to have the rights married people do when they can't get married? Magic?[/QUOTE]

We can agree there. Custom builds give you alot more bang for your buck.

Ever heard of the word civil unions?
 
Cheapy: Is the Netflix movie you're talking about Man, Woman, & the Wall?

Cause if you haven't seen that it's hot! Starring Sora Aoi.
 
[quote name='Josh5890']We can agree there. Custom builds give you alot more bang for your buck.

Ever heard of the word civil unions?[/QUOTE]


Ever heard the term Separate but Equal?

That one man one women thing how's that play with a 60%+ devoirce rate, or all the infidelity that goes on? Civil unions for the most part arent a protected status and there for rights can still be denied as in "our insurance company/ hospital/ or group doesn't recognize your union" and no other state has to recognize a civil union if it so chooses.
 
[quote name='sandmanzero']We also can't eat bottom feeding type fish and swine since they're unclean as well but most Christians don't know that...BUT HEY EVERYABODIES DOING IT! [/QUOTE]

[quote name='davidb69']My opinions on Science? I call most of it guess work with a paycheck. I'd say they are more like weathermen, sometimes right often wrong. But who's to argue with them, they are the "Experts"[/QUOTE]

I can't decide which statement is more insane. Not believing in science is kind of nuts but lobster, crab, flounder, cod, catfish and pigs are so delicious :drool::drool::drool::drool: it seems equally crazy to just blindly accept that you "can't" eat them... unless maybe you had a feeding tube or maybe like part of your jaw was missing from some horrible accident.... oh yeah, or maybe if you were really really really old - you know, with the dentures and all making it tough to chew.
 
Wombat: 'I have no problems with Christians as long as they stay in the closet about their beliefs.'

You boycott CBS over that ad? I'm boycotting CAGcast.

*Unsubscribed*
 
A marriage certificate is a government document, just like any other. And getting that document affords you certain protective rights. For our government to limit those who can get those rights is WRONG.

Now if certain churches want to limit who can have the religious ceremony and who cannot - fine, that is their right. But the government shouldn't be setup to limit rights because of what it says in some book written across the globe thousands of years ago.
 
I just had to point out - how can you say "I have no problems with Christians" then proceed to criticize the main object of their beliefs (faith in Christ is the only way to heaven)?
 
[quote name='Gentlegamer']Wombat: 'I have no problems with Christians as long as they stay in the closet about their beliefs.'

You boycott CBS over that ad? I'm boycotting CAGcast.

*Unsubscribed*[/QUOTE]

I am trying to avoid commenting in the thread and save my thoughts for the show, but that is completely twisting my words and not at all what I was saying. I know nothing I say will convince you otherwise, but you are wrong, please don't put words in my mouth.
 
I dunno why you're attacking Wombat. He's Wombat. He says things and they're typically not as well thought out as he'd like them to be. That's just part of his charm.

I'm a Christian (though not a very good one), and Wombat's thoughts didn't really bother me at all. He meant that no religion has any business trying to alter your views or opinions during something that religion has nothing to do with; in this case Football. The NFL wouldn't bring in the 700 Club during halftime shows, so why would they let another group with an agenda advertise during the game? I can almost guarantee you wouldn't have a problem with Wombat being upset with CBS if they were airing something blatantly Anti-Semite, because it doesn't reflect on what you believe, so would you kindly shut the fuck up?

Also, I was sad to hear how genuinely bummed you guys sounded about Josh killing off Kmart Gamer for the time being. The Kmart Gamer project meant a lot to me, as I met Josh via CAG and became a member of the KmartGamer blogging crew called the League of One to provide content for KmartGamer.com. Sadly, that's on hiatus for the time being too. :/
 
[quote name='Wombat']I am trying to avoid commenting in the thread and save my thoughts for the show, but that is completely twisting my words and not at all what I was saying. I know nothing I say will convince you otherwise, but you are wrong, please don't put words in my mouth.[/QUOTE]

Wombat, I love what you bring to the CAGcast and I litterally laugh at 75%-80% of your witty remarks (Your greatest moment was the Bill Cosby impression about Pokeman....HILARIOUS!!!).

However, please do NOT save your thoughts for the show. Instead, write a blog or start a completely seperate thread. I (along with several other CAG members) really do not want to read another 100+ thread about people being offended over religious beliefs. Ever notice how there has yet to be a good religious video game??? Well, until one is made, please keep religion out of the CAGcast.

We all know that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I'm sure its safe to say that the majority of the CAG members find ZERO enjoyment in reading about religious beliefs in what used to be a very enjoyable and funny gaming thread.
 
[quote name='Josh5890']I forgot to bring that up. These are my beliefs on gays/lesbians. For starters I am not a homophobe of any kind. my closest cousin is gay and we are still very close.

I firmly believe that marriage is an institution that is for a man and a woman together. That being said, I also believe that all gays and lesbians deserve the same legal rights that married couples have in this country. They should be allowed to adopt children. They should be allowed to put each other in their wills. They should be allowed to be given hospital visiting rights that couple's spouses recieve. As human beings we are given unalienable rights including pursuit of happiness. Gays and lesbians should be allowed to live happily together.

I actually didn't become a catholic until I was 17, and that was by choice. Please don't judge me without asking me first. Cool?[/QUOTE]

Dude, of course you're a homophobe. Here, let's apply a little thing I like to call the common-sense test, in which we replace gay with any other previously marginalized social group. Ready?

"I firmly believe that marriage is an institution that is for a man and a woman [of the same race]. That being said, I also believe that all [mixed race couples] deserve the same legal rights that [same race] couples have in this country. They should be allowed to adopt children. They should be allowed to put each other in their wills. They should be allowed to be given hospital visiting rights that couple's spouses recieve. As human beings we are given unalienable rights including pursuit of happiness. [Mixed race couples] should be allowed to live happily together. [They just shouldn't be allowed to marry]."

Now, is anyone in their right mind not going to call me a racist? You claim to be close to your cousin, yet you'd deny them what may be in their and their partner's eyes the most important aspect of marriage, the ability to sanctify it before their deity of choice? If you want to claim that your bigotry is justified because God/Jesus/the Pope/Batman told you it was, that's your right, but you don't get to deny people access to your private club and then claim you aren't prejudiced. There's a difference between tolerating and accepting, just as there's a difference between accepting and embracing. No one's asking you to go bump uglies with your buddy Steve, but you're deluding yourself if you think what you're doing is any better than separate water fountains.
 
[quote name='Splatoon']Dude, of course you're a homophobe. Here, let's apply a little thing I like to call the common-sense test, in which we replace gay with any other previously marginalized social group. Ready?

"I firmly believe that marriage is an institution that is for a man and a woman [of the same race]. That being said, I also believe that all [mixed race couples] deserve the same legal rights that [same race] couples have in this country. They should be allowed to adopt children. They should be allowed to put each other in their wills. They should be allowed to be given hospital visiting rights that couple's spouses recieve. As human beings we are given unalienable rights including pursuit of happiness. [Mixed race couples] should be allowed to live happily together. [They just shouldn't be allowed to marry]."

Now, is anyone in their right mind not going to call me a racist? You claim to be close to your cousin, yet you'd deny them what may be in their and their partner's eyes the most important aspect of marriage, the ability to sanctify it before their deity of choice? If you want to claim that your bigotry is justified because God/Jesus/the Pope/Batman told you it was, that's your right, but you don't get to deny people access to your private club and then claim you aren't prejudiced. There's a difference between tolerating and accepting, just as there's a difference between accepting and embracing. No one's asking you to go bump uglies with your buddy Steve, but you're deluding yourself if you think what you're doing is any better than separate water fountains.[/QUOTE]


holy shit man you need to chill. this is why people tend to have issues with gay rights and the like because if you have a view or belief that goes against it youre automatically labeled homophobic or anti gay. just because youre against or not in favor of something doesnt make you automatically ( racist, sexist, homophobic). a person can have a diff view point from you without hating you.


thanks for the shit storm wombat its shit like this that keeps me from talking politics or religion with people because everybody these days is too damn sensitive.
 
[quote name='lokizz']holy shit man you need to chill. this is why people tend to have issues with gay rights and the like because if you have a view or belief that goes against it youre automatically labeled homophobic or anti gay. just because youre against or not in favor of something doesnt make you automatically ( racist, sexist, homophobic). a person can have a diff view point from you without hating you.[/QUOTE]

Hate to break it to you, but whenever you are against someones RIGHTS you are, in fact, practicing discrimination. Now, sometimes that discrimination is arguably justified (I wouldn't expect people to support the sexual attitudes of say, a pedophile, or a rapist), but unless your defense for denying a loving couple the right to marry is better than "it's icky" or "an outdated text riddled with inaccuracies and abandoned practices told me to," you're damn right I'm going to call you out on it. I'm sorry if you'd like to pretend the whole issue doesn't even exist, but if you can't handle the topic being discussed on an internet message board (the world's least credible forum for debate), I shudder to think what would happen if you were forced to reflect and actually make some impactful real world decisions. This isn't politics, it's life, and you can no more disapprove of gays but not hate them than you can disapprove of minorities but not hate them, or disapprove of the opposite gender but not hate them. Just because it isn't a virulent hate doesn't mean it's not there.
 
[quote name='lokizz']holy shit man you need to chill. this is why people tend to have issues with gay rights and the like because if you have a view or belief that goes against it youre automatically labeled homophobic or anti gay. just because youre against or not in favor of something doesnt make you automatically ( racist, sexist, homophobic). a person can have a diff view point from you without hating you.


thanks for the shit storm wombat its shit like this that keeps me from talking politics or religion with people because everybody these days is too damn sensitive.[/QUOTE]

No your just justifying your marglization of a group of humans. Your right that dosent sound like a bigot at all.

Sorry it's black and white if you are ok with denying people rights based on sexual preference, race, creed, or yes religion you are bigoted towards that group.
 
[quote name='lokizz']holy shit man you need to chill. this is why people tend to have issues with gay rights and the like because if you have a view or belief that goes against it youre automatically labeled homophobic or anti gay. just because youre against or not in favor of something doesnt make you automatically ( racist, sexist, homophobic). a person can have a diff view point from you without hating you.


thanks for the shit storm wombat its shit like this that keeps me from talking politics or religion with people because everybody these days is too damn sensitive.[/QUOTE]

There's no reason anyone should be tolerant of intolerance. That's ridiculous, any person whose opinion actively denies people their rights, should NOT BE ACCEPTED.

I don't get how it's just accepted to still discriminate against a large group of people in this modern society because of outdated man made religions. Why, because everyone else is doing it?
 
and the sensitivity continues...... yeah btw how exactly is that cag member denying you anything? and im also tired of people comparing gay issues to race issues. not the same damn thing in the least but hey if youre willing to have all your basic human rights ignored and then placed into slavery for a few hundred years then we can talk otherwise stop comparing it.
 
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Sensitivity? Caring about a group of people's rights is calling being sensitive and a little bitch too now, right?
He by himself doesn't have the power to deny anyone anything, but he has millions of like minded people. People that take their beliefs against gays even further too.
 
Wombat - please don't comment at all on this on the CAGCast - keep the discussion to games and not this political stuff. CAG can't take another week of people actually commenting in the show feedback thread.
 
Great Job Wombat! I mean I know your idealism is unobtainable, but what really gets me is this, you recommended Hunger games.

That's it Wombat you need a timeout.
That novel was so full of holes I couldn't find the damn fabric. Then to top it of it is a love-story competitor with twilight. Anything that Katniss tells you is totally wrong in that novel including hiding her expressions, the facts about her being "used to being hungry." The entire ordeal is horrid. Didn't it get sappy? Didn't the "star-crossed lover routine" thing get old? How come Katniss is only smart enough to know what Haymitch means in any conversation?
Why did her father secretly fashion bows and put them in the woods years before his death and nobody finds them even before she ever got out into the woods and she knows where they are? Why are the residents of the districts so stupid they can't go around a mountain range? Why is Katniss petulant and impulsive in many actions and in others she thinks about things so long it would have to be annoying waiting on a response? Did you want me to continue? Really I have more especially the end where the beasts just disappear before they let the couple know there can be only 1 winner why? Why? Why?

You recommended it you need to explain and if you don't stay in that corner. IDK why that novel even got published. Yet again though it is better then Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy so there is that.
 
[quote name='Wombat']I am trying to avoid commenting in the thread and save my thoughts for the show, but that is completely twisting my words and not at all what I was saying. I know nothing I say will convince you otherwise, but you are wrong, please don't put words in my mouth.[/QUOTE]

You can plug your ears and go "la la la la la la la la" all you want when you hear it, but I am sure you already knew the differences between the religions.

So unless you are going to go on a battle against the entire Christian faith (whom you said you have no issues with) then it is silly to boycott CBS. According to you, all Christians are telling you to go to hell regardless of whether they cite a random Bible verse in a commercial or not.

But again, you said you don't have a problem with Christians, but CBS making known to you something you already knew? those bastards!
 
While FotF (assholes) are certainly allowed to say whatever they want, decorum dictates there is a time and place for everything. "If you don't believe in my narrow interpretation of a much-edited, bronze-age, skygod belief system, you will burn in eternal hellfire," is an argument best left off NFL broadcasts. Wombat is correct.
 
When Cheapy said his "Vita makes itself unavailable for a day at a time". I'd have said, "Oh, you mean like your wife?" I thought Wombat was going to say it.
 
If everyone was to boycott every network that aired an ad they found annoying/offensive/stupid/distasteful nobody would ever watch or listen to anything. It's totally okay to not like the FotF organization and still watch a CBS football game or sitcom. I mean, I guess if it makes you feel better to boycott CBS, go for it, but I would think there are other more effective ways to protest FotF. And personally, as an atheist I couldn't care less if someone thinks I'll burn in hell.
 
[quote name='AvidWriter']When Cheapy said his "Vita makes itself unavailable for a day at a time". I'd have said, "Oh, you mean like your wife?" I thought Wombat was going to say it.[/QUOTE]

I was shocked Wombat didn't make that joke. I think all this political protesting has left him rattled and off his game. But I'm sure he'll get his mojo back soon.
 
I was so scared when you mentioned Boondock Saints that you were going to say something positive about it. It felt so nice to hear you say what a crappy movie it was. It truly brought a smile to my face. Thank you for saying that. That movie is so crappy, it blows my mind people think it's good.
 
[quote name='Josh5890']homophobe- a person who fears or hates homosexuals and homosexuality.

I would fall under neither of these categories.[/QUOTE]

As they say, the Nile isn't just a river in Egypt. Hope your rights never get trampled on, be tough getting upset at people who clearly hold no ill will toward you. If you can't see the hypocrisy in denying someone's right to marriage while claiming no animosity towards them, I honestly don't know what to say other than I feel bad for all the homosexuals who have to overcome your backwards attitude to get fair treatment.
 
[quote name='Cheese']While FotF (assholes) are certainly allowed to say whatever they want, decorum dictates there is a time and place for everything. "If you don't believe in my narrow interpretation of a much-edited, bronze-age, skygod belief system, you will burn in eternal hellfire," is an argument best left off NFL broadcasts. Wombat is correct.[/QUOTE]

To be fair the verse was not meant to highlight any of the views you are criticizing FotF for, it actually highlighted that God loves EVERYONE, and ANYONE. It said it twice. You can argue all you want about their true motives but the commercial certainly did not have evil homophobic spreading intent.

As for the time and place BS, half of the commercials during football games are about stuff you don't care about. Just ignore the religion one just like you ignore the dodge caravan one.
 
if Wombat had just watched the Storage Wars Marathon instead of football we could have avoided this! jk

I am equally annoyed by any religious commercial, especially the I'm a Mormon ones. I change the channel as soon as any of that stuff shows up.
 
I didn't really like Wombat prior to this week's podcast and would usually tune him out...now, I very much despise him. How about keeping the podcast on track Cheapy? It seems like you let Wombat get sidetracked way too much. I really don't care to hear what his "thoughts" are. A few more Podcasts like that & I'm not going to be listening anymore.

Also, way to stick up for what you believe in Shipwreck.
 
I also don't really buy the NFL as that "family friendly" ( a few pink NFL jerseys and the Play 60 campaign doesn't change years of profanity and drunkenness) You guys are acting like it is the Disney Channel or Sprout TV.
 
Listening to you guys talk about Dead Island really makes me want to pick it up. I just finished Dead Rising 2: Off the Record and been wanting another zombie fix.

Cheapy you should really check out Dead Rising 2 Off the record. I know you picked up Dead Rising 2 and had problems with the lack of checkpoints and time constraint. Off the record fixes both of those issues with the sandbox mode and they added checkpoints every time you zone so you longer need to save all the time.
 
I am Catholic and I love the Cagcast! haha jk

Honestly though, Wombat is a part of this show, and has the right to express his thoughts. People getting mad for him doing so should follow the advice they give to Wombat and just go ahead and stop listening to the Cagcast.
 
On the subject of buying American to save American jobs: This is a noble idea that unfortunately doesn't translate from idea to reality. Businesses desire efficiency as efficiency usually leads to increased profitability. If it's more efficient to ship a job to a country where labor is less expensive, such as China, then that's what will happen. On the surface this seems like a terrible thing, but that's because generally people only look at one side of it, oddly, which is the side of the "greedy" CEOs who are looking for nothing but profit. Well, I suppose they are, but are they the only ones who benefit from the outsourcing? In the show itself, the question was answered: the Xbox costs around $100 less being manufactured abroad than it would were it made here in the US. So consumers benefit by saving $100. Given there are many more Xbox consumers than people making Xboxes, the benefit to consumers is much larger than the hypothetical benefit to a hypothetical manufacturing sector based purely on the number of people who consume vs. the number who create. On the subject of deplorable work conditions in Chinese factories, there's really no excusing that. But in many third-world countries, what we consider "sweat shops" the locals consider "better than starving in a barren field." And shockingly most places that employ child labor look, to the children, much better than the alternatives, which are often begging or prostitution. It would be great if everyone in the world were subjected to the same conditions as we are used to, but in many cases when we approach these situations from the point of view of "American living in America," we don't see the alternatives to what we perceive as abhorrent are actually the lesser of two evils by an incredible margin.
 
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Regarding Kingdoms of Amalur...I just finished playing the demo, and now firmly believe this game will bomb.
 
Yeah!!! You are gonna be SUPER CheapyD now with all those steam sales and Amazon deals to take advantage of!!! Also with the wireless HDMI it seems it might have some kind of lag issue I'd watch out for.
 
[quote name='polly']Regarding Kingdoms of Amalur...I just finished playing the demo, and now firmly believe this game will bomb.[/QUOTE]


Yeah, I tried the demo. From the archery to looting and character creation, game feels like a simplified Skyrim. And it's the comparisons to Skyrim that will cause it the most harm. The one area where it works better than Skyrim is the defensive combat. I dig the evasive roll, even if it launches you across the screen.

Cute game, tho. I definitely see its appeal. It's just not for me (especially when I still have interest in Skyrim).
 
I haven't really payed much attention to the forums until I started listening to CAGcast podcasts lately but- keep up the great banter, answers to the meaning of life, gaming nerd / random stoner ramble train of thoughts production style goodness that makes working the nightshift bearable. ****
 
I've been meaning to say this for a while but over the last 3 episodes Shipwreck is becoming strong with the force (and by "force" i mean "voice of the people") I think this year if we have a Cheapy Award for "Voice of the People" Shipwreck could bring some competition to Wombat. P.S. Good show chaps

Controversy Sells
===============
I think the nature of any religion is that they disagree* with other religions. That's why they're different religions and not the same religion.

While I can perfectly understand anyone's dislike of the group I think, like Shipwreck's initial response, that I don't think that particular verse should be received as offensive. That particular verse is more "advertising for Christians" than it is "condemnation of other religions"**. That would be like saying declaring as a Democrat is condemnation of Republicans.

That said if you want to take the verse and combine it with the group and come up with that interpretation as the intent of the commercial that's one thing (and I'd probably still disagree) but the verse itself is among (in my opinion) the more passive of verses.


* disagreement not equal to hate
** and there has got to be room in the spectrum of reasonable discussion for those two things to be different
 
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