The Civil War Comic Book Discussion Thread

Read it last night. Nicely done actually. I trust brubaker.
On the opposite end of the spectrum, The Initiative one-shot seemed to run with what was supposed to be the original ending to CW. Oh, then they have 4 previews in the back, including this weeks Captain America and a slightly important page.
 
I hope they don't keep doing this to characters... maybe it's just me, but I always liked the "perfect" heros... I've always found the idea of the powerful, yet benevolant hero (Superman, Captain America, Captain Marvel) more interesting than the dark, brooding and deeply flawed hero (Batman, Punisher, and Iron Man). While both tend to be needed for interesting stories at some point, writers seem to go out of thier way to introduce flaws into those heros, as a crutch to write them easier.
 
ive been crying in my red white and blue pjs all morning. havent read it yet. i heard it was a sniper, f'n pussies. think it was the punisher? remember that panel in CW 7?

who takes his place? someone has to. theyve done that alot in the past. the winter soldier? frank castle would be a cool replacement, though it couldnt last. hey, throw luke cage in the suit for a couple issues. call him black america.

it was a clone who was kiilled!

no wait...a genetically enhanced actor!


this is what should have STARTED the civil war.

dammit marvel!!! its always MY favorites!!! AAARRRGGHHH!!!:shame:
 
Figures. I saw on Newsarama that there was a spoiler on Captain America 25 in the USA Today, so I avoided that at all costs. I then avoid this topic at all costs. And that douche posts it up as the topic heading that Cap died. fucking a. And to make things worse apparently the frakking snow storm here delayed the comics to my store so they won't be there today. Today frakking blows.
 
[quote name='Salmonday']CNN has it on their front page, to which I spat out my coffee and screamed

ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR fuckING MINDS! I love how Marvel needs to fuck over characters they don't have the talent to write for and keep relevant. Pricks.[/quote]
i think brubaker was keeping him well revelant. not to mention fresh, exciting, damn it caps book was great and now this!

$^%#%Y%^#!!

:bomb::bomb::bomb::bomb::bomb::bomb:

ive changed my avatar as a show of respek. boo ya ca sha
 
Something tells me, and I haven't read any of it yet, that Brubaker still has some aces up his sleeves.
I'm not sure how much of the actual sniper shooting Cap they show, but what if it was all part of Red Skull's plot he'd been building up to over the 24 previous issues? Also, I wouldn't be surprised if Winter Soldier ended up as the main character of Captain America. It wouldn't surprise me to see him end up with the outfit once Punisher's done with it....Though I don't know if you'd wanna wear it after Punisher is done with it...
 
does anyone have any extra issues of captain america 25? EVERY STORE WITHIN EARSHOT IS SOLD OUT and i never put it on my pull list at my local store. ebay is flooded with assholes that are reselling at insane prices.

anyone? need help!
 
Eh, I don't see much value in "collecting" comics anymore... Though, the price they're starting to get single issues up to is bugging me. I'm just about ready to completely drop GI Joe entirely thanks to the last price hike. I mean, $3.50? That's starting to get ridiculous.
 
I was thinking about grabbing this too, sucks it's sold out everywhere. I typically only collect Ultimate X-Men and Runaways (not to mention civil war and a crapload sidestory crap to go along with it).

I also collected the whole arc of Fantastic Four where Reed got his face fucked up.

I dunno what the point of this post is, but goddamn I just want to read the damn comic and now I can't!
 
I ended up going to another comic store to get mine and they were sold out of Captain America also. Ended up having my mom go to the normal one back near my home and she got the very last copy of it the owner had. That's just freaking insane.
 
Reminds me of the whole Death of Superman fiasco in the 90s. I picked mine up this morning. I was going to pick up the other cover as well but I didn't....should have done it, though.
 
So I read Fantastic Four, JLofA, Civil War The Initiative, and 52 so far from this week. Hot damn were all of them pretty awesome. Fantastic Four was a great way to end the CW tie-in and still look back at the 45 year history of the Fantastic Four. Initiative was pretty cool in how it set up some really good looking series. I'm realy looking forward to Omega Flight and the Avengers crossover between Mighty and New. JLofA was similarly good as always, although
Grundy ripping off Tornado's arm and eating it was insanely brutal...
Finally, 52 was awesome, since I've loved the Black Marvel Family storyline from the start. Definitely a good week for comics and I still have Marvel Zombies vs Army of Darkness, Dark Tower 2, Detective Stories, and Mighty Avengers to read, plus Captain America back at my house.
 
[quote name='IronMan2020']marvel zombies vs army of darkness? that sounds awesome. i can see a boom stick to a rotting super hero already.[/quote]

Yeah, it looked like pure genius right from the start, so I had to pick it up. Especially with the fact that it had a zombie-ified Days of Future Past with Ash chainsawwing Zombie Wolverine as a cover.

I read Mighty Avengers and I really really dig this team. Sure, Tony is still a dick, but the rest of the team really gels together. And describing Ares as "Wolverine and Thor rolled together" was pure genius. Ares is a frakking badass in this first issue. I love his "audition" for joining the team. I really look forward to reading both Avengers teams, even though they have entirely different feels. It amazes me that Bendis is writing both series since they seem so different.
 
Ok after actually reading Cap # 25 just now,
I am going to go ahead and call Bull-Shit on this whole death story. From what we see right now it doesn't look good, but come on CAP DEAD. Yes he was shot and in bad shape, but at the end it seems like the Red Skull pulled up some planted memories in Sharon. I wouldn't put it past Shield to use this to take Cap somewhere secluded to "serve" his time/rehabilitate. The Skull tried, but I doubt he will be succesful.

At least that is what I think, I could be way off, in fact I probably am way off. But like Superman, this is a great way to get some main stream attention.
 
Captain America #25 was just great. I really hate Marvel for having done this, but a part of me believes it is only temporary.

I really think that Punisher is going to be the next Cap. I just feel that scene where he picks up Cap's mask and just stares at it. I think Frank Castle had a moment of clarity and figured out what it means to be a hero.

I think this is a logical choice because it will cause very heated discussion. You know what they say, there is no such thing as bad press.

As for the other great book of the week. Justice League of America #6 was simply DC at its best. Metzler has a true understanding of JLA and it heroes. It is by far one of most overlooked books out there (if that is possible). There is so much discussion about Civil War and 52 that many have lost sight of this great title.
 
fucking CNN leaked the story and every motherfucker and their grandma bought a copy. Now I'm assed out unless I want to pay $80 for one on ebay. fuck

I know a reprint will come but damn it, I prefer originals.
 
Couple of things...
There may be reorders of first printings going into stores next Wed. Marvel made a LOT of copies...and all those were pretty much sold out through Diamond as of Tuesday night. There will be a 2nd print announcement soon.

As for Steve Rogers. He's dead. I knew this Tuesday when I read it, but it took till this morning's update at Newsarama to back me up. There is an interview with Brubaker where he explainss the important stuff in detail.

-He's dead. Dead dead.
-The autopsey will be in the next issue
-they will explain how he had power dampening restraints on thus 4 bullets would actually fuck him up that bad
-This issue has been done since at least October. He wrote it with an older script of Civil War that had since been updated, so he only had to change a few bits of dialogue
-HE'S DEAD.
 
[quote name='SpottedNigel']Couple of things...
There may be reorders of first printings going into stores next Wed.[/quote]

Sucks for me if true. I purchased one from the web yesterday for $15.
 
id pay 15 for a first print.

id rather the punisher be the shooter than the replacement.
i really want to read it. i hope it was done well, unlike the sight gag when speedball was shot..."OSWALD!">bang<

why? did brubaker explain that?

just when CAPs book was really taking off, he kills him.

this had better be done well...if i see any CAP-clones in the next 2 years...thats it, im off comics!!!!

it'll take a lot off will-power...but dammit i'll try
 
Want a first print? Don't worry... in 10 years, you'll be tripping over, and/or whipeing your ass with the things. At least they won't be in a goofy polybag, though.
 
[quote name='JSweeney']Want a first print? Don't worry... in 10 years, you'll be tripping over, and/or whipeing your ass with the things. At least they won't be in a goofy polybag, though.[/QUOTE]


Agreed, finding Superman's death issue or the issue where Hal Jordan goes on that killing spree are a piece of cake now
 
"How much is Spawn #1 worth"
"I have a copy of X-men #1 with Jim Lee... is that worth anything"
"... I even have the one polybagged with arm-band!"

Reasons I'm glad we dont buy back comics...
 
For comics fans out there, I haven't kept up with this character too much, but he was one of my absolute favorite but is Mister M still alive?

I was reading the wiki on him and it doesn't really say either or. I thought he was Omega Level and couldn't really die due to his powers.

One last question, is Magneto finally dead in the normal Earth 616 universe? After House of M and the Scarlet Witch I can no longer really keep up with things.
 
CROSSBONES?? that jack-ass? hes a good character but not worthy of the honor of killing CAP. id rather it be some leftover programing in the WINTER SOLDIER or a HYDRA suicide bomber or something.

i just dont understand why you off a great character like CAP, no one was interested in SUPERMAN when they offed him, or GREEN ARROW, or GREEN LANTERN or FLASH... or COLOSSUS or JEAN GREY or MAGNETO(the first 2 times that is).

man i dont get it...you better know what you are doing brubaker
 
[quote name='IronMan2020']CROSSBONES?? that jack-ass? hes a good character but not worthy of the honor of killing CAP. id rather it be some leftover programing in the WINTER SOLDIER or a HYDRA suicide bomber or something.

i just dont understand why you off a great character like CAP, no one was interested in SUPERMAN when they offed him, or GREEN ARROW, or GREEN LANTERN or FLASH... or COLOSSUS or JEAN GREY or MAGNETO(the first 2 times that is).

man i dont get it...you better know what you are doing brubaker[/QUOTE]

They offed Captain America for the publicity and to drive up sales on comics in general.

Nobody in the real world gave a shit about the Civil War, but as soon as they killed Captain America places like CNN immediately latched on to the story, and now you probably got people who don't give two shits about comics going "Wow, I wonder what is going on in comics??".
 
[quote name='Roufuss']They offed Captain America for the publicity and to drive up sales on comics in general.

Nobody in the real world gave a shit about the Civil War, but as soon as they killed Captain America places like CNN immediately latched on to the story, and now you probably got people who don't give two shits about comics going "Wow, I wonder what is going on in comics??".[/QUOTE]

Actually when Civil War started there was a little bit of major media coverage of it. It mostly dealt with how the story could be compared to the present day with the war on terror and civil liberties.
 
[quote name='IronMan2020']CROSSBONES?? that jack-ass? hes a good character but not worthy of the honor of killing CAP. id rather it be some leftover programing in the WINTER SOLDIER or a HYDRA suicide bomber or something.

i just dont understand why you off a great character like CAP, no one was interested in SUPERMAN when they offed him, or GREEN ARROW, or GREEN LANTERN or FLASH... or COLOSSUS or JEAN GREY or MAGNETO(the first 2 times that is).

man i dont get it...you better know what you are doing brubaker[/QUOTE]

Well, Crossbones took the first shot but it was his own girlfriend who finished the job.

Not to mention that Red Skull was behind the scenes pulling the strings of the whole thing anyway...
 
[quote name='karsh']And there was also major media coverage when Spider-Man unmasked during Civil War.[/QUOTE]

The only thing that is different about Captain America dying is how many non fans I've seen and heard talking about it... other than comic book fans, nobody I know really talked about Civil War or Spider-Man unmasking, but EVERYONE is talking about Cap getting shot.
 
I think Crossbones cappin' Captain America was a good call. He deserved to die after opposing Tony Stark and the registration act, and I have been reading Cap comics since the mid' 80s. Crossbones is a great Captain America villain and during Brubakers run, he's become quite sadistic. What I want to know is when Marvel is going to come around to bringing back Thor. The Asgardians have been missed for a few years now ever since the disassembled story arcs. Oh well.......Make mine Marvel!
 
[quote name='gamerasscheap']I think Crossbones cappin' Captain America was a good call. He deserved to die after opposing Tony Stark and the registration act, and I have been reading Cap comics since the mid' 80s. Crossbones is a great Captain America villain and during Brubakers run, he's become quite sadistic. What I want to know is when Marvel is going to come around to bringing back Thor. The Asgardians have been missed for a few years now ever since the disassembled story arcs. Oh well.......Make mine Marvel![/quote]

That makes almost no sense.
Actually, I don't get all lot of what's going on with this...
How is Tony Stark even a credible hero anymore?
He plotted the death of fellow heros.
He orchestarted a near war with Atlantis and pulled the strings of villians to plot how they would best serve him.
There are so many screwed up, machiavellian things going on in the background that aren't even being addressed, or just swept under the rug.
Poor characterization mars so, so many across this entire debacle... it's as if they're tossing out continuity to try to throw out lame political crap to seem weighty and timely.


I hope Hulk just comes back and kills all of them.

I mean, I've found 52 to be far, far more enjoyable, and that's just all second and third string characters.
 
Can someone fill me in with the whole Spider-Man/Iron Man thing during the civil war? The last issue I could find(Nov. 06) ends with Peter getting MJ and May out of Stark Towers and then Iron Man ambushes him.

BTW, did Spider-Man get kicked out of the Avengers? Noticed that he hasn't been on any of the covers lately.
 
Wow. I finally read Captain America 25. That was an amazing issue. Even though I knew most of the big things, it was still great. Brubaker truly is an amazing author and besides Brian K. Vaughan and Joss Whedon, he might be my favorite. The issue was just so emotionally intense. And after going back and re-reading the Drums of War arc right before this, I'm really pumped for when the next issue comes out. I can't wait to see where the Red Skull's plans go next, considering we still don't know what he got from Doom or what Armin Zola is up to. Though now we know what Faustus was doing.
 
[quote name='tangytangerine']Can someone fill me in with the whole Spider-Man/Iron Man thing during the civil war? The last issue I could find(Nov. 06) ends with Peter getting MJ and May out of Stark Towers and then Iron Man ambushes him.

BTW, did Spider-Man get kicked out of the Avengers? Noticed that he hasn't been on any of the covers lately.[/QUOTE]

The Civil War tieins for New Avengers haven't been focusing on the team as a whole lately, that's why you haven't seen him on the cover. Its mostly been used to cover people's stories who just don't have much panel time in Civil War, like Luke Cage and his wife.

Spider-man will still be in New Avengers now that Civil War is over but the New Avengers have become the "underground" resistance movement and it would seem as if they're going to be led by Luke Cage now. I'm really anxious to see where they're gonna take it.

[quote name='karsh']Wow. I finally read Captain America 25. That was an amazing issue. Even though I knew most of the big things, it was still great. Brubaker truly is an amazing author and besides Brian K. Vaughan and Joss Whedon, he might be my favorite. The issue was just so emotionally intense. And after going back and re-reading the Drums of War arc right before this, I'm really pumped for when the next issue comes out. I can't wait to see where the Red Skull's plans go next, considering we still don't know what he got from Doom or what Armin Zola is up to. Though now we know what Faustus was doing.[/QUOTE]

I agree, it was a masterfully written issue. While I feel that they could have killed him a better way than they did, I feel it was redeemed by having it part of a bigger conspiracy. The issue, as a whole, though is really great with the way it does the flashbacks and covers all his supporting characters. I really liked the way they handled Winter Soldier.
 
[quote name='RedvsBlue']The Civil War tieins for New Avengers haven't been focusing on the team as a whole lately, that's why you haven't seen him on the cover. Its mostly been used to cover people's stories who just don't have much panel time in Civil War, like Luke Cage and his wife.

Spider-man will still be in New Avengers now that Civil War is over but the New Avengers have become the "underground" resistance movement and it would seem as if they're going to be led by Luke Cage now. I'm really anxious to see where they're gonna take it.[/quote]
The first issue of the new New Avengers was pretty damn good. It was just good during the whole backstory of Ronin/Echo, but once the whole team came to her rescue, it was definitely really good. I have to say, I know you're supposed to only like one of the Avengers teams really, but I personally enjoyed both Avengers titles so far, although I like the more "street level" Avengers team that New Avengers is.

[quote name='RedvsBlue']
I agree, it was a masterfully written issue. While I feel that they could have killed him a better way than they did, I feel it was redeemed by having it part of a bigger conspiracy. The issue, as a whole, though is really great with the way it does the flashbacks and covers all his supporting characters. I really liked the way they handled Winter Soldier.[/quote]

Yeah, I can see the whole having killed him a better way, but I feel that would be betraying what Brubaker's been building to this whole time. He's been building this massive conspiracy involving Red Skull using everyone to get back at Cap, and this is just the ultimate culmination of everything. But yeah, I loved the flash backs and seeing all the supporting characters shine in this issue. I loved Falcon showing up for some reason, but Winter Soldier is really becoming one of my favorite characters in the 616 universe. He was just awesome this issue.
 
[quote name='karsh']The first issue of the new New Avengers was pretty damn good. It was just good during the whole backstory of Ronin/Echo, but once the whole team came to her rescue, it was definitely really good. I have to say, I know you're supposed to only like one of the Avengers teams really, but I personally enjoyed both Avengers titles so far, although I like the more "street level" Avengers team that New Avengers is.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I found myself actually enjoying Mighty Avengers despite them being "Tony's team" (even though it was supposed to be Carol's team...).

Ares seems like he's gonna be the single greatest reason to read Mighty Avengers.

The New Avengers issue with them coming to Ronin's aid was FREAKIN AWESOME.

[quote name='karsh']Yeah, I can see the whole having killed him a better way, but I feel that would be betraying what Brubaker's been building to this whole time. He's been building this massive conspiracy involving Red Skull using everyone to get back at Cap, and this is just the ultimate culmination of everything. But yeah, I loved the flash backs and seeing all the supporting characters shine in this issue. I loved Falcon showing up for some reason, but Winter Soldier is really becoming one of my favorite characters in the 616 universe. He was just awesome this issue.[/QUOTE]

Not to start a DC vs. Marvel thing but Winter Soldier really feels like a better version of the whole Jason Todd/Red Hood thing...
 
"Not to start a DC vs. Marvel thing but Winter Soldier really feels like a better version of the whole Jason Todd/Red Hood thing..."

Be shocked: I agree.
 
[quote name='SpottedNigel']"Not to start a DC vs. Marvel thing but Winter Soldier really feels like a better version of the whole Jason Todd/Red Hood thing..."

Be shocked: I agree.[/quote]

I agree that Marvel did the whole "sidekick back from the dead" storyline better. Although I do like what they did with the Red Hood angle, since I don't think they've ever did a vengeful Robin(especially what he did to the Joker). Haven't followed it since Infinite Crisis, but hopefully he's still alive.
 
The whole Jason Todd was lame. I would have thought it would have been interesting for another hero to resurrect Jason. I thought Green Arrow would have been a good choice to resurrect Jason because he went through Speedy's drug addiction problem and knows the pain I father feels for his son. I think GA would want to save his "friend" the pain. When he resurrect Jason, he would then realize the mistake he just made. This could also explain the new sense of animosity that GA and Batman had before IC. That's just how I would have explained it.
 
Just a thought. Don't you think they can use the Cosmic Cube to bring back Cap? I mean the Red Skull survived a sniper's bullet. Yeah, good ol' cosmic cube.
 
There are a good 5-6 different ways to bring back Cap that fit story/continuity wise.

The problem for Marvel is seeing just how long they can keep him dead. They NEED this to mean something... no two months and he's back bullshit
 
[quote name='SpottedNigel']There are a good 5-6 different ways to bring back Cap that fit story/continuity wise.

The problem for Marvel is seeing just how long they can keep him dead. They NEED this to mean something... no two months and he's back bullshit[/quote]

Don't bring him fucking back, doest anybody stay dead any more in comics. I mean shit Bucky and Jason Todd are back. Hawkeye, back. Colosus, back. I mean shit, even Uncle Ben is back in comics. The only two I haven't seen back are Mockingbird and Warpath, (The Indian Dude from the X-men.) I can't wait to see how they are going to bring Black Goliath back.
 
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