The "Stay Classy, Republicans" Super Nintendo Chalmers Thread

Couple things:

Outside sources gave Walker $16 million, Barrett $6 million. Dude is conflating RNC versus DNC spending and outside spending.

DNC knew this was an unwinnable race, that's why Obama, Biden, and everyone from the DNC stayed away. Obama and the DNC have been steamrolling the RNC in fundraising. Internal polling for months showed what was in the exit polling last night; people didn't see the recall as legitimate, that's why the DNC didn't fund Barrett.

Oh, and Barrett was the losing candidate in 2010. Nothing like putting up someone who just lost to Walker in an effort to replace him. Also why the DNC didn't fund Barrett.

All of this. Over the ending of compulsory union membership for taxpayer-funded employees. Get a life, cry about something that is actually tyrannical, instead of weeping over the loss of your ability to tyrannize. Like the wars - foreign and domestic. Want the destruction of the middle and lower class? Go look at the rates of deaths, injury, and incarceration for the wars of drug and empire, then get back to me.

[quote name='Kirin Lemon']Hope the fucker gets his head blown off, honestly.[/QUOTE]

You're calling for the head of a guy who ended forced union membership for taxpayer-funded employees when there's a guy who commands a literal fucking empire and has people all over the world on his personally managed kill list - including children. Oh, and he throws people in jail for shit he did as a minor/young adult. While joking about those activities on a late night TV show.

If you weren't fucking frightening, you'd be hilarious.
 
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[quote name='Dr Mario Kart']
d) I want property taxes high
[/QUOTE]
I don't want property taxes low but I don't want them high either (low and high being inherently subjective). The goal is not to discourage owning property. Property owners are more likely to be concerned citizens, active citizens and take steps to improve their communities rather than ignore or even destroy them. While so-called "NIMBYs" can be a thorn in the side of people like me who advocate for passenger rail, I do admire their efforts to preserve their property and their neighborhoods, whether they win or not. I don't think renters would do that too often.
 
[quote name='eldergamer']I'm all for unions when they're for safe working conditions, 8 hour days and things like that.[/QUOTE]

Except for the fact that we now have federal laws that protect us from those things, so what does a union do exactly?
 
Union-vs-Taxpayer.jpg
 
[quote name='eldergamer']I'm all for unions when they're for safe working conditions, 8 hour days and things like that.

But when they're going for no-premium health care (even in retirement), guaranteed rate of return on their pension, and guaranteed raises each year regardless of personal or company performance, I think they're over reaching.[/QUOTE]People deserve to be able to collectively bargain if they wish, regardless of what it is for. It's a lie to that union members always get what they want. There is negotiation and compromise on both sides usually. Yes sometimes there is a strike if the union members feel they're not being treated fairly, and why shouldn't they?

It's also a lie that republican hate for unions only extends to the public sector, they'd love to eliminate all unions simple because many of them back democrat candidates. On the other hand, if unions backed republican candidates you'd find they're overwhelming support for them.
 
[quote name='eldergamer']I'm all for unions when they're for safe working conditions, 8 hour days and things like that.

But when they're going for no-premium health care (even in retirement), guaranteed rate of return on their pension, and guaranteed raises each year regardless of personal or company performance, I think they're over reaching.[/QUOTE]

I don't like over-powerful unions either.

But the rich elite who run corporations can't be trusted to do the right thing by workers. If you know of a better force that can counter-balance the 1% I'm all ears.
 
You want these big evil corporations to fail? Stop buying their stuff. Boycott things they support. Money talks. The beautiful thing about our economy is if people stop purchasing products, the big evil corporations can't exist.
 
[quote name='eldergamer']I'm all for unions when they're for safe working conditions, 8 hour days and things like that.

But when they're going for no-premium health care (even in retirement), guaranteed rate of return on their pension, and guaranteed raises each year regardless of personal or company performance, I think they're over reaching.[/QUOTE]
Just becasue they're "going for" it doesn't meen they'll get it. They can ask for whatever they want, just like the companies they negotiate with, doesn't mean either side will get everything they want. If the union does get what they asked for, well that was the company's decision to agree to it.
 
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[quote name='perdition(troy']You want these big evil corporations to fail? Stop buying their stuff. Boycott things they support. Money talks. The beautiful thing about our economy is if people stop purchasing products, the big evil corporations can't exist.[/QUOTE]
Boycotts don't work like that and the free market didn't end Jim Crow; government regulation did.

Systemic problems are not solved by individual actions. If people hate Apple because of Foxconn and everyone stopped buying Apple products tomorrow, what are the alternatives? Walkmans, Zunes, and every other portable music player are still made under the same conditions in the same manufacturing compounds. Are PS3's, Wii's, and 360's any better than one another in that respect? Of course not. Even before you get into assembly issues, you still have component source issues. Superconducting materials are still dug out of the ground using destructive methods in developing countries. Bad Things are so entrenched in literally everything that it's literally impossible to take yourself out of the game.
 
[quote name='perdition(troy']You want these big evil corporations to fail? Stop buying their stuff. Boycott things they support. Money talks. The beautiful thing about our economy is if people stop purchasing products, the big evil corporations can't exist.[/QUOTE]

Yeah what dohdough said. Boycotts are a nice idea but they are completely impractical to the point of being laughable. Like them or not, unions get results.

Also I think you misunderstand - I don't want corporations to fail. I want US corporations to thrive and pump more lifeblood into the economy. I want workers to get a fair deal. I want everyone to make money.
 
Then....

images



and now...the people fight back...



images


Hip Hip Hooray!!! What a glorious day!!
 
[quote name='dohdough']Boycotts don't work like that and the free market didn't end Jim Crow; government regulation did.

Systemic problems are not solved by individual actions. If people hate Apple because of Foxconn and everyone stopped buying Apple products tomorrow, what are the alternatives? Walkmans, Zunes, and every other portable music player are still made under the same conditions in the same manufacturing compounds. Are PS3's, Wii's, and 360's any better than one another in that respect? Of course not. Even before you get into assembly issues, you still have component source issues. Superconducting materials are still dug out of the ground using destructive methods in developing countries. Bad Things are so entrenched in literally everything that it's literally impossible to take yourself out of the game.[/QUOTE]

I'm curious... when, exactly, did iPods/Walkmans/Zunes/PS3s/360s/Wiis become necessities of life?

Basically, what DD's saying, is "Between Human suffering and not listening to my MP3s... well, **** you, Chinamen, I got mine."
 
It is pretty much impossible to buy goods that weren't produced with labor/conditions most people would find objectionable.

Especially electronics, but also true of necessities like clothing, appliances and other household necessities etc.

But it's not really anything new. Once society moved beyond hunting/gathering, manufacturing has always been the bottom of the totem pole and consumerism at the top.
 
Our lifestyles are basically subsidized by the folks who make our shit for little pay. It's why we can buy most of the shit we do. Most of it disposable too, which is a whole 'nother problem. Take clothing for example, most of the cheap clothing we buy is disposable, it's not even worth trying to repair (if you could sew). Nothing is meant to last anymore because it's cheap to begin with, so why bother?
 
[quote name='UncleBob']I'm curious... when, exactly, did iPods/Walkmans/Zunes/PS3s/360s/Wiis become necessities of life?

Basically, what DD's saying, is "Between Human suffering and not listening to my MP3s... well, **** you, Chinamen, I got mine."[/QUOTE]

Yeah, it's the dark side of human nature. We need law to ensure a level playing field. Society needs to give the workers some ability to negotiate a deal.

The alternative is violent massive worker riots like the one at Foxconn. And that isn't good for anyone. http://mashable.com/2012/06/07/foxconn-workers-riot/
 
I figure that China would be a republican's wet dream. No, not communism of course, but the lack of bargaining power that workers have.
 
Pretty sure you can buy clothing that's made in America, under our fair labor laws and all.

The entire "Woe is me, we have no choice" is a line of bull. The truth is, folks are simply unwilling to go without the creature comforts that make their lives so great. They may genuinely care about those who are being abused in factories, sweatshops and the like - but only to the point that they don't have to give up what they've want to make their lives easier.
 
I didn't know cell phones were manufactured in the United States. Tell me more 'bout that, Bob.

Since that is no longer a "creature comfort," and in fact a genuine necessity for people who hold down jobs that require them to be remotely accessible at all hours.

Or would your response to that be "if you're so concerned about that, find a job that doesn't require that. work at burger king if you have to"?
 
There are plenty of jobs outside of flipping burgers and ringing up someone's DVD that do not require you to be accessible outside of work. I worked a pretty decent office job after college (decent salary, full benefits, etc.) where I was there 9-5, went home, and the only time anyone ever called me outside of work was to let me know the office was gonna be closed due to flooding.

Bob is 100% correct. If people are so outraged by the awful working conditions around the world, don't buy all these products. Stop crying about shit while you're Twittering from your iPhone. You look like a hypocritical douche.
 
This is a stupid debate... it's been proven that stronger public sectors = better conditions for everyone. The real losers are the idiots who think that their enemies are these union workers.

[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']
Bob is 100% correct. If people are so outraged by the awful working conditions around the world, don't buy all these products. Stop crying about shit while you're Twittering from your iPhone. You look like a hypocritical douche.[/QUOTE]

Your logic here is terrible. If we're not ready to abandon modern technology we can't push for better treatment of the people who make it?
 
[quote name='willardhaven']Your logic here is terrible. If we're not ready to abandon modern technology we can't push for better treatment of the people who make it?[/QUOTE]

If someone said that they wanted the government to pass stricter regulations regarding gas guzzling vehicles while driving around in their full size Hummer, yes - that's pretty much the definition of hypocrite.

myke - You do realize that there are entire communities of people who manage to get by virtually self-sustaining themselves, without relying on cell phones, iPads and 360s, right?

Just because you're too pampered and weak to get by without electrical gadgets, it doesn't mean it can't be done by those who are actually willing to do it.
 
[quote name='willardhaven']This is a stupid debate... it's been proven that stronger public sectors = better conditions for everyone. The real losers are the idiots who think that their enemies are these union workers.



Your logic here is terrible. If we're not ready to abandon modern technology we can't push for better treatment of the people who make it?[/QUOTE]

Actually your debate is ridiculous pubic unions do not equal better conditions for everyone and that is a load of crap. They negatively affect many many many people. Including the poor who get benefits taken away from them to give to the unions. This vote and the one in california is a step in the right direction.

They are my enemies and I will not be happy until public sector unions are demolished. It is a drain and not needed.

You might want to read up a little bit and look at current history to see where your thinking is totally wrong. Many states and people are suffering because of public unions. They are selfish and totally unnecessary.

The real losers are the idiots who think public unions are anything but useless and counter productive.
 
I don't post around here too much so forgive me for having trouble wading through all of your garbage.

Becoming Amish Bob? That's your answer? That would be a hilarious response if I didn't think you were sincere.

Pliskin I don't think I have the patience... Though I think you might be in need of some counseling.
 
It's one possibility. It proves it can be done. It proves the "Woe is me, I'm sorry your life sucks Chinaman, but I need my iPod and electric nose hair trimmer" cries to be nothing but self-centered bull crap by folks who are too weak to admit that they *don't* need this stuff, but, instead are simply unwilling to put their creature comforts behind their own "dearly held" beliefs.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']Pretty sure you can buy clothing that's made in America, under our fair labor laws and all.

The entire "Woe is me, we have no choice" is a line of bull. The truth is, folks are simply unwilling to go without the creature comforts that make their lives so great. They may genuinely care about those who are being abused in factories, sweatshops and the like - but only to the point that they don't have to give up what they've want to make their lives easier.[/QUOTE]

It was an example; not a goddamned treatise on the subject. Giving up portable media players doesn't eliminate cellphones, giving up those two doesn't eliminate laptops, giving up those three doesn't eliminate computers, giving up those four doesn't eliminate superconductors, etc etc. It's a supply problem from the top to the bottom and not a demand problem, you obtuse twit.

"Made in the USA" is a marketing gimmick for the most part and you still encounter the problem of sourcing raw materials. That cotton has to come from somewhere and the US isn't even close to supplying most of the worlds cotton, but it sure as hell exports the most. And how do you think cotton is harvested in most of the world and by whom?

The same goes for food. You think co-ops alone can feed 330,000,000+ people? You think grown and picked in the US means that there was compliance with labor laws?

I find your derision hilarious considering the fact that you work at Walmart. You're a fucking joke. Giving up some "creature comforts" doesn't take you out of the game unless you want to go be some kind of isolated hermit.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']It's one possibility. It proves it can be done. It proves the "Woe is me, I'm sorry your life sucks Chinaman, but I need my iPod and electric nose hair trimmer" cries to be nothing but self-centered bull crap by folks who are too weak to admit that they *don't* need this stuff, but, instead are simply unwilling to put their creature comforts behind their own "dearly held" beliefs.[/QUOTE]
So what you're advocating for is that we return to the mid 18th century level of technology or that should be a model to follow or else everyone's a hypocrite? Technically no one needs anything and can just choose to die cause all choices are equal right?

fucking libertarians...I swear...:roll:
 
[quote name='willardhaven']I don't post around here too much so forgive me for having trouble wading through all of your garbage.

Becoming Amish Bob? That's your answer? That would be a hilarious response if I didn't think you were sincere.

Pliskin I don't think I have the patience... Though I think you might be in need of some counseling.[/QUOTE]

Right back at you. The Wisconsin vote was about "public" unions and where the conversation was started. Then the conversation here went to just UNIONS then within that it actually went to private sector unions ie businesses corporations and their impact even though nobody said private sector unions specifically.

Is it possible you jumped in on a business conversation and private unions and used the wrong language? As "public" sector unions are a bad thing and in no way help everyone.

Now for "private" unions to me are not what they started out as and while still useful are not all important any longer and are in many cases corrupt and harm the economy at least here in the U.S.

You have your opinion and I have mine. You said people who see "public" unions as enemies are idiots and that they help everyone. I sent that language right back at you and gave my opinion on it.

Maybe it is you who needs the counseling. If you can't take it do not dish it out.
 
[quote name='dohdough']So what you're advocating for is that we return to the mid 18th century level of technology or that should be a model to follow or else everyone's a hypocrite? Technically no one needs anything and can just choose to die cause all choices are equal right?

fucking libertarians...I swear...:roll:[/QUOTE]

I'd say the libertarian stance is buy the cheapest product available, and advocate freedom wherever possible.

Not buying the product merely further impoverishes the workers who made it, and the second part is self-explanatory.
 
[quote name='willardhaven']I don't post around here too much so forgive me for having trouble wading through all of your garbage.

Becoming Amish Bob? That's your answer? That would be a hilarious response if I didn't think you were sincere.[/QUOTE]

I thought you were joking.

Become Amish - I lol'd
 
[quote name='dohdough']It was an example; not a goddamned treatise on the subject. Giving up portable media players doesn't eliminate cellphones, giving up those two doesn't eliminate laptops, giving up those three doesn't eliminate computers, giving up those four doesn't eliminate superconductors, etc etc. It's a supply problem from the top to the bottom and not a demand problem, you obtuse twit.[/quote]

Again, all stuff you could live with out. But then you couldn't go online and call people names because you disagree with them and want to make yourself feel superior... how would you fill your empty, meaningless days?
 
[quote name='Feeding the Abscess']I'd say the libertarian stance is buy the cheapest product available, and advocate freedom wherever possible.

Not buying the product merely further impoverishes the workers who made it, and the second part is self-explanatory.[/QUOTE]
So what you're saying is that it's more complicated than token gestures? Who knew!

Btw, a real libertarian would say that of those workers feel like they're just being treated unfairly, they can go work for somewhere else, just as a consumer could just choose not to buy a computer, apple, or tshirt according to bobby.

[quote name='UncleBob']Again, all stuff you could live with out. But then you couldn't go online and call people names because you disagree with them and want to make yourself feel superior... how would you fill your empty, meaningless days?[/QUOTE]
Report any of Pliskin's posts lately? Go fuck yourself. And while you're at, explain how food and clothing don't have the same type of supply problems.
 
[quote name='dohdough']
Report any of Pliskin's posts lately? Go fuck yourself. And while you're at, explain how food and clothing don't have the same type of supply problems.[/QUOTE]

You are such a big baby whenever anybody calls you on your bullshit you always fall back on "yeah mommy but what about pliskin". Now you are doing it in this thread too and this subject?

Seriously??!!

I bet in life you are a spoiled rotten mama's boy who is used to getting your way too.
 
[quote name='Pliskin101']Actually your debate is ridiculous pubic unions do not equal better conditions for everyone and that is a load of crap. They negatively affect many many many people. Including the poor who get benefits taken away from them to give to the unions. This vote and the one in california is a step in the right direction.

They are my enemies and I will not be happy until public sector unions are demolished. It is a drain and not needed.

You might want to read up a little bit and look at current history to see where your thinking is totally wrong. Many states and people are suffering because of public unions. They are selfish and totally unnecessary.

The real losers are the idiots who think public unions are anything but useless and counter productive.[/QUOTE]

Just out of curiosity, how much lower do you think your state/local taxes would be if public unions were disbanded? Do you have any statistics that show it's impact as well?
 
[quote name='Pliskin101']You are such a big baby whenever anybody calls you on your bullshit you always fall back on "yeah mommy but what about pliskin". Now you are doing it in this thread too and this subject?

Seriously??!!

I bet in life you are a spoiled rotten mama's boy who is used to getting your way too.[/QUOTE]
LOLZ. If you were more adept at pointing out hypocrisy or maybe just less of an ideologue, you wouldn't make such a post.

If I really wanted to cry to mommy, I'd just report a post to the mods and call it a day like bobby does to some of my posts, but you already knew that, right?

And the is fact of the matter is that your post is just another giant ad hominem that doesn't refute my claims about supply chain and source issues. Or am I just premature in responding because you're typing up a nice long detailed post about your refutations? I doubt that anyone would put a penny on that one.
 
[quote name='dohdough']If I really wanted to cry to mommy, I'd just report a post to the mods and call it a day like bobby does to some of my posts, but you already knew that, right?[/QUOTE]

I swear, I've never seen someone get so butthurt over something so minor.

It's funny and sad at the same time.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']I swear, I've never seen someone get so butthurt over something so minor.

It's funny and sad at the same time.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, it has everything to do with me being buthurt and absolutely nothing to do with your hypocrisy in regards to "just following the rules." I couldn't care less if you reported every single one of my posts, but don't wrap yourself in a flag and claim some self-righteous moral high ground of the rules when it's clearly about attacking me; nothing else. I could at least respect that.

Or maybe you'd like to get back to the topic at hand and explain how food and clothing don't have the same supply problems.
 
[quote name='dohdough']LOLZ. If you were more adept at pointing out hypocrisy or maybe just less of an ideologue, you wouldn't make such a post.

If I really wanted to cry to mommy, I'd just report a post to the mods and call it a day like bobby does to some of my posts, but you already knew that, right?

And the is fact of the matter is that your post is just another giant ad hominem that doesn't refute my claims about supply chain and source issues. Or am I just premature in responding because you're typing up a nice long detailed post about your refutations? I doubt that anyone would put a penny on that one.[/QUOTE]

I get sucked in replying to UB's trolling because it's occasionally humorous (that "Go Amish" post is legitimately great - I could see that becoming a viral SNL skit)

But Pliskin has become a painfully obvious troll - plus his shtick is tired and I don't think anyone on the board is buying it anymore. I'm legitimately surprised he hasn't been banned yet. If I were you I wouldn't waste my time.
 
[quote name='onetrackmind']Just out of curiosity, how much lower do you think your state/local taxes would be if public unions were disbanded? Do you have any statistics that show it's impact as well?[/QUOTE]

I am not here to explain it to you. Look it up yourself. But I will help you a little....

Here are some hints and a good place for you to start...

How do public unions get paid? How do their demands and packages get paid for? How do they get paid even during hard economic times and the same money is not there?
Hint taxes is one robbing other programs is a second one for starters. Many states have been doing it especially as of late also the fed did it to help the states with it. Some robbed programs that help the "real" poor and disadvantaged just to meet these golden packages. Why is it that this happens? Hint because public unions and their unrealistic selfishness even in hard times over their true employer john q and the PEOPLE they are supposed to be serving.

Here is another hint....
If a business is in a slump or on hard times do private sector unions keep on making unreasonable demands THAT CANNOT be met without harming the business more or until the business is dead (Okay that may be a bad example as some actually do because they are to blinded by their own selfishness)? So why should public unions be allowed to do so over their employers?

Hints....Why do public unions (not all but most) and certain political leanings look at their employer (the people and the taxpayer that they are supposed to be serving) as some kind of endless bank (or magical money cabinet where money magically appears) that they can just keep demanding and expecting more and more no matter the economic circumstances? Why do public unions get to escape hard times instead of reflecting the economy and their bosses economy and hard times? Why is it so hard to fire a public servant who is not serving the public? Shouldn't efficiency and productivity be what is expected and the opposite of that NOT rewarded instead of being rewarded?

Hint...stiking PUBLIC service workers...really??!!

That is just some hints and a good place for you to start.

So instead of me meeting your demands why don't you post the things that back your initial statement that.... "public" unions help "everyone" and anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot... that started this between us then maybe we will talk some more.
 
[quote name='dohdough']Yeah, it has everything to do with me being buthurt and absolutely nothing to do with your hypocrisy in regards to "just following the rules." I couldn't care less if you reported every single one of my posts, but don't wrap yourself in a flag and claim some self-righteous moral high ground of the rules when it's clearly about attacking me; nothing else. I could at least respect that.

Or maybe you'd like to get back to the topic at hand and explain how food and clothing don't have the same supply problems.[/QUOTE]

Hey, look... DD complaining about me being "off topic" after over 400 posts of him going around and around, completely off topic in another thread with folks who aren't me.

And it wasn't about "attacking you". If that was the case, I would have been like "Oh, DD got modded... he's such a bad, bad boy.". I reported it and I moved on. Apparently, I'm the only one with that "moving on" ability. Some folks just can't help but get butthurt over minor things to the point where they can't move on.

I can see DD's will now. In it, he demands his tombstone read "Here lies DD - Persecuted by Uncle Bob and the moderators of CAG."

And, as for your food/clothing... again, there are communities here and overseas that manage to get by just fine without cheaply manufactured Chinese crap. You just refuse to make those sacrifices.

It's a pretty typical stance from folks like you. "I want things to be better, so long as I don't have to make any sacrifices to make them better. Other folks should do it for me."
 
[quote name='UncleBob']Pretty sure you can buy clothing that's made in America, under our fair labor laws and all.

The entire "Woe is me, we have no choice" is a line of bull. The truth is, folks are simply unwilling to go without the creature comforts that make their lives so great. They may genuinely care about those who are being abused in factories, sweatshops and the like - but only to the point that they don't have to give up what they've want to make their lives easier.[/QUOTE]
Those clothes that your employer sells so cheaply wouldn't be as cheap if they were made here. And we all know what Wally World does when they don't get the price they want on something.
 
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