Wall Street Protesters
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[quote name='chiwii']How do you think that should be fixed?[/QUOTE]
Protect Unions. Offer some incentives to business to stay here. End subsidies and tax major corporations and the top earners then use that money to invest in science, technology, education, infrastructure and other fields that if you talk to any economists they will tell you are the back bone of our society. Honestly every week I see crap tons of articles being wrote by or discussions from economists who say time and time agian that what built America and is now building China is investments in those areas. The WW2 generation built America by investing in those fields, the boomers came in and then lived off what the previous generations had done and then off our future. If they had invested in the same things their parents did we would not be in the mess we are in, but hey they needed tax cuts so they could take three vacations a year and retire to Florida right?
Protect Unions. Offer some incentives to business to stay here. End subsidies and tax major corporations and the top earners then use that money to invest in science, technology, education, infrastructure and other fields that if you talk to any economists they will tell you are the back bone of our society. Honestly every week I see crap tons of articles being wrote by or discussions from economists who say time and time agian that what built America and is now building China is investments in those areas. The WW2 generation built America by investing in those fields, the boomers came in and then lived off what the previous generations had done and then off our future. If they had invested in the same things their parents did we would not be in the mess we are in, but hey they needed tax cuts so they could take three vacations a year and retire to Florida right?
[quote name='dmaul1114']But that fact remains that they money they spend on those luxuries isn't going to get them out of poverty and off public assistance if they didn't spend that money and instead saved it.[/QUOTE]
In many situations, saving your money (or, better, spending it wisely) isn't going to make a major change in your overall financial situation.
In all but a very few rare situations (like, say, winning the lottery and managing not to blow it all), spending all your money on frivolous luxuries will GUARANTEE that you will never make a change in your overall financial situation.
You can spend your last $500 on the iPad you want and pray that your car doesn't break down or you could tuck that money into savings and, if your car breaks down next week, you can get it fixed so you can still get to work, keep your job and keep an income. But, if you have the iPad, at least you can entertain yourself when you're unemployed and can't even go out looking for a job because you have no car.
In many situations, saving your money (or, better, spending it wisely) isn't going to make a major change in your overall financial situation.
In all but a very few rare situations (like, say, winning the lottery and managing not to blow it all), spending all your money on frivolous luxuries will GUARANTEE that you will never make a change in your overall financial situation.
You can spend your last $500 on the iPad you want and pray that your car doesn't break down or you could tuck that money into savings and, if your car breaks down next week, you can get it fixed so you can still get to work, keep your job and keep an income. But, if you have the iPad, at least you can entertain yourself when you're unemployed and can't even go out looking for a job because you have no car.
[quote name='dohdough']Eat the rich. I'm sure they're tasty.:lol:
I'd also add increasing marginal tax and capital gains tax rates to dmaul's list.[/QUOTE]
You're getting back into this adversarial relationship between ownership and labour while failing to realize, or maybe just joking suggesting otherwise, that there needs to be a balance. Without monoloithic corporate entities, those jobs wouldn't be there. Without small businesses, those jobs wouldn't be there etc... We can't trade chickens for lap dances and as individuals we can't produce the durable goods that serve as the engines of our economy.
Simple solutions:
1.) Raise corporate taxes with the stipulation that hiring within the US is tax deductible and lower payroll taxes on the employer side.
2.) Sunset the bush tax cuts as they were supposed to have done.
3.) Tax dividend and capital gains as regular income and not at a static 15%
4.) Keep the accelrated depreciation that caused "the oil companies to have extra profit" that I explained elsewhere. This is actually a good thing as a faster ammortization of capital expenditure *should* lead to quicker replacement of heavy machinery type things. This has a ripple effect in manufacturing and such, which is good since after applying the first item on my list we'll have more manufacturing on US shores leading to more ripple. Call it trickle sideways.
5.) Assuming #2 increases revenues by 5-10%, cut budgets to a roughly equal amount, use the delta as debt service until the country is no longer in hock.
6.) Eliminate PAC type things as they've done no good whatsoever.
7.) Clone me some redheads to create my own harem.
8.) Politicians get put on the same health care and such as the citizens and receive a 20% cut in pay until we're in the black.
9.) Higher enforcement of labour laws such that unions aren't as necessary since they seem to be such a thorn in the side of the right.
10.) Invest in new technology. R&D pays off in the end. This has a round-about way of increasing the demand for math/science in schools and shuffles out those silly poli-sci kids.
Notice how this borrows from both ideologies since there is some merit in both, though going full swing into one or the other will cause problems.
In the end there's going to be a chicken/egg moment where people have to realize that "the economy" isn't going to solve itself and before it gets better there needs to be policy enacted that serves to provide the avenue for such things.
Also, tax policy and economic policy aren't the same thing despite what a republican will tell you.
I'd also add increasing marginal tax and capital gains tax rates to dmaul's list.[/QUOTE]
You're getting back into this adversarial relationship between ownership and labour while failing to realize, or maybe just joking suggesting otherwise, that there needs to be a balance. Without monoloithic corporate entities, those jobs wouldn't be there. Without small businesses, those jobs wouldn't be there etc... We can't trade chickens for lap dances and as individuals we can't produce the durable goods that serve as the engines of our economy.
Simple solutions:
1.) Raise corporate taxes with the stipulation that hiring within the US is tax deductible and lower payroll taxes on the employer side.
2.) Sunset the bush tax cuts as they were supposed to have done.
3.) Tax dividend and capital gains as regular income and not at a static 15%
4.) Keep the accelrated depreciation that caused "the oil companies to have extra profit" that I explained elsewhere. This is actually a good thing as a faster ammortization of capital expenditure *should* lead to quicker replacement of heavy machinery type things. This has a ripple effect in manufacturing and such, which is good since after applying the first item on my list we'll have more manufacturing on US shores leading to more ripple. Call it trickle sideways.
5.) Assuming #2 increases revenues by 5-10%, cut budgets to a roughly equal amount, use the delta as debt service until the country is no longer in hock.
6.) Eliminate PAC type things as they've done no good whatsoever.
7.) Clone me some redheads to create my own harem.
8.) Politicians get put on the same health care and such as the citizens and receive a 20% cut in pay until we're in the black.
9.) Higher enforcement of labour laws such that unions aren't as necessary since they seem to be such a thorn in the side of the right.
10.) Invest in new technology. R&D pays off in the end. This has a round-about way of increasing the demand for math/science in schools and shuffles out those silly poli-sci kids.
Notice how this borrows from both ideologies since there is some merit in both, though going full swing into one or the other will cause problems.
In the end there's going to be a chicken/egg moment where people have to realize that "the economy" isn't going to solve itself and before it gets better there needs to be policy enacted that serves to provide the avenue for such things.
Also, tax policy and economic policy aren't the same thing despite what a republican will tell you.
[quote name='nasum']Dohdough's last statement is interesting as it kind of gets at this notion of there being one money and we all have a chunk of it. This is oddly akin to going back to the gold standard.[/QUOTE]
Ummm...Not really. When CEO's fire 4,000 employees and takes a multi-million dollar bonus, what would you call that? Or when companies hire workers at part time to avoid paying benefits or numerous other things that the capitalist class does to stomp on labor? That capital doesn't disappear.
I'm not talking about fiat currency like a gold bug, homie.
And yes, I was joking about eating the rich...for now.:lol:
Ummm...Not really. When CEO's fire 4,000 employees and takes a multi-million dollar bonus, what would you call that? Or when companies hire workers at part time to avoid paying benefits or numerous other things that the capitalist class does to stomp on labor? That capital doesn't disappear.
I'm not talking about fiat currency like a gold bug, homie.
It's highly debatable that we owe our lives to those guys and I balk at hero worship, but green jobs aren't sustainable either. Years from now after the boom, we'll be right back to where we were after every bubble we've ever had. The problem is capitalism; not technological progress or lack thereof.
And yes, I was joking about eating the rich...for now.:lol:
[quote name='UncleBob']In many situations, saving your money (or, better, spending it wisely) isn't going to make a major change in your overall financial situation.
In all but a very few rare situations (like, say, winning the lottery and managing not to blow it all), spending all your money on frivolous luxuries will GUARANTEE that you will never make a change in your overall financial situation.
You can spend your last $500 on the iPad you want and pray that your car doesn't break down or you could tuck that money into savings and, if your car breaks down next week, you can get it fixed so you can still get to work, keep your job and keep an income. But, if you have the iPad, at least you can entertain yourself when you're unemployed and can't even go out looking for a job because you have no car.[/QUOTE]
If $500 is going to make or break you, you're
ed either way.
In all but a very few rare situations (like, say, winning the lottery and managing not to blow it all), spending all your money on frivolous luxuries will GUARANTEE that you will never make a change in your overall financial situation.
You can spend your last $500 on the iPad you want and pray that your car doesn't break down or you could tuck that money into savings and, if your car breaks down next week, you can get it fixed so you can still get to work, keep your job and keep an income. But, if you have the iPad, at least you can entertain yourself when you're unemployed and can't even go out looking for a job because you have no car.[/QUOTE]
If $500 is going to make or break you, you're
ed either way.[quote name='dohdough']If $500 is going to make or break you, you're ed either way.[/QUOTE]
This is the train of thought that leads someone to spending their last $500 on the iPad, then blaming their boss when they get fired because they don't come to work because their car broke down.
ed either way.[/QUOTE]This is the train of thought that leads someone to spending their last $500 on the iPad, then blaming their boss when they get fired because they don't come to work because their car broke down.
[quote name='UncleBob']This is the train of thought that leads someone to spending their last $500 on the iPad, then blaming their boss when they get fired because they don't come to work because their car broke down.[/QUOTE]
If someone needs a beat up car that requires a $500 repair to get to work or get fired, what's going to happen while they're getting the repair? Whoops, stilled.
If someone needs a beat up car that requires a $500 repair to get to work or get fired, what's going to happen while they're getting the repair? Whoops, still
ed.
willardhaven
CAGiversary!
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I haven't kept up... did anyone mention the fact that most households have two primary earners now? It used to be feasible for two adults and one child to live off of one salary.
[quote name='dohdough']If someone needs a beat up car that requires a $500 repair to get to work or get fired, what's going to happen while they're getting the repair? Whoops, still ed.[/QUOTE]
I don't know about your job - but I can call in sick on occasion at my job.
However, if I had to go a length of time "calling in" because I had no transportation to work, I'd likely be terminated.
So, if my car broke down for the day, I could spend the day to get it fixed. Hell, I even have good friends that wouldn't mind giving me a ride (or, possibly, loaning me a vehicle for a few days, which actually happened once)... but I wouldn't blame anyone's generosity getting shorted if, two weeks later, they're giving me a ride to work at 6 in the morning on their day off while I play with my iPad and complain about the cost of getting my car fixed.
ed.[/QUOTE]I don't know about your job - but I can call in sick on occasion at my job.
However, if I had to go a length of time "calling in" because I had no transportation to work, I'd likely be terminated.
So, if my car broke down for the day, I could spend the day to get it fixed. Hell, I even have good friends that wouldn't mind giving me a ride (or, possibly, loaning me a vehicle for a few days, which actually happened once)... but I wouldn't blame anyone's generosity getting shorted if, two weeks later, they're giving me a ride to work at 6 in the morning on their day off while I play with my iPad and complain about the cost of getting my car fixed.
[quote name='willardhaven']I haven't kept up... did anyone mention the fact that most households have two primary earners now? It used to be feasible for two adults and one child to live off of one salary.[/QUOTE]
It was hinted at, but not really a topic of discussion.
It was hinted at, but not really a topic of discussion.
[quote name='willardhaven']I haven't kept up... did anyone mention the fact that most households have two primary earners now? It used to be feasible for two adults and one child to live off of one salary.[/QUOTE]
I brought it up multiple times and even used my wife and I who live on 1 income as an example multiple times. We live on 1 income the same way if not worse as people did years and years ago....but in return we have given up kids and saddled ourselves with $50,000 in student loans and our house is hardly in what you would call the suburbs.
No suprise that those like bob carrying the conservative torch did not have much to say about this. Cause again after all black folk have cell phones and AC!
I brought it up multiple times and even used my wife and I who live on 1 income as an example multiple times. We live on 1 income the same way if not worse as people did years and years ago....but in return we have given up kids and saddled ourselves with $50,000 in student loans and our house is hardly in what you would call the suburbs.
No suprise that those like bob carrying the conservative torch did not have much to say about this. Cause again after all black folk have cell phones and AC!
[quote name='MSI Magus']No suprise that those like bob carrying the conservative torch did not have much to say about this. Cause again after all black folk have cell phones and AC![/QUOTE]
Why is it that people who feel the need to put me on ignore also feel the need to continuously throw verbal attacks my way? You'd think having me on ignore would sooth their mind.
But, hey, you want me to address your individual situation? I'd be interested in knowing more about your individual disability. I assume that it keeps you from, say, learning how to program? Because you seem to have one of those fancy iOS devices... They're pretty easy to program for and pretty easy to get apps up in the market place. While you won't likely become the next Bill Gates by creating Ninja Ropes, you could likely manage to bring in some income with a small app or two. You've commented before about how you like to better yourself, self educate and research and such.
http://www.amazon.com/Programming-i...8434/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1323301237&sr=8-2
http://www.amazon.com/iOS-Programmi...3772/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1323301237&sr=8-1
Here's a couple of books to get you started... far cheaper than the PSP Vita you seem to be interested in purchasing. (Oh, hey, look - spending wisely can help you.... you could buy books to help you learn how to program, then use your existing equipment to entertain yourself by building a few games that you might make a couple of bucks selling *or* you could use that same money and buy a video game system to entertain yourself... then, spend *more* money buying games to play in that system... and more money on proprietary memory cards to use in the system....)
Why is it that people who feel the need to put me on ignore also feel the need to continuously throw verbal attacks my way? You'd think having me on ignore would sooth their mind.
But, hey, you want me to address your individual situation? I'd be interested in knowing more about your individual disability. I assume that it keeps you from, say, learning how to program? Because you seem to have one of those fancy iOS devices... They're pretty easy to program for and pretty easy to get apps up in the market place. While you won't likely become the next Bill Gates by creating Ninja Ropes, you could likely manage to bring in some income with a small app or two. You've commented before about how you like to better yourself, self educate and research and such.
http://www.amazon.com/Programming-i...8434/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1323301237&sr=8-2
http://www.amazon.com/iOS-Programmi...3772/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1323301237&sr=8-1
Here's a couple of books to get you started... far cheaper than the PSP Vita you seem to be interested in purchasing. (Oh, hey, look - spending wisely can help you.... you could buy books to help you learn how to program, then use your existing equipment to entertain yourself by building a few games that you might make a couple of bucks selling *or* you could use that same money and buy a video game system to entertain yourself... then, spend *more* money buying games to play in that system... and more money on proprietary memory cards to use in the system....)
[quote name='UncleBob']I don't know about your job - but I can call in sick on occasion at my job.
However, if I had to go a length of time "calling in" because I had no transportation to work, I'd likely be terminated.
So, if my car broke down for the day, I could spend the day to get it fixed. Hell, I even have good friends that wouldn't mind giving me a ride (or, possibly, loaning me a vehicle for a few days, which actually happened once)... but I wouldn't blame anyone's generosity getting shorted if, two weeks later, they're giving me a ride to work at 6 in the morning on their day off while I play with my iPad and complain about the cost of getting my car fixed.[/QUOTE]
You're REALLY invested in this stupid scenario, aren't you?
Having a job that you live paycheck-to-paycheck on is not sustainable in the long run and won't put you in a higher economic bracket no matter how much you save. It doesn't matter if there's a car repair or a sickness or an ipad.
However, if I had to go a length of time "calling in" because I had no transportation to work, I'd likely be terminated.
So, if my car broke down for the day, I could spend the day to get it fixed. Hell, I even have good friends that wouldn't mind giving me a ride (or, possibly, loaning me a vehicle for a few days, which actually happened once)... but I wouldn't blame anyone's generosity getting shorted if, two weeks later, they're giving me a ride to work at 6 in the morning on their day off while I play with my iPad and complain about the cost of getting my car fixed.[/QUOTE]
You're REALLY invested in this stupid scenario, aren't you?
Having a job that you live paycheck-to-paycheck on is not sustainable in the long run and won't put you in a higher economic bracket no matter how much you save. It doesn't matter if there's a car repair or a sickness or an ipad.
[quote name='MSI Magus']I brought it up multiple times and even used my wife and I who live on 1 income as an example multiple times. We live on 1 income the same way if not worse as people did years and years ago....but in return we have given up kids and saddled ourselves with $50,000 in student loans and our house is hardly in what you would call the suburbs.
No suprise that those like bob carrying the conservative torch did not have much to say about this. Cause again after all black folk have cell phones and AC![/QUOTE]
I don't know what you're financial situation is, but it seems like you're living an extremely frugal lifestyle. It's good to be responsible, but you have to keep things in perspective. Paying off a mortgage in 6 years is a little extreme, isn't it? There's nothing wrong with it, but I don't think that it's a normal for a middle-class, single income household to pay off a house in 6 years. It's not normal today, and it wasn't normal 30-50 years ago.
Also, I thought that your wife was still working on her degree, and you expect her to make 50-100% more when she graduates. It's not really fair to say that you have 50k in student loan debt and can only live a lower-middle class lifestyle. Once your wife gets her first job in her field, your finances will change dramatically, right?
No suprise that those like bob carrying the conservative torch did not have much to say about this. Cause again after all black folk have cell phones and AC![/QUOTE]
I don't know what you're financial situation is, but it seems like you're living an extremely frugal lifestyle. It's good to be responsible, but you have to keep things in perspective. Paying off a mortgage in 6 years is a little extreme, isn't it? There's nothing wrong with it, but I don't think that it's a normal for a middle-class, single income household to pay off a house in 6 years. It's not normal today, and it wasn't normal 30-50 years ago.
Also, I thought that your wife was still working on her degree, and you expect her to make 50-100% more when she graduates. It's not really fair to say that you have 50k in student loan debt and can only live a lower-middle class lifestyle. Once your wife gets her first job in her field, your finances will change dramatically, right?
[quote name='dohdough']You're REALLY invested in this stupid scenario, aren't you?[/quote]
...says the guy who keeps dragging it out...
Weird... that sounds vaguely familiar...
[quote name='UncleBob']In many situations, saving your money (or, better, spending it wisely) isn't going to make a major change in your overall financial situation.[/QUOTE]
...however, it doesn't change the fact that if you're not making reasonable spending decisions with your money, you sure as heck have no right to demand that other people support you.
Are you a charitable man, dohdough?
...says the guy who keeps dragging it out...
Weird... that sounds vaguely familiar...
[quote name='UncleBob']In many situations, saving your money (or, better, spending it wisely) isn't going to make a major change in your overall financial situation.[/QUOTE]
...however, it doesn't change the fact that if you're not making reasonable spending decisions with your money, you sure as heck have no right to demand that other people support you.
Are you a charitable man, dohdough?
[quote name='dohdough']You're REALLY invested in this stupid scenario, aren't you?
Having a job that you live paycheck-to-paycheck on is not sustainable in the long run and won't put you in a higher economic bracket no matter how much you save. It doesn't matter if there's a car repair or a sickness or an ipad.[/QUOTE]
There are people at every income level that live paycheck-to-paycheck.
Having a job that you live paycheck-to-paycheck on is not sustainable in the long run and won't put you in a higher economic bracket no matter how much you save. It doesn't matter if there's a car repair or a sickness or an ipad.[/QUOTE]
There are people at every income level that live paycheck-to-paycheck.
[quote name='chiwii']I don't know what you're financial situation is, but it seems like you're living an extremely frugal lifestyle. It's good to be responsible, but you have to keep things in perspective. Paying off a mortgage in 6 years is a little extreme, isn't it? There's nothing wrong with it, but I don't think that it's a normal for a middle-class, single income household to pay off a house in 6 years. It's not normal today, and it wasn't normal 30-50 years ago.
Also, I thought that your wife was still working on her degree, and you expect her to make 50-100% more when she graduates. It's not really fair to say that you have 50k in student loan debt and can only live a lower-middle class lifestyle. Once your wife gets her first job in her field, your finances will change dramatically, right?[/QUOTE]
You are assuming the economy gets better and she finds a job that pays anywhere near that. As things stand yes we hope she finds something for $60-$100k a year and id tap dance if she did(hell id tap dance for $50 a year!). And of course that would put us outside of lower middle class. But see that is the problem with many Americans...they bank on things that never end up happening. Hopefully it works out that way and if it does we just stay buckled down for another 2-6 years and pay off all our debt....but if not we instead get hit with a crushing avalanche of debt because that job never came.
Also, I thought that your wife was still working on her degree, and you expect her to make 50-100% more when she graduates. It's not really fair to say that you have 50k in student loan debt and can only live a lower-middle class lifestyle. Once your wife gets her first job in her field, your finances will change dramatically, right?[/QUOTE]
You are assuming the economy gets better and she finds a job that pays anywhere near that. As things stand yes we hope she finds something for $60-$100k a year and id tap dance if she did(hell id tap dance for $50 a year!). And of course that would put us outside of lower middle class. But see that is the problem with many Americans...they bank on things that never end up happening. Hopefully it works out that way and if it does we just stay buckled down for another 2-6 years and pay off all our debt....but if not we instead get hit with a crushing avalanche of debt because that job never came.
[quote name='UncleBob']...says the guy who keeps dragging it out...[/quote]
I like talking down stupid. A disproportionate amount of it comes from your direction.
I like talking down stupid. A disproportionate amount of it comes from your direction.
If the system doesn't provide ample availablity of opportunity as a contributing member of it, then yes.
Of course not, I make fun of people with obvious developmental issues on the internet.
[quote name='chiwii']There are people at every income level that live paycheck-to-paycheck.[/QUOTE]
Good thing we're talking about people on the lower end of the economic ladder in which a $500 car repair bill could cripple them and not someone making $500k a year!
Good thing we're talking about people on the lower end of the economic ladder in which a $500 car repair bill could cripple them and not someone making $500k a year!
eldergamer
CAGiversary!
[quote name='willardhaven']I haven't kept up... did anyone mention the fact that most households have two primary earners now? It used to be feasible for two adults and one child to live off of one salary.[/QUOTE]
It's just been me working for the past 6-7 years now. Wife finally went back to school and then had the misfortune to get knocked up again.
But we've made it by with just my income for years. I was fortunate enough to get a college degree in a fairly well paying and stable field, though. It's strictly paycheck to paycheck. Most of the paycheck goes to the house/mortgage, which we're underwater on. But it's not breaking us.
That's really the key, you have to choose your career wisely.
It's just been me working for the past 6-7 years now. Wife finally went back to school and then had the misfortune to get knocked up again.
But we've made it by with just my income for years. I was fortunate enough to get a college degree in a fairly well paying and stable field, though. It's strictly paycheck to paycheck. Most of the paycheck goes to the house/mortgage, which we're underwater on. But it's not breaking us.
That's really the key, you have to choose your career wisely.
[quote name='dohdough']Good thing we're talking about people on the lower end of the economic ladder in which a $500 car repair bill could cripple them and not someone making $500k a year![/QUOTE]
Exactly, if you are making more then $100,000 a year as a family and living pay check to paycheck your either a moron or you have experienced some real hardship in life(like a bad disease or something).
[/QUOTE]Exactly, if you are making more then $100,000 a year as a family and living pay check to paycheck your either a moron or you have experienced some real hardship in life(like a bad disease or something).
[quote name='Msut77']http://bostonreview.tumblr.com/post/13882551328/from-the-racial-wealth-gap-increases-fourfold-a[/QUOTE]
Well and thats without home equity. If you include HE in it I imagine things will become even worse. I recall listening to an episode of I believe it was NPRs Talk of the Nation not long ago(may have been Diane Rehm)and they were talking about the late 2000's crash. The experts on the show talked about how African Americans and Latinos were hit by far the hardest for a variety of reasons, one of which was that many tied most of their finances to their homes.
Well and thats without home equity. If you include HE in it I imagine things will become even worse. I recall listening to an episode of I believe it was NPRs Talk of the Nation not long ago(may have been Diane Rehm)and they were talking about the late 2000's crash. The experts on the show talked about how African Americans and Latinos were hit by far the hardest for a variety of reasons, one of which was that many tied most of their finances to their homes.
[quote name='MSI Magus']You are assuming the economy gets better and she finds a job that pays anywhere near that. As things stand yes we hope she finds something for $60-$100k a year and id tap dance if she did(hell id tap dance for $50 a year!). And of course that would put us outside of lower middle class. But see that is the problem with many Americans...they bank on things that never end up happening. Hopefully it works out that way and if it does we just stay buckled down for another 2-6 years and pay off all our debt....but if not we instead get hit with a crushing avalanche of debt because that job never came.[/QUOTE]
You plan to pay off your house and student loan debt within 6 years of graduation? You're really anti-debt, I guess! There's nothing wrong with that, but I wouldn't put off things like having children just to pay off that debt quickly. Not all debt is bad.
I hope that your wife does find a great paying job right after graduating.
You plan to pay off your house and student loan debt within 6 years of graduation? You're really anti-debt, I guess! There's nothing wrong with that, but I wouldn't put off things like having children just to pay off that debt quickly. Not all debt is bad.
I hope that your wife does find a great paying job right after graduating.
[quote name='MSI Magus']Well and thats without home equity. If you include HE in it I imagine things will become even worse. I recall listening to an episode of I believe it was NPRs Talk of the Nation not long ago(may have been Diane Rehm)and they were talking about the late 2000's crash. The experts on the show talked about how African Americans and Latinos were hit by far the hardest for a variety of reasons, one of which was that many tied most of their finances to their homes.[/QUOTE]
And Asians.
And Asians.
[quote name='chiwii']You plan to pay off your house and student loan debt within 6 years of graduation? You're really anti-debt, I guess! There's nothing wrong with that, but I wouldn't put off things like having children just to pay off that debt quickly. Not all debt is bad.
I hope that your wife does find a great paying job right after graduating.[/QUOTE]
O I know not all debt is bad debt. We are still paying off a $3,000 hospital bill from 5 or 6 years ago and another hospital bill from a year or two ago because it doesnt hurt to take our time paying it. With our house we could have possibly paid it off faster, but we knew it would be pointless. We did the math and found the point where if we paid it off any faster we would not be saving much in interest payments and then planned our monthly from there(we paid $37ish for the house, we would owe like $65,000 with interest, taxes and what not but we shave $10,000 paying this way). We will do the same with student loans, pay off anything that has a nasty interest over time effect then do $50-$100 a month on the rest.
I hope that your wife does find a great paying job right after graduating.[/QUOTE]
O I know not all debt is bad debt. We are still paying off a $3,000 hospital bill from 5 or 6 years ago and another hospital bill from a year or two ago because it doesnt hurt to take our time paying it. With our house we could have possibly paid it off faster, but we knew it would be pointless. We did the math and found the point where if we paid it off any faster we would not be saving much in interest payments and then planned our monthly from there(we paid $37ish for the house, we would owe like $65,000 with interest, taxes and what not but we shave $10,000 paying this way). We will do the same with student loans, pay off anything that has a nasty interest over time effect then do $50-$100 a month on the rest.
[quote name='UncleBob']Oh, The System exists, all right ...and it's made up of people ...and they're all out to get you.[/QUOTE]
Yeah...let's just eliminate any and every social safety net we have just so we can prove that conservatism works and how BIG GOVERNMENT is holding THE PEOPLE back. Obviously people should've planned ahead or else they wouldn't beed over ever.
Yeah...let's just eliminate any and every social safety net we have just so we can prove that conservatism works and how BIG GOVERNMENT is holding THE PEOPLE back. Obviously people should've planned ahead or else they wouldn't be
ed over ever.[quote name='dohdough']Yeah...let's just eliminate any and every social safety net we have just so we can prove that conservatism works and how BIG GOVERNMENT is holding THE PEOPLE back.[/quote]
Never said anything like that.
When you're getting ****** over, it never hurts to have some lube on hand to make the process less painful.
Geesh - what is it with you people always trying to turn our discussions into references to sexual behavior? Is your life missing something?
Never said anything like that.
Obviously people should've planned ahead or else they wouldn't be
When you're getting ****** over, it never hurts to have some lube on hand to make the process less painful.
Geesh - what is it with you people always trying to turn our discussions into references to sexual behavior? Is your life missing something?
[quote name='UncleBob']Never said anything like that.[/quote]
Oh really? Is that comment somehow incongruent with your tiresome mantra of "personal responsibility" you've been constantly vomiting on this forum for the entire day?
[quote name='MSI Magus']*has an image of the crazy guy from Dohdoughs avatar sitting and arguing with a scarecrow with a voicebox*[/QUOTE]
I hope you're enjoying the show. Everytime I quote him, I know it bypasses your ignore filter...HA!
Oh really? Is that comment somehow incongruent with your tiresome mantra of "personal responsibility" you've been constantly vomiting on this forum for the entire day?
I'm not the one making a big deal out of it.
[quote name='MSI Magus']*has an image of the crazy guy from Dohdoughs avatar sitting and arguing with a scarecrow with a voicebox*[/QUOTE]
I hope you're enjoying the show. Everytime I quote him, I know it bypasses your ignore filter...HA!
[quote name='dohdough']Oh really? Is that comment somehow incongruent with your tiresome mantra of "personal responsibility" you've been constantly vomiting on this forum for the entire day?[/quote]
Again, it goes back to what I said earlier - if you're not making every reasonable effort to better yourself, you have no right to demand that others do it for you. The waggoner at least asked for help...
Again, it goes back to what I said earlier - if you're not making every reasonable effort to better yourself, you have no right to demand that others do it for you. The waggoner at least asked for help...
[quote name='UncleBob']Again, it goes back to what I said earlier - if you're not making every reasonable effort to better yourself, you have no right to demand that others do it for you. The waggoner at least asked for help...[/QUOTE]
How the did you get through statistics and what makes you an authority on what's "reasonable" when you can't even acknowledge systemic problems.
How the
did you get through statistics and what makes you an authority on what's "reasonable" when you can't even acknowledge systemic problems.[quote name='dohdough']How the did you get through statistics and what makes you an authority on what's "reasonable" when you can't even acknowledge systemic problems.[/QUOTE]
reasonable [ree-zuh-nuh-buhl, reez-nuh-]
adjective
1. agreeable to reason or sound judgment; logical: a reasonable choice for chairman.
2. not exceeding the limit prescribed by reason; not excessive: reasonable terms.
3. moderate, especially in price; not expensive: The coat was reasonable but not cheap.
4. endowed with reason.
5. capable of rational behavior, decision, etc.
6. not spending your last $500 on an electronic toy.
Origin:
1250–1300; Middle English resonable < Middle French raisonnable < Latin ratiōnābilis. See reason, -able
did you get through statistics and what makes you an authority on what's "reasonable" when you can't even acknowledge systemic problems.[/QUOTE]reasonable [ree-zuh-nuh-buhl, reez-nuh-]
adjective
1. agreeable to reason or sound judgment; logical: a reasonable choice for chairman.
2. not exceeding the limit prescribed by reason; not excessive: reasonable terms.
3. moderate, especially in price; not expensive: The coat was reasonable but not cheap.
4. endowed with reason.
5. capable of rational behavior, decision, etc.
6. not spending your last $500 on an electronic toy.
Origin:
1250–1300; Middle English resonable < Middle French raisonnable < Latin ratiōnābilis. See reason, -able
[quote name='UncleBob']reasonable [ree-zuh-nuh-buhl, reez-nuh-]
adjective
1. agreeable to reason or sound judgment; logical: a reasonable choice for chairman.
2. not exceeding the limit prescribed by reason; not excessive: reasonable terms.
3. moderate, especially in price; not expensive: The coat was reasonable but not cheap.
4. endowed with reason.
5. capable of rational behavior, decision, etc.
6. not spending your last $500 on an electronic toy.
Origin:
1250–1300; Middle English resonable < Middle French raisonnable < Latin ratiōnābilis. See reason, -able[/QUOTE]
Back to the dictionary huh? We already went over that months ago. Either way, that still doesn't address systemic problems, your lack of authority to define reasonable efforts, and your reversion to child-like argumentative strategies. Just look at your pathetic posts...you can't even justify your own bullshit ideology, so you have to break out a dictionary to hide behind your paper-thin arguments.
Oh hey! I just dropped $1k last week on stuff I didn't need! Does that make me doubly unreasonable?
adjective
1. agreeable to reason or sound judgment; logical: a reasonable choice for chairman.
2. not exceeding the limit prescribed by reason; not excessive: reasonable terms.
3. moderate, especially in price; not expensive: The coat was reasonable but not cheap.
4. endowed with reason.
5. capable of rational behavior, decision, etc.
6. not spending your last $500 on an electronic toy.
Origin:
1250–1300; Middle English resonable < Middle French raisonnable < Latin ratiōnābilis. See reason, -able[/QUOTE]
Back to the dictionary huh? We already went over that months ago. Either way, that still doesn't address systemic problems, your lack of authority to define reasonable efforts, and your reversion to child-like argumentative strategies. Just look at your pathetic posts...you can't even justify your own bullshit ideology, so you have to break out a dictionary to hide behind your paper-thin arguments.
Oh hey! I just dropped $1k last week on stuff I didn't need! Does that make me doubly unreasonable?
[quote name='Msut77']http://youtu.be/akVL7QY0S8A[/QUOTE]
Elizabeth Warren? Aint she that lesbian socialist running for congress? Pfff what does she know.
Elizabeth Warren? Aint she that lesbian socialist running for congress? Pfff what does she know.
Was it your last $1,000?
You are seriously trying to argue that the system is stacked against you, therefore you have absolutely no responsibility to make any effort whatsoever towards making yourself better.
There's really no use in trying to to have a reasonable discussion with someone who has that mindset.
You are seriously trying to argue that the system is stacked against you, therefore you have absolutely no responsibility to make any effort whatsoever towards making yourself better.
There's really no use in trying to to have a reasonable discussion with someone who has that mindset.
[quote name='Msut77']I am kind of interested in seeing if one of the resident clown shoes will even try to debunk even one bit of it.[/QUOTE]
No. Because I am watching it now and its full of charts and facts. People like bob run from those kind of things so they can argue over things no one can prove right or wrong. Its better to argue with some random guy online about what it used to cost to buy things then to try and debunk a professor saying here is over 100 years worth of data proving everything you believe is flat out wrong.
No. Because I am watching it now and its full of charts and facts. People like bob run from those kind of things so they can argue over things no one can prove right or wrong. Its better to argue with some random guy online about what it used to cost to buy things then to try and debunk a professor saying here is over 100 years worth of data proving everything you believe is flat out wrong.
[quote name='chiwii']Magus - based on the way you handle your finances, I'm surprised that you don't at least respect Bob's stance on the importance of personal responsibilty.[/QUOTE]
Yes, we are all not boostrappy enough in the shittiest economy in a lifetime.
Yes, we are all not boostrappy enough in the shittiest economy in a lifetime.
[quote name='MSI Magus']No. Because I am watching it now and its full of charts and facts. People like bob run from those kind of things so they can argue over things no one can prove right or wrong. Its better to argue with some random guy online about what it used to cost to buy things then to try and debunk a professor saying here is over 100 years worth of data proving everything you believe is flat out wrong.[/QUOTE]
Isn't it glorious?
It is so different from the faux-philosphical blathering and chewies BS about bootstraps.
Isn't it glorious?
It is so different from the faux-philosphical blathering and chewies BS about bootstraps.
[quote name='chiwii']Magus - based on the way you handle your finances, I'm surprised that you don't at least respect Bob's stance on the importance of personal responsibilty.[/QUOTE]
I respect the important of personal responsibility. As I said earlier I think its a big fault of liberals that they sit and say that Americans have no part what so ever in why they are the bottom. However I have a huge amount of disdain for anyone that chooses to ignore facts and place the majority of the blame where it does not belong.
Bob is one of those people that just rails and rails and rails against irresponsibility pretending like if its not our only problem that its the majority of the problem. Bob is the type of guy that loves to say its the goverment but then cant accept that the goverment is currently controlled by the top 1%. He is the type of guy that can only see a small small sliver of the pie but somehow manages to whole heatedly believe he sees the big picture.
I respect the important of personal responsibility. As I said earlier I think its a big fault of liberals that they sit and say that Americans have no part what so ever in why they are the bottom. However I have a huge amount of disdain for anyone that chooses to ignore facts and place the majority of the blame where it does not belong.
Bob is one of those people that just rails and rails and rails against irresponsibility pretending like if its not our only problem that its the majority of the problem. Bob is the type of guy that loves to say its the goverment but then cant accept that the goverment is currently controlled by the top 1%. He is the type of guy that can only see a small small sliver of the pie but somehow manages to whole heatedly believe he sees the big picture.
[quote name='MSI Magus']Bob is the type of guy that loves to say its the goverment but then cant accept that the goverment is currently controlled by the top 1%.[/QUOTE]
... put into power by the voting part of the community that makes up the 99%...
And with all due respect to Mrs. Warren - I'm reluctant to take someone who willing handed out billions of taxpayer dollars (most of it to the ever-so-loved top 1%) at face value.
Unlike some folks around here, I don't suddenly forget the bank bailouts simply because the person involved has a (D) behind their name.
... put into power by the voting part of the community that makes up the 99%...
And with all due respect to Mrs. Warren - I'm reluctant to take someone who willing handed out billions of taxpayer dollars (most of it to the ever-so-loved top 1%) at face value.
Unlike some folks around here, I don't suddenly forget the bank bailouts simply because the person involved has a (D) behind their name.
cochesecochese
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[quote name='MSI Magus']Bob is one of those people that just rails and rails and rails against irresponsibility pretending like if its not our only problem that its the majority of the problem. Bob is the type of guy that loves to say its the goverment but then cant accept that the goverment is currently controlled by the top 1%. He is the type of guy that can only see a small small sliver of the pie but somehow manages to whole heatedly believe he sees the big picture.[/QUOTE]
Yeap.
Yeap.
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[quote name='UncleBob']... put into power by the voting part of the community that makes up the 99%...[/QUOTE]
UB is the classic Walmart flunkie who is brainwashed into voting for those who will always keep him down. The only twist here is that UB also happens to be a dilettante.
Eldergamer is more your garden variety idiot and all-around ignoramus.
UB is the classic Walmart flunkie who is brainwashed into voting for those who will always keep him down. The only twist here is that UB also happens to be a dilettante.
Eldergamer is more your garden variety idiot and all-around ignoramus.
bread's done