Xbox One on the way. DRM removed, more details to come.

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If I had a nickel for every asinine thing Timbo said in this thread, I could afford to buy both consoles at launch ;)

Anyway, the more I read about this Kinect stuff the less I like it. It didnt work well on 360 and I dont have confidence in Microsoft learning from their mistakes and making it much more than a glorified add-on to the X1.
i used the new kinect 2.0 at e3 and it is alot better then kinect 1.0 it can be used in really small areas. with that said do i want a kinect no and which is why im not buying a x1 till a price drop.

 
well if you don't want to support game companys fine but i for one don't buy many used games because i want to support the people that makes my games
The hypocrisy of this comment makes me laugh. By the way why don't people just ignore Timbo, that's apparently his strategy when he's called out for half the stuff he's full of crap on.
last used games i got was like five rock band games at least over a year ago. i don't even support gamestop i buy all my games from amazon
But you HAVE bought a used game. And since you lie about so much stuff I'm sure those purchases from amazon are marketplace used games.
i only buy like 4-5 games a year(unless i get cheap old new games) rest of the games i want to play i rent from gamefly so i have no need to buy used games.

 
i used the new kinect 2.0 at e3 and it is alot better then kinect 1.0 it can be used in really small areas. with that said do i want a kinect no and which is why im not buying a x1 till a price drop.
A lot of the E3 videos expose that there is still a pretty heavy lag issue. People have also said the heart rate monitor is a gimmick. So sounds like it will be good for dance and fitness games, basically all it's good for now.

 
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i used the new kinect 2.0 at e3 and it is alot better then kinect 1.0 it can be used in really small areas. with that said do i want a kinect no and which is why im not buying a x1 till a price drop.
A lot of the E3 videos expose that there is still a pretty heavy lag issue. They also said the heart rate monitor is a gimmick. Basically sounds like it will be good for dance and fitness games, basically all it's good for now.
i only use my kinect for stuff like netflixs and other video apps. Only time my kinect is used for games is when i have party or my 8 year old son wants to play party games.

 
why don't you put me on ignore if you don't like what i say you just advised others to do that
That's what I did, Best Advice ever!

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Also, there is a Timbo Jr?!

 
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well if you don't want to support game companys fine but i for one don't buy many used games because i want to support the people that makes my games
The hypocrisy of this comment makes me laugh. By the way why don't people just ignore Timbo, that's apparently his strategy when he's called out for half the stuff he's full of crap on.
last used games i got was like five rock band games at least over a year ago. i don't even support gamestop i buy all my games from amazon
But you HAVE bought a used game. And since you lie about so much stuff I'm sure those purchases from amazon are marketplace used games.
i only buy like 4-5 games a year(unless i get cheap old new games) rest of the games i want to play i rent from gamefly so i have no need to buy used games.
Are those 4-5 games you buy counting your return frauds or no?

 
w/e i really don't see no need to have a convo here with people anymore everything i say is bashed left and right lets just change this thread name to bash xbox 1/timbo.

 
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i only buy like 4-5 games a year(unless i get cheap old new games) rest of the games i want to play i rent from gamefly so i have no need to buy used games.
Are those 4-5 games you buy counting your return frauds or no?
Oh yes, I believe you caught him in another lie. How is he the messiah of game returns when he buys all his games from Amazon? hrmm

w/e i really don't see no need to have a convo here with people anymore everything i say is bashed left and right lets just change this thread name to bash xbox 1/timbo.
And since that happens to no other users maybe one should reflect on their actions and figure out why it is that everyone is bashing oneself left and right.

 
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i never said i do it all the time lol i just said that i have returned games open in the past and was able to do it then people put things in my mouth saying i do it all the time. most of the time the only games i buy from non amazon is great deals i find. saving tax on amazon is great when you buy new games for 60 bucks no tax saves me close to six bucks

 
i never said i do it all the time lol i just said that i have returned games open in the past and was able to do it then people put things in my mouth saying i do it all the time. most of the time the only games i buy from non amazon is great deals i find. saving tax on amazon is great when you buy new games for 60 bucks no tax saves me close to six bucks
Nevermind. He went through your posts lol

 
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i get refunds on open games from bestbuy,target,walmart all the time
i never said i do it all the time lol i just said that i have returned games open in the past and was able to do it then people put things in my mouth saying i do it all the time. most of the time the only games i buy from non amazon is great deals i find. saving tax on amazon is great when you buy new games for 60 bucks no tax saves me close to six bucks
HAHAHA see this is the very reason you don't want PRISM and other data mining projects to keep all your data from your past, cause you never know when it will be dug up and used to prove you are a flat out liar.

 
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This thread is becoming a train wreck... Anyway, moving on from the other issues:

Trade in values have been plummeting and I don't really understand why people think trading in 5 games for $75-100 credit (if you are lucky) is a good deal when you paid $300+ out of pocket for them.

Where I find value is like the NewEgg sale yesterday Max Payne 3 for $10 or the Black Friday sales or a decent Gold Box sale. Not in the used game market.
But you see, who's to say you didn't originally get those games for Newegg $10 or less prices, and then, when you were done with them, traded them to GS (or sold them or whatever)? To me, that is the way to maximize being a CAG. Hell, if you do it right, you can actually make some money back in the process - imagine that! Just look at your example above - in general, I'd be thrilled with $75-$100 trade-in credit for 5 games. Why? Precisely because I did not pay $300+ for them. That is in general terms of course. There are other times when I do buy $60 games (using my trade-in credit of course - never, ever cash) and then either I hold on to them a long time and they are worth much less so getting $10 for them is all you can get. Or other times I try to sell them right away (dmaul's method) to recoup most of the initial cost.

Also not sure what you mean by "trade in values have been plummeting". Yeah, sure, on Amazon they have. But they are pretty much the same as they've ever been at GS and with their frequent promos you just have to pick and choose what to trade in when.

I'm about to take my 5th or 6th set of 7 games in for their extra $35 promo. I've been averaging about $10 per game with that, which is pretty good for stuff that is otherwise simply taking up space.

In any case, it looks like we'll still be able to do that with X1 games, so I'm still not sure why Gamestop and used games are brought up at all in this thread to defend the DRM policies. It remains to be seen if X1 games get less value at GS because of the lack of competition from users selling their own games. If they don't plummet from that, we can probably thank the PS4's more open market for that (trade-in values and sales prices of used games will need to be pretty equivalent for PS4 vs. X1 at Gamestop). But I think it will be interesting to see how that all plays out.

Once again I'll stress that the way to take care of used games and the secondary market in general is to provide incentives to purchase digital versions. Microsoft could be on to something with the 10-person gamesharing. Sony is already on to something with PS+ and its freebies and sales (I just bought PSASBR digitally for $14). We'll see how that all plays out over the next year or two as well. I just prefer Sony's method because it doesn't also preclude allowing me to do whatever the hell I want with the discs I buy.

 
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Yeah, its all about maximizing your value.  I dont buy a lot of games and RARELY at the $60 price point.  Only games I did that on last year were ME3 and Halo 4 (which I got a $25 giftcard and a preorder skin I sold for 1600 MSP).  Otherwise I always wait for $20-$30 price range on games.

 
Trade in values have been plummeting and I don't really understand why people think trading in 5 games for $75-100 credit (if you are lucky) is a good deal when you paid $300+ out of pocket for them.

Where I find value is like the NewEgg sale yesterday Max Payne 3 for $10 or the Black Friday sales or a decent Gold Box sale. Not in the used game market.
I don't know where you're coming up with trade in values are plummeting. Your comment assumes everyone buys games at full retail before trading them in. More times than I can count I have bought new or used games on websites and traded them in weeks later for more than I payed for them, a few times I even doubled my money.

 
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well if you don't want to support game companys fine but i for one don't buy many used games because i want to support the people that makes my games

i only buy like 4-5 games a year(unless i get cheap old new games) rest of the games i want to play i rent from gamefly so i have no need to buy used games.
Does. Not. Compute.

 
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Ya i don't think he he realized the hypocrisy of that comment compared to all the other things he's posted.  Won't even be possible on the XBone (at least at launch) and he's getting games while no money is going to the game makers which is the exact opposite of what he keeps saying he supports.

 
i only buy like 4-5 games a year(unless i get cheap old new games) rest of the games i want to play i rent from gamefly so i have no need to buy used games.
Your prior posts crusading against buying used games (from Gamestop) and instead buying them new so you can "support developers and publishers is full of hypocrisy...

1. You admit buying new games, opening them, playing them and then returning them - a practice largely not permitted at retailers.

2. You rent certain games rather than buying them.

3. You do buy used games (from Amazon), just not from Gamestop

4. You have no problem waiting for games to fall in price rather than pay full price on release (which I don't take issue with since we are all CAGs, but I merely point it out since you are the one arguing that the devs and pubs are losing revenue when people buy a used game for $50 instead of a new game for $60; it's the same scenario, people wanting to save money and pay less whether its used right away or marked down months later.)

By your own logic, you are no better than the people you've been railing against for buying used games at Gamestop because used sales don't support the developers and publishers. It sounds to me that you simply don't like Gamestop, and that is all fine, but don't use that to make some argument in support of Microsoft's DRM on the XBone.

 
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but people have no problems in have a cam built into their labtop which is always powered when you use your labtop and alot of people have a cam on thier desktop.
Who says people don't have a problem with this? Just because it hasn't been a mainstream headline in your world doesn't mean the issue doesn't exist.
why don't you put me on ignore if you don't like what i say you just advised others to do that
Since even Timbo thinks it's a good idea to ignore him, I finally did. Over half the people I've ignored have been banned from the site, so I guess I'm doing a public service.

 
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Trade in values have been plummeting and I don't really understand why people think trading in 5 games for $75-100 credit (if you are lucky) is a good deal when you paid $300+ out of pocket for them.

Where I find value is like the NewEgg sale yesterday Max Payne 3 for $10 or the Black Friday sales or a decent Gold Box sale. Not in the used game market.
I don't know where you're coming up with trade in values are plummeting. Your comment assumes everyone buys games at full retail before trading them in. More times than I can count I have bought new or used games on websites and traded them in weeks later for more than I payed for them, a few times I even doubled my money.
They are not plummeting. If anything they are going up. There's a reason why Gamestop is having all these trade in specials, inventory is low. Two Gamestop managers that I have spoken to have told me this.

 
They are not plummeting. If anything they are going up. There's a reason why Gamestop is having all these trade in specials, inventory is low. Two Gamestop managers that I have spoken to have told me this.
Probably not for long, not with all the people on reddit claiming they are dumping their 360 and all their library to trade in for PS4s.

 
They are not plummeting. If anything they are going up. There's a reason why Gamestop is having all these trade in specials, inventory is low. Two Gamestop managers that I have spoken to have told me this.
Probably not for long, not with all the people on reddit claiming they are dumping their 360 and all their library to trade in for PS4s.
The old games plummet but your example was clearly recent games. Obviously if someone is dumping all their 360 games now then they won't be trading in any recent 360 games in the future.

Additionally that is an excellent example of the used market helping the new market: people sell their 360 and games and spend the money they make on a PS4 and games.

 
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So my internet is being kind of spotty right now.

I wanted to play that dumb Karaoke app to get some avatar awards from raptr but since my xbox can't connect I can't play the game...at all.

I just had a vision of the future and it is not good

 
It's $10 extra in your pocket. That makes a huge difference to some people.
oh come on seriously all of a sudden gamers turned into the sisters of the poor worried about their fellow man? come on give me a break

They definitely did say online pass only. I as well as others have corrected you on this before yet you continue to repeat it. Sony is allowing online passes not any kind of pass for single player.
Trettons comment were what started the confusion. It was later cleared up.

http://www.gamefront.com/sony-third-party-drm-refers-to-playing-used-games-online-only/
So we now know the worst thing that a third party can do on PS4 is online pass. Thanks for the article.
actually what Sony continues to say is the and has been cleared up in recent articles is that PS4 1st party games will not use online passes but that 3rd party games will not be restricted on their DRM so they can use online passes or what ever they want but as said in this article publishers are moving away from online passes so do people really think EA is going to bring back online passes right after doing away with them and only for PS4?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-06-11-the-big-interview-sonys-jim-ryan-on-ps4-drm-and-the-next-gen-console-war

 
So my internet is being kind of spotty right now.

I wanted to play that dumb Karaoke app to get some avatar awards from raptr but since my xbox can't connect I can't play the game...at all.

I just had a vision of the future and it is not good
Unless your internet is spotty 24 hours from its last connection, I think your perfectly fine.

Remember, it it's low powered state, its 24 hours *exactly from the time you lose internet*. Not 24 hours at a random time at night.

 
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They definitely did say online pass only. I as well as others have corrected you on this before yet you continue to repeat it. Sony is allowing online passes not any kind of pass for single player.
Trettons comment were what started the confusion. It was later cleared up.

http://www.gamefront.com/sony-third-party-drm-refers-to-playing-used-games-online-only/
So we now know the worst thing that a third party can do on PS4 is online pass. Thanks for the article.
actually what Sony continues to say is the and has been cleared up in recent articles is that PS4 1st party games will not use online passes but that 3rd party games will not be restricted on their DRM so they can use online passes or what ever they want but as said in this article publishers are moving away from online passes so do people really think EA is going to bring back online passes right after doing away with them and only for PS4?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-06-11-the-big-interview-sonys-jim-ryan-on-ps4-drm-and-the-next-gen-console-war
False. This has been cleared up and third parties can ONLY do online DRM.

Tretton: "Any game that is made for PS4 that is physical goods, whether first-party or third-party, can go into a PS4 and play regardless of where it came from. The first player will play it, no problem, the second player will play it, no problem. What I was referring to was the online proposition. (This example was later given to me by a Sony spokesman: If you buy a used disc from GameStop, you’ll have no problem popping that disc in and playing it from your PlayStation 4. The issue may arise when you try to jump online and play with other players. At that point, a third-party publisher may impose a fee or not allow that.) The easiest way to explain it is — if you understand how it works on PlayStation 3, then that’s the same way it will work on PlayStation 4. No changes there. We’ve been out for six and a half years. It’s the same experience.
http://allthingsd.com/20130611/five-questions-about-the-ps4-for-sonys-jack-tretton/

 
actually what Sony continues to say is the and has been cleared up in recent articles is that PS4 1st party games will not use online passes but that 3rd party games will not be restricted on their DRM so they can use online passes or what ever they want but as said in this article publishers are moving away from online passes so do people really think EA is going to bring back online passes right after doing away with them and only for PS4?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-06-11-the-big-interview-sonys-jim-ryan-on-ps4-drm-and-the-next-gen-console-war
EA says Online Passes weren't worth the PR damage

Basically EA is done with online passes and it had nothing to do with Microsofts implemented DRM. EA announced the end of online passes then a week later Microsoft announced their DRM policies and people assumed they were related. With that said they could also be riding the Sony no DRM positive PR. But some of the other articles I've seen it looks like the new CEO really does want to fix EAs image so...

 
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This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.

From the X1 preorder thread

traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)



I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?


Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...
 
This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.

From the X1 preorder thread

traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)
I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?


Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...
Regardless of how much money he might have lost, without the used market he'd have $693 less. Clearly he isn't interested in playing those games anymore, so having $693 is much better than having those games.

 
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This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.

From the X1 preorder thread
traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)


I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?


Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...

Regardless of how much money he might have lost, without the used market he'd have $693 less. Clearly he isn't interested in playing those games anymore, so having $693 is much better than having those games.

Once again I don't understand the logic. He spent $2,250+ on games if bought at an average of $30, and let's be honest it's probably higher, and it is considered a great deal to get $690?

For those of us that don't have gynormus backlogs the used game thing is a non issue. And the fact that more than likely most of our main retailers will be preferred retailers where you more than likely will be able to trade.

Don't understand why this is such a big deal. But I guess it is to some people.
 
I imagine those 75 games were acquired over the last several years.  It also might not be a ginormous backlog, but a stack of completed games.  You can't preorder on eBay or craigslist, and preorders are also a limited time thing so going to GameStop was likely the best choice if he wanted to ensure he got a launch console.  But that's exactly the thing, it was a choice.  I'm sure he could've gotten double the ROI had he sold on eBay or craigslist, but he may not have gotten the money fast enough to ensure a launch console. 

With the Xbox One's used game policy, you lose this choice.  If a new console is coming out and you've got 75 games that you've acquired, you're only option will be a "participating retailer" where are you are almost certain to get less credit than he got since everyone has to trade games in to the same places so the supply will be higher.  Also you will likely be paying way more than $30 per game average since you can't find deals on eBay or craigslist and have to pay new price or whatever "participating retailers" want to charge for used.

So even if his ROI here was only 31%, I imagine it will be much closer to 10-15% on Xbox One.  With the lower ROI, fewer people will be able to purchase new games, but I guess that's what the family plan is for.

 
This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.

From the X1 preorder thread

traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)
I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?


Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...
Regardless of how much money he might have lost, without the used market he'd have $693 less. Clearly he isn't interested in playing those games anymore, so having $693 is much better than having those games.
Once again I don't understand the logic. He spent $2,250+ on games if bought at an average of $30, and let's be honest it's probably higher, and it is considered a great deal to get $690?

For those of us that don't have gynormus backlogs the used game thing is a non issue. And the fact that more than likely most of our main retailers will be preferred retailers where you more than likely will be able to trade.

Don't understand why this is such a big deal. But I guess it is to some people.
The price paid is irrelevant, it's a sunk cost. He has already paid that amount (whatever it may be) and he can't get it back. With the used game market, he can get $690 for stuff he no longer wants. Without the used game market he can't get anything for stuff he no longer wants. Would you rather have $690 or $0?

Additionally, you just pulled the $30 average out of nowhere. My average price per game is close to $10.

 
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This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.

From the X1 preorder thread

traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)
I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?


Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...
Regardless of how much money he might have lost, without the used market he'd have $693 less. Clearly he isn't interested in playing those games anymore, so having $693 is much better than having those games.
Once again I don't understand the logic. He spent $2,250+ on games if bought at an average of $30, and let's be honest it's probably higher, and it is considered a great deal to get $690?

For those of us that don't have gynormus backlogs the used game thing is a non issue. And the fact that more than likely most of our main retailers will be preferred retailers where you more than likely will be able to trade.

Don't understand why this is such a big deal. But I guess it is to some people.
How can you not understand the logic? The price paid makes no difference. They're commodities and they've lost value. Not everyone is a hoarder and wants boxes full of shit in their house that they will never again use. If someone can sell it and get some money back then that's a lot better than throwing it all in the garbage.
 
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This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.
From the X1 preorder thread

traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)
I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?
Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...
Regardless of how much money he might have lost, without the used market he'd have $693 less. Clearly he isn't interested in playing those games anymore, so having $693 is much better than having those games.
Once again I don't understand the logic. He spent $2,250+ on games if bought at an average of $30, and let's be honest it's probably higher, and it is considered a great deal to get $690?
For those of us that don't have gynormus backlogs the used game thing is a non issue. And the fact that more than likely most of our main retailers will be preferred retailers where you more than likely will be able to trade.
Don't understand why this is such a big deal. But I guess it is to some people.
The price paid is irrelevant, it's a sunk cost. He has already paid that amount (whatever it may be) and he can't get it back. With the used game market, he can get $690 for stuff he no longer wants. Without the used game market he can't get anything for stuff he no longer wants. Would you rather have $690 or $0?

Additionally, you just pulled the $30 average out of nowhere. My average price per game is close to $10.
Is this really going to be a problem? I am pretty sure you can trade X1 games into GameStop still.
 
This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.

From the X1 preorder thread

traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)
I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?


Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...
Regardless of how much money he might have lost, without the used market he'd have $693 less. Clearly he isn't interested in playing those games anymore, so having $693 is much better than having those games.
Once again I don't understand the logic. He spent $2,250+ on games if bought at an average of $30, and let's be honest it's probably higher, and it is considered a great deal to get $690?

For those of us that don't have gynormus backlogs the used game thing is a non issue. And the fact that more than likely most of our main retailers will be preferred retailers where you more than likely will be able to trade.

Don't understand why this is such a big deal. But I guess it is to some people.
How can you not understand the logic? The price paid makes no difference. They're commodities and they've lost value. Not everyone is a hoarder and wants boxes full of shit in their house that they will never again use. If someone can sell it and get some money back then that's a lot better than throwing it all in the garbage.
Not only that but with DRM someone can't be a collector either. As soon as the Xbox One loses support, the games stop working.

 
This is what is wrong with the used game system. And you can try and defend it all you want and because there are mostly X1 and Timbo haters in here I will probably get troll slammed but nowhere does a trade in system like this make sense to me. But that's my opinion. No way this guy came out ahead in this trade.

From the X1 preorder thread

traded 75 xbox 360 games into gamestop,got $693.00 store credit, pre-ordered xbox one and paid it off with 2 games! :)
I just don't trade or flip much. What's the need for a huge backlog?


Even at an average of $30 a game it's only a 31% ROI...
I would say it depends on the person trading in games. Let's say they buy games at $60 each, but only get $10-$20 back (sometimes higher, sometimes lower depending on how new the game is). To some people, they have a mindset that the new game they played only cost them $40-$50 after trade in. To some, that's a great deal for a new game. To others, especially on CAG, not too much. So it really depends on the individual.

I think another point is simply convenience. Some people don't want the hassle of going through eBay or taking a chance with Craigslist when Gamestop is faster. Not the best value, but it's much easier, faster, and less risk.

And as others have pointed out, without that used game market, that person wouldn't even have $690 to put towards a new system.

All a matter of that person's perspective.

 
That's like asking why people take lump sum payments. Sometimes you want/need that money in the more immediate future and a bigger amount over a longer period of time (i.e. throwing them up on Ebay/Craiglist/Amazon and that's if anyone buys them in the first place) won't do you much good anyways. Would you rather take $700 now or get say double that but it took weeks if not months and was in small amounts? I'll take the $700.

 
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Additionally, you just pulled the $30 average out of nowhere. My average price per game is close to $10.
This^^ I build up huge backlogs at Christmas time and play them through the year. My average price is around $10-$12. Yesterday, I traded in 15 games at GS for an $11 average. It's not a losing proposition at all. I don't believe I'll be able to duplicate this with XB1, but that remains to be seen. Not convinced one way or the other.

 
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Regardless of how much money he might have lost, without the used market he'd have $693 less. Clearly he isn't interested in playing those games anymore, so having $693 is much better than having those games.
Once again I don't understand the logic. He spent $2,250+ on games if bought at an average of $30, and let's be honest it's probably higher, and it is considered a great deal to get $690?
For those of us that don't have gynormus backlogs the used game thing is a non issue. And the fact that more than likely most of our main retailers will be preferred retailers where you more than likely will be able to trade.
Don't understand why this is such a big deal. But I guess it is to some people.
The price paid is irrelevant, it's a sunk cost. He has already paid that amount (whatever it may be) and he can't get it back. With the used game market, he can get $690 for stuff he no longer wants. Without the used game market he can't get anything for stuff he no longer wants. Would you rather have $690 or $0?

Additionally, you just pulled the $30 average out of nowhere. My average price per game is close to $10.
Is this really going to be a problem? I am pretty sure you can trade X1 games into GameStop still.
Yes. My cost per game is also around the $10 mark, mostly from pawn shops or Target clearance, though I pay more if it's a harder to find title or something I can't wait to play (Dead Island Riptide, Bioshock Infinite, and Soul Hackers were my last few preorders). But I can't buy games from a pawn for the X1, I have to either buy new at retail (ie pay $60, since there will be no motivation to lower prices anywhere near as quickly as they do now), or buy used at GS since that will be the only local participating retailer. Now if I want to fund those games with trade-ins I'll be getting peanuts because they'll have a ton of stock and without Ebay/Craigslist/etc to compete with they won't have to offer even remotely competitive trade values. So between raising my average game price and likely-to-plummet trade values on the Xbone I'm buying a lot less games, both new and used.

Plus, you're all looking at games as purely an investment. They're for entertainment. If I buy a game and end up "losing" $20 when I later get rid of it if I do, then that $20 paid for the experience.

 
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