Official 2011-2012 NBA Season thread
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[quote name='Feeding the Abscess']Speaking of coaches who didn't adjust their offense...
With all of those athletic wings, Portland should have been running like the Suns of 2005. As an upside to the deal, Batum will be featured even more than he has been in the last month, and he'll shine.
On Melo:
For his career, his points produced per 100 possessions is 107. League average during that time? 107.
Top 10!
Losing Nene will suck for Denver, but Faried will be a decent replacement. Not as big, but will grab boards, shoot a high percentage, not turn the ball over, and gets steals and blocks.[/QUOTE]
ORtg is a pointless stat for high volume shooters. AI's career ORtg is only 105. Kobe's ORtg this year is only 105 (although his career avg is 112). Look Melo has sucked this year and has never been an efficient scorer. What he has been, in the past and hopefully will be again, is a pure scorer. Many people forget the great scoring SF of the 80s. You can win in the NBA by having a dominant scorer.
With all of those athletic wings, Portland should have been running like the Suns of 2005. As an upside to the deal, Batum will be featured even more than he has been in the last month, and he'll shine.
On Melo:
For his career, his points produced per 100 possessions is 107. League average during that time? 107.
Top 10!
Losing Nene will suck for Denver, but Faried will be a decent replacement. Not as big, but will grab boards, shoot a high percentage, not turn the ball over, and gets steals and blocks.[/QUOTE]
ORtg is a pointless stat for high volume shooters. AI's career ORtg is only 105. Kobe's ORtg this year is only 105 (although his career avg is 112). Look Melo has sucked this year and has never been an efficient scorer. What he has been, in the past and hopefully will be again, is a pure scorer. Many people forget the great scoring SF of the 80s. You can win in the NBA by having a dominant scorer.
Feeding the Abscess
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[quote name='Soodmeg']Greg Oden was waived today.[/QUOTE]
Miami should sign him for league minimum and see if he ever recovers. Or Phoenix, their medical staff has kept Grant Hill and Steve Nash back together and healthy.
Miami should sign him for league minimum and see if he ever recovers. Or Phoenix, their medical staff has kept Grant Hill and Steve Nash back together and healthy.
Feeding the Abscess
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[quote name='kill3r7']ORtg is a pointless stat for high volume shooters. AI's career ORtg is only 105. Kobe's ORtg this year is only 105 (although his career avg is 112). Look Melo has sucked this year and has never been an efficient scorer. What he has been, in the past and hopefully will be again, is a pure scorer. Many people forget the great scoring SF of the 80s. You can win in the NBA by having a dominant scorer.[/QUOTE]
It's not pointless for high volume shooters. LeBron's ORtg is 121 this year, Dirk has regularly been in the mid to high 110s. Look at Wade, Durant, Rose, Love, Aldridge, Lou Williams. Much better ORtg, similar usage rate. Using AI and Kobe as comparisons is making my point; the Lakers would be better with Bynum and Gasol being featured more in the offense, and AI-led teams were poor offensively.
I'd also argue that if your efficiency is poor, you aren't a dominant scorer, and should take fewer shots. Less shots for Melo would mean more shots for Chandler and Novak, and aside from being a good thing from a stathead perspective, it'd lead to a more unpredictable offense and better ball movement.
I'd also argue that if you hog the ball with the best of them, only produce average efficiency, and are terrible defensively, your team isn't going to do anything. When you have two of those players, you're screwed.
And which 80s SF does Carmelo compare to? Dantley? Bird? Nique? King? Gervin? Dr. J? English? Ellis? Mullin? Vandeweghe? Might want to check their efficiency stats again, Carmelo is outclassed by a mile.
It's not pointless for high volume shooters. LeBron's ORtg is 121 this year, Dirk has regularly been in the mid to high 110s. Look at Wade, Durant, Rose, Love, Aldridge, Lou Williams. Much better ORtg, similar usage rate. Using AI and Kobe as comparisons is making my point; the Lakers would be better with Bynum and Gasol being featured more in the offense, and AI-led teams were poor offensively.
I'd also argue that if your efficiency is poor, you aren't a dominant scorer, and should take fewer shots. Less shots for Melo would mean more shots for Chandler and Novak, and aside from being a good thing from a stathead perspective, it'd lead to a more unpredictable offense and better ball movement.
I'd also argue that if you hog the ball with the best of them, only produce average efficiency, and are terrible defensively, your team isn't going to do anything. When you have two of those players, you're screwed.
And which 80s SF does Carmelo compare to? Dantley? Bird? Nique? King? Gervin? Dr. J? English? Ellis? Mullin? Vandeweghe? Might want to check their efficiency stats again, Carmelo is outclassed by a mile.
Wow the Blazers sure dealt away some decent stuff for nothing...they needed Camby and Wallace. Okur is nothing.
Jackson for Jefferson, that could benefit both teams. I wonder how much playing time Young will get with the clippers
As others mentioned Oden was waived lets see if he calls it quits
Jackson for Jefferson, that could benefit both teams. I wonder how much playing time Young will get with the clippers
As others mentioned Oden was waived lets see if he calls it quits
BigSpoonyBard
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[quote name='Soodmeg']Yeah this trade deadline hype was crap....no real trades were done that I know off. Most were very meh. The sessions trade is nice but does it really put the Lakers past OKC or the Spurs? Hell CP3 pretty much makes the trade moot if they face the clippers at any point.
Meh meh and more meh.
Wallace who I think is one of the most underrated players in NBA history goes to the nets but....meh.
EDIT:
What a second....I think Nene was traded. Nene is legit but maybe the change of scenary is good for McGee who, if he wasnt such a dumbass, could be a borderline all star at one point for his defense.
Wizards get:
• F/C Nene
• F Brian Cook
• Future second-round pick
Clippers get:
• G Nick Young
Nuggets get:
• C JaVale McGee
• F/C Ronny Turiaf
Good for the wizard to break up the worst core of people of all time. Sucks for Nene who has to go to such a crap team, Clippers get a little more firepower if Young can stop air balling layups.[/QUOTE]
I dunno. How many of these "if only he'd pull his head out of his ass" guys have actually pulled their heads out of their asses? JaVale McGee has all the tools to be an all-star, but the history of the league is littered with guys who had the tools but not the head.
But hey, John Wall and Nene isn't a bad combo, right?
As for other trades, the Lakers solidified themselves by bringing in Sessions and an extra big body, but I don't see that making them significantly better. They're going to win or lose based on how they use Bynum and Gasol, not whether Sessions is faster than Fisher.
Portland's moves are just the sad icing on a depressing cake. A few years ago they looked like a perennial contender in the making, and it's all collapsed in spectacular fashion.
On the subject of the Knicks, let's be honest: there's enough blame to go around. D'antoni gets his fair share for being inflexible, but Carmelo should also get a bit (but just a small bit!). Carmelo is who he is, a volume scorer (and one of the best in the game), but he could be more than that. In nine years, however, we haven't really seen much desire to be more.
In the end, though, the real blame needs to go to the front office. They're the ones who decided to bring in D'antoni when it's no mystery how he operates his teams. Then they make the deal for Carmelo who clearly doesn't fit that kind of system because he's a big shiny star. And they're not going to risk looking like they
ed up or taking a star away from their fans (you poor, long-suffering bastards) when they can just as easily let the coach walk, taking the blame with him. The Knicks have long been run poorly, and this awful mishmash of coaching and players is just the latest result.
Meh meh and more meh.
Wallace who I think is one of the most underrated players in NBA history goes to the nets but....meh.
EDIT:
What a second....I think Nene was traded. Nene is legit but maybe the change of scenary is good for McGee who, if he wasnt such a dumbass, could be a borderline all star at one point for his defense.
Wizards get:
• F/C Nene
• F Brian Cook
• Future second-round pick
Clippers get:
• G Nick Young
Nuggets get:
• C JaVale McGee
• F/C Ronny Turiaf
Good for the wizard to break up the worst core of people of all time. Sucks for Nene who has to go to such a crap team, Clippers get a little more firepower if Young can stop air balling layups.[/QUOTE]
I dunno. How many of these "if only he'd pull his head out of his ass" guys have actually pulled their heads out of their asses? JaVale McGee has all the tools to be an all-star, but the history of the league is littered with guys who had the tools but not the head.
But hey, John Wall and Nene isn't a bad combo, right?
As for other trades, the Lakers solidified themselves by bringing in Sessions and an extra big body, but I don't see that making them significantly better. They're going to win or lose based on how they use Bynum and Gasol, not whether Sessions is faster than Fisher.
Portland's moves are just the sad icing on a depressing cake. A few years ago they looked like a perennial contender in the making, and it's all collapsed in spectacular fashion.
On the subject of the Knicks, let's be honest: there's enough blame to go around. D'antoni gets his fair share for being inflexible, but Carmelo should also get a bit (but just a small bit!). Carmelo is who he is, a volume scorer (and one of the best in the game), but he could be more than that. In nine years, however, we haven't really seen much desire to be more.
In the end, though, the real blame needs to go to the front office. They're the ones who decided to bring in D'antoni when it's no mystery how he operates his teams. Then they make the deal for Carmelo who clearly doesn't fit that kind of system because he's a big shiny star. And they're not going to risk looking like they
ed up or taking a star away from their fans (you poor, long-suffering bastards) when they can just as easily let the coach walk, taking the blame with him. The Knicks have long been run poorly, and this awful mishmash of coaching and players is just the latest result.
bigdaddybruce44
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I love how Soodmeg started breaking down my "list." I was just naming random players that are all clearly better basketball players than Stat and Melo. I never once said that was the 10. Learn to how to read.
Also, as far as my basketball knowledge goes, I played basketball all four years in high school and have coached and referred various levels from elementary school to adult recreation programs. I've probably forgotten more about the game of basketball and the NBA than you've ever known, Sood. I watch almost every Knick game and try to keep up with the rest of the league the best I can.
It's funny that you insult everyone else's basketball knowledge at every turn, but you clearly know very little about the game at all. Your entire argument for Melo being a top player is "he scores a lot." That's wonderful. He also takes a ton of shots and slows offenses down to a crawl with his isolation game. He also plays almost no defense and has a well-known reputation for taking plays off. His efficiency rating is generally ho-hum at best, and outside of one decent playoff run, has done next to nothing to propel his teams to postseason success.
At the very least, I will say Stat plays hard all the time and makes the most of the talent he has (though he's a crappy man defender), unlike Melo.
Also, as far as my basketball knowledge goes, I played basketball all four years in high school and have coached and referred various levels from elementary school to adult recreation programs. I've probably forgotten more about the game of basketball and the NBA than you've ever known, Sood. I watch almost every Knick game and try to keep up with the rest of the league the best I can.
It's funny that you insult everyone else's basketball knowledge at every turn, but you clearly know very little about the game at all. Your entire argument for Melo being a top player is "he scores a lot." That's wonderful. He also takes a ton of shots and slows offenses down to a crawl with his isolation game. He also plays almost no defense and has a well-known reputation for taking plays off. His efficiency rating is generally ho-hum at best, and outside of one decent playoff run, has done next to nothing to propel his teams to postseason success.
At the very least, I will say Stat plays hard all the time and makes the most of the talent he has (though he's a crappy man defender), unlike Melo.
Soodmeg
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Durr ok.
I also played Basketball all 4 years of high school (as well as soccer, track and football) and I went to a school that produced 10 D1 scholarships players and 4 professional basketball players. I gave up basketball when I was offered a soccer scholarship for college.
No idea why this was brought up but I can play that game to, what does it matter? And you coach? Congrats, I coached a championship middle school soccer team. Are we just tossing out random achievements from our lives? Also its not everyone...its your knowledge which you continue to lack. How many god damn times do I have to say I could give a shit if Melo is a top ten player? .Your post proves my point that you have no idea what you are even talking about...nor do you even know what the actual topic at hand is which is and you have nothing real to contribute.
Talking to people like you is pointless because you have done nothing but be a one track mind typical scapegoat fan. My superstar is better than your superstar....noo hes not a superstar..blah blah blah. I am not 12 years old I dont care to try and prove that Bron is better than Kobe nor am I a first time weekend DJ trying to fill 20 min of a show.
What I am interested in (and what I mentioned in all of my posts) is gameplans, coaching systems, coaching style, play style, rotation. GM coach relations, front office moves and opinions...you know real stuff....meanwhile your only topic of conversation is trying to prove that melo isnt as good as people say. So I will simply refer you to this point of excellent and real commentary so that after you get done proving to 10 year olds and water cooler fans that J.R Smith is better than Melo (lets see you take the bait on that one) you can join the big boy table with some real discussion.
Anyway, there was more trades, Richard Jefferson and Stephen Jackson swapped. I dont know how much Jackson has left in the tank but it seems like the spurs are really going for it this year. I assume its because they are going to have to blow that team up in less than 3 years.
I also played Basketball all 4 years of high school (as well as soccer, track and football) and I went to a school that produced 10 D1 scholarships players and 4 professional basketball players. I gave up basketball when I was offered a soccer scholarship for college.
No idea why this was brought up but I can play that game to, what does it matter? And you coach? Congrats, I coached a championship middle school soccer team. Are we just tossing out random achievements from our lives? Also its not everyone...its your knowledge which you continue to lack. How many god damn times do I have to say I could give a shit if Melo is a top ten player? .Your post proves my point that you have no idea what you are even talking about...nor do you even know what the actual topic at hand is which is and you have nothing real to contribute.
Talking to people like you is pointless because you have done nothing but be a one track mind typical scapegoat fan. My superstar is better than your superstar....noo hes not a superstar..blah blah blah. I am not 12 years old I dont care to try and prove that Bron is better than Kobe nor am I a first time weekend DJ trying to fill 20 min of a show.
What I am interested in (and what I mentioned in all of my posts) is gameplans, coaching systems, coaching style, play style, rotation. GM coach relations, front office moves and opinions...you know real stuff....meanwhile your only topic of conversation is trying to prove that melo isnt as good as people say. So I will simply refer you to this point of excellent and real commentary so that after you get done proving to 10 year olds and water cooler fans that J.R Smith is better than Melo (lets see you take the bait on that one) you can join the big boy table with some real discussion.
Opinion, insight, logic, iiiinnnnpuuuuttt (Johnny 5 reference)On the subject of the Knicks, let's be honest: there's enough blame to go around. D'antoni gets his fair share for being inflexible, but Carmelo should also get a bit (but just a small bit!). Carmelo is who he is, a volume scorer (and one of the best in the game), but he could be more than that. In nine years, however, we haven't really seen much desire to be more.
In the end, though, the real blame needs to go to the front office. They're the ones who decided to bring in D'antoni when it's no mystery how he operates his teams. Then they make the deal for Carmelo who clearly doesn't fit that kind of system because he's a big shiny star. And they're not going to risk looking like they
Anyway, there was more trades, Richard Jefferson and Stephen Jackson swapped. I dont know how much Jackson has left in the tank but it seems like the spurs are really going for it this year. I assume its because they are going to have to blow that team up in less than 3 years.
[quote name='Feeding the Abscess']It's not pointless for high volume shooters. LeBron's ORtg is 121 this year, Dirk has regularly been in the mid to high 110s. Look at Wade, Durant, Rose, Love, Aldridge, Lou Williams. Much better ORtg, similar usage rate. Using AI and Kobe as comparisons is making my point; the Lakers would be better with Bynum and Gasol being featured more in the offense, and AI-led teams were poor offensively.
I'd also argue that if your efficiency is poor, you aren't a dominant scorer, and should take fewer shots. Less shots for Melo would mean more shots for Chandler and Novak, and aside from being a good thing from a stathead perspective, it'd lead to a more unpredictable offense and better ball movement.
I'd also argue that if you hog the ball with the best of them, only produce average efficiency, and are terrible defensively, your team isn't going to do anything. When you have two of those players, you're screwed.
And which 80s SF does Carmelo compare to? Dantley? Bird? Nique? King? Gervin? Dr. J? English? Ellis? Mullin? Vandeweghe? Might want to check their efficiency stats again, Carmelo is outclassed by a mile.[/QUOTE]
Melo is closer to King, Dantley and Mullin. I would say better than English and Vandeweghe. Not even close to guys like Nique, Gervin, Bird or Doc. Heck I would say that Worthy and Pierce are better players than Melo. On a slight tangent, I knew Dantley was an offensive force but truth be told i never realized his career ORtg was that high (118). One more thing worth noting is that teams scored more in the 80s but I'm starting to see things your way.
I'd also argue that if your efficiency is poor, you aren't a dominant scorer, and should take fewer shots. Less shots for Melo would mean more shots for Chandler and Novak, and aside from being a good thing from a stathead perspective, it'd lead to a more unpredictable offense and better ball movement.
I'd also argue that if you hog the ball with the best of them, only produce average efficiency, and are terrible defensively, your team isn't going to do anything. When you have two of those players, you're screwed.
And which 80s SF does Carmelo compare to? Dantley? Bird? Nique? King? Gervin? Dr. J? English? Ellis? Mullin? Vandeweghe? Might want to check their efficiency stats again, Carmelo is outclassed by a mile.[/QUOTE]
Melo is closer to King, Dantley and Mullin. I would say better than English and Vandeweghe. Not even close to guys like Nique, Gervin, Bird or Doc. Heck I would say that Worthy and Pierce are better players than Melo. On a slight tangent, I knew Dantley was an offensive force but truth be told i never realized his career ORtg was that high (118). One more thing worth noting is that teams scored more in the 80s but I'm starting to see things your way.
soulvengeance
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[quote name='Soodmeg']
Anyway, there was more trades, Richard Jefferson and Stephen Jackson swapped. I dont know how much Jackson has left in the tank but it seems like the spurs are really going for it this year. I assume its because they are going to have to blow that team up in less than 3 years.[/QUOTE]
You really think three? I'm thinking two, and I'm including this year. I think Duncan hangs it up after next year.
Anyway, there was more trades, Richard Jefferson and Stephen Jackson swapped. I dont know how much Jackson has left in the tank but it seems like the spurs are really going for it this year. I assume its because they are going to have to blow that team up in less than 3 years.[/QUOTE]
You really think three? I'm thinking two, and I'm including this year. I think Duncan hangs it up after next year.
Soodmeg
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Maybe, Ducan is a HOF but at this point in his career he can be replaced by the dozens of other double double PF so you dont need to blow up the entire team for it.
Tony Parker is who concerns me because at one point I think he was looking to get away from the Spurs and if he goes its time to blow everything up.
Also....Knicks are up by like 25 on the Pacers.....uh oh. Thats 2 blow out wins after Mikey D left...time to get my jump to conclusions mat out!
Tony Parker is who concerns me because at one point I think he was looking to get away from the Spurs and if he goes its time to blow everything up.
Also....Knicks are up by like 25 on the Pacers.....uh oh. Thats 2 blow out wins after Mikey D left...time to get my jump to conclusions mat out!
lordopus99
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[quote name='Soodmeg']
Also....Knicks are up by like 25 on the Pacers.....uh oh. Thats 2 blow out wins after Mikey D left...time to get my jump to conclusions mat out![/QUOTE]
So how many more games before Melo complains about playing time
Also....Knicks are up by like 25 on the Pacers.....uh oh. Thats 2 blow out wins after Mikey D left...time to get my jump to conclusions mat out![/QUOTE]
So how many more games before Melo complains about playing time
soulvengeance
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[quote name='Soodmeg']Maybe, Ducan is a HOF but at this point in his career he can be replaced by the dozens of other double double PF so you dont need to blow up the entire team for it.
Tony Parker is who concerns me because at one point I think he was looking to get away from the Spurs and if he goes its time to blow everything up.
Also....Knicks are up by like 25 on the Pacers.....uh oh. Thats 2 blow out wins after Mikey D left...time to get my jump to conclusions mat out![/QUOTE]
Yeah, Parker wasn't so good early on his career, but once he developed that jumper, he became lethal. I'm not sure he's a guy you can build around, I know he's not as old as Duncan, but he's not exactly young either.
Tony Parker is who concerns me because at one point I think he was looking to get away from the Spurs and if he goes its time to blow everything up.
Also....Knicks are up by like 25 on the Pacers.....uh oh. Thats 2 blow out wins after Mikey D left...time to get my jump to conclusions mat out![/QUOTE]
Yeah, Parker wasn't so good early on his career, but once he developed that jumper, he became lethal. I'm not sure he's a guy you can build around, I know he's not as old as Duncan, but he's not exactly young either.
Ray Allen still has a few years left if he wants to go play for a contender. His game fits in with just about any team and they all could definitely use a sharpshooter off the bench (or, in Chicago's case, starting). Boston is going to be going into rebuilding and I don't know if he'll want to stick around. He's stated he wants to retire a Celtic, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was the "Robert Parish" of this big 3 and goes and plays for another ring.
Nash too, but I don't think he'll ever leave Pheonix.
Duncan and Garnett? Yeah. I think they'll retire after this season.
Nash too, but I don't think he'll ever leave Pheonix.
Duncan and Garnett? Yeah. I think they'll retire after this season.
Soodmeg
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Yeah because once ray allens legs go he can always just shoot jumpers. Nash also he only needs enough athletics to pass the ball. Garnett probably won't retire because he is stubborn and still has decent stats. Ducun is probably in te best position, he is so universal loved that people will support him forever.
Soooooooo new work knicks are 3-0 then huh? Where the haters at?
Soooooooo new work knicks are 3-0 then huh? Where the haters at?
lordopus99
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[quote name='Soodmeg']
Soooooooo new work knicks are 3-0 then huh? Where the haters at?[/QUOTE]
The Bucks are 5-0, starting the streak with NY. Want a cookie?
Soooooooo new work knicks are 3-0 then huh? Where the haters at?[/QUOTE]
The Bucks are 5-0, starting the streak with NY. Want a cookie?
Soodmeg
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Yes, yes I would. Naw, I am not letting you guys just sweep this under the rug, nope...you guys bitched far too hard about the whole Melo thing. So now I am going to be a constant reminder of the fandom here.
Some of you had good insightful analyst...while others just played that crap dump on the superstar card....so for them I am going to smash that crow into their faces every time they win just as they did whenever they lost.
Some of you had good insightful analyst...while others just played that crap dump on the superstar card....so for them I am going to smash that crow into their faces every time they win just as they did whenever they lost.
Jeremy Lin was also the leading scorer last night and Chandler and JR Smith lead the night before. JR Smith lead the game before that.
Yup, Melo doin' work.
Edit: This was meant as a joke. Forgot to put some sort of indicator here. Personally, I don't care about Knicks, one way or the other.
Yup, Melo doin' work.
Edit: This was meant as a joke. Forgot to put some sort of indicator here. Personally, I don't care about Knicks, one way or the other.
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BigSpoonyBard
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I think you're all missing the point of New York's win streak. Clearly, Mike Woodson is the best coach in the history of the NBA.
soulvengeance
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[quote name='Soodmeg']Yes, yes I would. Naw, I am not letting you guys just sweep this under the rug, nope...you guys bitched far too hard about the whole Melo thing. So now I am going to be a constant reminder of the fandom here.
Some of you had good insightful analyst...while others just played that crap dump on the superstar card....so for them I am going to smash that crow into their faces every time they win just as they did whenever they lost.[/QUOTE]
Interestingly, Melo hasn't shot too well in the streak either, so they're definitely playing better as a team overall, so perhaps their good play will stick. Hopefully they stick with Lin though, Baron looks terrible out there.
Some of you had good insightful analyst...while others just played that crap dump on the superstar card....so for them I am going to smash that crow into their faces every time they win just as they did whenever they lost.[/QUOTE]
Interestingly, Melo hasn't shot too well in the streak either, so they're definitely playing better as a team overall, so perhaps their good play will stick. Hopefully they stick with Lin though, Baron looks terrible out there.
Soodmeg
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Yeah. I think the Knicks are still an average team I just want to poke fun at everyone. Maybe the players jut didn't like Mikey d because it does look like they are playing harder and I am sure Woodson hasn't done that much to the gameplay.
I am still disappointed in the trades. Doesn't seem like anyone got any better just shifting money around. Hopefully the off season fairs better.
I am still disappointed in the trades. Doesn't seem like anyone got any better just shifting money around. Hopefully the off season fairs better.
[quote name='soulvengeance'] Hopefully they stick with Lin though, Baron looks terrible out there.[/QUOTE]
They have little reason not to. He hasn't been tearing it up like he started, but he's still been solid. Just has to work on keeping the turnovers down, and that will come with more playing time and experience.
They have little reason not to. He hasn't been tearing it up like he started, but he's still been solid. Just has to work on keeping the turnovers down, and that will come with more playing time and experience.
BigSpoonyBard
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Wow. Golden State crowd boos the owner when he's there for to retire Chris Mullin's jersey -- to the point where Mullin has to intervene (and Rick Barry). Guess they wanted to keep Monta.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLCuJzI_jEc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLCuJzI_jEc
lordopus99
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All that over Monta Ellis?!? :lol:
BigSpoonyBard
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It's odd considering that this guy bought the team two years ago and was not responsible for the decades of failure prior. He's legitimately trying to turn the team around. Yes, that means taking a bit of a gamble by letting Monta go for Bogut. But they weren't winning with Monta, so why not hope Bogut comes back healthy? And to take it out on this guy on a night when you're honoring one of your team's greats and one of the NBA's great redemption stories? Nice going.
Actually if they really wanted to boo some they can boo Mullin for trading their first round pick in 2008 for Marcus Williams/
Still the new ownership was off a rocky start
1. Drafting Ekpe Udoh over Greg Monroe or Paul George.
2. Chose Charles Jenkins over Jeremy Lin
3. Mess up on the Andre Jordan signing
4. Lead to wasting amnesty clause on Charlie Bell.
Still the new ownership was off a rocky start
1. Drafting Ekpe Udoh over Greg Monroe or Paul George.
2. Chose Charles Jenkins over Jeremy Lin
3. Mess up on the Andre Jordan signing
4. Lead to wasting amnesty clause on Charlie Bell.
Feeding the Abscess
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[quote name='62t']Actually if they really wanted to boo some they can boo Mullin for trading their first round pick in 2008 for Marcus Williams/
Still the new ownership was off a rocky start
1. Drafting Ekpe Udoh over Greg Monroe or Paul George.
2. Chose Charles Jenkins over Jeremy Lin
3. Mess up on the Andre Jordan signing
4. Lead to wasting amnesty clause on Charlie Bell.[/QUOTE]
DeAndre Jordan has made exactly one basket outside the paint in his entire NBA career. Warriors should be glad he didn't end up on the team for 10+ mil a year. Udoh over George and Monroe was bad, though.
I think the biggest travesty has been the handling of Biedrins. Dude had his head screwed up by Nelson. He and Anthony Randolph could have been an absolute nightmare on D for years had GS played their cards right.
Still the new ownership was off a rocky start
1. Drafting Ekpe Udoh over Greg Monroe or Paul George.
2. Chose Charles Jenkins over Jeremy Lin
3. Mess up on the Andre Jordan signing
4. Lead to wasting amnesty clause on Charlie Bell.[/QUOTE]
DeAndre Jordan has made exactly one basket outside the paint in his entire NBA career. Warriors should be glad he didn't end up on the team for 10+ mil a year. Udoh over George and Monroe was bad, though.
I think the biggest travesty has been the handling of Biedrins. Dude had his head screwed up by Nelson. He and Anthony Randolph could have been an absolute nightmare on D for years had GS played their cards right.
[quote name='Feeding the Abscess']DeAndre Jordan has made exactly one basket outside the paint in his entire NBA career. Warriors should be glad he didn't end up on the team for 10+ mil a year. Udoh over George and Monroe was bad, though.
I think the biggest travesty has been the handling of Biedrins. Dude had his head screwed up by Nelson. He and Anthony Randolph could have been an absolute nightmare on D for years had GS played their cards right.[/QUOTE]
Oh it is just they done nothing with their cap space aside from signing Kwame Brown.
I think the biggest travesty has been the handling of Biedrins. Dude had his head screwed up by Nelson. He and Anthony Randolph could have been an absolute nightmare on D for years had GS played their cards right.[/QUOTE]
Oh it is just they done nothing with their cap space aside from signing Kwame Brown.
Soodmeg
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Knicks are about to close out a game against the 76ers. Making them undefeated since Mikey d's shitty gamplan Was put out. So how many games do they need to win before I was right? Also I love how all of these so-called knicks fans were only in here to bash memo but haven't been around jn the 5 games they have one. This is why I don't get Ito debates with people who are clearly watercooler fans.
Also the defense in the game was outstanding on both sides. Lin had a some steals and a block stat had a huge block on brand and jr smith was playing lock down d.
Also the defense in the game was outstanding on both sides. Lin had a some steals and a block stat had a huge block on brand and jr smith was playing lock down d.
soulvengeance
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[quote name='Soodmeg']Yea that was strange but you cant take away from the Knicks because the 76ers decided to quit with 3 seconds left.[/QUOTE]
I found it pretty hilarious. Doug Collins looked pissed.
I found it pretty hilarious. Doug Collins looked pissed.
lordopus99
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[quote name='Soodmeg']So how many games do they need to win before I was right? Also I love how all of these so-called knicks fans were only in here to bash memo but haven't been around jn the 5 games they have one. This is why I don't get Ito debates with people who are clearly watercooler fans.[/quote]
So how many games do the Bucks need to win before I was right... *chuckles*
As for Melo (since you asked)... 5 for 15 last night. Iguadala was 4 for 9 (one of those a wide open layup miss at a critical time), 8 boards, 6 assists; in other words, Melo's "defense" still lacking as Andre got his. As for the rest of the games, Melo has been under 30 minutes in 3 of them; in other words, well under his career average (36:12). This season he is shooting a career low shot percentage (currently under 40%). You still think he is top 10 NBA player and a big reason why this team is currently winning games??? Come on give it up.
By the way, that game last night was ugly. Nobody could shoot and the game ended with a team giving up (see the missed layup, not fouling, etc). Teams both shot under 38%. For comparisons, Magic/Suns both went 47%+ with Phoenix almost outshooting NY on 3 pointers alone (Ryan Anderson/Magic DID outshoot both NY and Philly in 3s alone).
So how many games do the Bucks need to win before I was right... *chuckles*
As for Melo (since you asked)... 5 for 15 last night. Iguadala was 4 for 9 (one of those a wide open layup miss at a critical time), 8 boards, 6 assists; in other words, Melo's "defense" still lacking as Andre got his. As for the rest of the games, Melo has been under 30 minutes in 3 of them; in other words, well under his career average (36:12). This season he is shooting a career low shot percentage (currently under 40%). You still think he is top 10 NBA player and a big reason why this team is currently winning games??? Come on give it up.
By the way, that game last night was ugly. Nobody could shoot and the game ended with a team giving up (see the missed layup, not fouling, etc). Teams both shot under 38%. For comparisons, Magic/Suns both went 47%+ with Phoenix almost outshooting NY on 3 pointers alone (Ryan Anderson/Magic DID outshoot both NY and Philly in 3s alone).
Soodmeg
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Yep, keep riding that train until it dies it get worse every time you try to make a case. At this point, if he shoots too much its his fault, if he shoots to little its his fault, he gets no credit if they win, all the blame if they take a lost, if he locks his opponent up for the day he gets no credit for any defense, if he gets killed he gets all the blame and you pull that shitty "melo doesnt play D" card out.
Its just the Skip Bayless approach. Discredit everything positive as a fluke, blame everything negative on him, nit pick to down to the very core to make your argument.
Also, maybe you didnt see it the last 20 times I have said it...but I could give a less if melo is a top 10 player. Is this the only point you have? Is this what you have been trying to prove? You have brought it up several times and each time I tell you fine he can be the worse player in the league it doesnt effect my point. Also what happened to the STAT portion of this debate? I believe the original topic was that Melo and STAT....so STAT scored like 21ish last night does that magically make him absolved from all the recent hate? This is how I know your just talking out of your ass because you are debating a god damn straw man here.
I dont have anything in common with Stephen A Smith so you are going to have to dump the Skip Bayless approach and get some real points with real discussion backing them.
Its just the Skip Bayless approach. Discredit everything positive as a fluke, blame everything negative on him, nit pick to down to the very core to make your argument.
Also, maybe you didnt see it the last 20 times I have said it...but I could give a
less if melo is a top 10 player. Is this the only point you have? Is this what you have been trying to prove? You have brought it up several times and each time I tell you fine he can be the worse player in the league it doesnt effect my point. Also what happened to the STAT portion of this debate? I believe the original topic was that Melo and STAT....so STAT scored like 21ish last night does that magically make him absolved from all the recent hate? This is how I know your just talking out of your ass because you are debating a god damn straw man here. I dont have anything in common with Stephen A Smith so you are going to have to dump the Skip Bayless approach and get some real points with real discussion backing them.
bigdaddybruce44
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[quote name='lordopus99']You still think he is top 10 NBA player and a big reason why this team is currently winning games??? Come on give it up.[/QUOTE]
He won't, which is why I simply put him on ignore. Even before this season, Melo was consistently ranked as one of the most overrated players in the NBA, and that was at times when he was averaging in the mid 20's in PPG. Now, he doesn't even score, and he couldn't hit water if he fell off a boat. So now his flaws are even more glaring and apparent. He's an overrated ball jock who hasn't done much of anything since getting to New York, and the Knicks gave up too much to get him. Everyone knows this, and anyone who refuses to concede this is just too pig headed to admit they are wrong. He's a bum, and he certainly is not the reason the Knicks are winning games. The Knicks are winning games, because they gave up on D'Antoni and have decided to play again for a new coach. Also, Stat looks like he is finally getting his legs back. Anyone who honestly thinks Melo is the reason the Knicks are winning really, really needs to lay off the drugs.
He won't, which is why I simply put him on ignore. Even before this season, Melo was consistently ranked as one of the most overrated players in the NBA, and that was at times when he was averaging in the mid 20's in PPG. Now, he doesn't even score, and he couldn't hit water if he fell off a boat. So now his flaws are even more glaring and apparent. He's an overrated ball jock who hasn't done much of anything since getting to New York, and the Knicks gave up too much to get him. Everyone knows this, and anyone who refuses to concede this is just too pig headed to admit they are wrong. He's a bum, and he certainly is not the reason the Knicks are winning games. The Knicks are winning games, because they gave up on D'Antoni and have decided to play again for a new coach. Also, Stat looks like he is finally getting his legs back. Anyone who honestly thinks Melo is the reason the Knicks are winning really, really needs to lay off the drugs.
[quote name='Soodmeg']Yep, keep riding that train until it dies it get worse every time you try to make a case. At this point, if he shoots too much its his fault, if he shoots to little its his fault, he gets no credit if they win, all the blame if they take a lost, if he locks his opponent up for the day he gets no credit for any defense, if he gets killed he gets all the blame and you pull that shitty "melo doesnt play D" card out.
Its just the Skip Bayless approach. Discredit everything positive as a fluke, blame everything negative on him, nit pick to down to the very core to make your argument.
Also, maybe you didnt see it the last 20 times I have said it...but I could give a less if melo is a top 10 player. Is this the only point you have? Is this what you have been trying to prove? You have brought it up several times and each time I tell you fine he can be the worse player in the league it doesnt effect my point. Also what happened to the STAT portion of this debate? I believe the original topic was that Melo and STAT....so STAT scored like 21ish last night does that magically make him absolved from all the recent hate? This is how I know your just talking out of your ass because you are debating a god damn straw man here.
I dont have anything in common with Stephen A Smith so you are going to have to dump the Skip Bayless approach and get some real points with real discussion backing them.[/QUOTE]
Don't even bother discussing anything with Knicks fans, they'll usually put their fingers in their ear and scream CANT HEAR YOU CANT HEAR YOU. Glad when they don't make the playoffs or get bounced out in the first round it'll spare me from ever hearing about them for the duration of the season.
Its just the Skip Bayless approach. Discredit everything positive as a fluke, blame everything negative on him, nit pick to down to the very core to make your argument.
Also, maybe you didnt see it the last 20 times I have said it...but I could give a
less if melo is a top 10 player. Is this the only point you have? Is this what you have been trying to prove? You have brought it up several times and each time I tell you fine he can be the worse player in the league it doesnt effect my point. Also what happened to the STAT portion of this debate? I believe the original topic was that Melo and STAT....so STAT scored like 21ish last night does that magically make him absolved from all the recent hate? This is how I know your just talking out of your ass because you are debating a god damn straw man here. I dont have anything in common with Stephen A Smith so you are going to have to dump the Skip Bayless approach and get some real points with real discussion backing them.[/QUOTE]
Don't even bother discussing anything with Knicks fans, they'll usually put their fingers in their ear and scream CANT HEAR YOU CANT HEAR YOU. Glad when they don't make the playoffs or get bounced out in the first round it'll spare me from ever hearing about them for the duration of the season.
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']He won't, which is why I simply put him on ignore. Even before this season, Melo was consistently ranked as one of the most overrated players in the NBA, and that was at times when he was averaging in the mid 20's in PPG. Now, he doesn't even score, and he couldn't hit water if he fell off a boat. So now his flaws are even more glaring and apparent. He's an overrated ball jock who hasn't done much of anything since getting to New York, and the Knicks gave up too much to get him. Everyone knows this, and anyone who refuses to concede this is just too pig headed to admit they are wrong. He's a bum, and he certainly is not the reason the Knicks are winning games. The Knicks are winning games, because they gave up on D'Antoni and have decided to play again for a new coach. Also, Stat looks like he is finally getting his legs back. Anyone who honestly thinks Melo is the reason the Knicks are winning really, really needs to lay off the drugs.[/QUOTE]
[quote name='renique46']Don't even bother discussing anything with Knicks fans, they'll usually put their fingers in their ear and scream CANT HEAR YOU CANT HEAR YOU. Glad when they don't make the playoffs or get bounced out in the first round it'll spare me from ever hearing about them for the duration of the season.[/QUOTE]
I know what you mean renique, I shouldnt have even tried to have a debate because its clearly over their head.....look at what bruce just wrote...this guy still thinks I am talking about Melo!?!?! Are you serious...its a clear example of someone who knows nothing about the NBA as a whole, just watches ESPN and catches 2 or 3 games of his favorite team.
2 pages they have spent trying to prove that Melo is not a top 10 player against NO ONE..for the last time FINE, MELO IS THE WORST PLAYER IN THE NBA...does that make you happy, because it doesnt change the topic at hand. Neither one of these jokers have had any actual insight or opinion about the Knicks as a whole because they are so focused on proving that their superstar is better than that superstar like a 10 year old.
"The Knicks are winning because they gave up on Mikey D," WOW!!! Greating analyst right there....one of the top 10 most used generic views when you dont know anything (see what I did there?)
"Stat looks like he is finally get his legs back" O really? Wow....thats some grade A insight....yep...how much time did you spend at the water cooler to come up with that brilliant point.
[quote name='renique46']Don't even bother discussing anything with Knicks fans, they'll usually put their fingers in their ear and scream CANT HEAR YOU CANT HEAR YOU. Glad when they don't make the playoffs or get bounced out in the first round it'll spare me from ever hearing about them for the duration of the season.[/QUOTE]
I know what you mean renique, I shouldnt have even tried to have a debate because its clearly over their head.....look at what bruce just wrote...this guy still thinks I am talking about Melo!?!?! Are you serious...its a clear example of someone who knows nothing about the NBA as a whole, just watches ESPN and catches 2 or 3 games of his favorite team.
2 pages they have spent trying to prove that Melo is not a top 10 player against NO ONE..for the last time FINE, MELO IS THE WORST PLAYER IN THE NBA...does that make you happy, because it doesnt change the topic at hand. Neither one of these jokers have had any actual insight or opinion about the Knicks as a whole because they are so focused on proving that their superstar is better than that superstar like a 10 year old.
"The Knicks are winning because they gave up on Mikey D," WOW!!! Great
ing analyst right there....one of the top 10 most used generic views when you dont know anything (see what I did there?)"Stat looks like he is finally get his legs back" O really? Wow....thats some grade A insight....yep...how much time did you spend at the water cooler to come up with that brilliant point.
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
[quote name='vlv723']Wow. Clippers lost again to the Hornets. I won't be surprised if Vinny Del Negro gets fired tomorrow.[/QUOTE]
I really think the Billups injury killed them. Like I said before, Billups is one the the best vet PG in the game right now. He knows how to lead a locker room, gameplan and kills in the clutch.
Although it was way early in the season so its tough to judge when they were winning their division but I would say Billups leadership is what had them starting out so strong.
I really think the Billups injury killed them. Like I said before, Billups is one the the best vet PG in the game right now. He knows how to lead a locker room, gameplan and kills in the clutch.
Although it was way early in the season so its tough to judge when they were winning their division but I would say Billups leadership is what had them starting out so strong.
[quote name='Soodmeg']
I know what you mean renique, I shouldnt have even tried to have a debate because its clearly over their head.....look at what bruce just wrote...this guy still thinks I am talking about Melo!?!?! Are you serious...its a clear example of someone who knows nothing about the NBA as a whole, just watches ESPN and catches 2 or 3 games of his favorite team.
2 pages they have spent trying to prove that Melo is not a top 10 player against NO ONE..for the last time FINE, MELO IS THE WORST PLAYER IN THE NBA...does that make you happy, because it doesnt change the topic at hand. Neither one of these jokers have had any actual insight or opinion about the Knicks as a whole because they are so focused on proving that their superstar is better than that superstar like a 10 year old.
"The Knicks are winning because they gave up on Mikey D," WOW!!! Greating analyst right there....one of the top 10 most used generic views when you dont know anything (see what I did there?)
"Stat looks like he is finally get his legs back" O really? Wow....thats some grade A insight....yep...how much time did you spend at the water cooler to come up with that brilliant point.
[/QUOTE]
I'd like to have seen in the world there, but I guess NBA works.
I know what you mean renique, I shouldnt have even tried to have a debate because its clearly over their head.....look at what bruce just wrote...this guy still thinks I am talking about Melo!?!?! Are you serious...its a clear example of someone who knows nothing about the NBA as a whole, just watches ESPN and catches 2 or 3 games of his favorite team.
2 pages they have spent trying to prove that Melo is not a top 10 player against NO ONE..for the last time FINE, MELO IS THE WORST PLAYER IN THE NBA...does that make you happy, because it doesnt change the topic at hand. Neither one of these jokers have had any actual insight or opinion about the Knicks as a whole because they are so focused on proving that their superstar is better than that superstar like a 10 year old.
"The Knicks are winning because they gave up on Mikey D," WOW!!! Great
ing analyst right there....one of the top 10 most used generic views when you dont know anything (see what I did there?)"Stat looks like he is finally get his legs back" O really? Wow....thats some grade A insight....yep...how much time did you spend at the water cooler to come up with that brilliant point.
[/QUOTE]I'd like to have seen in the world there, but I guess NBA works.
bread's done