Ubisoft's new DRM cracked in under 25 hours

Right. More or less my overall point.

And you also hit on what I was baiting for: if those PC sales numbers are NPD, then the comparison with *global* piracy numbers are useless.
 
Of course it was cracked. Nothing is unbreakable, if a man can make it then a man can crack it.

Im glad they did, I personally hate DRM and all this security shit they put on pc games. All it does is cause hassles to people that actually pay for the game, anyone who steals it gets a crack and plays it hassle free.

EA has sunk to horrible standards with its use on command conquer 4. On it you have to be constantly connected to a EA server even single player to stay in the game. Guy doing the preview in the magazine said its a problem because if the internet connection gets intterupted or EA server has a problem while your playing the game closes because it lost connection and you lose whatever it was you had done since your last save.
 
There is no money to be made on the PC and every PC gamer is a dirty pirate...a dirty whore pirate that don't give a fuck about how they are treated and only use that as an excuse to steal everything they can...

[quote name='November 2008']CD Projekt RED is proud to announce that The Witcher, the epic RPG that puts players in the morally lenient boots of the aforementioned anti-hero, has sold more than a million copies to real, live people since its release twelve months ago. Scientific research has proven that those sales numbers are quite good for a debut game based on a relatively unfamiliar IP from an unknown studio on a “dead” platform.

The news comes just weeks after the release of The Witcher: Enhanced Edition, which was developed based on fan feedback to further improve the game that was named PC RPG of the Year by IGN, GameSpy, PC Gamer, Play and many more. The studio spent close to a year improving various facets of the game to deliver the ultimate role-playing game, then released the update for free to existing fans and loaded the retail package with extra value to encourage retail sales. As always, it seems that the customer is always right, as the Enhanced Edition is getting higher review scores than the original across the globe.

“We created The Witcher with the intent of becoming an acclaimed and successful development studio that always made games for its fans; we spent more than $11 million developing The Witcher and the Enhanced Edition, and it sure is nice to make some of that money back!” said Adam Kicinski, CEO of CD Projekt RED. “The success of The Witcher has ensured that we’ll be able to make the games we want – and the games that fans want – for the foreseeable future, and the amazing response we had from the gaming community to the Enhanced Edition really reinforced that we’re on the right track with our development philosophy. We really couldn’t have achieved this sort of success without the support of our amazing fans.”[/QUOTE]

http://www.thewitcher.com/community/en/news/745.html

Hold on. A good product released by a humble developer that went above and beyond for customers instead of treating them like criminals and milking them for maximum profit...actually made money?!?

:whistle2:#
 
I always find it odd when people defend pirates and try to say that pirating does not affect anyone. Being that passionate about defending something "you are not" seems a little strange. Hmmm...

And how is torrenting AC2 easier then buying it? You have to have a decent internet connection to DL it and there are sooo many problems right now with the crack, tons of virus' and you have to emulate a server (which still some say does not work). Seems like more of a pain in the ass then just having to be online to save...

i have a crack and i can got to the white screen but you say : Start a new game, play til the white screen, quit.
"Then the folder will be there with the save. replace the save with the one with the cracks. " i cant under stand this i cant find the folder with the saves
Click to expand...
This sounds user friendly!
 
[quote name='DarkNessBear']I always find it odd when people defend pirates and try to say that pirating does not affect anyone. Being that passionate about defending something "you are not" seems a little strange. Hmmm...

[/QUOTE]

I love it when people who complain about DRM are automatically considered pirates. Pirates don't care about DRM. They crack a game and move on. The paying customers are the ones stuck between the pirates and the publishers. But like people pirate games "Because they can." publishers screw their customers because they can. And since they created the game, they have every right to screw their customers. Then they wonder why pc game sales are lower than console game sales. :roll:
 
So, a user's inability to find a folder is the best example of non-user-friendliness / how-hard-it-is-to-apply-the-crack you could find? The notion about having to wade through tons of fake virus-laden cracks is a legitimate concern, but usually those cracks are found and outed as such quick enough (assuming you're on a halfway decent torrent site).

Even with a complicated crack, someone pirating the game because of the DRM won't tell you they're pirating because it's easier to play, but rather because it's less "broken". With a cracked version, they are free to play the game where they want, how they want, without a care for external forces. They want to play on a plane, they can. They want to play on a boat, they can. They want to play while some bored hacker launches an attack on the authentication servers, they can. They also never have to worry about what happens when Ubi shuts off the authentication servers. Worst-case scenario and they run out of business, is releasing a patch going to be a concern?

Now, I hope it doesn't sound like I'm trying to defend piracy, just trying to defend why someone might want a functional cracked version over the retail version.
 
As a pirate, I can chime in on a few things. ;)

First things first. We don't care about DRM. I don't pirate PC games, but if I did, would I only choose games that are easy to crack? Of course not, because they can all be cracked. If I have to spend an extra 20 minutes doing it, so be it. When I'm looking for a cracked version of Photoshop, do I look for the pre-cracked version over the one that isn't? No.

Pirates don't dislike DRM, we love it. We get off on being able to crack it. We take pride in the fact that we can crack it, even the little stuff. Even something as simple as editing a .exe file so the CD isn't needed in the drive anymore. It's fun for us to go out and tell our friends that we pirated a game, and even though it took 6 hours to install correctly, editing registry entries was well worth it.

Developers needs to learn that DRM has absolutely no effect on piracy. If it's there, we crack it, if it's not, we just use it. If they don't want their games pirated, tell them to move away from the PC and try the PS3. Because if they think they're ever going to even slow down PC piracy in even the tiniest bit, they're crazy.

I've been going more and more legit with my games lately, but I would never in hell buy a game with this kind of DRM. If I'm going to have to deal with a DRM, I'm going to do it the fun way and crack it. So if there's anything these developers need to learn, is that we find DRM fun, and we welcome your challenge.
 
[quote name='DarkNessBear']I always find it odd when people defend pirates and try to say that pirating does not affect anyone. Being that passionate about defending something "you are not" seems a little strange. Hmmm...[/QUOTE]

lol @ that argument

Let's us search your car or house. No? What are you hiding something? You must be if you don't consent to our search.
Let's put hundreds of cameras up to "police" crime. You oppose? Why? If you have don't commit a crime, you have nothing to worry about. And anyways, it's for your protection.
Let's let the government censor the internet. No? But we promise only to use it on child porn sites. Still no? You must be some type of pedophile.

[quote name='DarkNessBear']Seems like more of a pain in the ass then just having to be online to save...[/QUOTE]

Actually, if you read the complaints, you have to be online just to access your game. If your internet goes out while you are playing, it kicks you out of the game.

Also, what is stopping Ubi from shutting down the servers some time in the future making your purchase worthless?

[quote name='Access_Denied']Pirates don't dislike DRM, we love it. We get off on being able to crack it. We take pride in the fact that we can crack it, even the little stuff. Even something as simple as editing a .exe file so the CD isn't needed in the drive anymore. It's fun for us to go out and tell our friends that we pirated a game, and even though it took 6 hours to install correctly, editing registry entries was well worth it.

So if there's anything these developers need to learn, is that we find DRM fun, and we welcome your challenge.[/QUOTE]

You are talking more about hackers than pirates.
 
[quote name='Sporadic']lol @ that argument

Let's us search your car or house. No? What are you hiding something? You must be if you don't consent to our search.
Let's put hundreds of cameras up to "police" crime. You oppose? Why? If you have don't commit a crime, you have nothing to worry about. And anyways, it's for your protection.
Let's let the government censor the internet. No? But we promise only to use it on child porn sites. Still no? You must be some type of pedophile.
[/QUOTE]
Woah, sorry man. I had no idea all that was happening because of piracy.

And I find it funny that everyone got all defensive when I just said, "I find it odd that people defend pirates". Hehe.

[quote name='mogamer']I love it when people who complain about DRM are automatically considered pirates. Pirates don't care about DRM. They crack a game and move on. The paying customers are the ones stuck between the pirates and the publishers. But like people pirate games "Because they can." publishers screw their customers because they can. And since they created the game, they have every right to screw their customers. Then they wonder why pc game sales are lower than console game sales. :roll:[/QUOTE]
Have you guys not seen the Penny Arcade Strawman argument comic? Damn, I didn't say anything about those who hate DRM. I just said, "I find it odd people are defending pirates". Look through this thread, there are people that are actually defending pirates.
 
[quote name='DarkNessBear']Woah, sorry man. I had no idea all that was happening because of piracy.

And I find it funny that everyone got all defensive when I just said, "I find it odd that people defend pirates". Hehe.[/QUOTE]

lol you completely missed the point behind that post

go ahead and bow out of this conversation plz
 
[quote name='DarkNessBear']

Have you guys not seen the Penny Arcade Strawman argument comic? Damn, I didn't say anything about those who hate DRM. I just said, "I find it odd people are defending pirates". Look through this thread, there are people that are actually defending pirates.[/QUOTE]

Yes, I read it. And their argument is the actual strawman. The reason being is in that strip they're assuming that the complainers are pirates themselves. And like I said, actual pirates couldn't care less about drm because they're just going to crack it anyway.

You have also been implying that being against drm is being, at the least, not disturbed by piracy. And that is far from the truth in my case. You and PA have both used a broad brush in painting the anti-drm crowd picture.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']cite your source for the best-selling pc games. where did those come from?[/QUOTE]
the NDP


[quote name='mykevermin']
you keep coming back to this phony theory that serves as the foundation for your argument - this idea that PC gamers pay when they feel "respected" and they only steal what games "spit in their face."[/QUOTE]
PC gamers are more likely to steel from companies they hate notice how EA, and activision(a.k.a the new ea) tend to dominate the most pirated list.
[quote name='mykevermin']
Which is preposterous; you've done nothing to address that; those lists of top pirated games reinforces that, because the line is clear. you're scared to admit that PC piracy doesn't reflect people taking software that "spits in their face"; they simply take software that they want.. They don't discriminate.[/QUOTE]
Which is why the list of best selling games differ from the list of most pirated games?
[quote name='mykevermin']
And of all the industry-bashing rah-rah for the felons who hacked Ubi's servers one-sidedness in this thread, you have the gall to call *me* black and white? Son, you got somethin' personal. [/QUOTE]
1. It's one of the things you are famous for, if you don't believe me put a poll up in the verses forum.
2.Ya saying that everyone is either an upstanding gamer or some who pirates what ever game they want with out regard to who made it and the middle ground is not worth considering is totally not black and white at all:roll:.
[quote name='mykevermin']
you didn't get me anything for valentine's; get outta here.
[/QUOTE]
nobody did

I can't help but notice that you didn't bother to back up your claims by pointing out what points I didn't respond to, where I said pirating is noble, or that a bulk of gamers are pirates.

Nor have you responded to the contradiction that if the only basis of pirating games was greed then then every popular game should be highly pirated but this is not the case, so what is your explanation?
 
[quote name='itachiitachi']the NDP



PC gamers are more likely to steel from companies they hate notice how EA, and activision(a.k.a the new ea) tend to dominate the most pirated list.

Which is why the list of best selling games differ from the list of most pirated games?

1. It's one of the things you are famous for, if you don't believe me put a poll up in the verses forum.
2.Ya saying that everyone is either an upstanding gamer or some who pirates what ever game they want with out regard to who made it and the middle ground is not worth considering is totally not black and white at all:roll:.

nobody did

I can't help but notice that you didn't bother to back up your claims by pointing out what points I didn't respond to, where I said pirating is noble, or that a bulk of gamers are pirates.

Nor have you responded to the contradiction that if the only basis of pirating games was greed then then every popular game should be highly pirated but this is not the case, so what is your explanation?[/QUOTE]

As discussed in the previous page, your NPD data is probably only for the US, while the most torrented list is compiled from Trackers using global data. Thinking globally, games that aren't available or were neutered in a region will cause it to have a much higher rate of piracy.
 
Right. NPD data are simply not comparable to global data for a mile-long list of reasons.

And EA and Activision have some of the biggest selling franchises out there - the fact that they're the most pirated should be *expected*.

You don't seem to grasp what I'm referring to when I talk of a "noble pirate." I mean not that the idea is noble, but that pirates are principled and act on those principles when deciding what to pirate or what not to pirate. That they "steel," as you might say, from "companies they hate." When I refer to the "noble pirate," that's precisely what I'm saying - so you're not saying anything contrary to my point, actually. They aren't deciding what to steal and what not to steal based on whether or not they "hate" a company - they steal it because it's available. Pirates lack principle, but possess greed in spades. *That* is my point. Let's see if your literacy improves if I used the word "principled" instead. You seem to argue that pirates are "principled" and steal from "companies they hate." I argue that pirates simply steal.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Right. NPD data are simply not comparable to global data for a mile-long list of reasons.[/QUOTE]
If you look at list of the best selling games from other countries they tend to correspond to the U.S. sales numbers and also A majority of a games sales take place in the US.
[quote name='mykevermin']
And EA and Activision have some of the biggest selling franchises out there - the fact that they're the most pirated should be *expected*..[/QUOTE]
Yes but it is the fact the they are being disproportional downloaded.(other games sell more than they are download their games tend to be downloaded more than they are sold)
[quote name='mykevermin']
You don't seem to grasp what I'm referring to when I talk of a "noble pirate." I mean not that the idea is noble, but that pirates are principled and act on those principles when deciding what to pirate or what not to pirate. That they "steel," as you might say, from "companies they hate." When I refer to the "noble pirate," that's precisely what I'm saying - so you're not saying anything contrary to my point, actually. They aren't deciding what to steal and what not to steal based on whether or not they "hate" a company - they steal it because it's available. Pirates lack principle, but possess greed in spades. *That* is my point. Let's see if your literacy improves if I used the word "principled" instead. You seem to argue that pirates are "principled" and steal from "companies they hate." I argue that pirates simply steal.[/QUOTE]
You don't seem to grasp that if greed where the only motivating factor, then there should be a trend between popularity and pirating. Yet certain games are clearly being targeted (mw2 spore prototype).

How do you explain prototype being pirated more than some of the most popular PC games if it was not targeted?

How do explain the lack of steam games on the list?

How do you explain the DRM laided spore being pirated more than it sold but sims 3 with it's DRM removed selling more than it was pirated?

How do you explain the fact that sporadic who admits to pirating has 110 games on his steam page?

Could you try to answer these question rather than copying and pasting your rant again.

And still you have yet to adress a single point or back up any of your claims.
 
:lol:

If you know so much about PC game sales outside the US, cite your sources.

Why bother using NPD data if you have that information?
 
As hopeless as it probably is, I still cannot resist a good (or hell, even bad) debate.

[quote name='itachiitachi'] How do you explain prototype being pirated more than some of the most popular PC games if it was not targeted?[/QUOTE]

Prototype may not have had much demand on PC, but it was still a fairly successful multi-platform release (as were games 4 and 5 in 2009's most pirated list). Using VGChartz (which usually steals NPD data when it's released), Prototype on 360 and PS3 moved ~ 2 million units. Might not be bestselling game of the year, but it still shows there was demand for the game. It's just easier to pirate it on the PC than 360 or PS3.

[quote name='itachiitachi']How do explain the lack of steam games on the list?[/QUOTE]

What do you mean "steam games"...games that use Steam as their form of DRM? Cause Modern Warfare 2 used Steam as it's form of DRM, and it's up there. If you mean games developed by Valve, the data you're looking at only lists 2008 and 2009. During that time, Valve released Left 4 Dead, and Left 4 Dead 2. Both games are built solely for multiplayer...sure, you can run through by yourself, but it kills all the fun.

[quote name='itachiitachi']How do you explain the DRM laided spore being pirated more than it sold but sims 3 with it's DRM removed selling more than it was pirated?[/QUOTE]

I'll grant this, but only because Spore was a huge release with some terrible DRM that was intentionally pirated to spurn EA. However, should mention that Sims 3 also shows that pirates will pirate stuff because they want it, and for no other reason. Sims 3 was still a very highly pirated game, in spite of the fact that, as you mentioned, it had no DRM. There was nothing to protest by pirating it.

[quote name='itachiitachi']How do you explain the fact that sporadic who admits to pirating has 110 games on his steam page?[/QUOTE]

Steam's Holiday Sales. When you can get a ton of games for 2-3 bucks a piece, why pirate?

Now, I must promise myself to walk away from this thread...
 
[quote name='Salamando3000']Steam's Holiday Sales. When you can get a ton of games for 2-3 bucks a piece, why pirate?[/QUOTE]

Negative.

I bought decent amount of them the day of release and paid $40 for The Witcher: EE after I heard about what they did with the Extended Edition.
 
[quote name='Salamando3000']
I'll grant this, but only because Spore was a huge release with some terrible DRM that was intentionally pirated to spurn EA. However, should mention that Sims 3 also shows that pirates will pirate stuff because they want it, and for no other reason. Sims 3 was still a very highly pirated game, in spite of the fact that, as you mentioned, it had no DRM. There was nothing to protest by pirating it.

[/QUOTE]
I actually know a few people who pirated the sims. One reason they pirated it was because of EA raping them with all these content packs (mostly the items packs) which were overpriced since you could make your own items.

Also to stay back onto topic. Everyone I know even if they did buy the game legit would crack the drm. It's one thing to put drm on it, but I can't play a single player game hoping both my internet connection and ubi's servers don't fuck up.
 
[quote name='Salamando3000']
Prototype may not have had much demand on PC, but it was still a fairly successful multi-platform release (as were games 4 and 5 in 2009's most pirated list). Using VGChartz (which usually steals NPD data when it's released), Prototype on 360 and PS3 moved ~ 2 million units. Might not be bestselling game of the year, but it still shows there was demand for the game. It's just easier to pirate it on the PC than 360 or PS3.[/QUOTE]
If that where the case we should see other popular games that are on both consoles and pc with high piracy rates, prototype was outsold by games like borderlands, left 4 dead 2, resident evil 5, call of duty world at war, all of these game had more demand than prototype 2 but none of these games where pirated 2 million times.


[quote name='Salamando3000']
What do you mean "steam games"...games that use Steam as their form of DRM? Cause Modern Warfare 2 used Steam as it's form of DRM, and it's up there. If you mean games developed by Valve, the data you're looking at only lists 2008 and 2009. During that time, Valve released Left 4 Dead, and Left 4 Dead 2. Both games are built solely for multiplayer...sure, you can run through by yourself, but it kills all the fun.[/QUOTE]
I mean game by valve.
You can play the pirated version of valve games online so that's not what is stopping pirates


[quote name='Salamando3000']
I'll grant this, but only because Spore was a huge release with some terrible DRM that was intentionally pirated to spurn EA. However, should mention that Sims 3 also shows that pirates will pirate stuff because they want it, and for no other reason. Sims 3 was still a very highly pirated game, in spite of the fact that, as you mentioned, it had no DRM. There was nothing to protest by pirating it.[/QUOTE]
sims sold over 6 million and was pirated over 3.2 million time in 2009.
spore sold 1.1 million and was pirated 1.7 million times in 2008.
See the difference? One game(with out intrusive DRM) had about twice as many sales as pirated copies and the other(with intrusive DRM) had twice as many pirated copies as downloads



[quote name='Salamando3000']
Steam's Holiday Sales. When you can get a ton of games for 2-3 bucks a piece, why pirate?
.[/QUOTE]
1. why would a pirate want to wait for a holiday sale
2. not every game drops that low
3. 2-3 bucks is still 2-3 bucks if people pirate the way mike thinks they do then why would they pay any money at all.

@mike
how about you stop being a coward and respond to my points and back up your claims.
Or if that is too hard how about you just answer why prototype was pirated more then games that are far more successful and popular.
 
Borderlands, left 4 dead 2, and resident evil 5 had about 2-3 months of exposure in 2009, while Prototype had 7 months. That's a huge difference in terms of windows of opportunity.

You're also resting your case on 1-2 games.

Now, cite the source of your knowledge of worldwide PC game sales, US marketshare of PC games in those global sales, and explain why if you are aware of the former two (as you've claimed), why you cited incomparable NPD data.
 
[quote name='Elite Bushido™']the new DRM is only barely cracked, still cant do missions and crap like that[/QUOTE]

Nice... congrats.. Why is everyone acting like they pirated the whole game?
>. >?
 
[quote name='Lice']Nice... congrats.. Why is everyone acting like they pirated the whole game?
>. >?[/QUOTE]
i... dont know
confused the hell out of me reading the topic, but it seems like people were just kinda goin off topic i guess
>_>
 
[quote name='Elite Bushido™']i... dont know
confused the hell out of me reading the topic, but it seems like people were just kinda goin off topic i guess
>_>[/QUOTE]

Yeah... DRM discussions will eventually be avenues to talk about piracy and then death of PC gaming... and then something else. It never stops.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Borderlands, left 4 dead 2, and resident evil 5 had about 2-3 months of exposure in 2009, while Prototype had 7 months. That's a huge difference in terms of windows of opportunity.[/QUOTE]
So were modern warfare 2 and spore that didn't stop them from being the most pirated games of the year.
Having only 2-3 motnth of exposure didn't stop any of these game from being best selling games of there year on consoles and/or PC(U.S.).
So unless you can offer an explanation to as why someone would wait to pirate those games that explanation doesn't work.

[quote name='mykevermin']
You're also resting your case on 1-2 games.
[/QUOTE]
yes it's an outlier in your theory.
" an outlier could be the result of a flaw in the assumed theory, calling for further investigation by the researcher."
So how you do you explain prototype?
It fits well in my theory of people pirating games out of more than greed.

[quote name='mykevermin']
Now, cite the source of your knowledge of worldwide PC game sales, US marketshare of PC games in those global sales, and explain why if you are aware of the former two (as you've claimed), why you cited incomparable NPD data.[/QUOTE]
There's that fact that U.S. makes up over half of the worlds gaming revenue.
you could look at every other system and see that most games sell a majority of their copies in the U.S.

Then you realize that the U.S. likely has the majority of PC gamer(people who use the PC as their main console) with an estimated at 67m in the US and world wide estimated to be around 100 million.
over 43 million participate in online gaming, the user bases of steam, wow, and battle net total to around 49 million.

You could look at the few PC games that have both worldwide and US sales figure.

spore sold 720,000 units in before years end in the US, it sold a total of 1.1 million world wide in that same time period.

Sims 3 sales world wide over 6 million U.S. sales some where between 3-4 million

You can also look at how many games our popular across the world
Here are the top 10 PC games from Germany(5th largest gaming nation)
1. sims 3
2. anno 1404
3. MW 2
4. Wow: lich king
5. wow
6. cs:source
7. Risen
8. Empire total war
9. football manager 2010
10. agricultural simulator 2009

3 German games, 1 game aimed at europeans and 5 out of the 6 games from the U.S. market where on the U.S. top 10. (note they actully have a list of the top 19 German games and prototype was no where on it).

So there is no reason to believe that Prototype was a best seller anywhere, and even if it where it would be in a minority of the market.

So that still means you're theory needs an explanation for why Prototype was so heavily downloaded.
 
Well, I suspect it's the same thing that explains why people downloaded NFS: Shift and Street Fighter IV in such high numbers. Given EA and Capcom publishing those, I can't help but continue to reject the idea that people *in large numbers sufficient to alter those piracy rates* look at the publisher on the box, read about the DRM in the game, and then decide to pirate as a "principled" stance, or one of protest, or however you prefer to frame your theory.

People continue to pirate whatever it is they want.

Your post-hoc attempts to justify the use of NPD numbers (1) at all, and (2) as a proxy for worldwide sales is lamentable.

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/62729

1) The PC gaming market sales increased nearly 20% over 2008.
2) It is increasing despite a 10-15% decline in US/European sales.

So you've not only zero support for your claim that the US market is "half" of global sales (and half's not good enough when making generalizations about entire populations, but I digress), even if that were true it's not something that was true in 2009.
 
the new DRM is only barely cracked, still cant do missions and crap like that
Click to expand...

Chinatowns across the world beg to differ.
 
Last edited:
[quote name='mykevermin']Well, I suspect it's the same thing that explains why people downloaded NFS: Shift and Street Fighter IV in such high numbers. Given EA and Capcom publishing those, I can't help but continue to reject the idea that people *in large numbers sufficient to alter those piracy rates* look at the publisher on the box, read about the DRM in the game, and then decide to pirate as a "principled" stance, or one of protest, or however you prefer to frame your theory.[/QUOTE]
Umm how about you stop trying to put a moral spin on everything.
My theory is that people are complex and make choices based on a variety of factors so pigeonhole every one as either Mr. I pirate everything even if it only cost a penny and it goes to charity or Mr. I'm so virtues I won't pirate anything ever even if it means having to play solitaire while everyone else plays starcraft at a lan party is inaccurate view of the situation.
I don't need to explain the piracy numbers of NFS or SVIV, all that I need to show for my theory is that the most popular games or not the one being pirated the most.
So how do you explain those game being pirated more than more popular games?
[quote name='mykevermin']
People continue to pirate whatever it is they want.[/QUOTE]
Which is why Valve, which has some of the most popular games and who's theory on pirate's "pirates are just underserved customers" doesn't have these kind of piracy problems and is having tremendous growth.
[quote name='mykevermin']
Your post-hoc attempts to justify the use of NPD numbers (1) at all, and (2) as a proxy for worldwide sales is lamentable.

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/62729

1) The PC gaming market sales increased nearly 20% over 2008.
2) It is increasing despite a 10-15% decline in US/European sales.

So you've not only zero support for your claim that the US market is "half" of global sales (and half's not good enough when making generalizations about entire populations, but I digress), even if that were true it's not something that was true in 2009.[/QUOTE]
Your assuming revenue is equivalent to game sales.
You notice those numbers are "revenue" so online games with things like digital downloads(virtual items) and subscription fees and in games adds give these much higher revenues per person/game. Over half of the virtual market is in asia(you know the place that saw growth in PC revenue).

And do you really think that asia is going to have any affect on the sales number of prototype?
So that still leaves the question if people only pirate due to greed why was prototype pirated more than games that were more popular?
 
Your 'theory' has taken quite the back-and-forth in the historical revisionism department if you want to claim it's always been that people are "complex." You started out with the idea that software sales are unrelated to piracy rates b/c PC gamers are more prone to stealing from devs who "spit in their faces." Which suggests the need for a publisher (or developer? you were quite vague there) to actively do something to piss off gamers. Or they don't run as great a risk of being pirated (which doesn't explain Prototype or SFIV or NFS:S, whose high rates do contradict your theory).

I'd point that out to you by quoting your previous posts in this thread (at least how your theory is a moving target), but (1) I've got things to do today, (2) you already know you're full of it ("I don't need to explain the piracy numbers of NFS or SVIV" is quite handily the most pretentious thing I've read in my years on these forums), and (3) hey, it's all in this thread. Anyone who wants to see that can simply skim this thread and see it.

As for why Prototype proves your "spit in gamers' faces" theory wrong, it's because you're conflating publisher with the cause of piracy. You're acting like people deliberately stole Prototype because it was an activision title (and not, say, because it was a franchise folks had some interest in, but not enough to spend money on it yet). Which doesn't hold water at all, since the myriad other Activision PC releases in 2009 aren't located on that list. There are too many exceptions to the rule to what you claim, and you don't want to admit that. You want to settle on a simple proof (piracy rates ≠ sales rankings) that is far too simple and rests on too many assumptions.

Now, if you had started with "pirates are complex people who do things for complex reasons," we could have avoided this *entire* fucking discussion, because that's a sensible way to put things. But you (1) didn't state anything anywhere *near* that until now, and (2) probably would have found a way to disagree with me because of your fucking maniacal mancrush.
 
ubi.png


I ​
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Your 'theory' has taken quite the back-and-forth in the historical revisionism department if you want to claim it's always been that people are "complex."[/QUOTE]
Really show me where I revised?(I know you won't because you are a coward who never backs up his claims)
I think you mixing revised with expandeding as the focus of the conversation shifted.
[quote name='mykevermin']
You started out with the idea that software sales are unrelated to piracy rates b/c PC gamers are more prone to stealing from devs who "spit in their faces."[/QUOTE]
Show me where I said that Sales rates are unrealated to Piracy.
Guess what I didn't All I said was that there are other important factors.

[quote name='mykevermin']
Which suggests the need for a publisher (or developer? you were quite vague there) to actively do something to piss off gamers. Or they don't run as great a risk of being pirated (which doesn't explain Prototype or SFIV or NFS:S, whose high rates do contradict your theory).[/QUOTE]
All I stated was that if a publisher who piss of their customers are going to have their games pirated more, I never said there were not other factors which affect piracy rates(which is what you seem to be basing your whole argument around). So actually they don't contradict my theory but they contradict your theory(which you still have yet to explain).

[quote name='mykevermin']
I'd point that out to you by quoting your previous posts in this thread (at least how your theory is a moving target), but (1) I've got things to do today, (2) you already know you're full of it ("I don't need to explain the piracy numbers of NFS or SVIV" is quite handily the most pretentious thing I've read in my years on these forums), and (3) hey, it's all in this thread. Anyone who wants to see that can simply skim this thread and see it.[/QUOTE]
1.Or because so such a post doesn't exist and rather than adimiting that you are wrong you going to offer same lame excuses about how you don't have a minute to find this contradiction yet some how still have time to write a wall of text.

2.Explain how a theory that states that games are pirated for a variety of reasons would need to explain the piracy numbers of NFS, SVIV(what ever that is).


[quote name='mykevermin']
As for why Prototype proves your "spit in gamers' faces" theory wrong, it's because you're conflating publisher with the cause of piracy. You're acting like people deliberately stole Prototype because it was an activision title (and not, say, because it was a franchise folks had some interest in, but not enough to spend money on it yet).[/QUOTE]
Ya and people didn't have interest in all those games that outsold prototype.
[quote name='mykevermin']
Which doesn't hold water at all, since the myriad other Activision PC releases in 2009 aren't located on that list. There are too many exceptions to the rule to what you claim, and you don't want to admit that. You want to settle on a simple proof (piracy rates ≠ sales rankings) that is far too simple and rests on too many assumptions.
[/QUOTE] Ya I'm sure That x-men origins games and That transformes games where titles people really wanted to play:roll:.

Why don't you show me some exceptions then if there are so many.
[quote name='mykevermin']
Now, if you had started with "pirates are complex people who do things for complex reasons," we could have avoided this *entire* fucking discussion, because that's a sensible way to put things. But you (1) didn't state anything anywhere *near* that until now, [/QUOTE]
Great but I didn't because the discussion was about originally about whether or not intursive DRM hurt games sales not about piracy in general.(apprently you have forgotten)
[quote name='mykevermin']
and (2) probably would have found a way to disagree with me because of your fucking maniacal mancrush.[/QUOTE]
You're the one that's prolonging this discussion by being illogical and avoiding responding to points.

[quote name='Jodou']

I ​
 
Ubisoft, as part of their current PR campaign to win the hearts and minds of PC gamers, are taking a new approach. Not only will anyone wanting to play Splinter Cell: Conviction be forced to keep their PC permanently online (and hope Ubisoft’s own servers stay online over a weekend) if they want to be able to play the single player game, but now very disappointingly there’s no demo for the PC player.


As reported by Blend Games, today’s demo for the latest Sam Fisher stealth-em-up is to be released for the Xbox 360 only.

“”Sorry guys,” said Ubisoft community manage Li Kuo on Twitter. “Tomorrow’s demo is for X360 only. There are no plans for a PC demo.”

The game’s due out on the 15th April, but sadly you won’t receive an opportunity to discover whether it’s worth gambling your money with the idiotic DRM before taking the plunge. Clearly no publisher is under any obligation to release a demo. But when one is available for the 360, it seems extremely strange not to offer the same for PC.
Click to expand...

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/03/18/uh-thanks-no-splinter-cell-demo

Keep up the good fight, Ubisoft.
 
[quote name='DarkNessBear']So... the DRM is STILL not cracked...[/QUOTE]

Yes it is, at least on some copies of Silent Hunter 5 it is.

A co-worker played it almost all day today and he has a pirated copy on his laptop. I didn't really talk much about it with him outside of a few questions and him showing me that he is nearly done with the game now. He knows how I feel on piracy so he respects that, but he knows how much I hate this type of DRM so he brought it up to me lol.
 
[quote name='KaOTiK']Yes it is, at least on some copies of Silent Hunter 5 it is.

A co-worker played it almost all day today and he has a pirated copy on his laptop. I didn't really talk much about it with him outside of a few questions and him showing me that he is nearly done with the game now. He knows how I feel on piracy so he respects that, but he knows how much I hate this type of DRM so he brought it up to me lol.[/QUOTE]
Oh, was talking about AC2. I don't even know what Silent Hunter 5 is...
 
[quote name='evanft']Are steam or other digital download sources counted in NPD sales numbers?[/QUOTE]
Sales list are usually just retail, but does even NPD include pc at all? thought it was only consoles?
 
[quote name='evanft']Are steam or other digital download sources counted in NPD sales numbers?[/QUOTE]

No, which is why they don't do them for PC.
 
Saw on Rock Paper Shotgun and then confirmed in the comments the game has finally been 100% cracked by Skidrow.

No virtual servers, just one crack and you're good to go, game is 100% playable apparently. It even includes the Ubisoft achievements.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/04/21/here-we-go-again-ubi-drm-really-cracked/

Now maybe Ubisoft will finally give up on this. Here is Skidrow's message to all of us and Ubi:

While we worked on this release, we noticed that several news
webpages, forums, blogs etc. posted information, including a
screenshot of a Ubisoft server attack message, which showed
our group name.



First of all, that picture is a fake, nor would any member of
Skid Row cause such riot, as we’re only here to compete with
our game release competitors, nothing else.



Neither do we encourage anyone to take such actions, no matter
how much we agree, that DRM’s like this one, are only hurting
those that do want to buy the game or have bought it.



Another point is those news medias, we mentioned before, post
anything these days, no matter if it’s a joke or not. Beware
what you’re posting, just because you want to prank someone.
This release is an accomplishment of weeks of investigating,
experimenting, testing and lots of hard work.



We know that there is a server emulator out in the open, which
makes the game playable, but when you look at our cracked
content, you will know that it can’t be compared to that.
Our work does not construct any program deviation or any kind
of host file paradox solutions. Install game and copy the
cracked content, it’s that simple.



Since we don’t want to see cheap imitations, we protected our
work with a solid shield. Not because we want to deceive the
majority, like certain people out there, but because we have
in the past been an open book of knowledge for our competitors.
Click to expand...
Now that they know how to crack it, I wouldn't be surprised if Splinter Cell: Conviction was cracked in under 24 hours of release.
 
[quote name='animalspinners']Saw on Rock Paper Shotgun and then confirmed in the comments the game has finally been 100% cracked by Skidrow.

No virtual servers, just one crack and you're good to go, game is 100% playable apparently. It even includes the Ubisoft achievements.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/04/21/here-we-go-again-ubi-drm-really-cracked/

Now maybe Ubisoft will finally give up on this. Here is Skidrow's message to all of us and Ubi:

Now that they know how to crack it, I wouldn't be surprised if Splinter Cell: Conviction was cracked in under 24 hours of release.[/QUOTE]


You have to admit, that it took far longer to crack this system than it does for other new releases. Although, you're probably right in saying that now that it's cracked, the rest will be easier to do.
 
[quote name='mogamer']You have to admit, that it took far longer to crack this system than it does for other new releases.[/QUOTE]
Doesn't matter, the damage is already done and Ubi lost a sale from me over this.
 
[quote name='Jodou']Doesn't matter, the damage is already done and Ubi lost a sale from me over this.[/QUOTE]

With a no cd crack available, it is tempting to buy the game and then apply the crack. But I do agree with you. I won't be buying any pc games from Ubisoft for a long time and only if this drm is no longer being used. And unless the game is a must buy for me. I won't be getting any of their games on console either. It's just not right to give money to a company that shows such contempt of it's customers (I know you can say this about most companies, but Ubisoft went above and beyond :bomb:).
 
[quote name='Jodou']Doesn't matter, the damage is already done and Ubi lost a sale from me over this.[/QUOTE]

This. To me, it doesn't matter if they cracked it in two hours or two months. The DRM was garbage and turned me off from legally buying the product in the first place, as I'm sure it did to tons of others as well.
 
[quote name='SEH']turned me off from legally buying the product in the first place, as I'm sure it did to tons of others as well.[/QUOTE]

It's not a tidal wave, it's a drop in the ocean.
 
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